Evolution the myth

[Asmodean]

And you can know everything through google, why we debate then? Why this forum then?

How do you think Google "knows" things? By the will of Odin?

By making this forum and paying for it, it turned to be yours?!!

Is Whitney's forum. Available to public is not the same as public owned. For instance, the road outside my house is mine while I rent the place. However, anyone can walk on it.

And you think you can turn its members to be yours?

Incoherent.

If you don't want to debate this topic, leave here to any other thread or show us your personal judgment away from any rules and against free respectful speech.

Still incoherent. Oh, and respectful preach is not allowed here. Nor is trolling. That there is abuse of free speech. Up until now, you have not debated anything, even though we tried to help you start a good debate. All you do in reply is spew unsubstantiated nonsense.

[Whitney]

Happy Forever is banned for a week for being rude to the site owner and for showing no desire to follow the rules or even attempt to discuss properly..in short, trolling.

Note HF can log in and see posts during the ban.....

[Asmodean]

Well... We gave him (Or was it her..?) a fair chance and you and the mod team have been more than patient enough... 

[Stevil]

Happy Foever, if you want people to take you seriously and not think that you're just trolling then,

I am already convinced this person is not interested in intelligent conversation.
I have not seen any honest questions asked from this person with this person looking to learn from any potential answers.

Happy Forever is only interested in stirring and trying to push his/her points, whatever those points may be.
Waste of time.

Happy Forever if you are truly interested in understanding the theory of evolution there are any good books and websites and likely forums dedicated to evolution.

[xSilverPhinx]

Happy Foever, if you want people to take you seriously and not think that you're just trolling then,

I am already convinced this person is not interested in intelligent conversation.
I have not seen any honest questions asked from this person with this person looking to learn from any potential answers.

Happy Forever is only interested in stirring and trying to push his/her points, whatever those points may be.
Waste of time.

Agreed. I just gave him the benefit of the doubt because most creationists are terribly ignorant but not stupid. I'm not too sure if that's the case here, since Happy Forever doesn't show any sign that he is understanding what we're trying to tell him. Maybe the language barrier or something...

[DeterminedJuliet]

This entire thread was painful to read. Kudos to those who tried to have a sensible discussion.

[The Magic Pudding]

Although evolution is against science and logic, yet countless people follow it in this age of science and mind!

May anyone who thinks of this myth interpret birth and life and death which are the evidence of its fallacy?


Thanks in advance.

From this first post it should have been obvious this wasn't going to be productive.

I've typed and deleted a line or two, I'll just say I think the approach of a very recent MacQ post on a similar theme expresses my feelings.

It's too easy to be trolled by someone claiming to be an Arab woman with poor English.

[Tank]

HF was so desparate to respond that SHE sent this email to the admin who passed it on to me. I thought I would share it with you as it does put this 'tin lid' on her thoughts 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeEUANN9wsk

Dear brother Tank,

To watch a video presented by an old man with quite voice and nice music and colorful pictures will not turn unlogical concept to a fact. I can do the same but I will not cuz I don't need tricky shows.

Let's think together what is eye and why and how?

Eyes are given to us not evolved, we are born with it. Eyes are the tools that make us see. Eyes are blind in themselves, it is us who see through them. Why??

Because The Creator is merciful to grant us these eyes and allow us to see with them.

But what this video says and why it is unlogical?

As I said, eyes are blind in themselves, it is us who see through them so,

A light touches an eye will not make it to refresh and see for your sake but it does its written role.

You the only mindful here didn't create your eyes, you were created with them. The eye is like you or less, it was created to do its role. If there is something here is keen to see, it is you not the eye. If a light touched blind thing for billions of trillions of years will not turn to seer.

This is the trick. The same for your ears and nose and elbows and legs and arms and teeth.

Here is the right clear picture of evolution which I tried to deliver to you:

Evolution is self development through countless years by chance or natural selection or randomness.

If we applied this definition in another a universe other than this, it would be as such:

There is a mindful thing existed by itself---it develops itself by time to be bigger and stronger---- it amend itself as it knows itself well as it is its maker---- it will never die because death is against its purpose of life which is selfishness and desire to be the best.
This imaginable thing will never make another thing to challenge it but use any avaiable means to strengthen itself. Every part of it is made by it, every part of it has nothing to do but to do what it does automatically without choice.

Finally this thing or this universe is a myth because no mindful thing exist by itself and will not find things existed by itself to develop itself.


What about this universe?

It is not one thing and not consistedof parts. It is independant creatures not existed by themselves or develop by themselves because they no nothing about their own creation and cannot amend themselves to live forever.

This existence is based on integration, very accurate organized integration. Everything has a role must do it not because it has nothing but to do it but because it is its role for which it was created.
The eye was created for you to make you see not you who created the eye to be able to see. Here is another clear logical evidence:

A blind deaf mindless thing will remain as is even if we waited for it to evolve for endless years, why?

Because a deaf doesn't know what is the meaning of sound and never experience it, how will it make itself hear?
A blind doesn't know what is the meaning of sight and never experience it, how will it make itself seer?

If a thing evoved itself, why it let itself die and make another thing to live instead of it?
Why it allows itself to die?

That is why birth and death and life are aagainst evolution.

Meditate the very accurate integration of the creation of Allah and think by your mind and see by your eyes and hear by your ears not by others mind and eyes and ears.

Ask yourself, why the sun rises? Why the sun sets? Why rain water is sweat? Why do I have eyes? Why trees produce delicious fruits? Why earth is paved? Why birth? Why death? Why am I here?

What everything stops, is there something to enforce it other than Allah?
What if your eyes stop to see for no reason, can you force it to see?
What if your heart stops to beat, can you force it to beat?

Why brother?

Nothing is by chance, or else there is no science and there is no nature. Your creation starting from a sperm to a clot to bones with flesh to fetus then a baby is not by chance. A chance can never turn to be a law even after trillions of years.

Randomness: Where is randomness here?

Natural selection: Let's nature selects, desire that claims to cause chance is not magical to make changed by itself. A white skin doesn't turn to dark from sun rays out of natural selection as skin itslef doesn't feel but you who feels, you who feel pain and suffered not the skin. If skin turned to be dark not to avoid the harm of the sun for your sake and not out of interactions and not by you, as skin doesn't know you and interactions is the processes itself not the doer and you are just a watcher not a doer.

"Nothing done by itself and nothing is forced for anything"


I have a miracle from Allah, a challenge against humanity at the age of science. if you'd like to continue our debate, you know my email, it is for respectful religious debate only.

Glory and praise be to Allah The One The Creator



All the best and farewell.


P.S   Life is a big trick.


لا إله إلا الله
{name removed}
{email address removed}

[The Magic Pudding]

Do any of the multilingual or other members have an opinion as to whether the language seems authentic?

[OldGit]

Here's a total guess, and I could well be wrong:

It really is by someone whose first language is very different - not, say, French or German whose structures are more or less like our own.  They have spent time in the UK, probably in education, but arrived here too late to pick up our syntax (typically after age 10 - 12).

The alternative would surely be a very clever, creative and consistent hoaxer.

But, I repeat, I've presumed a lot there and may well get egg on my face.

[xSilverPhinx]

What a complete mess of the topic she makes. Ever heard of non-overlapping magesteira? if you want to incorporate actual facts of reality into your worldview, you have to compromise to some extent, otherwise it's based on falsehoods. I know that if I were a non-solipist and religious, I wouldn't want that...

Well, for what it's worth, if she's still reading the replies to this thread, it's worth mentioning (though I doubt it would register with her...) that evolution can't be analysed from the 'finished product'. You can't look at already formed and evolved eyes and say that it couldn't have come about by chance, because then you'll commit an error by trying to calculate what the odds are that an extremely complex and functional apparatus instantaneously formed, which ultimately leads to idiotic arguments such as Hoyle's what are the odds of a wind sweeping through a junkyard and assembling a fully functional passenger plane?

Since there is actual evidence pointing to evolution as a fact, it's pointless and not to mention fallacious to try to calculate any odds based on that perspective. Obviously if you were to look at an already evolved human being and say that the odds of nature producing us from scratch are so low that it's close to zero, then you would need a concious designer capable of planning and foresight to explain our existence.  

Though, just for the record, the odds of eyes (of all intermediate types) existing through an evolutionary process is 100%.

[The Magic Pudding]

What a complete mess of the topic she makes. Ever heard of non-overlapping magesteira? if you want to incorporate actual facts of reality into your worldview, you have to compromise to some extent, otherwise it's based on falsehoods. I know that if I were a non-solipist and religious, I wouldn't want that...

I know what you mean, intelligent Christians, Muslims too saw the old creationist story couldn't be maintained, not without knowingly pedalling falsehood.  God banging his stick and life formed and then proceeded to evolve as he knew it would, how he planned, I don't admire this story, but the creationist alternative of just closing your eyes and accepting such a convoluted bunch of lies just boggles the mind.  I'm tempted to say they hurt my brain, make them go away, but that's what they do. 

I think I need to check out the image dump, that helps.

[Velma]

Happy Foever, if you want people to take you seriously and not think that you're just trolling then,

I am already convinced this person is not interested in intelligent conversation.
I have not seen any honest questions asked from this person with this person looking to learn from any potential answers.

Happy Forever is only interested in stirring and trying to push his/her points, whatever those points may be.
Waste of time.

Happy Forever if you are truly interested in understanding the theory of evolution there are any good books and websites and likely forums dedicated to evolution.

From what I've seen elsewhere, it would be easier to converse with HF about how octagonal the color red is than it would be to converse with her about TOE.

[Stevil]

Now that everything has cooled down. I've just re-read this thread.

I am still baffled as to why so many people were trying so hard and so honestly to have a conversation.
From what I read there has never been a conversation between anyone and Happy Forever.
HF makes some outrageous bold claim, with no attempt to substantiate it at all.

Just keeps telling everyone they are wrong and that they are following a myth and then demanding them again to provide evidence or logic.

[Tank]

Now that everything has cooled down. I've just re-read this thread.

I am still baffled as to why so many people were trying so hard and so honestly to have a conversation.
From what I read there has never been a conversation between anyone and Happy Forever.
HF makes some outrageous bold claim, with no attempt to substantiate it at all.

Just keeps telling everyone they are wrong and that they are following a myth and then demanding them again to provide evidence or logic.

I understand what your saying but just because one's interlocutor is behaving in an irrational and unreasonable manner doesn't mean one has to respond in kind. It's good training to learn to keep one's cool