Rules and rules breakers

[Gawen]

I don't know why people try to argue over very simple easy to follow new member rules; breaking them just means their posts get moved to where they can't participate and breaking them repeatedly just annoys me (and the rest of the mods) because we have to move a lot of threads; and that's how people get themselves banned quickly.

The following is not a response directly to Whitney and this boards Mods but, rather a general reply in that I know where she's coming from.

Having been a moderator at several Discussion and RPG Boards since 1997 and Head Administrator and one of three on the (for lack of better words) BoD for the most recent DB i was in, I reckon I can say a few words here.

Some boards offer no holds barred. Others adhere to certain modicums of civility, copyrights, 50 post count rules before they can become active in other forums on the site and whatnot. What users must consider is the quality of educational DB's, like this one and their rules and how they're run and policed, so to speak. Recently, at a radio controlled aircraft DB, I asked a question by starting a new thread. The very first response wasn't an off topic one-liner, it was an off topic paragraph of tongue-in-cheek gibberish. I learned nothing. Had I been a moderator or Admin in that DB, I would have removed that post and stuck it in the board's recycle bin.

All too often we hear about "free speech" being violated. I understand the slights against "American" boards and "free speech". In the example above, would have I have abused the posters free speech by removing his gibberish? Not according to the OWNERS rules. Free speech has rules, regardless what country you live in. If all one does is post one liners with no value to the discussion, it takes away from the discussion, depending on what forum they are in. I am a member of a DB who's owner is in New Zealand and he's all upset over "American" boards lack of free speech - read into this the irony of it. But read his rules and he's talking out his ass.

How many times have you seen a poster come along and hijack a thread? It's irritating to me as a Mod, Admin or user. Equally an irritant is the poster that derails the thread with off topic crap. I don't know how many times I've had to split a thread into two or more separate threads and at the same time remove the junk just to keep the original thread coherent and on topic. The idea, at least in the DB's I voluntarily worked in, was to keep the OP on topic. And that includes separating posts to make new threads because some bonehead simply has to derail the OP...deleting insulting or offensive material...cutting out copyrighted material to 10% of the original material (plagiarism)...keeping an eye on quote-mining...watching out for spam and a host of various other junk. Are users ethics and manners in such low esteem these days? Don't you expect the same treatment from those moderating as well?

In all the DB's I've belonged to, none of the moderators and administrators were paid. It's all volunteer work. This board is not fast. From what I'm used to, the Religion Forum is a downright turtle. But consider a DB with 30+ forums and 30+ moderators with several of the main forums being fast(fast means there will be anywhere from two to five pages of posts on a single forum per 24 hours). A perfect world would see that each forum is maintained with enough Moderators and hopefully one of them is several time zones apart from the others to provide round the clock coverage. I'm telling you, it's sometimes a real bitch to catch up a thread when a fast forum hasn't been looked at for whatever reason - Mods sick or on vacation. Sometimes one has no choice but to ask Mods to cover 3 or 4 forums. Burnout is quick. Turnover sucks.

At one point (a few months ago), I was spending 4-6 hours a day administrating one DB and at the same time watching my self assigned forums. I had to give it up.

On a HUGE RC aircraft board, a guy found a way to cover the adds that are plastered all over the page. He publicly told people how he got rid of the adds and was promptly banned. In one respect, I can see why Admin got hot on him. The adds supply income. And a board that size requires a huge amount of space on a server. I'd reckon the operational costs is over $15,000 per year. It's a huge website going back to the early 2000's and there are threads there that have over 7000 posts.
BUT...
That doesn't assuage the treatment he got from Admin. Heavy handedness. Lack of courtesy. Moderation inconsistency. Etc. Not my way of running a board. At the same time, there's thousands of members at that site. How many do you reckon click on the ads? I don't.

The old timer poster that gets angry at a newbie who asks a question (and the questions they ask are always the same and recur frequently) are burnt out...or bored...or post sluts. These posters have nothing stopping them from answering a legitimate question with a legitimate answer by either typing it out or even providing a canned cut-and-paste reply (I've done the C&P thing thousands of times). They forget that they were once newbies and that search functions are not always helpful.

Either way I look at it, though, I use DB's such as this one for reference and education. Ever notice how much time I spend in the Lounge? I'm not much on social networking and therefore lurk in the Religious forum.
My only problem is wading through all the crap in a large thread on some boards to find it. Most of the time I feel like I'm a heron wading all day through a pond looking for that one fish I can eat out of the thousand I can't eat. Why do you think there are several thousand posts in a single thread in some boards? Because Mods don't filter out the crap. I'm a big fan of posters staying on topic and Mods making sure the threads stay that way. I'm also a bigger fan of temporarily and permanently banning users that post crap and getting rid of Moderators that don't do their jobs.

So this board has rules.
You don't like the 50 count rule? Tough beans.
You don't like your posts moved? Tougher beans.
Don't obey the rules? No beans.



This is way too long. I'll quit now.

[Asmodean]

So this board has rules.
You don't like the 50 count rule? Tough beans.
You don't like your posts moved? Tougher beans.
Don't obey the rules? No beans.

Precisely. 

Personally, I don't even think the mods and admins should explain their decisions to general public unless challenged specifically on some point within the written rules.

When I did moderating and administrating, therefor, "read the rules" was the most common reply to people dissatisfied with my modding.

[xSilverPhinx]

I always thought this forum was well moderated.

[Tank]

I always thought this forum was well moderated.

It is very well moderated. One of the reasons I joined was that the forum had already well established and had not imploded as forums have a habit of doing.

[Jabbles]

I am just happy some people are willing to be Mods. I know I wouldn't have the patience for it. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

[leedan]

I have seen some of this forum policing and think of it as a necessity. I think I may already be guilty of some thread bending and will stay on topic in the future.

[Gawen]

Don't get me wrong through. I wasn't complaining about this DB at all. This site should be easily maintainable due to its low volume. Yeah, some people go off topic, but really, you can't help it in some cases.

I also agree that a Discussion Board should be moderated. And the Mods we have here are doing a fine job.

Asmodean:

On the mega DB I helped in, when a person, say for example insulted another poster, we removed the post or offending words to a 'holding' area where only Staff could see it. Then we left a note in the thread saying something like <Edited Insult> .

There was no public chastisement whatsoever. It wasn't allowed. Everything was done in PM or a "complaint forum" so any discussion didn't muck up the thread. No poster was singled out in a thread, if you get my drift. However, if tempers rise within a thread, a general Mod note would be left to (sadly) remind those participating to settle down.

[Will]

For the record, and just speaking for myself, I'm cool with dissent. As a moderator, I take my responsibility seriously, and part of being in any role of authority is to listen very carefully to those not in a role of authority to maintain objectivity. I've seen other forums burn to the ground because the administrators and moderators became too aristocratic and lived in their own little bubble of perception, which eventually was completely divorced from the reality of normal forum use. I'd like to avoid that here.

I had to be convinced of the 50 post rule initially, because I was concerned it was too draconian for a relatively free forum like HAF. I've been mostly happy with the way it's been carried out and the result, though. If, however, I feel at some point that it's more of a hindrance then a help, I'll talk it over with Whitney, McQ and the rest of the moderators, because I know they value my opinion as much as I value theirs.