Faith is Greater than Reason

[xSilverPhinx]

I wish he would stop being embarrassing with his "My ideas are nuclear fire on Atheist forums!"  Maybe he doesn't feel embarrassed, but I wince inside when I see those words on his blog, and I compare his personal feelings about his presented ideas here, which I don't find compelling (and others here don't seem too fussed, either).  Nuclear fire...oh, brother.  It's unbearably...undignified.  It's undignified to be so boastful, and even worse when basis of his boasting is unfounded or unproven.    

He should be quite embarrassed about that, but he seems to be very happy with his lack of self awareness.

Typical Dunning-Kruger effect, where the unskilled are unaware that they're unskilled and so suffer from illusory superiority, such as our Egor here, who thinks his ideas actually shake an atheistic worldview to it's foundations. .

I already suggested to Egor that he read up on it a bit, but he never replied.

[DeterminedJuliet]

I wish he would stop being embarrassing with his "My ideas are nuclear fire on Atheist forums!"  Maybe he doesn't feel embarrassed, but I wince inside when I see those words on his blog, and I compare his personal feelings about his presented ideas here, which I don't find compelling (and others here don't seem too fussed, either).  Nuclear fire...oh, brother.  It's unbearably...undignified.  It's undignified to be so boastful, and even worse when basis of his boasting is unfounded or unproven.    

He should be quite embarrassed about that, but he seems to be very happy with his lack of self awareness.

Typical Dunning-Kruger effect, where the unskilled are unaware that they're unskilled and so suffer from illusory superiority, such as our Egor here, who thinks his ideas actually shake an atheistic worldview to it's foundations. .

I already suggested to Egor that he read up on it a bit, but he never replied.

I checked out that Wiki and this seemed like an applicable elaboration.

The propensity to predictably misjudge one's own IQ was first noted by C. L. Downing who conducted the first cross-cultural studies on perceived 'intelligence'. His studies also evidenced that the ability to accurately estimate others' IQ was proportional to one's own IQ. This means that the lower the IQ of an individual, the less capable they are of appreciating and accurately appraising others' IQ. Therefore individuals with a lower IQ are more likely to rate themselves as having a higher IQ than those around them.

[xSilverPhinx]

I find this topic to be fascinating partly because the local culture where I live is so focused on itself that it lacks the metaview (of other cultures) to correctly assess what they look like to others. Extreme self-serving biases and in-group validation and reinforcement. 

Sort of like an equivalent.

I'm aware that it's close to impossible to correctly measure which cultures are better than others objectively, but it's mostly how they see themselves rather than their culture that I'm talking about. They do exaggerate more than a little bit

Fascinating at a group level.

[Too Few Lions]

Don't patronise me ineffectual chimp, reaching for weapons that aren't there.
You know, or you would know if only you could know the word of god.
You are wrong, open your ears and let Jesus sing the song of your wrongness to you.

Fuck, you make a good Egor substitute MP, has your account been hacked by a feisty Christian? I feel like my poor simian arguments have been destroyed like Sodom and Gomorrah, your new persona is like nuclear fire!

[Sandra Craft]

You are wrong, open your ears and let Jesus sing the song of your wrongness to you.[/color]

I like that, it sounds almost romantic.

[Tristan Jay]

Truth is Recusant, I don't think I can debate a lot of your points, because I'm not sure I'm qualified to do so. I had an opinion that faith is a greater mental activity than reason or rationality, but I may not have supported it too well in the OP.

I have come to realize I have a lot of learning to do when it comes to faith, and until then, I probably need to keep my mouth shut.

It seems so strange seeing Egor post this kind of thing, it almost makes me wonder if someone else was posting for him.

But I don't think that's the kind of faith I'm talking about. I'm not really talking about faith in God or Jesus Christ.  I'm talking about miracle-working faith, and I think the two might be different things.

Well I couldn't leave this without a comment.  Magic-making caliber of faith?  Given the state of my own mind, this is a step for a person setting themselves up for frustration, disappointment, and many other negative emotions toward God.  Unless they've already done it, or seen it happen consistently. 

Alternatively, it could be a setup for fabricated story of faith and loss of faith.

Tristan I just can't hang with the length of your replies.

And here's me, anxious about my posts, going out of my way to avoid junk posting.  Am I going overboard?  I try to keep them to the point, and quality, but, well...shoot!  He's gone away again.  Don't even know if he actually read my post.  I wonder if he thinks that there has been a barrage of overly lengthy comments posted in his somewhat disappointing blog, of late?  :looks around paranoid:

[Sandra Craft]

And here's me, anxious about my posts, going out of my way to avoid junk posting.  Am I going overboard?  I try to keep them to the point, and quality, but, well...shoot!  He's gone away again.  Don't even know if he actually read my post.  I wonder if he thinks that there has been a barrage of overly lengthy comments posted in his somewhat disappointing blog, of late?  :looks around paranoid:

There, there.    We all take our chances with our posting styles.  I try to make mine as short as possible, which means I run the risk of saying too little and not making my point at all.  What are you gonna do?  Just express yourself and let the chips fall where they may.

[Tristan Jay]

And here's me, anxious about my posts, going out of my way to avoid junk posting.  Am I going overboard?  I try to keep them to the point, and quality, but, well...shoot!  He's gone away again.  Don't even know if he actually read my post.  I wonder if he thinks that there has been a barrage of overly lengthy comments posted in his somewhat disappointing blog, of late?  :looks around paranoid:

There, there.    We all take our chances with our posting styles.  I try to make mine as short as possible, which means I run the risk of saying too little and not making my point at all.  What are you gonna do?  Just express yourself and let the chips fall where they may.

Thanks, BooksCatsEct.  Your very username is a comfort; books and cats...contemplating these things brings a measure of serenity.

[Whitney]

Truth is Recusant, I don't think I can debate a lot of your points, because I'm not sure I'm qualified to do so. I had an opinion that faith is a greater mental activity than reason or rationality, but I may not have supported it too well in the OP.

I have come to realize I have a lot of learning to do when it comes to faith, and until then, I probably need to keep my mouth shut.

I'm glad that you are being more honest with yourself.

[Stevil]

Truth is Recusant, I don't think I can debate a lot of your points, because I'm not sure I'm qualified to do so.

Recusant is a very wise and ancient being.
Exactly how old, nobody knows, maybe as old as time itself.

But his posts are always well considered, knowledgeable and full of experienced wisdom.
Anyone would be wise to accept the wisdom generously offered by Recusant.

[Guardian85]

I am just surprised that Egor possesses the self-insight to know his limitations on this subject...
That is a new side of him.

[Recusant]

Oh my. True, it's been a long time since I was a youngster, and I've learned a thing or two, but I'm just as capable of being a silly git as the next fellow. Thank you, Stevil; you flatter me.

* * *

I should come as no surprise that I can't help being a little dubious about the tack taken by you, Egor, in your reply to me. Having discussed various things with you when you were a member here before, I recognized the same overbearing attitude in your posts (up till now) since you've returned. However, I understand that you're now trying to present a less volatile persona, so I'm willing to give the benefit of doubt.

[Heisenberg]

I'm an American. I have two guns. Imagine that? And yet, I've never shot anyone. How can that be? Oh yeah, I'm a Christian and I value other people as creations of God our Father!

Really? That's why you don't shoot people? It has nothing to do with eliminating their contribution to society or ruining the lives of family members? It just begs the question of what you would do if you found out we weren't creations of 'god our father'. I'm scared to think.

[Asmodean]

My stepfather has a dozen or so firearms, three (Or four) of which are handguns. His body count? None. His religion? None.

How does one explain that, I wonder..?

[Sandra Craft]

My dad had a hand gun he took with him when he traveled (he was a salesman [insert joke here] and some of his customers were in sketchy neighborhoods) and, just to make sure we didn't act stupid and shoot ourselves playing with it, he taught my brother and I to use it.  I'm fairly certain none of us ever shot anybody and our religious beliefs are all over the place.  Dad could probably have been called a lax agnostic, my brother a semi-traditional Xtian and me an atheist. 

The main point -- would we shoot anyone? -- absolutely yes, given what we considered a good reason.  I don't think my Dad or brother would shoot anyone for any reason other than protecting their kids, and I'd do it to protect my own life or someone elses if I thought we were about to lose those lives otherwise.  Killing or even shooting at someone without a good reason tho, I can't even imagine doing that.  When I try to imagine it, I find myself transfering my own enjoyment of being alive and horror of pain and/or violent death onto them and it's just literally unthinkable.