Satanism - an atheistic religion of common sense

[Whitney]

Sure, but not everybody agrees with "common sense", as silly as it sounds. If Satanism is a collection of conclusions then I don't see how it's not a set of beliefs, common or not.

OK.  If you would say you believe touching a hot stove hurts, or that you believe it makes sense to keep your hand off a hot stove, then I guess you would consider Satanism a set of beliefs.

but by this you are implying that all beliefs in satanism are clearly true...it's an ethical egoist religion/philosophy and not everyone agrees with ethical egoism; so you really can't call it a set of obvious facts.

Frankly, if I did subscribe to ethical egoism I'd just do so and not bother with the satanic symbolism because I think it's kinda pointless.

[Lythande]

Satanism is not atheism.   Satanism is a theism, a belief in a higher power, a supreme being.  Atheism is the lack of belief in a supreme being.  Nothing more, nothing less.

[Whitney]

Satanism is not atheism.   Satanism is a theism, a belief in a higher power, a supreme being.  Atheism is the lack of belief in a supreme being.  Nothing more, nothing less.

The OP is about LaVey satanism, not devil worship.  There is a form of satanism that actually does worship and believe in a real satan but that's not what is being discussed.

[joeactor]

The OP is about LaVey satanism, not devil worship.  There is a form of satanism that actually does worship and believe in a real satan but that's not what is being discussed.

... I get it.  The stated definition sounds like a good set of precepts.

But, seriously - Satanism?

"Hey everyone, I've got a wonderful set of rules to make the world a better place... I call it Hitlerism!"

Why, why, why would you associate yourself with a prominent evil figure?

(also agree that a set of precepts by which you live your life is not equal to a religion).

ism ism ism

[Kylyssa]

The problem with Satanism is the name.  By and large, people aren't going to be smart enough to see the difference between this concept of Satan and the biblical Satan.  By creating a non-theistic religion named after the big bad guy in Christianity it helps spread the idea that all atheists worship Satan and are evil.

[Babylon Fell]

Isn't one of the stated goals of Satanism to create robot slaves to serve humanity? I remember reading that on the official Satanist Church website years ago.

[The Magic Pudding]

The problem with Satanism is the name.

Ye but I bet it got old LaVey a lot of weird sex he wouldn't have got otherwise.

[Inevitable Droid]

but by this you are implying that all beliefs in satanism are clearly true...it's an ethical egoist religion/philosophy and not everyone agrees with ethical egoism; so you really can't call it a set of obvious facts.

I'll split a hair, because I think it's an important one.  Satanism is rational egoism*, which differs somewhat from ethical egoism.  Rational egoism is the claim that doing what's in your best interest is rational; I.e., it makes sense.  Ethical egoism is the claim that doing what's in your best interest is obligatory - that failure to do so is moral failure.  Ayn Rand was an ethical egoist.  Objectivism and Satanism differ on a number of points, including whether egoism is obligatory.  

Rational egoism can be soft or hard.  The soft variety claims doing what's in your best interest is sufficient but not necessary in order to be rational; I.e., choosing someone else's best interest above your own can be rational, if such action fulfills your genuine, honest priorities.  The hard variety claims doing what's in your best interest is not only sufficient but also necessary in order to be rational; I.e., it would always be irrational to choose someone else's best interest above your own.  Satanism is soft rational egoism.  No Satanist will call you irrational for sacrificing on behalf of your son or daughter, for example, or even your pet.

I can easily imagine atheists rejecting ethical egoism.  I myself reject it, just as I reject all morality.  I can also imagine atheists rejecting hard rational egoism.  I myself reject it.  But I doubt there are atheists who reject soft rational egoism.  Is my doubt misplaced?

* I know LaVey's talk of sins can make it seem like ethical egoism is being promoted, but such isn't the case.  Sometimes Satanism will opt for drama over philsophical rigor.  It's more dramatic to talk of sins.  But no moral obligation is implied.

Frankly, if I did subscribe to ethical egoism I'd just do so and not bother with the satanic symbolism because I think it's kinda pointless.

Fair enough.  If taking on the guise of society's bogey man doesn't amuse or gratify you, then Satanism would hold no appeal.

[Inevitable Droid]

The problem with Satanism is the name.  By and large, people aren't going to be smart enough to see the difference between this concept of Satan and the biblical Satan.  By creating a non-theistic religion named after the big bad guy in Christianity it helps spread the idea that all atheists worship Satan and are evil.

Two responses to this.  First, yes, a consequence is that Satanists have from time to time been the targets of angry or frightened Christians.  One avoids this by declining to publicise one's involvement.  But of course, being a public atheist can draw some of the same anger or fear from Christians, as can being a public Wiccan.  Why be a Satanist at all?  Why not simply be an atheist and a soft rational egoist?  Because taking on the guise of society's bogey man can be fun, and being in the company of others who think so too, can likewise be fun.  I can't emphasize enough that Satanism is something you do because you enjoy it.  Among Satanists, it often can seem like it's Halloween all year long, and if you happen to be a fan of Halloween, you'll delight in being among Satanists, and being one yourself.  When you were a kid, did you and your friends ever play imaginary games where you took on the roles of monsters?  When you got older, did you ever play role playing games like Vampire: The Masquerade?  This is generally the underlying impetus for someone to engage fully with Satanism.  But since atheism and soft rational egoism* are also part of the package, if you don't embrace those concepts as well, the whole thing won't work for you as a long-term lifestyle.

Secondly, yes, a consequence is that Satanism doesn't have a magnetic attraction for most people.  This is viewed as a plus rather than a minus.  That old slogan of the United States Marines works beautifully here.  "The few.  The proud.  The Satanists."  Whereas Christianity wants as many devotees as it can get, Satanism aims at quality instead, and in fact would be suspicious of too much quantity.  It is taken as axiomatic that Satanism isn't for everybody, by design.  This harkens back to the disdain for lack of common sense.  Satanists tend to view the general population, taken collectively, as mostly lacking in common sense.  This perception results in misanthropy to a greater or lesser degree, depending on how passionate the disdain is.  Misanthropes don't proselytise.  In fact, they tend to do the very opposite.  They would rather scare you away.  Unless you're really one of them, of course, in which case you're invited right in, with a knowing smile and a twinkling eye.  
 
* I should note that in Satanism, soft rational egoism is absolute; I.e., anything, absolutely anything, that satisfies, and is neither harmful to you or others nor counter-productive to goals that matter more to you, and is legal, is rational, and by definition, then, makes sense to pursue - and your fellow Satanists will be supportive, and will laud your accomplishments, regardless whether they share your inclinations or not.

[Inevitable Droid]

Isn't one of the stated goals of Satanism to create robot slaves to serve humanity? I remember reading that on the official Satanist Church website years ago.

Robots slaves, or, Artificial Human Companions, are indeed part of a Five-Point Program that Anton Szandor LaVey put forth for the membership of the Church of Satan.  I quote all five points at the bottom of this post.

Robot slaves and human ones would differ in (at least) one crucial regard.  Most humans aren't programmed by chemistry to want to serve a master.  I'll note in passing that in the BDSM community, where master and slave are known as top and bottom, the bottoms may in fact be genetically predisposed to the lifestyle they pursue with passion and delight, albeit we must remember that for them, slavery is voluntary and can be terminated by them at any time.  Robot slaves will all be programmed by sapient hands to want to serve a master - assuming it makes sense to say they want, which would really be the case only if they have awakened to experience.  In any case, if slavery is built into their very natures, then, for these robots, slavery will be self-actualization.

The appeal of robot slaves is partly the fact that they could perform tasks their masters would rather not, but mostly the fact that, if capable of conversation and other intimacies, they could be programmed to fit the precise predilections of the master, would never behave irrationally, and could be turned off and stored in a closet whenever the master wanted to be alone.  Cake both had and eaten, for the lonely misanthrope, who disdains most of humanity for its lack of common sense.  Consider that talking to a sapient robot would be literally like talking to the entire internet, since of course the robot would have internet access and the ability to perform searches and analyze results at nanosecond speed, and you may not even need to be a misanthrope to grasp the appeal.

With regard to the Five-Point Program, I'll clarify that the Church of Satan doesn't function as any kind of legion.  It is the farthest thing from a corpus diabolicus.  Each Satanist is doing his or her own thing.  It's unusual for even two Satanists to band together, let alone three, or thirty.  The Five-Point Program, then, serves purely as a set of suggestions the Satanist might take into account when and if the Satanist decides to venture into the world with intent to leave a mark.  The first suggestion would make the world more top performer-friendly and less slacker-friendly; the second would make it less Christian-friendly and less Muslim-friendly, hence more atheist-friendly; the third would make it less criminal-friendly and more law abiding citizen-friendly; the fourth would make it more misanthrope-friendly; and the fifth would make it more anachronist-friendly, more futurist-friendly, and more fantasist-friendly.  This all makes sense because Satanists tend to be top performers, atheists, law-abiding citizens, misanthropes, and either anachronists, futurists, or fantasists - or all three, or two of the three.  Rational egoism is the impetus.      

What follows was authored by Anton Szandor LaVey:

The following Five-Point Program reflects attitudes which allow others to decide whether they wish to align themselves with Satanism or not. Each is necessary for Satanic change to take place. When asked what we’re “doing,” here’s the answer:

1. Stratificationâ€"The point on which all the others ultimately rest. There can be no more myth of “equality” for allâ€"it only translates to “mediocrity” and supports the weak at the expense of the strong. Water must be allowed to seek its own level without interference from apologists for incompetence. No one should be protected from the effects of his own stupidity.

2. Strict taxation of all churchesâ€"If churches were taxed for all their income and property, they’d crumble overnight of their own obsolescence, and the National Debt would be wiped out as quickly. The productive, the creative, the resourceful should be subsidized. So long as the useless and incompetent are getting paid, they should be heavily taxed.

3. No tolerance for religious beliefs secularized and incorporated into law and order issuesâ€"to re-establish “Lex Talionis” would require a complete overturning of the present in-justice system based on Judeo-Christian ideals, where the victim/defender has been made the criminal. Amnesty should be considered for anyone in prison because of his alleged “influence” upon the actual perpetrator of the crime. Everyone is influenced in what he or she does. Scapegoating has become a way of life, a means of survival for the unfit. As an extension of the Judeo-Christian cop-out of blaming the Devil for everything, criminals can gain leniency, even praise, by placing the blame on a convenient villain. Following the Satanic creed of “Responsibility to the responsible,” in a Satanic society, everyone must experience the consequences of his own actionsâ€"for good or ill.

4. Development and production of artificial human companionsâ€"The forbidden industry. An economic “godsend” which will allow everyone “power” over someone else. Polite, sophisticated, technologically feasible slavery. And the most profitable industry since T.V. and the computer.

5. The opportunity for anyone to live within a total environment of his or her choice, with mandatory adherence to the aesthetic and behavioral standards of sameâ€"Privately owned, operated and controlled environments as an alternative to homogenized and polyglot ones. The freedom to insularize oneself within a social milieu of personal well-being. An opportunity to feel, see, and hear that which is most aesthetically pleasing, without interference from those who would pollute or detract from that option.

[elliebean]

I'll note in passing that in the BDSM community, where master and slave are known as top and bottom

Not to derail (I hope), just a correction: in the BDSM community, Masters and slaves are known as Masters (or Mistresses) and slaves, or Dominants and submissives, etc., to use those terms loosely. These denote roles within certain types of relationship dynamics. Tops and bottoms are known as tops and bottoms, and have to do with roles within certain activities. Though certainly not mutually exclusive, they're not interchangeable; they're distinct terms with different meanings.

Carry on.  

[Inevitable Droid]

Though certainly not mutually exclusive, they're not interchangeable; they're distict terms with different meanings.

Hmm.  You're totally correct, as I've discovered after googling.  I would swear that twenty years ago, when I took an interest in the subject, the terms top, dominant, and master were interchangeable, but they aren't today, and maybe they weren't back then either, and my memory is just faulty.  Thanks for correcting me.

EDIT: It bugged me that I had neglected to italicise the jargon words above, so I went back and italicised them.  No other edits.

[DJAkuma]

Thanks for the informative post, I've got a couple of friends who are satanists and now I understand a bit more why we get along so well.

Funny story: I had to move on short notice and there was a ton of work to do so I tried to rally my friends, all of my religious friends who I'd helped move in the past suddenly had plans come up and couldn't help. Three of my friends showed up to help, a satanist and my gay agnostic friend along with his boyfriend. After thanking them for showing up when others failed my satanist friend simply said "You have a truck and I'm moving soon too. That, and you always have good beer"

[Inevitable Droid]

After thanking them for showing up when others failed my satanist friend simply said "You have a truck and I'm moving soon too. That, and you always have good beer"

Ha!  Spoken very Satanically! :cool:

Added to the prior three codifications I had already offered, this fourth and last completes what could be viewed as a primer on what someone is telling you when he or she says, "I'm a Satanist."  Bear in mind once again that a particular aesthetic, and a sense of drama, take priority over philosophical rigor, because it's assumed that if you're a Satanist, you exemplify common sense, and therefore you don't need things spood-fed to you.  Those who lack common sense may misinterpret, but whether they do or don't is of no consequence, for they are of no consequence.  The aesthetic and the sense of drama are where a lot of the fun derive, and when it comes to fully engaging with Satanism, there is only one reason for doing it - because it's fun.

As authored by Anton Szandor LaVey:

The Eleven Satanic Rules of the Earth

1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there.

4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

9. Do not harm little children.

10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.

[Inevitable Droid]

The Five-Point Program, then, serves purely as a set of suggestions the Satanist might take into account when and if the Satanist decides to venture into the world with intent to leave a mark.

Later today you'll see an example of this.  I'll be posting a thread about strict taxation of churches.  I've googled the topic, and as far as I can tell, no one on the internet is seriously pushing this idea at the current time.  This surprises me a little.  Hence the thread I'll be posting later today.  The topic genuinely interests me, yet, by raising it for discussion, I'm incidentally adding energy to one of the Five Points.  That's how this sort of thing works.