Bible Slavery v. American Slavery

[The Magic Pudding]

Subjective morality is based on the subject's preference. Objective morality is based on the circumstance. Absolute morality is always the case regardless of the circumstance. Biblical morality is objective. Is it wrong to lie? Yes, but there are times when a greater good is in play.

I think I kinda agree with your definition of subjective, your objective seems kinda subjective and your absolute seems akin to my definition of objective.

[Black36]

^What?
How does this apply to whether slavery is wrong or not?  It's pretty black and white that is.  No matter what.

One should look at slavery objectively in each historical case, rather than in one subjective broad stroke.

So, in your opinion, slavery is NOT objectively wrong?

Sorry, but I don't see any good in owning people and being allowed to beat them under any circumstances.

Biblical slavery instituted by God for the Israelites had strict moral guidelines. American slavery did not. Regardless of how much one wants to call them synonomous, it does not make them synonomous.

However much you want to try to make there appear to be a significant difference there isn't. The situation is basically one person owning another who does not want to be owned, whatever flowery bits of irrelevent niceness you want to add to the issue. Unless of course you would be willing to become a slave, if not for me but for an orthodox Israeli Jew. Would you become a slave under the Biblical rules?

But, Israelite slaves had the immediate or eventual option to remain a slave... voluntarily. Your ownership implications are just not correct. And to answer your question, yes, there are circumstances where Israelite Biblical slavery would be an attractive option in my view.

[Black36]

Subjective morality is based on the subject's preference. Objective morality is based on the circumstance. Absolute morality is always the case regardless of the circumstance. Biblical morality is objective. Is it wrong to lie? Yes, but there are times when a greater good is in play.

I think I kinda agree with your definition of subjective, your objective seems kinda subjective and your absolute seems akin to my definition of objective.

People often mistake absolute morals as objective morals. They are distinct.

[The Magic Pudding]

People often mistake absolute morals as objective morals. They are distinct.
[/quote]

Ye, whatever.

[Tank]

^What?
How does this apply to whether slavery is wrong or not?  It's pretty black and white that is.  No matter what.

One should look at slavery objectively in each historical case, rather than in one subjective broad stroke.

So, in your opinion, slavery is NOT objectively wrong?

Sorry, but I don't see any good in owning people and being allowed to beat them under any circumstances.

Biblical slavery instituted by God for the Israelites had strict moral guidelines. American slavery did not. Regardless of how much one wants to call them synonomous, it does not make them synonomous.

However much you want to try to make there appear to be a significant difference there isn't. The situation is basically one person owning another who does not want to be owned, whatever flowery bits of irrelevent niceness you want to add to the issue. Unless of course you would be willing to become a slave, if not for me but for an orthodox Israeli Jew. Would you become a slave under the Biblical rules?

But, Israelite slaves had the immediate or eventual option to remain a slave... voluntarily. Your ownership implications are just not correct. And to answer your question, yes, there are circumstances where Israelite Biblical slavery would be an attractive option in my view.

Could they opt out of their slavery at any point they wanted to?

[Sweetdeath]

I doubt anyone would or ever has been a willing slave.

And if you think it is okay to own another humanbeing in any way, shape, or form, I truly reccomend you seek immediate help.

[Tank]

I doubt anyone would or ever has been a willing slave.

And if you think it is okay to own another humanbeing in any way, shape, or form, I truly reccomend you seek immediate help.

Oh I don't think that's 100% true, but they did have a safe word

[Medusa]

I wish we could ask a slave what they thought. Then they could look to their owners for the answer they are to give. Because you know I somehow imagine some slave saying " well you know it all depends on subjective or objective definitions of (HELP ME) right and wrong etc etc."

Yeah I imagine it that way.

[xSilverPhinx]

I wish we could ask a slave what they thought. Then they could look to their owners for the answer they are to give. Because you know I somehow imagine some slave saying " well you know it all depends on subjective or objective definitions of (HELP ME) right and wrong etc etc."

Yeah I imagine it that way.

Or:

I can either choose to be a slave or choose to die a horrible death in the free world with no means to house, feed and protect myself and my family. But it's a choice.

[Tank]

I wish we could ask a slave what they thought. Then they could look to their owners for the answer they are to give. Because you know I somehow imagine some slave saying " well you know it all depends on subjective or objective definitions of (HELP ME) right and wrong etc etc."

Yeah I imagine it that way.

Or:

I can either choose to be a slave or choose to die a horrible death in the free world with no means to house, feed and protect myself and my family. But it's a choice.

I would agree that there have been some slaves who at some times have been better of than non-slaves. But that is more indicative of the appalling society/culture that they were slaves in.

[Medusa]

I wish we could ask a slave what they thought. Then they could look to their owners for the answer they are to give. Because you know I somehow imagine some slave saying " well you know it all depends on subjective or objective definitions of (HELP ME) right and wrong etc etc."

Yeah I imagine it that way.

Or:

I can either choose to be a slave or choose to die a horrible death in the free world with no means to house, feed and protect myself and my family. But it's a choice.

I don't recall those shackles being something of a chosen accessory. Are you out of your mind? Yeah, I'm seriously asking that too. Seems the ridiculous stuff we need to say to not just say you know, I might be wrong about this particular subject. So instead I'll just grasp for anything that will keep me from saying that.

At this point you are not your own property. Hell your family is not YOUR family. Your wife probably having sired the Massa' 5th illegitimate son. Seriously no slaves is having this contemplation. Those songs they were singing out in the cotton fields weren't coded songs of cooperation and loyalty. It was coded songs of HOW TO GET THE HELL AWAY FROM THESE CRACKAS. Come on.

[Sweetdeath]

I doubt anyone would or ever has been a willing slave.

And if you think it is okay to own another humanbeing in any way, shape, or form, I truly reccomend you seek immediate help.

Oh I don't think that's 100% true, but they did have a safe word

Well~~    I don't mind that at all.


LOL@Medusa. xD

[Whitney]

If anyone that actually cares if they are using words correctly would like to read about the difference between objective and subjective they can do so quickly here:
http://www.differencebetween.net/language/difference-between-objective-and-subjective/

It does matter when discussing moral issues but I don't see any real discussion occurring other than among those who agree so whatever...

And for Black36....i don't care if biblical slaves were treated a bit nicer than American slaves or if they had a chance to go free.  That doesn't make it ethical.  Arguing that something is less bad still means it is bad.

[xSilverPhinx]

I wish we could ask a slave what they thought. Then they could look to their owners for the answer they are to give. Because you know I somehow imagine some slave saying " well you know it all depends on subjective or objective definitions of (HELP ME) right and wrong etc etc."

Yeah I imagine it that way.

Or:

I can either choose to be a slave or choose to die a horrible death in the free world with no means to house, feed and protect myself and my family. But it's a choice.

I don't recall those shackles being something of a chosen accessory. Are you out of your mind? Yeah, I'm seriously asking that too. Seems the ridiculous stuff we need to say to not just say you know, I might be wrong about this particular subject. So instead I'll just grasp for anything that will keep me from saying that.

At this point you are not your own property. Hell your family is not YOUR family. Your wife probably having sired the Massa' 5th illegitimate son. Seriously no slaves is having this contemplation. Those songs they were singing out in the cotton fields weren't coded songs of cooperation and loyalty. It was coded songs of HOW TO GET THE HELL AWAY FROM THESE CRACKAS. Come on.

I can just imagine an older, invalid or sick slave who wouldn't be able to work freely to support themselves choosing the shackles over whatever they would have to face as a free person. The main question, however, is if the choice of their master overrides their own to remain a slave.

[Medusa]

I'm pretty sure alot of those old invalid slaves who couldn't work...disappeared into the night. Never to be heard of again.