Ron Paul

[Ultima22689]

So does anyone like Ron Paul? I know i'm fairly far to the left and while there are for sure many things I don't agree with him with he is most certainly starting to rub my good side, what's the rest of you guys' opinions on the man?

[kenh]

While some of Ron Paul's policies are admirable, here is one reason I would never vote for him:

The Founding Fathers envisioned a robustly Christian yet religiously tolerant America, with churches serving as vital institutions that would eclipse the state in importance. Throughout our nation’s history, churches have done what no government can ever do, namely teach morality and civility. Moral and civil individuals are largely governed by their own sense of right and wrong, and hence have little need for external government. This is the real reason the collectivist Left hates religion: Churches as institutions compete with the state for the people’s allegiance, and many devout people put their faith in God before their faith in the state. Knowing this, the secularists wage an ongoing war against religion, chipping away bit by bit at our nation’s Christian heritage. Christmas itself may soon be a casualty of that war.

(an excerpt from his "The War on Religion")
http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul148.html

[Ultima22689]

Yeah, that's my point, he has some policies that sounds really, really good on the other hand he is kinda crazy like most republicans however he is more of a libertarian but that isn't a farcry from republican.

[Will]

He's a fundamentalist libertarian. I'm not a big fan of fundamentalism because it doesn't leave room for doubt.

[Whitney]

I don't think he can do anything redeeming enough to allow me to get over his crazy religious views that he apparently wants to force on people via government.  I don't get how he can be a libertarian yet wants to allow state and religion to mix; that would be more gov power not less.  Someone who basically wants a theocracy shouldn't be in a leadership role no matter what otherwise good ideas they may have.  Why trust someone who doesn't even follow the views of his own party?  From my understanding libertarianism is about maxing out freedom by making government involvement in our lives as small as possible (including cutting many socialized and welfare programs in favor of privately run schools and charities).  Ron Paul's religious views cloud his ability to realize that blurring the line between separation of church and state would give the government more power than less; why should we trust him to have clear reasoning on any other issue?

[SSY]

While some of Ron Paul's policies are admirable, here is one reason I would never vote for him:

The Founding Fathers envisioned a robustly Christian yet religiously tolerant America, with churches serving as vital institutions that would eclipse the state in importance. Throughout our nation’s history, churches have done what no government can ever do, namely teach morality and civility. Moral and civil individuals are largely governed by their own sense of right and wrong, and hence have little need for external government. This is the real reason the collectivist Left hates religion: Churches as institutions compete with the state for the people’s allegiance, and many devout people put their faith in God before their faith in the state. Knowing this, the secularists wage an ongoing war against religion, chipping away bit by bit at our nation’s Christian heritage. Christmas itself may soon be a casualty of that war.

(an excerpt from his "The War on Religion")
http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul148.html

What a nutter, note how fails to garnish his own views with some quotes from the founding fathers to back him up.

Also, welcome to the forum.

[andrewclunn]

While some of Ron Paul's policies are admirable, here is one reason I would never vote for him:

The Founding Fathers envisioned a robustly Christian yet religiously tolerant America, with churches serving as vital institutions that would eclipse the state in importance. Throughout our nation’s history, churches have done what no government can ever do, namely teach morality and civility. Moral and civil individuals are largely governed by their own sense of right and wrong, and hence have little need for external government. This is the real reason the collectivist Left hates religion: Churches as institutions compete with the state for the people’s allegiance, and many devout people put their faith in God before their faith in the state. Knowing this, the secularists wage an ongoing war against religion, chipping away bit by bit at our nation’s Christian heritage. Christmas itself may soon be a casualty of that war.

(an excerpt from his "The War on Religion")
http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul148.html

Odd, that doesn't sound any less "religious wacko" than Obama's anti-gay marriage stance.  I think people on the left delude them selves into believing that the left is more secular than it is.

[Ultima22689]

While some of Ron Paul's policies are admirable, here is one reason I would never vote for him:

The Founding Fathers envisioned a robustly Christian yet religiously tolerant America, with churches serving as vital institutions that would eclipse the state in importance. Throughout our nation’s history, churches have done what no government can ever do, namely teach morality and civility. Moral and civil individuals are largely governed by their own sense of right and wrong, and hence have little need for external government. This is the real reason the collectivist Left hates religion: Churches as institutions compete with the state for the people’s allegiance, and many devout people put their faith in God before their faith in the state. Knowing this, the secularists wage an ongoing war against religion, chipping away bit by bit at our nation’s Christian heritage. Christmas itself may soon be a casualty of that war.

(an excerpt from his "The War on Religion")
http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul148.html

Odd, that doesn't sound any less "religious wacko" than Obama's anti-gay marriage stance.  I think people on the left delude them selves into believing that the left is more secular than it is.

But Obama isn't spouting this is a Christian country and that the founding fathers founded the country on christian principles which isn't the case, not that makes his anti-gay marriage stance any less messed up, either way I'll have a hard time voting in 2012, maybe I'll consider Hilary more this time, I need to look up her policy however.

[andrewclunn]

I'm just saying that the liberals are no more secular than the libertarians.  Both play to religion often.  But at least both are tolerant of secular views.  There are secular humanists in both camps and Marxist in the liberal camp and Objectivists in the libertarian camp.  The dismissal of the Libertarians and clinging to the Democrats, when they have clearly shown that they are much more interested in expanding government involvement in the economy than repealing the affronts to personal liberty put forth by the Republicans or expanding civil liberties just strikes me as complete madness.  Why?  I do not believe the Democrats stand for what you have been made to believe they stand for.  (the 'you' here is not directed at anyone here in particular.)

[MommaSquid]

I agree with many of Ron Paul's views on government, taxes and laws.  I strongly disagree with his religious views.

I wrote him in as my vote for president in the last two elections.

[Sheeplauncher]

I agree with mommasquid though i couldn't vote yet but in 2012 i can. My ideal candidate besides ron paul (besides his religious views) would be gary johnson who was governor of new mexico who was libertarian minded and if he ran in 2012 i would support the hell out of him.

[Whitney]

gary johnson who was governor of new mexico who was libertarian minded and if he ran in 2012 i would support the hell out of him.

Bill Richardson was my fav from this past election even though he had to drop out due to lack of support (which means he might have lost my vote if he had kept running and I had more time to research his background)...I don't really know who Gary Johnson is.

[Ellainix]

I agree with many of Ron Paul's views on government, taxes and laws.  I strongly disagree with his religious views.

I wrote him in as my vote for president in the last two elections.

Ron Paul supports the Constitution!

[kenh]

Ron Paul has a perfect voting record in congress.

What is a perfect voting record?  From what viewpoint?
Just asking, I don't know anything about his record.

[Whitney]

Ron Paul has a perfect voting record in congress.

What is a perfect voting record?  From what viewpoint?
Just asking, I don't know anything about his record.

From my understanding, it just means he actually showed up and voted every time congress has voted on something while he is in office.  Most congressmen/women tend to miss a lot of voting opportunities due to absence.  "perfect voting record" has nothing to do with making quality choices.