If God DOES exist, would good atheists be allowed in heaven?

[User192021]

Ok, obviously this is a complete hypothetical so I ask that you simply play along.

Let's pretend for just a moment that God exists and there is, indeed, a heaven and a hell (or something of that sort).  If an atheist lives his whole life by a relatively strict moral code, generally treating others as he would wish to be treated, would God care if that person believed in him or not?  

As a fairly new atheist, this is something I've contemplated while going through the "what if I'm wrong" phase.  I find it to be somewhat unreasonable that God would punish people for doubting his existence based on the (lack of) evidence HE gave us using the critical, inquisitive minds HE gave us.  Why would God punish people for using the same logical thinking processes which have enabled the human race to survive.   In fact, I think God would prefer to have people who used their minds in a rational manner during their time on earth in his presence rather than people who simply followed the flock and never bothered to challenge themselves and the belief system they happen to have been born into.

I suppose it doesn't matter since I have absolutely no earthly reason to believe any such place exists...but it's something I would imagine most of us have at least considered.  Thoughts?

[ImpaledSkier]

Well, if we're playing along then...obsviously he has a sense of humor, and we atheists would be like a running gag for him.

But yeah, I do agree with you I suppose. If it turns out I'm completely wrong and find myself at the pearly gate I'd probably say, "My Bad, God...eh...what can I say? you made me this way apparently. I lived my life well, didn't cause any serious damage, think I can still pass through that eye of a needle?"

I think he'd like that whole deal with a needle and let me in.

[Tom62]

Why do you think that this God of you is a HE? If HE is male than HE has a penis, otherwise HE is an impotent IT. We must therefore assume that there is also a SHE somewhere around and some KIDS as well. Being a family man your God would more likely be someone like Odin instead of this rather pathetic single person the christians know from their bible. So f##k moral codes, just kill a couple of your enemies with a broadsword, while wearing a funny helmet,  and up you go to Valhalla (to feast on roasted boar and drink intoxicating mead) on the day you die.

[McQ]

I guess answering this, even hypothetically, means having to first define which "God" we're talking about. If you mean the christian god, then my answer is "no", even good atheists don't get into heaven. That's a no-brainer.

But if you mean one of the many other gods that people all over the world worship, then the answers will change. Vishnu, Zeus, Allah (technically different, based on the Koran), Ra, Qezacoatl?

[MommaSquid]

Hypothetically, if the god of the bible exists and everything in the bible is true, then we're all going to hell.  I'll bring the chips and dip.

If there is a god but he/she/it doesn't have anything to do with the bible, then we have a fighting chance to explain our choices and possibly get into heaven.  

Valhalla sounds pretty good too...    

[Asmodean Prime]

Not easy to answer for anyone who has an absence of "beliefs". Maybe yes, maybe no. (Maybe snow?)

   People who have "beliefs" should be able to provide a more philosophical answer.

+

[Whitney]

I think the important part of what defines "god" is a being worthy of worship.  So, if a supreme beign does exist then I would only consider it worthy of worship if it at least let everyone who was good have a nice afterlife.  I also wouldn't consider it worthy of worship if it had an eternal hellfire for those who are bad...I wouldn't necessarily have a problem with bad people ceasing to exist rather than being rewarded with eternity.

But of course, this is just hypothetical.

[Will]

I don't want to spend eternity surrounded by theists. Let me be with people in limbo or something. The reward for my good behavior is simply self respect. I don't need some perfect existence without things like pain, disappointment, and sickness. It is the bad in life that gives the good things meaning. Perfection is meaningless.

[Big Mac]

Dude...there are no naked chicks with big boobs in heaven. Remember all the strippers, hookers, escorts, massage parlor women, etc. will reside in hell. Heaven has those frigid girls who never put out because they used God  as an excuse to wait until marriage...

Spring Break: Hell! HELLS YEAH!!!

[Will]

Actually, I say we lie to get in, overthrow god, and replace him with science!!! Muhahaha.

[liketolearn]

i think that most humble christians would admit that they are not god, and as such cannot say with certainty who is and who is not getting in to heaven. what about people groups who have never been visited by missionaries? most christians would not say that those people are going to hell.

christians believe that humans were made in the image of God. because of this, our qualities supposedly reflect god's qualities. so using our reasoning is a positive thing. i mean, a lot of early science was christians trying to find out more about the world god created. i think that christians do have evidences for god, and they are worth reading. i don't think that people should be atheists without considering any arguments for god, or christians without considering arguments against god.

[SteveS]

Good thread!

what about people groups who have never been visited by missionaries?

Hehe, I thought this was funny.  It reminded my of "Tommy" by the Who.  Remember the Christmas song, since Tommy was deaf, dumb and blind they couldn't teach him about Jesus and praying.  Lyrics:

"And Tommy doesn't know what day it is.
Doesn't know who Jesus was or what praying is.
How can he be saved, from the eternal grave?"

So, these people won't go to hell, but they can't go to heaven either, right?  In a real case like Tommy's (that is, if he were real), how would he be saved (since he hasn't accepted Jesus as his lord and savior)?  Or does god just have something against cripples (which would explain why he doesn't heal amputees - check out http://www.whywontgodhealamputees.com)?

humans were made in the image of God. because of this, our qualities supposedly reflect god's qualities

Just a small point, if you reverse god and humans in this sentence, it also works really well:

god was made in the image of humans.  because of this, his qualities reflect human qualities.

i don't think that people should be atheists without considering any arguments for god, or christians without considering arguments against god.

Couldn't agree more strongly - right on!

Actually, I say we lie to get in, overthrow god, and replace him with science!!! Muhahaha.

Sweet!  I kept thinking of "Paradise Lost" by John Milton:
"or once more With rallied Arms to try what may be yet Regaind in Heav'n".  Just 'cause Lucifer lost doesn't mean someone else can't win...

I also wouldn't consider it worthy of worship if it had an eternal hellfire for those who are bad...

Or demanded it's own son as a blood sacrifice as ransom for humanity's sins?

Hypothetically, if the god of the bible exists and everything in the bible is true, then we're all going to hell. I'll bring the chips and dip.

I'll bring the beer!  I'm thinking, sulfur smoked porter...

[Scrybe]

I can only comment on the Christian God since I'm not a professor of comparative religion.

Let's pretend for just a moment that God exists and there is, indeed, a heaven and hell.

Let's pretend that God desired a family.

Let's pretend He created a universe bound by time and matter, with little sentient beings.

Let's pretend He is omniscient, so He knows exactly what will happen to each of these being.  Every particle that exploded into existence went exactly where He planned it to go due to His brilliant laws of physics.  Every being's intellect, will, and emotional makeup determined through the brilliant laws of D.N.A mixed with environmental factors in a chemical and psychological concoction only God could have foreordained.  

Let's pretend these beings have a spiritual component that exists in a different dimension and is thus unperceivable to the beings themselves, save for the nagging questions it puts in their heads about why they exist and where they came from, and where they are going.

Let's pretend the world they live on is full of beauty and shit.  And God doesn't appear to every person to prove Himself to them.

Let's pretend He wanted to show us an actual physical example of how He wants us to love each other, so He incarnates Himself, lives a life dedicated to loving other's and correcting wrong teaching about Him, then is executed as a result, demonstrating the fullest extent of love.  

Let's pretend that there are reasons for the suffering these beings are going though.  One part this:

It is the bad in life that gives the good things meaning. Perfection is meaningless.

Another part: purification.  The final result: perfection.

Let's pretend some people took the manuscripts that were written about Him, put them together in a book, and started worshipping the book more than the God that the book was about.

Let's pretend they mistranslated a word that means age-lasting into eternal so they could keep their Hellenistic views of eternal torment to use as a whip to keep people in line, threatening them with the worst thing imaginable.

Let's pretend some people were influenced by their D.N.A./environment in such a way that made them decide God must not exist.  (Let's keep in mind He planned all this out.)  Let's pretend the poor example that the religious folks set caused a bitter backlash from these people, so they discarded the book-worshipping, revenge-doctrine priests as what they really were- vipers.

Let's pretend the atheist (who was made that way by God) and the viper/priest (who was made that way by God) die and are judged according to their deeds.  

Let's pretend the atheist says, "Wow.  Who would have thunk it?"  Sorry I didn't believe in you.  I tried to be kind to people and stuff."

Let's say the viper/priest says, "YES!  Now I shall get my giant crown to replace the giant hat that I had on earth.  Now I shall be eternally happy while I watch those sick bastards who were foolish enough to doubt God writhe in agony while I laugh and laugh!"

Which one do you think is going to get the reprimand, "Depart from Me.  I never knew you."?

Which one gets to spend an 'age' learning to love instead of hate?

[SteveS]

Well, since we're doing so much pretending, I'll go ahead and pretend that if an afterlife exists I'll get first class on account of my good behaviour.  Change my "sulfur smoked porter" to a "heavenly hopped pretend pale ale".

[Scrybe]

I'm going to pretend I can fly.