crazy UK church claiming it can cure HIV....

[DeterminedJuliet]

Telling a HIV patient "stop taking your meds, cuz God made you all better" and then letting said person slowly die, completely unawares and unprepared for their death is seriously one of the most evil things I can think of.

Oh, let them..! If an HIV patient is dumb enough to trust some twat with a cross over a doctor with seven or eight years of education, he deserves whatever is coming for him in my book.

HIV is no longer a death sentence, so as I see it, if you don't want to live with the virus and take your meds, your alternatives are pretty much fuck the meds and die.

I get your point, but there's a reason why doctors need a license to give out medical advice - as a society we want people to actually know what the fuck they're talking about when it comes to life and death situations. These asshats obviously didn't and once they start using their authority to tell people what they should be doing with their physical bodies, as opposed to their "spiritual bodies" (or whatever), I think they should be as legally culpable as someone selling placebos who claim it can cure cancer.

[Sandra Craft]

I get your point, but there's a reason why doctors need a license to give out medical advice - as a society we want people to actually know what the fuck they're talking about when it comes to life and death situations. These asshats obviously didn't and once they start using their authority to tell people what they should be doing with their physical bodies, as opposed to their "spiritual bodies" (or whatever), I think they should be as legally culpable as someone selling placebos who claim it can cure cancer.

Then there's the issue of sick kids whose parents go in for healing prayer exclusively, as opposed to tossing it in along with medical treatment.  They don't have a choice, and I've heard people defend the parents on the grounds of both religious freedom and parental authority.  I find it very hard to remain calm when explaining why I think a child's health, and possibly life, matter more than the parents "rights".

[DeterminedJuliet]

I get your point, but there's a reason why doctors need a license to give out medical advice - as a society we want people to actually know what the fuck they're talking about when it comes to life and death situations. These asshats obviously didn't and once they start using their authority to tell people what they should be doing with their physical bodies, as opposed to their "spiritual bodies" (or whatever), I think they should be as legally culpable as someone selling placebos who claim it can cure cancer.

Then there's the issue of sick kids whose parents go in for healing prayer exclusively, as opposed to tossing it in along with medical treatment.  They don't have a choice, and I've heard people defend the parents on the grounds of both religious freedom and parental authority.  I find it very hard to remain calm when explaining why I think a child's health, and possibly life, matter more than the parents "rights".

Holy shit, I didn't even think of that. Yeah. That makes me sick. And angry.

[Squid]

I get your point, but there's a reason why doctors need a license to give out medical advice - as a society we want people to actually know what the fuck they're talking about when it comes to life and death situations. These asshats obviously didn't and once they start using their authority to tell people what they should be doing with their physical bodies, as opposed to their "spiritual bodies" (or whatever), I think they should be as legally culpable as someone selling placebos who claim it can cure cancer.

Then there's the issue of sick kids whose parents go in for healing prayer exclusively, as opposed to tossing it in along with medical treatment.  They don't have a choice, and I've heard people defend the parents on the grounds of both religious freedom and parental authority.  I find it very hard to remain calm when explaining why I think a child's health, and possibly life, matter more than the parents "rights".

Reminded me of an article in Pediatrics some years ago:

Objective. To evaluate deaths of children from families in which faith healing was practiced in lieu of medical care and to determine if such deaths were preventable.

Design. Cases of child fatality in faith-healing sects were reviewed. Probability of survival for each was then estimated based on expected survival rates for children with similar disorders who receive medical care.

Participants. One hundred seventy-two children who died between 1975 and 1995 and were identified by referral or record search. Criteria for inclusion were evidence that parents withheld medical care because of reliance on religious rituals and documentation sufficient to determine the cause of death.

Results. One hundred forty fatalities were from conditions for which survival rates with medical care would have exceeded 90%. Eighteen more had expected survival rates of >50%. All but 3 of the remainder would likely have had some benefit from clinical help.

Conclusions. When faith healing is used to the exclusion of medical treatment, the number of preventable child fatalities and the associated suffering are substantial and warrant public concern. Existing laws may be inadequate to protect children from this form of medical neglect.

Asser, S. & Swan, R. (1998). Child Fatalities From Religion-motivated Medical Neglect. Pediatrics, 101(4), 625-629.

[Sweetdeath]

That article broke my heart...

There clearly needs to be a line and law drawn when it comes to "religious rights."