More of a Misotheist...Is there room here?

[Tristan Jay]

Hello, I'm calling myself Tristan, which is pretty close to the actual mark.  I have a lot of friends and family who are Christian, or who believe in loving God.  But I've struggled with my belief, been very appalled and disappointed by religion, and how religion has intersected with politics and the justice system.  Now, I'm just mainly angry.

I can't decide if I'm agnostic.  I can't decide if I want to remain Christian and believe in Jesus, but continue to hate God (to see if I can cheat and hedge my bets).  I can't stop myself from hating God.  I try to imagine not believing in a God of some form, but somehow I feel like it's very easy to believe in him.  But either version I try to imagine, I don't like.  I don't like the Bible's version of God.  If any of us acted like he is depicted, we would be locked away as criminally insane, a dangerous psychopathic narcissist.  The other version I can imagine is one who is so far beyond what the Bible is capable of depicting in it's tedious way; but I can't excuse this version of God either because he didn't do a good enough job with the whole creation thing.  He messed it up.  Again, if anyone of us creates something and botches the job, we are held responsible (or we feel guilty and hold ourselves responsible).  The second version of God does not take responsibility.  I researched this, and came across the term "misotheist."  This has made things difficult for me, as I do not know what kind of forum to go to.  Misotheism isn't atheism, and I don't feel like it's a worthwhile to venture into Christian forums, as the ones I've looked into have disappointed me with the nature of their discourse.  There aren't really any misotheism forums I've found, except for a webpage with a bunch of people being gratuitous and silly in their anger.  I don't want to be silly or gratuitous.

So here I am, searching.  Hello to you all.

[Too Few Lions]

hello and welcome, I've never heard of the phrase 'misotheist' before, it's nice to learn a new word. Looking it up I see it means 'god hater', it seems to me there's no real point in wasting any energy hating something that doesn't exist!

As for the idea of a botched creation and faulty world created by a demented and imperfect god, the Gnostics wrote some interesting stuff on it 2000 years ago if you haven't read any of their ideas already.

[Whitney]

Welcome to haf.

I can see how someone could come to hate the idea of God, there is a lot of needless suffering in the world that I would expect any sort of good god to do something about.  Really the whole way the world works is really quite evil if you look at it as a form of creation...like was it really necessary to design it so everything has to fight against each other to survive?  It is much easier to see the beauty from a secular perspective (or do what most theists do and compartmentalize away the issues).

It might help you to think about why you feel there must be a god.  Imo, if given the choice to just believe or not, it would seem better for your own mental health to not believe than to believe in an evil god that you are constantly mad at.

Btw, you haven't done anything wrong but I wanted to make sure you were aware of our 50 post rule.  If not, check out the rules board so you'll know how we operate here: http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?board=9.0  Basically, till you reach your 50 avoid serious topics and instead focus on getting to know the other forum members....it makes actual discussions much more fruitful later on because respect is developed prior to jumping into debate.

[Tristan Jay]

Welcome to haf.

I can see how someone could come to hate the idea of God, there is a lot of needless suffering in the world that I would expect any sort of good god to do something about.  Really the whole way the world works is really quite evil if you look at it as a form of creation...like was it really necessary to design it so everything has to fight against each other to survive?  It is much easier to see the beauty from a secular perspective (or do what most theists do and compartmentalize away the issues).

It might help you to think about why you feel there must be a god.  Imo, if given the choice to just believe or not, it would seem better for your own mental health to not believe than to believe in an evil god that you are constantly mad at.

Btw, you haven't done anything wrong but I wanted to make sure you were aware of our 50 post rule.  If not, check out the rules board so you'll know how we operate here: http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?board=9.0  Basically, till you reach your 50 avoid serious topics and instead focus on getting to know the other forum members....it makes actual discussions much more fruitful later on because respect is developed prior to jumping into debate.

The policy makes sense.  I was curious, and I've seen that non-atheist posters are here in the mix.  And like I said, I'm trying to sort my feelings on the nature of the universe, spiritual or not, god or no god.  My misotheistic instincts were the first way spirituality manifested when I was very young, it really is very instinctive.

I agree with you that it's seems like a waste of energy to go out of my way to hate something.  I think part of it stems from my personality type.  It's a struggle.  But I won't get too deeply into it.

A few other things about myself, I like teaching but am right now doing stocking at a retail store, I occasionally write random stuff recreationally (not on the internet very often, it's more of a journalling kind of thing).  I swing dance, lindy hop is my favorite swing step; I used to play in bands, I like to sing (and am contemplating getting into Karaoke more).  My favorite type of music is movie soundtrack music (but I do like Queensryche and some of Journey's obvious power ballads).  I love reading, mainly science fiction and fantasy, but I've been branching out a lot; there's a lot of joy in the 1930's pulp fiction short stories.  Recently I've ventured further into short stories with Sherlock Holmes, Rudyard Kipling's work, and a volume from the Hornblower series that serves well as an introductory anthology.  Favorite TV show is Doctor Who. 

[The Magic Pudding]

Hello Tristan

Are Deist forums of no help to you?
Believing there's a god who doesn't care and you don't have to please seems mostly harmless.

[Tank]

Hi Tristran

I like Dr Who too! I a was born in '59 and Dr Who has been around for a very large part of my life. I like SiFi too and fantasy by Terry Pratchett. You may like his discworld stories, you might try 'Small Gods' for starters.

I'm also a huge fan of 'Strictly Come Dancing' and you must be pretty fit if you can Lindy Hop! My Karaoke song is Bad Moon Rising as it is easy, short and requires absolutely NO vocal talent whatsoever!

I hope you make your 50 as I would definitely like to discuss your world view.

Welcome to HAF.

Regards
Chris

[xSilverPhinx]

Welcome!

I agree, the god of the bible looks more like the devil than anything else.

[Tristan Jay]

My thanks to The Magic Pudding for bringing that to my attention, it is helpful; and I'm following up with that.

And Tank, that's awesome to contemplate that you may have seen some of those DW stories that were erased and don't exist anymore, except in novelization form.  With Lindy Hop, well, I should dance more, and it is quite a cardio workout, especially dancing to a bunch of songs in a row.  My wife and I occasionally look in on the show Dancing With the Stars, but we are always baffled by when they call a routine a Lindy or Charleston or East Coast routine, it which usually means it has a moment or two of the actual step, with everything else being...well, everything else!

Thanks for the welcome, everybody!

[DeterminedJuliet]

Hi friend

I think my husband could have been classified as someone who went through a period of being "angry with God" before he became a straight up atheist. I never really went through that myself, most of my experiences with religion where pretty positive, actually. I just got older and realized that none of it made much sense.

I hope your experience here helps you, no matter which camp you end up in. 

[Willow]

Hello Tristan.
Don't tell anyone, it's a secret, but I was called Mary until I was about 20, then had my name changed legally a couple of years later.  Now only my family know my given name.  You can leave a name behind.

I want to be Doctor Who.

[Twentythree]

Hello, I'm calling myself Tristan, which is pretty close to the actual mark.  I have a lot of friends and family who are Christian, or who believe in loving God.  But I've struggled with my belief, been very appalled and disappointed by religion, and how religion has intersected with politics and the justice system.  Now, I'm just mainly angry.

I can't decide if I'm agnostic.  I can't decide if I want to remain Christian and believe in Jesus, but continue to hate God (to see if I can cheat and hedge my bets).  I can't stop myself from hating God.  I try to imagine not believing in a God of some form, but somehow I feel like it's very easy to believe in him.  But either version I try to imagine, I don't like.  I don't like the Bible's version of God.  If any of us acted like he is depicted, we would be locked away as criminally insane, a dangerous psychopathic narcissist.  The other version I can imagine is one who is so far beyond what the Bible is capable of depicting in it's tedious way; but I can't excuse this version of God either because he didn't do a good enough job with the whole creation thing.  He messed it up.  Again, if anyone of us creates something and botches the job, we are held responsible (or we feel guilty and hold ourselves responsible).  The second version of God does not take responsibility.  I researched this, and came across the term "misotheist."  This has made things difficult for me, as I do not know what kind of forum to go to.  Misotheism isn't atheism, and I don't feel like it's a worthwhile to venture into Christian forums, as the ones I've looked into have disappointed me with the nature of their discourse.  There aren't really any misotheism forums I've found, except for a webpage with a bunch of people being gratuitous and silly in their anger.  I don't want to be silly or gratuitous.

So here I am, searching.  Hello to you all.

Welcome. I would encourage you to not allow anger to influence your world views, or your beliefs or lack therein. Spirituality is a very private thing and can be taken advantage of in the wrong hands. My advice would be to remain as neutral as possible and just educate yourself. Ask tons of questions and seek out your own answers. This is a great place to get started lots of active minds post here.

[YoungAtheist]

When I first heard this word, I always pictured people hating other people who believe in a god or gods.

[absurdsolidarity]

Hi and welcome!

I hope this board can help you answer the questions you've raised for yourself.  Hearing from other people who have gone through the same confusion that you are now is a really wonderful way to gain perspective.  I'm sure we all can learn from your thoughts too. 

[Shy]

Welcome.

I had some anger issues with God myself. Then I was kinda able to drop him like a hot potato. I think I felt angry because I felt the pressure that I was supposed to believe and love him, but that was fighting against all my questions and reasoning which then all snowballed into hate. It's different for all, hope you find what your looking for here. 

[Sweetdeath]

Hi Tristian!
I thimk most athiests have gone through the "pissed off at God phase."
I myself don't get bothered anymore, except when religious nutballs attempt to explain to me that serial killers and child murderers are all part of "god's" plan. I want to slap them with a banana.


Seriously though, get through thr anger phase, and you won't stressed out about a lot.