Should a Christian own and/or carry a side arm?

[The Magic Pudding]

If I had time I would add a couple of shooten irons to my avatar.
He looks about ready to draw.

[Thanos]

NO

they are not to be trusted. especially in groups. they should be disarmed.

sounds crazy, but that's only because of the 'good christian' image. it shouldn't be seen as crazy. I know what they talk about among themselves. I'm convinced if it was made easy for them, they would eliminate everybody but other christians. and that means shooting them. and I have heard some chritians entertaining that notion, more than once.

so I would not trust one in the meantime not to partake of armed mischief, against a nonbeliever, in the name of his religion.

[Tank]

It's amazing how the original intent of a question can be interpreted in different ways!

Assuming Jesus had been born in our time and there were no laws prohibiting the carrying of side arms would the stereotypical peaceful Jesus have carried one? I contend that he would not have. IF my contention is correct (for arguments sake lets assume it is) the basis of the thought is that Christians would have to follow his lead and not carry side arms, because it would be against his peaceful world view. So should a Christian not take their lead from their godhead and also not carry a gun. For a Christian to carry a gun is, in my view, extremely un-Christian.

[The Magic Pudding]

side arms would the stereotypical peaceful Jesus have carried one? I contend that he would not have.

I don't remember any mention of Jesus carrying a sword.

[Tank]

side arms would the stereotypical peaceful Jesus have carried one? I contend that he would not have.

I don't remember any mention of Jesus carrying a sword.

Same thought here. Now when I was a kid we definitely got fed 'Jesus Lite' none of you're going to Hell stuff. I don't think Jesus would have carried a weapon of any sort at any time, it would simply not have been his style.

[humblesmurph]

It's amazing how the original intent of a question can be interpreted in different ways!

Assuming Jesus had been born in our time and there were no laws prohibiting the carrying of side arms would the stereotypical peaceful Jesus have carried one? I contend that he would not have. IF my contention is correct (for arguments sake lets assume it is) the basis of the thought is that Christians would have to follow his lead and not carry side arms, because it would be against his peaceful world view. So should a Christian not take their lead from their godhead and also not carry a gun. For a Christian to carry a gun is, in my view, extremely un-Christian.

I dunno.  Is being like Jesus what defines being Christian?  Jesus as a peaceful man I guess is debatable, although most people I know infer that he was. It seems to me that the thing that Jesus is most known for is martyrdom.  To me martyrdom is consistent with gun ownership. It seems the most common way to die for something you believe in is to grab a gun and start shooting at other people with guns who believe in something different.

[Tank]

It's amazing how the original intent of a question can be interpreted in different ways!

Assuming Jesus had been born in our time and there were no laws prohibiting the carrying of side arms would the stereotypical peaceful Jesus have carried one? I contend that he would not have. IF my contention is correct (for arguments sake lets assume it is) the basis of the thought is that Christians would have to follow his lead and not carry side arms, because it would be against his peaceful world view. So should a Christian not take their lead from their godhead and also not carry a gun. For a Christian to carry a gun is, in my view, extremely un-Christian.

I dunno.  Is being like Jesus what defines being Christian?  

Good question. I think that for some Christians emulating Jesus is supposed to be at the core of their 'relationship' with Him. But Jesus supposedly taught via parables and created aspirational guidance that was basically pacifist in nature. Your dads comment about guns not being mentioned in the Bible springs to mind. By his literal interpretation he avoids the 'spirit' of the Christian message of 'peace to all men'. We will never know what the alleged messages of Jesus are because Christian themselves can't come up with a common set of messages.

Jesus as a peaceful man I guess is debatable, although most people I know infer that he was. It seems to me that the thing that Jesus is most known for is martyrdom.  To me martyrdom is consistent with gun ownership. It seems the most common way to die for something you believe in is to grab a gun and start shooting at other people with guns who believe in something different.

The resurrection of Jesus is a pillar of Christianity, and as you say this was an act of martyrdom as Jesus gave himself up to the Romans knowing full well what would happen. But I don't see the act of martyrdom as being linked to any weapon of any sort. In fact IMO it's a passive acceptance of ones fate really. Ok there may have been a 'shoot out' prior to capture but the martyr essentially goes to their death at the behest of others. And while going down in a blaze of glory probably is the most common way to die in the story of Jesus it is the fact that it happened in a passive way that makes it an essentially Christian ending to my mind. It's because Jesus gave himself up to his fate that he gave an example for others to follow. I contend that this was not a last minute change of heart but a continuation of his style of passive resistance and trust in God (himself(his father)).

For a true Christian to carry a gun is the same to me as putting a lightning conductor on a church, it demonstrates a lack of faith in God.

[humblesmurph]

point taken Tank.  I haven't read a bible in years.

Question, Would David Koresh count as a modern day Jesus? He didn't seem to have a problem with guns.  Maybe guns would be a necessity for Jesus in modern times because any man that could provoke such blind devotion might need to protect himself from people who would inevitably target him as a threat.

[Tank]

point taken Tank.  I haven't read a bible in years.

Question, Would David Koresh count as a modern day Jesus? He didn't seem to have a problem with guns.  Maybe guns would be a necessity for Jesus in modern times because any man that could provoke such blind devotion might need to protect himself from people who would inevitably target him as a threat.

Well that is a valid point, that Jesus may well have carried a gun today. But I would offer up this thought, what would the son of God have to fear on Earth if he were immortal? Nothing I assume, so why carry a gun? The other thing is that Jesus never was the son of God anymore than David Koresh was, although he may have deluded himself to the point where he believed he was. But Koresh still behaved in an essentially mortal way while Jesus appears not to have done so.

Personally I would find it much harder to give credence to a gun toting 'second coming' than a pacifist one simply on the basis of the prior stereotypical presentation of Jesus as a peaceful man. And this lead to the 'shower thought' in the OP, should a Christian carry a gun as it is an implement that can take the lives of others? Even in self defence one could essentially be exercising 'free will' against Gods wishes that one should die at a particular time.

I mean it's all a bunch of bollocks anyway in that Jesus (if he existed) was not the son of god, but for those who do believe he was and follow the 'spirit' of what I think Christianity is all about then I can't see how a Christian could countenance carrying a gun. To me it would appear hypocritical to pray to ones God of an evening to 'Keep me safe' and then to carry a gun around as 'back up' just in case God didn't get the message. But then again theism is full of contradictions so I don't suppose I should expect anything less really.  

[Gawen]

Don't like the wording of the question, but my opinion is that yes, anyone where it is legal to own and carry should be able to (subject to all applicable laws).

I agree. However, where I live, many Christians at least own firearms for defense. I find it a huge contradiction to their own belief system. In my opinion, no Christian should WANT to own a firearm for defensive purposes.

[Jac3510]

It's amazing how the original intent of a question can be interpreted in different ways!

Assuming Jesus had been born in our time and there were no laws prohibiting the carrying of side arms would the stereotypical peaceful Jesus have carried one? I contend that he would not have. IF my contention is correct (for arguments sake lets assume it is) the basis of the thought is that Christians would have to follow his lead and not carry side arms, because it would be against his peaceful world view. So should a Christian not take their lead from their godhead and also not carry a gun. For a Christian to carry a gun is, in my view, extremely un-Christian.

The stereotypical peaceful Jesus probably would not have. Then again, there's little reason to believe that picture of Jesus is accurate. I've always been a bit amused by it. It's hard to imagine a polite, non-violent, love-filled flower-child-Jesus that most of us are presented with--especially when you add the liberal theological picture of one was PC before PC was cool and never would have claimed to be God, the Messiah, etc.--going and doing something offensive enough to get himself crucified.

There's much more evidence that Jesus was a very hard man. People just see him described as "meek" and "humble" and make bad assumptions about what those words mean. They do NOT mean quiet, lowly, and self-deprecating. They actually refer to power under absolute control (viz., a horse with a bit in its mouth--a very powerful creature easy to control; that is "meek") and not thinking more highly of one's self than one's status allows. If Jesus thought he was God, then it wouldn't be much for him to be humble. What truly made him humble wasn't self-deprecation--he did just the opposite--it was his intention to serve others even though he was God. Even the staunchest unbeliever can see the humility in that. Suppose, just for the sake of argument, Jesus really was God in the flesh, the God who created the entire universe, the King of Kings. In that case, he is the last person you would expect to bend down to serve anyone. Now, whether or not he was God in the flesh, if he thought of himself that way . . . well, there's the humility.

To bring this back to the question of the thread, since there is no reason to buy into the pacifist Jesus, there is no reason to think that Christians shouldn't be willing to defend themselves. If someone threatens my family, I promise you, I'd have no problem pulling the trigger.

[Thumpalumpacus]

And so "turn the other cheek" ... ?  What of that?

[pinkocommie]

And so "turn the other cheek" ... ?  What of that?

That's immediately what popped into my head too - is there some kind of caveat attached to that which I'm unaware of?

[The Magic Pudding]

I seem to remember something about love thy neighbour and thou shalt not kill.

[Tank]

{snip}
The stereotypical peaceful Jesus probably would not have.
{snip}

Snipped out the other stuff because it was all reasonable.

However the bit I retained interests me. Consider the Christians that do perceive stereotypical peaceful Jesus are there any? And would it be reasonable to expect them to attempt to emulate JC as they perceive him to be? I does strike me as hypocritical to aspire to emulate a 'perception' of peace and love and still carry a gun. Have you met Christians that cast JC in the peace loving lamb of God that do carry guns?