Why Did God Have to Make Evil?

[Whitney]

For the record I still disagree even after the clarification...I just don't feel like bothering to debate it further.

[iSok]

Too avoid further delay, I'll give my argument.

Why did God have to make evil?

Man is a being which came forward from evolution, man has a lot of qualities that also occur in nature.
There are qualities, that only man has, which nature can hardly grasp on. One of these qualities is intellect.

Every man is egocentric, whether we want this or not, but this is reality.
This is reality in the case of God and without God.

Evil is caused by both man and God.

1. Evil is caused by man, because of his free-will.
2. Evil is caused by God, for the benefit of man.

In my opinion, is the root of all evil: the love for wordly gains, powered by the instinct that nature has given man, to maintain his physical health, NOT his mental health.
In the first case, we have a constant desire for more, just to fulfill our desire, fueled by instinct. The concept of taking. Evil occurs when we do not set a limit, the desire for more, more and more.
When we forget the negative output on society just to fulfill our desires. Because of this evil comes into existence.

Religion teaches the opposite. Once man has the basic needs to maintain his physical health (enough food, water and a shelter), man should switch to a different egocentricism.
Man should no longer adopt the attitude of continuosly taking, but rather giving.
Charity for example. This is the source of happiness for man, in this life and the life after.
Conscience plays a crucial role in this. It's actually the feedback for man: 'Are you doing it alright?.
We do good things, just to please our conscience.

But according to religion (particulary Islam), conscience has too develop.
A child is born in a state of Al-Fitrah (=A sound nature), society has the task to give the child a good upbringing.
Once the child is old enough, he can play a role in the everlasting battle between: 'take' or 'give'.

But sometimes, society gives the child a not so good upbringing. (ritual rape was quite common among the Aztecs).
In that case, according to Islam, there should be no blame on the child. Because he could not distinguish between good and evil.
But once given the message and the criterium for good and wrong, and man with his choice still rejects it, then there is blame to be put.


Now, what role does evil play in all this?
Man's life is about developping. During his life he has to fight obstacles that we see as 'evil'.

Evil: Everything that which we want too overcome.
This could be: illiteracy, wars, injustice, diseases, murder, pollution and so on...

The source for all this lies within man. Greediness, ignorance, arrogance and rage bring forward evil.
Concepts that man should fight against. That is the true purpose of life, called 'Jihad' in Islam.
If there was no injustice in the world, then there would be no struggle for justice in the world.

God for example causes natural disasters.
Because when there's an external calamity, that is not caused by man, we tend to unite more.
In case of an internal calamity, caused by man, we don't unite. Take a look at wars.
Another reason is too stimulate our intellect.
For a scientist the question comes: "How does and When does the earth shake?"

Our whole society is based on this:

We send our children to school, to educate them.
Some of our children become scientists, who are looking for ways to treat cancerpatients.
Some of them become politicians, to organise society and give society a better direction.
Other's join the police force, to oppose injustice on the streets.

Evil is absolutely needed in the world.
For our development.

You can throw away all that I have said, just take a look at this:

Now, what happens if somehow God decides to delete all evil.
Society would crumble, because our whole purpose is based on defeating evil.
Every aspect of society is based on this --> Fight 'Evil'.



No evil = No purpose for society = No society = Chaos = Evil


The result is impossible within our reality (absence of evil), it's the journey that is extremely important.
In my opinion is the purpose life: fulfilling this journey in succes and adding your part to beat the unbeatable.


A heaven on earth is simply not possible, it would turn into a hell on earth.
Evil is bound to exist, you might ask: Why not a little less evil than now?
The problem with man is always the limit.

We want more proof of God.
We want more money.
We want more happiness.
We want to live longer.
and so on....

Honestly: Is there anything in our life, when we'll say: We have enough.

Now some of us might find the concept of God a bit silly.
You do good, He rewards, You do bad, He punishes.

But we take a look at our reality, we can conclude.
That we are already subjected to laws.
In the materialistic universe, there are already laws that confine us.

If I jump off a building, gravity will harm me.
If I put my hand in fire, the activity of particles will harm me.
If I jump into ice, the low activity of particles will harm me...and so on.

There's only one thing that is not connected to these 'laws'.
These are our thoughts, that transcend reality (imagination).
And somehow these thoughts that we have are constantly stored in our subconscious. Like a recordplayer, 'writing' down everything we think.
So why wouldn't we get punishment for our overal thought process in this life while we are already being punished for everything else?

[Stevil]

And somehow these thoughts that we have are constantly stored in our subconscious. Like a recordplayer, 'writing' down everything we think.
So why wouldn't we get punishment for our overal thought process in this life while we are already being punished for everything else?

To be honest, I skipped your novel and went straight to the climactic conclusion.
Society rightly judges people based on actions not thoughts. We are free to imagine whatever we like, poor Megan Fox and Jessica Alba would blush if they knew what I had imagined about them. Should I be punished by society for these thoughts? Is it natural that I might be attracted to beautiful people and hence have some passionate thoughts? Was there a victim? Do I really care that some theist may think poorly on my "impure" thoughts? What's impure about imagined sex?

Think what you like, but think twice when turning thought into action, actions have consequences.

[fester30]

Religion teaches the opposite. Once man has the basic needs to maintain his physical health (enough food, water and a shelter), man should switch to a different egocentricism.
Man should no longer adopt the attitude of continuosly taking, but rather giving.

Religion also teaches to TAKE territory that belongs to “God’s people” (Jews and the land of Canaan, Muhammad and Mecca).

But according to religion (particulary Islam), conscience has too develop.

But sometimes, society gives the child a not so good upbringing. (ritual rape was quite common among the Aztecs).

Where is the Islamic conscience when a woman is punished for being raped, as if the man who raped her was the victim?  Or when a Muslim father is killing his daughter to restore honor because she had premarital sex or disobeyed him?

God for example causes natural disasters.

No God doesn’t.  Natural disasters occur independent of any supposed God.  Just like we, as humans, have found out there is no lightning god, we have also found out there’s no volcano or earthquake god.

You can throw away all that I have said.

Something we can agree on.

We want more proof of God.
We want more money.
We want more happiness.
We want to live longer.
and so on...

“MORE proof?”  I’m looking for ANY proof.  I haven’t seen any yet.  
I would like more money and to live longer.  Of course more happiness would be fine, but that’s more of a philosophical idea.  Would I reject more happiness because I’ve been conditioned to accept the level of happiness I have now?  Not sure.

Honestly: Is there anything in our life, when we'll say: We have enough.

No.  I have only one chance at life.  If I ever say I have enough, I’ll stop making an effort for more and turn into a vegetable.

Now some of us might find the concept of God a bit silly.

You picked up on that, eh?

If I jump off a building, gravity will harm me.

If I jump off a building, gravity won’t harm me, it will make me accelerate toward the center of the earth until I reach terminal velocity based upon air friction.  What will harm me is the force that will stop my inertia (the ground).

There's only one thing that is not connected to these 'laws'.
These are our thoughts, that transcend reality (imagination).
And somehow these thoughts that we have are constantly stored in our subconscious. Like a recordplayer, 'writing' down everything we think.
So why wouldn't we get punishment for our overal thought process in this life while we are already being punished for everything else?

Our thoughts, imagination, and memory are connected to the laws of nature.  These are all results of biochemistry.  Atheists understand that even when we have knowledge gaps, we no longer need a god to fill in those gaps.  We understand that those gaps are simply undiscovered knowledge of science that will one day be uncovered.

[iSok]

And somehow these thoughts that we have are constantly stored in our subconscious. Like a recordplayer, 'writing' down everything we think.
So why wouldn't we get punishment for our overal thought process in this life while we are already being punished for everything else?

To be honest, I skipped your novel and went straight to the climactic conclusion.
Society rightly judges people based on actions not thoughts. We are free to imagine whatever we like, poor Megan Fox and Jessica Alba would blush if they knew what I had imagined about them. Should I be punished by society for these thoughts? Is it natural that I might be attracted to beautiful people and hence have some passionate thoughts? Was there a victim? Do I really care that some theist may think poorly on my "impure" thoughts? What's impure about imagined sex?

Think what you like, but think twice when turning thought into action, actions have consequences.

Can a child deny brocolli and go for the candy, even if we tell him that it's bad for him?

Nonetheless, This was my conclusion to the thread question:

You can throw away all that I have said, just take a look at this:

Now, what happens if somehow God decides to delete all evil.
Society would crumble, because our whole purpose is based on defeating evil.
Every aspect of society is based on this --> Fight 'Evil'.



No evil = No purpose for society = No society = Chaos = Evil


The result is impossible within our reality (absence of evil), it's the journey that is extremely important.
In my opinion is the purpose life: fulfilling this journey in succes and adding your part to beat the unbeatable.


A heaven on earth is simply not possible, it would turn into a hell on earth.
Evil is bound to exist, you might ask: Why not a little less evil than now?
The problem with man is always the limit.

We want more proof of God.
We want more money.
We want more happiness.
We want to live longer.
and so on....

Honestly: Is there anything in our life, when we'll say: We have enough.


Fester,


Honour revenge, killing of a rape victim and so on...are cultural concepts.
There's no such thing honour revenge within Islam. Islam is against it, because honour comes from the ego.

The primary life lesson within the Qur'an is that Iblis did not bow down for Adam, just because he was a human. Iblis found himself better.
The Qur'an asks us not too make the same mistake, but unfortunately, man still acts in this way.

No God doesn’t.  Natural disasters occur independent of any supposed God.  Just like we, as humans, have found out there is no lightning god, we have also found out there’s no volcano or earthquake god.

The question is here "Why did God create evil?". As it says, in the case of God. Why do you start waffeling (Tank taught me this word) around as soon as I mention the word, God.
"GOD DOES NOT EXIST YOU IDIOT!!"...I already know that you think that way Fester, repeating it won't make it more 'true'.
I'm simply trying to give an argument on why evil has too exist. So far you did not refute.

“MORE proof?”  I’m looking for ANY proof.  I haven’t seen any yet.  

I'll let the Qur'an answer this one.
Did you imagine that We created you without any purpose, and that you will not be brought back to Us?"
Does man imagine that whatever he wishes for is right for him?
And when Our verses are recited to them, they say: 'We have heard. We could, if we willed, compose the like of it. They, are nothing but fables of the ancient times.'

Did they come into being without any creator? Or were they their own creators?
Or did they create the heavens and the earth? Rather, they are not certain.

Did the unbelievers not realize that the heavens and the earth were one solid mass, then We tore them apart, and We made every living being out of water?
Will they, then, not believe (that We created all this)?

If We were even to open for them a way to the heavens, and they could continually climb up to it in broad daylight.
they would still have said: "Surely our eyes have been dazzled; rather, we have been enchanted."

[Munchkin Goddess]

I apologize if this question has already been answered and I simply missed it; however, would someone care to define exactly what evil is? Preferably a theist since the original question is asking, "why did god have to make evil?" I realize that some theists will argue that evil is a result of sin and if it is god who decides what is and is not a sin, then it just seems like sin is at the mercy of the opinion of this deity.

I do have one question for any theists who believe that this deity is omnipotent and omniscient: If god or goddess or deity is omnipotent and omniscient, then wouldn't he or she or it be able to have the knowledge and the power to create a world without what people commonly refer to as "evil"? An all-powerful and all-knowledgeable being would be able to have the power and knowledge to do anything and everything. Therefore something that may be impossible for us mere mortals, would be completely doable for an omnipotent and omniscient being. If you do not believe in a deity that is omnipotent and omniscient, then feel free to disregard this question.

[fester30]

No God doesn’t.  Natural disasters occur independent of any supposed God.  Just like we, as humans, have found out there is no lightning god, we have also found out there’s no volcano or earthquake god.

The question is here "Why did God create evil?". As it says, in the case of God. Why do you start waffeling (Tank taught me this word) around as soon as I mention the word, God.
"GOD DOES NOT EXIST YOU IDIOT!!"...I already know that you think that way Fester, repeating it won't make it more 'true'.
I'm simply trying to give an argument on why evil has too exist. So far you did not refute.

You're right, I forgot for a moment you were trying to answer the question in this thread.  My bad.

“MORE proof?”  I’m looking for ANY proof.  I haven’t seen any yet.  

I'll let the Qur'an answer this one.
Did you imagine that We created you without any purpose, and that you will not be brought back to Us?"
Does man imagine that whatever he wishes for is right for him?
And when Our verses are recited to them, they say: 'We have heard. We could, if we willed, compose the like of it. They, are nothing but fables of the ancient times.'

Did they come into being without any creator? Or were they their own creators?
Or did they create the heavens and the earth? Rather, they are not certain.

Did the unbelievers not realize that the heavens and the earth were one solid mass, then We tore them apart, and We made every living being out of water?
Will they, then, not believe (that We created all this)?

If We were even to open for them a way to the heavens, and they could continually climb up to it in broad daylight.
they would still have said: "Surely our eyes have been dazzled; rather, we have been enchanted."

This has been mentioned many times in this forum: "holy" books are not proof of God.  I can write a book that claims I'm a god, and point to that book as proof that I'm a god.  That doesn't make it true.

[The Magic Pudding]

Evil: Everything that which we want too overcome.
This could be: illiteracy, wars, injustice, diseases, murder, pollution and so on...

That seems a bit broad, we may be egocentric but we can recognise this and try to get beyond tree with fruit good, tree without fruit bad.  I'm not so egocentric as to see the world as put here for my benefit/punishment.

The source for all this lies within man. Greediness, ignorance, arrogance and rage bring forward evil.
Concepts that man should fight against. That is the true purpose of life, called 'Jihad' in Islam.
If there was no injustice in the world, then there would be no struggle for justice in the world.

Yes and we could concentrate on positive things such as science, art or the art of living.

God for example causes natural disasters.
Because when there's an external calamity, that is not caused by man, we tend to unite more.
In case of an internal calamity, caused by man, we don't unite. Take a look at wars.

Wars unites people, in either heroic defence or wicked slaughter, shared adversity will often unite people, we can share our hatred of the other, a bonding experience.

Another reason is too stimulate our intellect.

The adversity of our environment caused our intellect to develop through evolution, a god could have just given us one, maybe without the baggage left by our species battles with tooth and claw.

Now, what happens if somehow God decides to delete all evil.
Society would crumble, because our whole purpose is based on defeating evil.
Every aspect of society is based on this --> Fight 'Evil'.



No evil = No purpose for society = No society = Chaos = Evil

It would take a bit more than bold red font to convince me this so.

There's only one thing that is not connected to these 'laws'.
These are our thoughts, that transcend reality (imagination).
And somehow these thoughts that we have are constantly stored in our subconscious. Like a recordplayer, 'writing' down everything we think.
So why wouldn't we get punishment for our overal thought process in this life while we are already being punished for everything else?

Ah good old punishment, it's always about the punishment, and if I'm real good I get a stick and get to join in the punishing.

[iSok]

TMP, I think I gave a sufficient argument.
Instead of nitpicking each line, you can try to refute it.

We're all egocentric, I don't understand what's so bad about that.
It's just a layman talk when you say:

'I just care a lot for my children, I'm not egocentric'
If I'd ask: Why do you care?
answer: I just care.

I rest my case.

You say that you would focus on science and art if there was no injustice.
First, define what injustice is.
Is war injustice? Is murder injustice? Is cancer injustice?
The problem is we can't set a limit to say: To here and no further.
I see illiteracy also as a form of injustice.

Art and the art of living are just tools to ease the dangerous mind of the human being, to avoid injustice.
Science is looking for answers, to cure disease, to understand the world a bit more, to avoid injustice.

Instead of commenting on the colour, rather tell me what is wrong with my claim.

No evil = No purpose for society = No society = Chaos = Evil

(Do you like blue?)


As for punishment, it's the most basale instinct of the human mind.
If God wouldn't threat mankind, then He wouldn't know His creation, we would probably negotiate on the terms to follow.

We are constantly asked to make choices. If there was no choice, there would be no good or evil.
We can choose for Good or we can choose for Evil, it's upto us, and the choice is our responsibility. Do wrong and you will destroy yourself, it's as clear as that.

This has been mentioned many times in this forum: "holy" books are not proof of God.  I can write a book that claims I'm a god, and point to that book as proof that I'm a god.  That doesn't make it true.

I think you didn't read it well, it's not just a Book.
The Qur'an attacks with fury, directly, personally and it debates, shames, criticizes and challenges. And above all demands complete submission.

Did you imagine that We created you without any purpose, and that you will not be brought back to Us?"
(Life has a purpose)

Does man imagine that whatever he wishes for is right for him?
(Stevil having dirty thoughts about Megan Fox)

And when Our verses are recited to them, they say: 'We have heard. We could, if we willed, compose the like of it. They, are nothing but fables of the ancient times.'
(Many of us, say today that religion is just a myth)

Did they come into being without any creator? Or were they their own creators?
Or did they create the heavens and the earth? Rather, they are not certain.
(Adressing the uncertainty of man)

Did the unbelievers not realize that the heavens and the earth were one solid mass, then We tore them apart, and We made every living being out of water?
(Giving proof for the origin of the universe)

Will they, then, not believe (that We created all this)?
(Is this proof enough for you?)

If We were even to open for them a way to the heavens, and they could continually climb up to it in broad daylight.
they would still have said: "Surely our eyes have been dazzled; rather, we have been enchanted."
(Adresses man's everlasting desire for more, more and more. Also the proof of God. That some people will simply not believe with all the proof in the world)

I mentioned multiple times here:

The scholar who translated the Qur'an, translated verse 51:47 in the following way.

"(51:47) And heaven â€" We made it with Our Own Power and We have the Power to do so."
But in his tafseer, he adds that the verse also has a second meaning. That is both equal in the context.

The word must' (pl. musi'un) may mean the one who possesses power and means, and also the one who can extend and expand something. According to the first meaning, the verse would mean: "We have built this heaven by Our own might and not with somebody else's help, and its erection was in no way beyond Us. Then how can you ever conceive that We shall not be able to recreate it ?" According to the second meaning, it would mean: "This huge universe that We have created, is not a finished work, but We are expanding it continuously, and new and ever new manifestations of Our creation are appearing in it every moment. How do you then think that such a marvelous Creator would not be able to repeat His creation.  

This line is written by a man with zero scientific knowledge, in the mountains of Pakistan, in 1979.
But at the same time, he adresses with astonishing precision on how the universe works.

I simply don't agree with you, if you say: We have NO proof.
The question is: Is this enough proof for you? I assume not.

[Whitney]

I didn't read the whole post because I don't care about what the quran says...but:

To claim that evil must exist because it creates purpose for society is ignoring that it doesn't have to be that way.  A society could be formed around simply enjoying each other's company.  We could have no society at all and just live in nomadic family groups.  We could go back to tribal culture.  There are a lot of viable alternatives in which human life can exist without the need for evil and even without the need for society.  Not to mention that just because we have labeled the dichotomy of good vs evil, light vs dark etc doesn't mean that's how some other intelligent species would view the world nor if that is the only way a universe could be set up.

[fester30]

This has been mentioned many times in this forum: "holy" books are not proof of God.  I can write a book that claims I'm a god, and point to that book as proof that I'm a god.  That doesn't make it true.

[quote="iSok]I think you didn't read it well, it's not just a Book.
The Qur'an attacks with fury, directly, personally and it debates, shames, criticizes and challenges. And above all demands complete submission.

[/quote]

I've read a couple Tom Clancy books that did the same thing, and I don't worship Jack Ryan.

[Davin]

No evil = No purpose for society = No society = Chaos = Evil

This logic does not necessarily follow:
Having no evil doesn't necessarily lead to no purpose for society, no purpose for society doesn't necessarily lead to no society.
Even if the only purpose of society is to remove evil, if there is no evil to remove then society would be useless.
The lack of society doesn't lead to chaos in itself. There could be a chaotic society even, like an anarchistic commune.
Chaos doesn't lead to evil, just as order doesn't prevent evil. Chaos doesn't even lead to bad things in itself.

So this entire string of stuff doesn't follow.

To answer the question of the thread: If the god is all powerful, then the god doesn't need to do anything, anything the god does and anything that happens/will happen is the intention of the god. So if the god is all powerful, it did not need to create evil, if the god isn't all powerful then it might have needed to create evil.

By arguing that the god needed to create evil for whatever reason, you're arguing that the god is not all powerful.

Did you imagine that We created you without any purpose, and that you will not be brought back to Us?

This statement is meaningless unless one already accepts what the Quran says is true.

Does man imagine that whatever he wishes for is right for him?

No.

And when Our verses are recited to them, they say: 'We have heard. We could, if we willed, compose the like of it. They, are nothing but fables of the ancient times.'

So the people that wrote the Quran already knew that they were saying the same things that other religions had said many times before.

Did they come into being without any creator? Or were they their own creators?
Or did they create the heavens and the earth? Rather, they are not certain.

The dichotomy that either a thing must be created by a sentient entity or create itself is completely ridiculous. There is also far less wrong about remaining uncertain than by assuming and commiting to those assumptions for the rest of ones life.

Did the unbelievers not realize that the heavens and the earth were one solid mass, then We tore them apart, and We made every living being out of water?
(Giving proof for the origin of the universe)

The origin of the universe is not water. The heavens and the earth were not one solid mass. The heavens and the earth were not torn apart... so how does this explain the origin of the universe?

Will they, then, not believe (that We created all this)?

Who? Just some humans writing something down in a book claiming that it's devine... how many books do this? No, I do not believe that men created everything.

If We were even to open for them a way to the heavens, and they could continually climb up to it in broad daylight.
they would still have said: "Surely our eyes have been dazzled; rather, we have been enchanted."
(Adresses man's everlasting desire for more, more and more. Also the proof of God. That some people will simply not believe with all the proof in the world)

Oh how convenient for the book to talk about how people will reject such crappy evidence of a book that promotes itself as true.

"(51:47) And heaven â€" We made it with Our Own Power and We have the Power to do so."
But in his tafseer, he adds that the verse also has a second meaning. That is both equal in the context.

The word must' (pl. musi'un) may mean the one who possesses power and means, and also the one who can extend and expand something. According to the first meaning, the verse would mean: "We have built this heaven by Our own might and not with somebody else's help, and its erection was in no way beyond Us. Then how can you ever conceive that We shall not be able to recreate it ?" According to the second meaning, it would mean: "This huge universe that We have created, is not a finished work, but We are expanding it continuously, and new and ever new manifestations of Our creation are appearing in it every moment. How do you then think that such a marvelous Creator would not be able to repeat His creation.

This line is written by a man with zero scientific knowledge, in the mountains of Pakistan, in 1979.
But at the same time, he adresses with astonishing precision on how the universe works.

So a man with zero scientific knowledge saying something unscientific is evidence for?

[iSok]

I didn't read the whole post because I don't care about what the quran says...but:

Open minded!

This logic does not necessarily follow:
Having no evil doesn't necessarily lead to no purpose for society, no purpose for society doesn't necessarily lead to no society.
Even if the only purpose of society is to remove evil, if there is no evil to remove then society would be useless.
The lack of society doesn't lead to chaos in itself. There could be a chaotic society even, like an anarchistic commune.
Chaos doesn't lead to evil, just as order doesn't prevent evil. Chaos doesn't even lead to bad things in itself.

Okay, then tell me, what is the purpose of society?
What is your purpose of life?
You want to enjoy life, then where does enjoyment come from?

Last time you told me you don't have a conscience, I'm very curious to this.
Because I understand by now that you reject the soul, now you reject also conscience.
That's quite new, so from what void do you get your morals?

To answer the question of the thread: If the god is all powerful, then the god doesn't need to do anything, anything the god does and anything that happens/will happen is the intention of the god. So if the god is all powerful, it did not need to create evil, if the god isn't all powerful then it might have needed to create evil.

God is giving us the choice, to be even better people. Because we can choose to do good.
Therefore the concept of evil has too exist. We as human beings interact with one and other.
The choice within this plays a central role.

Have you ever heard of a compassionate MRI-scanner? Or a Merciful dialysis machine?
We could have been programmed to do good, like the MRI-scanner or dialysis machine.

God is already doing it, this life is already the final step.
Our choice plays the central role within this process.

So a man with zero scientific knowledge saying something unscientific is evidence for?

You very well know what I mean. In this 'unscientific' sentence the man says that the universe was created and is expanding.
Atheist before you Davin, ridiculed the concept by religion that the universe was created.
Their primary reason for atheism was: "How ridiculous is it too say, that such a large universe is created."

Religion has won on that, after 3000 years of discussion, science finally admitted that the universe did have a starting point.
(Qur'an adds that the universe is expanding, and life on earth is made of water, look at the cell cytoplasma)
You cannot ask for more proof, the only next proof you'll get will be after death.

You just believe that somehow the universe popped out of nowhere, started expanding, add some time and a bit of chance, voila! Life!.
But did an intelligent Mind do this? "Ridiculous!!".
Homo Sapien has been around for over 100.000 years on this planet, and somehow by an unknown reason in the last 30 years, people are leaving
religion on a massive scale. It's almost a 'cool' thing to do now, to be an atheist.
Davin, do you know why you are obsessed with science?

[Stevil]

Okay, then tell me, what is the purpose of society?

Society has no common purpose. Some people join a specific society for companionship or a sense of belonging, some people are forced into a society and cannot leave regarless of their desire to do so. Some people simply find themselves a part of a society because the governing body finds it a practical solution to managing/controlling people and attaining funds (taxes) for common infrastructure (roads, schools).

What is your purpose of life?

Not everyone defines a purpose for their life. Those that do often have different purposes to others and can often change their own self defined purpose. It is only people that belong to an organisation (that looks to develop and control people's behaviours and thoughts) that these people might have a common purpose, common because these people are taught to believe what their purpose is, they are taught not to trust their own thoughts, they are taught to do and think as they are told.

That's quite new, so from what void do you get your morals?

Morals are an indoctorined religious term. One does not have to adopt morals to behave favourably.

Therefore the concept of evil has too exist.

I have no belief in Good and Evil. This thinking is the seed of war.

this life is already the final step.

Absolutely

In this 'unscientific' sentence the man says that the universe was created and is expanding.

We have no clue as to whether the Universe was created. The term Universe is ambiguous, the term created is ambiguous. The "expanding" word is an interpretation of the sentence that is in the qu'ran. Scientists can only derive that the system resulting from the theoretical Big Bang is expanding. They have no idea about the rest of the energy and matter in Space.

Religion has won on that, after 3000 years of discussion, science finally admitted that the universe did have a starting point.

No, science does not agree. Science has no idea what happened before the Big Bang, Science does not rule out that there are many Big Bang events within Space. To assume our Universe within Space is the only one is somewhat egotistical and arrogant of human kind.

You just believe that somehow the universe popped out of nowhere, started expanding, add some time and a bit of chance, voila! Life!.

We have no idea how all this energy and matter came to exist, potentially quantum fluctuations. We have no idea how life started. We try to keep an open mind and not make assumptions as to imagining up a god creature and then telling everyone that this is the answer and the truth.

Homo Sapien has been around for over 100.000 years on this planet, and somehow by an unknown reason in the last 30 years, people are leaving
religion on a massive scale. It's almost a 'cool' thing to do now, to be an atheist.

Christianity has been around for 2,000 years, Islam was derived/rewritten from Christianity. For the most part humans have not had religion. Every human, every living thing, every non living thing has been an Atheist at some point. When the theists die, their remains return back to their natural Atheist state. It is natural to be an Atheist, not cool.

[Tank]

I didn't read the whole post because I don't care about what the quran says...but:

Open minded!

If Whitney were not open minded do you think she would be funding and running a site that allowed people with your world view to post on it?