Proposition 19

[Ultima22689]

I'm sure people have heard of it, the proposition that will be voted on in Cali on November 2nd. It will legalize Mary Jane for all those who are 21 and above. It just got a major boost in the polls today and a lot of cash is being thrown at it.  Analysts were saying that it may not pass due to less youth turnout on midterm elections however there are polls indicating youth turnout should be high this November in California, no doubt due to the proposition itself. It looks like it will pass but then there's a chance it won't, we'll see. So what if it does pass? What do you think will happen? People write it off because it's weed but it's beginning to be taken very seriously because there is a strong chance it will.

This is America, money talks and i'm sure California is going to rake in a lot of cash from this and a legitimate marijuana industry will bloom there. I think it's going to eventually spread across the country if it passes. Other states will see how it performs and want to cash in on the money themselves. It's already evident in other states as candidates have actually debated about it. Seems like the age of prohibition is over or it's end is at least approaching fast. When that does happen, I wonder how legal pot will affect the country, I see it as mostly a good thing, arrests will plummet, more money into the economy, less people getting drunk and smoking tobacco. We'll have a commodity that no other country is taking advantage of, especially considering how versatile cannabis is aside from just smoking it, from food, fuel, paper, clothes and plenty of other things I think it will be beautiful to see it legal. So as I said above, thoughts?

[Sophus]

Normally I would like to see something like this get passed. However, since it's not at a federal level this could mean trouble. The alcohol age was lowered in some states and what happened was kids would drive from neighboring states to get a legal buzz. On the drive back, naturally they had accidents and killed people.

[Ultima22689]

So you would rather let hundreds of thousands get locked up every year, Mexico continue to turn into Somalia and waste massive amounts of money on a drug war because some kids MIGHT have accidents driving to California that they would have in their respective hometowns just buying from a dealer on their corner?

[Sophus]

In a perfect world the federal government would be handling this law, because I would hate to see interstate death tolls go through the roof. From AMA:

After Prohibition, nearly all states restricting youth access to alcohol designated 21 as the minimum legal drinking age (MLDA). Between 1970 and 1975, however, 29 states lowered the MLDA to 18, 19, or 20. These changes occurred when the minimum age for other activities, such as voting, also were being lowered (Wechsler & Sands, 1980). Scientists began studying the effects of the lowered MLDA, focusing particularly on the incidence of motor vehicle crashes, the leading cause of death among teenagers. Several studies in the 1970s found that motor vehicle crashes increased significantly among teens when the MLDA was lowered (Cucchiaro et al., 1974; Douglas et al., 1974; Wagenaar, 1983, 1993; Whitehead, 1977; Whitehead et al., 1975; Williams et al, 1974).

With evidence that a lower drinking age resulted in more traffic injuries and fatalities among youth, citizen advocacy groups pressured states to restore the MLDA to 21.

But, let me play Devil's Advocate to this. I believe I've read that cannabis doesn't impair motor skills as bad as alcohol. Whether or not it's enough to make a big difference on a highway, I don't know.

[Will]

It's polling above 50%. If we keep pushing, keep educating people on the medical benefits and lack of dangers (it takes like 1500 lbs. to OD), we can get this common sense legalization passed and get on with actual serious problems like unnecessary wars or the horrible economy.

[Ultima22689]

Indeed, I hope it goes through, i've been wanting to move to California for years now, this just sweetens the deal.

As for driving while stoned. When you drink alcohol you become careless and do reckless things. You smoke weed, you can get cautious or even paranoid. From my experience, driving stoned equates to actually driving safer, regardless of whether it improves or worsens the situation, people smoke and drive now, I don't get why that would change with prohibition ending, it's not like it's hard to get, weed is as easy as ordering a pizza.

[TheWilliam]

Indeed, I hope it goes through, i've been wanting to move to California for years now, this just sweetens the deal.

As for driving while stoned. When you drink alcohol you become careless and do reckless things. You smoke weed, you can get cautious or even paranoid. From my experience, driving stoned equates to actually driving safer, regardless of whether it improves or worsens the situation, people smoke and drive now, I don't get why that would change with prohibition ending, it's not like it's hard to get, weed is as easy as ordering a pizza.

it really is, and with the right guy it's faster.

and i'd like to ad to the driving thing.

i use reefer to make myself more meticulous and critical.

like, before I do stuff around the house like laundry, sanitizing,  I smoke a joint and it makes me check extra little details from corner to corner and I don't miss a  spot.

[Thumpalumpacus]

I'm going to vote in favor of this prop, but I'm pretty sure it won't matter, because on the Federal level the levers of power will be pulled to negate it.

When the Feds wanted the MLDA raised to 21 by every state, it simply adopted the policy of withholding highway funding until the law was changed.  I think the same thing will happen here, if it does indeed pass.

So far as driving high goes, when I used to smoke I hated driving high.  It made me too paranoid.  Plus, I reckon it's pretty dumb to be driving under the influence of a perception-altering drug.

[notself]

The Feds wont do anything if the law passes.  We have a President who is very familiar with recreational drugs.

[Ultima22689]

Aside from Obama's experience, it would be political suicide. Think about it, if you were up for re-election, what's the one state you don't want to piss off, that would be California who has the most amount of electoral votes by far. Not to mention Cali is the state that pretty much decided it for Obama. I don't think the fed will do a thing, they will simply remain quiet, if multiple states successfully implement a similar measure then I imagine that the feds will follow suit, as they should. This is exactly how alcohol prohibition ended FDR lifted the ban after several states had already did it at the state level.

[hismikeness]

My specific curiosity with this is by what margin the testing levels will have to be raised for a legal substance. Obviously companies will still test for it, but with THC staying in the system longer than the other legal substance companies test for- alcohol- I'm curious how high they'll raise the levels. Currently, my understanding is the test levels are 50-100 micrograms per milliliter. The problem is, at that level it could be either a habitual smoker or someone who snooker only two nights ago. That will be interesting.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Aside from Obama's experience, it would be political suicide.

Bush Jr won the presidency twice without carrying California.  Also, the margin even here for legalization is very narrow.  Advocating for legalization won't add any votes for him; those folk are already going to vote for him anyway.  It will only cost him votes from older folk who agree with his platform but disagree with legalization.  

He has little to gain, and, I think, more to lose.

[Ultima22689]

Aside from Obama's experience, it would be political suicide.

Bush Jr won the presidency twice without carrying California.  Also, the margin even here for legalization is very narrow.  Advocating for legalization won't add any votes for him; those folk are already going to vote for him anyway.  It will only cost him votes from older folk who agree with his platform but disagree with legalization.  

He has little to gain, and, I think, more to lose.

The pro legalization isn't just in California, he stands to lose a massive part of the youth vote across the country which was also instrumental in getting him elected.

[Thumpalumpacus]

The pro legalization isn't just in California, he stands to lose a massive part of the youth vote across the country which was also instrumental in getting him elected.

Insofar as potheads vote, you have a point.  But I don't see that they've flocked to the polls, at least not around here.

[Ultima22689]

The pro legalization isn't just in California, he stands to lose a massive part of the youth vote across the country which was also instrumental in getting him elected.

Insofar as potheads vote, you have a point.  But I don't see that they've flocked to the polls, at least not around here.

I think you underestimate how many youths smoke weed or don't have a problem with it, they may not look like pot heads but many of them are and then another portion of them think it's ok. During 2008 elections young people voted in droves, youth votes aren't to be underestimated, the problem is getting them to be enthusiastic about voting, a good way to do that is to come out pro pot. I think that may be the only possible way Palin can get elected as she has stated multiple times she's pro pot.