Why do Christians believe what's in the New Testament?

[lundberg500]

I truly don’t understand how Christians can believe what’s in the bible. I occasionally hear some Christians state that they are not literalists when it comes to the inane stories of the Old Testament. They say this because they are faced with undeniable facts that prove the Old Testament to be highly fallible and some of these people are finally coming around to at least some kind of logic and reason. But how can they, at the same time, take the New Testament as literal? I would really like to know how an intelligent person in today’s world truly believe these incredibly ludicrous stories as presented in the gospels? Have these Christians even read the gospels or are they just learning certain lines preached to them by the pastors on Sunday?

Let’s take the gospel of Mark as an example because it was the first gospel written and is what Matthew and Luke based so much of their gospels on. The gospel of Mark is literally one miracle after another all the way through.

1. Starts off with the heavens parting and the voice of God booming down saying how pleased he is with his son
2. A wilderness scene with angels and then a devil that tempts Jesus
3. Jesus heals a possessed man in a synagogue
4. Jesus heals a woman from a fever
5. Jesus heals several people from disease and devil possession
6. Jesus heals a leper the next day
7. Jesus heals a man sick with Palsy in a crowded house of people
8. Jesus goes to a synagogue and heals a man with a withered hand
9. Jesus gives his disciples power to heal and cast out demons
10. Jesus calms a storm that would have destroyed the ship that he and his followers were in
11. Jesus gets off the ship and is greeted by another possessed man. He casts out the evil spirits and puts them into pigs that then run off a cliff.
12. A lady touches the garment of Jesus and she is healed from bleeding that had lasted 12 years
13. Jesus goes to the ruler of a synagogue’s house and raises a little girl out of apparent death
14. Jesus heals more sick people back near his home
15. Jesus sends out his disciples to heal the sick and cast out demons
16. After John the Baptist is beheaded, Jesus feeds thousands of mourners with 5 bread loaves and 2 fish
17. Jesus sends his disciples out to a boat in the sea then he walks on water out to the ship to meet them
18. Jesus heals more sick people
19. Jesus heals a possessed girl after her mother begs at his feet
20. Jesus heals a deaf man with a speech impediment by sticking his finger in the man’s ears and touching his tongue
21. Jesus does the bread and fish trick again to feed thousands, this time with 7 loaves of bread and a few fish
22. Jesus heals a blind man
23. Jesus tells his disciples that he must be killed and rise again in 3 days
24. Jesus leads Peter,James,and John up onto a mountain where they meet Elias and Moses. The voice of God booms down that Jesus is his beloved son.
25. Jesus heals a sick child that his disciples could not heal
26. Jesus heals a blind man in Jericho
27. Jesus has his disciples steal him a colt and he rides into Jerusalem.
28. Jesus curses a fig tree that was producing no fruit. The Jews are that fig tree. Salvation will go to the Gentiles now.
29. Jesus overturns tables in the temple without getting arrested. The fig tree is dried up. Judaism is being replaced with a new covenant.
30. Judas scene where Judas is paid money to turn Jesus in
31. Passover meal scene where Jesus says that someone will betray him.
32. Judas kisses Jesus to signal that he is the one to be taken away by the Jews
33. Jesus proclaims himself as the “Christ” and he is condemned to death. He is spat upon and hit.
34. Roman court scene with Pilate where Jesus says nothing. Barbarras is released. Jews cry out to crucify Jesus.
35.  Jesus is dressed in purple clothing with crown of thorns and is mocked
36. Crucifixion scene where he is mocked and dies among two thieves. Darkness falls. He says “why hast thou forsaken me”.
37. Joseph of Arimatheau takes the body of Jesus and places it in the sepulcher. He moves stone to cover it.
38. Jesus rises from the dead.

Then there was the added ending of Jesus floating up to heaven.

How is it that so many of us here can see this writing for what it is…. literature. It’s just literature with none of it actually being true. The gospel of Mark reads like an imaginative fictional play. As history it falls apart into complete nonsense. If this same story were presented in today’s time everyone would dismiss it as fiction. How do Christians today look at this story and claim, Yep that’s the truth right there. How do they claim that the events in these gospels could have actually happened? It’s not like Matthew, Luke, and John are any better. They contain even more embellishments.

The largest religion in the US is Christianity (76% as of 2008). How can this be? I truly feel that I am walking among crazy people. Robert Pirsig said: “When one person is delusional it can be labeled insanity. When many people are delusional it’s called religion.”

Do Christians believe these stories because the fear of hell has been pounded in their heads since they were children? Is it the fear of death and that this is the only story being offered to them by their communities in which they were raised? Is it because they believe they will be reunited with their body after death and live forever in heaven if they just believe that these things really happened? Are they afraid that if they don’t believe then they will burn forever in the eternal torture of hell fire? If so then this is weak in my opinion. Any logical person should be able to look at these gospels and dismiss them for what they are, fictional literature. I really want to know from any Christians here how they can actually believe the gospels.

[AnimatedDirt]

How is it that so many of us here can see this writing for what it is…. literature. It’s just literature with none of it actually being true. The gospel of Mark reads like an imaginative fictional play. As history it falls apart into complete nonsense.

You sure give the Bible a lot calling it literature.  Most of the NT is simply letters and not written with the intention of being a "book".

If this same story were presented in today’s time everyone would dismiss it as fiction. How do Christians today look at this story and claim, Yep that’s the truth right there. How do they claim that the events in these gospels could have actually happened? It’s not like Matthew, Luke, and John are any better. They contain even more embellishments.

Well, lets play the game.  Let's say there were some writings done today of this type.  We would be able to talk with the person writing the "book" and probe them.  We'd have eye witnesses to cross-examine.  We'd have at least only one generation separating the events with the writings.  Do you believe the writings of the Civil War are true or even that the Civil War really happened?  Why?  Pictures?  Photoshop.  Books?  Bible.  Video?  Final Cut Pro/movies.  Artifacts?  Archaeology.

Do Christians believe these stories because the fear of hell has been pounded in their heads since they were children? Is it the fear of death and that this is the only story being offered to them by their communities in which they were raised? Is it because they believe they will be reunited with their body after death and live forever in heaven if they just believe that these things really happened? Are they afraid that if they don’t believe then they will burn forever in the eternal torture of hell fire? If so then this is weak in my opinion. Any logical person should be able to look at these gospels and dismiss them for what they are, fictional literature. I really want to know from any Christians here how they can actually believe the gospels.

Are you saying to fear death or pain is to be weak?

[lundberg500]

You sure give the Bible a lot calling it literature. Most of the NT is simply letters and not written with the intention of being a "book".

Let's look at the definition of the word literature:

â€"noun
â€" n  
1.  written material such as poetry, novels, essays, etc, esp works of imagination characterized by excellence of style and expression and by themes of general or enduring interest  
2.  the body of written work of a particular culture or people: (like Scandinavian literature)  
3.  written or printed matter of a particular type or on a particular subject: (like scientific literature)
4.  printed material giving a particular type of information: (like sales literature)  
5.  the art or profession of a writer  
6. literary work or production.
7. any kind of printed material, as circulars, leaflets, or handbills: literature describing company products.

Where did I ever say anything about a book?

Do you believe the writings of the Civil War are true or even that the Civil War really happened? Why?

It's funny. I don't recall any Civil War stories claiming that General Lee walked on water, raised the dead, healed the sick, cast out demons, died, resurrected, and then floated up to heaven.  

Are you saying to fear death or pain is to be weak?

No, not at all. I am saying that to believe in such a fantastic tale filled with miracles JUST because you have been intimidated into believing that you will burn in hell is weak when you could use your own intellect to discover the realities of logic and common sense.

[AnimatedDirt]

Where did I ever say anything about a book?

Point taken.  :hmm: [/quote]
It makes no difference what is claimed, the point remains and the question remains.  Do you believe the Civil War is reality/true?  If so, what is your proof?

Are you saying to fear death or pain is to be weak?

No, not at all. I am saying that to believe in such a fantastic tale filled with miracles JUST because you have been intimidated into believing that you will burn in hell is weak when you could use your own intellect to discover the realities of logic and common sense.

Would you believe every story written and/or told about a certain instance that happened in the Civil War to be true?  Why or why not?  What would you use to divide tale from sense?

Logic?  When something is less probable than probable what does "logic" say will happen?  What if the improbability is so large a number it is incomprehensible?  Logic would say...

[lundberg500]

It makes no difference what is claimed

Oh my... yes it matters greatly what is claimed. Do you really see no difference when miracles are claimed and when they are not?

[Sophus]

Well, lets play the game.  Let's say there were some writings done today of this type.  We would be able to talk with the person writing the "book" and probe them.  We'd have eye witnesses to cross-examine.  We'd have at least only one generation separating the events with the writings.  Do you believe the writings of the Civil War are true or even that the Civil War really happened?  Why?  Pictures?  Photoshop.  Books?  Bible.  Video?  Final Cut Pro/movies.  Artifacts?  Archaeology.

There's evidence that the civil war happened other than the personal writings of a select few individuals. Those writings also have a strong tendency to not contradict each other (unlike the Gospels) and doesn't insult our good judgement by defying natural laws like fairy tales (unlike the Gospels). There's no reason to not be skeptical of a few guys claiming to have witnessed a miracle. Especially when they lie abut who they are.

[pinkocommie]

A lot of Christians I know seem to believe it because they're told, "Listen, it might sound a little wacky or fantastical, but if you believe this then when you die, you'll actually live forever in the coolest place that you can imagine with every person you've ever loved."  A lot of people want that enough that belief seems pretty easy - as long as they don't think about it too much.

[Thumpalumpacus]

It makes no difference what is claimed, the point remains and the question remains.  Do you believe the Civil War is reality/true?  If so, what is your proof?

There are scores of battlegrounds in the East and South which still have the mouldering bodies of soldiers dressed in the rotting uniforms of the respective sides.  There are plentiful gravestones in cemeteries attesting to the nature and cause of the deaths of the interred.  Mathew Brady, amongst others, took photos to worldwide acclaim.

What, exactly, is your point?  That religions lack this sort of solid evidence?  Well, we knew that already.

Would you believe every story written and/or told about a certain instance that happened in the Civil War to be true?  Why or why not?  What would you use to divide tale from sense?

Possibility would be the first place I'd start.  For instance, given that water is a yielding, fluid medium, the possibility of a man walking on it without sinking into it would be infinitesimal -- especially when you didn't have a Matthew Brady there, taking pictures to show that it happened.  Or if Joe down the street claimed to be a veteran of the siege of Vicksburg, I'd be very skeptical.  After all, he doesn't look to be 170 years old, and even if he did, the possibility of a man living that long is pretty slender.

Now, there are other ways to falsify claims about military service as well.  If, for instance, I read a book asserting that David Farragut was killed by the CSS Virginia in its rampage in 1863, I could be pretty sure that the book is wrong, because there is a wealth of documentation in government archives attesting to his leadership in the assault on Mobile Bay in 1864.

In short, one must weigh and balance sources in the proportion to which they comport with the physics of our world, what is known from archaeology, and how it comports with other contemporaneous sources.  It's really pretty simple.

Logic?  When something is less probable than probable what does "logic" say will happen?  What if the improbability is so large a number it is incomprehensible?  Logic would say...

Probability is a sub-discipline of mathematics, and not logic. The two disciplines are related, but not identical.

[Gawen]

Christianity creates the disease and the cure. They believe because they are afraid.

[lundberg500]

Christianity creates the disease and the cure. They believe because they are afraid.

Well put Gawen. This is what I am really starting to believe. Christians believe this story because of fear.
Fear instilled into them by the church. How sad.  

[AnimatedDirt]

There are scores of battlegrounds in the East and South which still have the mouldering bodies of soldiers dressed in the rotting uniforms of the respective sides.  There are plentiful gravestones in cemeteries attesting to the nature and cause of the deaths of the interred.  Mathew Brady, amongst others, took photos to worldwide acclaim.

What, exactly, is your point?  That religions lack this sort of solid evidence?  Well, we knew that already.

Oh so bodies of soldiers dressed in what is thought to be authentic Civil War uniforms...and there are no movies made today using "authentic" uniforms...what if some one is simply dressing dead bodies in these?  There are many explanations, all of which have a probability of being the case.

What is the probability of this "movies" theory?

Possibility would be the first place I'd start.  For instance, given that water is a yielding, fluid medium, the possibility of a man walking on it without sinking into it would be infinitesimal -- especially when you didn't have a Matthew Brady there, taking pictures to show that it happened.  Or if Joe down the street claimed to be a veteran of the siege of Vicksburg, I'd be very skeptical.  After all, he doesn't look to be 170 years old, and even if he did, the possibility of a man living that long is pretty slender.

Really.  So on instances of "biblical" happenings you revert to possibilities, but on belief in scientific matters you "believe" regardless of the probability however farfetched the probability says it is.  At what point does the high degree of improbability become impossible?

I'm a Christian and some say this leads to low IQ, but it seems to this person of low IQ that you pick and choose what you want to "believe" based on what falls within your bias.

Now, there are other ways to falsify claims about military service as well.  If, for instance, I read a book asserting that David Farragut was killed by the CSS Virginia in its rampage in 1863, I could be pretty sure that the book is wrong, because there is a wealth of documentation in government archives attesting to his leadership in the assault on Mobile Bay in 1864.

And our government is 100% honest and has never hidden, nor changed the facts to further their perceived agenda.  In other words, you trust your government to give you 100% truth.  Ok.

In short, one must weigh and balance sources in the proportion to which they comport with the physics of our world, what is known from archaeology, and how it comports with other contemporaneous sources.  It's really pretty simple.

Again, so when archaeology digs up evidence that supports your bias, it's proof, but when the same goes for biblical archaeology...

Probability is a sub-discipline of mathematics, and not logic. The two disciplines are related, but not identical.

I think I understand, based on the above.

[Gawen]

Christianity creates the disease and the cure. They believe because they are afraid.

Well put Gawen. This is what I am really starting to believe. Christians believe this story because of fear.
Fear instilled into them by the church. How sad.  

Sad indeed. And when you question it, you get sophistry, apologetics, circular reasoning, no good evidence, arguments that can't hold water and semantics.

It's a wonderful worldview, is it not...*chucklin*

[Asmodean]

It makes no difference what is claimed, the point remains and the question remains.  Do you believe the Civil War is reality/true?  If so, what is your proof?

Isn't there like a mountain of archeological data to support historical claims along with independent accounts and whatnot..?

I'm not sure, as I really don't give a damn about that there war, but I think me there is substantial evidence to support that it actually happened.

[AnimatedDirt]

It makes no difference what is claimed, the point remains and the question remains.  Do you believe the Civil War is reality/true?  If so, what is your proof?

Isn't there like a mountain of archeological data to support historical claims along with independent accounts and whatnot..?

I'm not sure, as I really don't give a damn about that there war, but I think me there is substantial evidence to support that it actually happened.

search for evidence, archaeological support, historical support for biblical 'fables/tales".  You may find some.

[Asmodean]

Google search for evidence, archaeological support, historical support for biblical 'fables/tales".  You may find some.

Sorry, I didn't turn up anything more definitive today than I did last month or a year ago on similar dares.