Greetings From Earthling

[Earthling]

Stevil and Earthing

What is the point of the 10 post rule is you're both going to ignore it 

I don't understand, I thought the 10 post rule amounted to a restriction to the Get To Know You portion of the forums until that 10 post goal is reached. I'm anxious to reach that goal but how could I ignore it? Is there some restriction on the subject of the post that I may have overlooked, other than the lazy 1 word "hi" or "yes" posts?

[Earthling]

welcome Earthling, it'll be interesting to hear your take on things. Personally I don't think there's much left of Christianity if you try and remove 'pagan' influences. The same goes for Judaism too, I think both were products of their time and borrowed much of their mythology and theology from earlier external religions, cosmology and philosophy.

The nature of religion is to transmogrify the original meanings over time. You see this especially once an organized religion becomes sponsored by the state. Constantine with Christianity, for example, produced the Trinity and Cross. However, the original teachings can be seen beneath the infiltration of outside forces. Modern day Christianity is far removed from the original, of course, but it didn't borrow those influences from the start, but with much controversy and historical documentation.   

[Tank]

Stevil and Earthing

What is the point of the 10 post rule is you're both going to ignore it 

I don't understand, I thought the 10 post rule amounted to a restriction to the Get To Know You portion of the forums until that 10 post goal is reached. I'm anxious to reach that goal but how could I ignore it? Is there some restriction on the subject of the post that I may have overlooked, other than the lazy 1 word "hi" or "yes" posts?

Basically the idea of 'getting to know you' is 'getting to know you' not 'let's debate religion'.

[Tank]

Earthling

I have move this thread to religion
I have locked this thread
I have restricted you to Getting To Know You area until you convince me you haven't just come here to preach.
So I suggest you go to the Laid Back Lounge and start interacting with the forum as a member and not just a preacher.

Tank

PS If anybody feels that I could have handled this better please PM me.  

[Whitney]

Stevil and Earthing

What is the point of the 10 post rule is you're both going to ignore it 

I don't understand, I thought the 10 post rule amounted to a restriction to the Get To Know You portion of the forums until that 10 post goal is reached. I'm anxious to reach that goal but how could I ignore it? Is there some restriction on the subject of the post that I may have overlooked, other than the lazy 1 word "hi" or "yes" posts?

Debating religion isn't "Laid Back" an "Introduction" nor does it allow people to Get to Know You in any meaningful manner.  You are restricted to the genre of post types that are described in the sections....and there is even a sticky post in the "laid back" area that says not to post controversial topics there.

[Tank]

Earthling

I've had a thunk and I've unrestricted you. You can carry on with this thread, here in religion, after 3 more posts as you currently have 7.

[Earthling]

Earthling

I've had a thunk and I've unrestricted you. You can carry on with this thread, here in religion, after 3 more posts as you currently have 7.

My apologies to the forum, it was a misunderstanding on my part. I suppose that I spend so much time doing this that there isn't a great deal more to discuss. It is a big part of my . . . life, for lack of a better term? 

[Stevil]

My questions lead to your explanation, so really it is my fault.
I was simply interested to know more about your position, rather than to debate it for now.

[McQ]

Group hug!!!

[xSilverPhinx]

And happy ending!

_{Or is it?}

[Earthling]

My background's in archaeology, and it doesn't back up the Bible in any way shape or form. In fact it contradicts most of the OT narrative, and hasn't provided any evidence to back up the NT either. As for eyewitness testimony, the OT books were written centuries after any supposed events, and the NT books were written decades after, often 50 or more years. So I'm not sure you can say your beliefs are based on 'cold facts', but it'll be interesting to hear your take on these things.

When I think of something that can compare to the possible variations in interpretation, being subject to interpretation, next to the Bible is archaeology. Though archaeology and the Bible don't always agree, of course, in fact archaeology doesn't always agree with archaeology.

Consider Belshazzar (Daniel 5:1-30) Until the discovery of small cylinders of cuneiform in southern Iraq the Bible was the only mention of Belshazzar. The prosperity of King Salomon's time; the stela of Moab's revolution discovered in 1868 in Jordan; the Babylonian Chronicle are some examples.   

[Earthling]

And happy ending!

_{Or is it?}

I'm cool. No worries here.

[Too Few Lions]

My background's in archaeology, and it doesn't back up the Bible in any way shape or form. In fact it contradicts most of the OT narrative, and hasn't provided any evidence to back up the NT either. As for eyewitness testimony, the OT books were written centuries after any supposed events, and the NT books were written decades after, often 50 or more years. So I'm not sure you can say your beliefs are based on 'cold facts', but it'll be interesting to hear your take on these things.

When I think of something that can compare to the possible variations in interpretation, being subject to interpretation, next to the Bible is archaeology. Though archaeology and the Bible don't always agree, of course, in fact archaeology doesn't always agree with archaeology.

Consider Belshazzar (Daniel 5:1-30) Until the discovery of small cylinders of cuneiform in southern Iraq the Bible was the only mention of Belshazzar. The prosperity of King Salomon's time; the stela of Moab's revolution discovered in 1868 in Jordan; the Babylonian Chronicle are some examples.   

I was thinking more the stories that were once considered historical, but which archaeology has shown are just myths, eg the Flood or the Exodus.

The Book of Daniel clearly isn't a historical book, it was most probably written some 400 years after Belshazaar lived! The fact that some stories contain the names of historical figures doesn't mean that the stories themselves are historically accurate.

As for Solomon, the Bible claims that he had a mighty empire that stretched from the Euphrates to Egypt, whereas archaeology has shown this wasn't the case, and his mighty capital at Jerusalem was probably just a small town. There's also no archaeological evidence for Solomon's temple, and archaeology suggests the Jews weren't even monotheistic in the time of Solomon.

[Too Few Lions]

welcome Earthling, it'll be interesting to hear your take on things. Personally I don't think there's much left of Christianity if you try and remove 'pagan' influences. The same goes for Judaism too, I think both were products of their time and borrowed much of their mythology and theology from earlier external religions, cosmology and philosophy.

The nature of religion is to transmogrify the original meanings over time. You see this especially once an organized religion becomes sponsored by the state. Constantine with Christianity, for example, produced the Trinity and Cross. However, the original teachings can be seen beneath the infiltration of outside forces. Modern day Christianity is far removed from the original, of course, but it didn't borrow those influences from the start, but with much controversy and historical documentation.  

I totally agree with you on this, I think that the main branches of Christianity today are based on the religion Constantine and his cronies (re)created in the fourth century. My problem is that I don't think there's anything in Judaism and Christianity that you can't trace back to earlier philosophies and religions. Even the Christian idea of God itself is very similar to that found in Greek philosophy, and the concept of a Son of God is also something we find in Hellenic religion. Plus the majority of the teachings of Jesus are found in earlier Greek philosophy too.

oh, and I'm glad you've reached your ten posts. Sorry, it was partly my fault too, I shouldn't have weighed into a debate til you'd hit your tenth post.

[Earthling]

I was thinking more the stories that were once considered historical, but which archaeology has shown are just myths, eg the Flood or the Exodus.

In the case of a worldwide deluge, what could we expect to see? We have indication that the oceans were smaller and continents larger, we have river channels extending out far under the oceans. It is believed that the mountains in the distant past were much lower, some mountains have been pushed up from under the seas. There is ten times as much water by volume in the oceans as there is land above sea level. If it were dumped evenly in the see the water would cover the entire earth 1 and 1/2 miles deep.

The water vapor canopy that was raised earlier in Genesis chapter 1, would have protected the inhabitants of earth from harmful radiation, resulting in shorter lifespans after the flood. The change in radiation would also have altered the rate of formation of radioactive carbon-14, invalidating all dates prior to the flood. 2 tons of water per square inch would have formed new mountains, raised old mountains to new heights, deepened shallow sea basins, created new shorelines, and fossilized fauna and flora quickly.

The canopy would have allowed for a global tropical to sub-tropical climate, the sudden devastation would have changed dramatically the climate very quickly. There would be the remains of mammoths and rhinoceroses being discovered in odd places with vegetation in their frozen mouth and stomachs. In Siberian cliffs and Alaskan ice. Lions, tigers, bears, and elk would be found in common strata indicating a simultaneous destruction.

Flood stories would spread out with the scattering of people throughout the globe. Folklore from the Chinese, Druids, Egyptians, Greeks, Eskimos, Greenlanders, Africans, Hindus, Native Americans . . .

As for the Exodus, how much archaeological evidence would one expect from a nomadic people traveling through the wilderness beginning in 1513 B.C.E. who didn't make towns, didn't establish villages. 

The Book of Daniel clearly isn't a historical book, it was most probably written some 400 years after Belshazaar lived! The fact that some stories contain the names of historical figures doesn't mean that the stories themselves are historically accurate.

Daniel was written about 536 B.C.E. Belshazzar's rule ended on the night of October 5, 539 B.C.E. (Gregorian calendar / October 11 Julian calendar)

As for Solomon, the Bible claims that he had a mighty empire that stretched from the Euphrates to Egypt, whereas archaeology has shown this wasn't the case, and his mighty capital at Jerusalem was probably just a small town. There's also no archaeological evidence for Solomon's temple, and archaeology suggests the Jews weren't even monotheistic in the time of Solomon.

I'm just curious, could you demonstrate how archaeology has shown these things?