Nonexistence

[ErnestB]

As I am approaching my 40th birthday thoughts about my eventual nonexistence are becoming more pervasive. I used to find solace in quantum physics mutiverse and other theories, but it is no longer effective. I recently read everything I could on terror managment, Ernest Becker, watched "Flight From Death", absudism, but I can't get back into some kind of mental equilibrium.

I don't ever get to talk freely to other athiests and would like to know how you deal with this, the "dark place in my mind" as I call it.

[elliebean]

A little nonexistence never hurt anyone. I've had my brush with it. It was coming back that was painful.

Just fill your life with as much joy as you can while you have it.

[Tanker]

To paraphrase a wise man, you've spent most of time in non-existance why should you fear returning to it?

It's sounds like you may be suffering from depression, I urge to seek help even if it's just comiserateing  with friends or family.

[kenh]

Forty is hardly the age to start thinking about nonexistance.  As your body ages, and you are into your 70's or 80's, death doesn't seem quite as foreboding. Perhaps there is some form of existence beyond the present dimensions we are conscious of, but I like the Mark Twain quote:  "I was dead for millions of years before I was born and it never inconvenienced me a bit."

[Kylyssa]

My thought is that you get what you've got so just live while the living is good.

I agree that it sounds like depression.  But by talking about it, I think you are doing the right thing.

[ErnestB]

I am wondering if you "happy" atheists are just in denial or just can't wrap your head around the concept of no longer existing even if only for a brief moment. Atheism isn't really about the belief in a god or not - that's just the sideshow, and I see on this forum many of you find it entertaining to debate this. The true nature of being an Atheist is the acceptance that there is no hope of an afterlife in any shape or form for you - tell me what is so GOD damn happy about that?

[pinkocommie]

I am wondering if you "happy" atheists are just in denial or just can't wrap your head around the concept of no longer existing even if only for a brief moment. Atheism isn't really about the belief in a god or not - that's just the sideshow, and I see on this forum many of you find it entertaining to debate this. The true nature of being an Atheist is the acceptance that there is no hope of an afterlife in any shape or form for you - tell me what is so GOD damn happy about that?

Believe me, when my dad died I thought about non existence quite a bit and I can understand how, if you find the idea of death frightening, you would want to believe in a religion that promises an afterlife.  However, I don't think it's fair to project your own fear onto others and then claim that because they don't seem as frightened as you they must be kidding themselves.   Atheism is the lack of belief in god or gods, nothing more.  Whatever else you claim atheism to be says far more about you than it says about atheism in general.  I'm happy that I got a chance to live.  That in and of itself is enough for me to be happy.  It doesn't make sense to me to be upset about having to die because that's part of the process of living.  I'm not the kind of person to say 'well, I'm alive which is more than can be said for the millions of sperm that didn't make it into one of my mom's eggs, but you know what?  Living isn't enough - I want more life after I die too.'  I'm happy with what I have.  

[Kylyssa]

I am wondering if you "happy" atheists are just in denial or just can't wrap your head around the concept of no longer existing even if only for a brief moment. Atheism isn't really about the belief in a god or not - that's just the sideshow, and I see on this forum many of you find it entertaining to debate this. The true nature of being an Atheist is the acceptance that there is no hope of an afterlife in any shape or form for you - tell me what is so GOD damn happy about that?

I can wrap my head around the idea of not existing just fine and there have been times in my life when that realization was about as welcome as a pile of shit in a parlor.

When I was in junior high I started obsessing about the non-existence thing.  It lasted a few months.  And looking back on it - it was a symptom of depression.  My childhood friends were becoming teens and couldn't be seen hanging out with a geek, my co-ordination, already poor, went into the crapper with a growth spurt, and my mom was going through another bout of illnesses.  Once my overall situation improved, the horror and concern about my inevitable future non-existence evaporated and I re-focused on life.

The next time I experienced a bout of this thought process (with a twist) occurred when my first love committed suicide.  The twist was that I became obsessed with the idea that she was gone forever, totally and completely - it made the idea of my own inevitable future non-existence sound tempting instead of horrifying.  I wasn't thinking that I'd be with her, I was thinking that the sucking chest wound of loss would stop existing if I did, too.

A short time later I was homeless when my parents decided to skedaddle on me.  The non-existence seemed tempting again.  Then, a few people beat the shit out of me and a couple of them did a pretty good job of trying to kill me.  After that, when I was dumped from the hospital and back on the street, almost every night was spent thinking about a more clear and present possibility of non-existence.  It was both frightening and tempting then.  I became unafraid of the non-existence part but scared shitless of the moments or days that might lead to it and directly precede it.

I figured out that this life stuff is bloody frelling precious.  I want it to go on forever even if it won't but because it won't I've learned not to waste any of it worrying about it ending.  Think how miserable you are thinking about your inevitable future non-existence.  It's not worth it.  So try to occupy your life with enjoyable things instead.

[Whitney]

Earnest, does knowing the roller coaster ride will end make it any less enjoyable?

I realize you are dealing with going over the smaller 40 hill but just because you are worried about not existing doesn't mean others don't grasp the permanence of death.  I know elderly atheists who do not struggle with not existing after death even if they would prefer an afterlife...humans are wired for survival so it makes sense that we naturally and initially  feel uneasy about the concept of not existing later.

[bfat]

As I am approaching my 40th birthday thoughts about my eventual nonexistence are becoming more pervasive. I used to find solace in quantum physics mutiverse and other theories, but it is no longer effective. I recently read everything I could on terror managment, Ernest Becker, watched "Flight From Death", absudism, but I can't get back into some kind of mental equilibrium.

I don't ever get to talk freely to other athiests and would like to know how you deal with this, the "dark place in my mind" as I call it.

I struggle with this a lot too.  It's terrifying to me, knowing that one day I will have to die.  I hate the passage of time--it's a thief, and it steals days and opportunities and loved ones, and shoves you into the future without your consent.  But I heard a line in a song the other day that made me feel oddly more comfortable about death--it said something about wanting to "return my body to the earth," and I thought about how all of us, all our cells and atoms, they all came from the matter of the earth, and eventually, they will go back there.  We're just borrowing these bodies, and they're not meant to last that long.  I don't know what happens to consciousness when people die, but energy is indestructible.  It can never disappear, only change forms.  So knowing that the electromagnetic energy of my brain and the atoms of my body will never be destroyed was comforting to me.

I dunno if this helps, but it made me feel better.  

[Typist]

I don't ever get to talk freely to other athiests and would like to know how you deal with this, the "dark place in my mind" as I call it.

I cast my vote with what the others above have already said.  You're on the right track, talking about it.  

Don't know if this will help, but here's what I can add, for what it may be worth...

I deal with the "dark place in my mind" by studying it.  What I've learned so far is that the dark places are made of thought.   And that thought can be managed.  

As example, many people enjoy extreme sports like skydiving, surfing, bungie jumping etc.   Imho, what all these activities have in common is that they suppress thought, and while we're not thinking, we don't have problems.  

Obviously, there are other ways to manage thought that don't involve jumping off of bridges.  Some people meditate, or go fishing, or take long walks in the woods etc.  

More example.   If we were out of breath and feeling like we might pass out, we would stop, sit down, and slow our heart rate.   Thought is a mechanical process too, just like blood flow.  If we slow the thought rate, the "dark places" ease in intensity.

Short version: Dark places are made of thought.

Speaking of life and death...

Most of us spend most of lives "lost in thought".  That is, our attention, our focus, our experience of our lives, is aimed at a flow of abstract symbols running through our minds.    To the degree we are living in this abstract world, instead of the real world,  there's a sense in which we are already dead.

When I worry, that's what I worry about.  Being dead NOW.

[Tanker]

I am wondering if you "happy" atheists are just in denial or just can't wrap your head around the concept of no longer existing even if only for a brief moment. Atheism isn't really about the belief in a god or not - that's just the sideshow, and I see on this forum many of you find it entertaining to debate this. The true nature of being an Atheist is the acceptance that there is no hope of an afterlife in any shape or form for you - tell me what is so GOD damn happy about that?

I am wondering if you are not a poe after a post like that.

The ONLY part of being an Atheist is the disbelief in a higher power. That is the sum total of all being an Atheist means. Everything esle is an individuals decision.

If you are an Atheist It has oviously been a rocky road or an ambigious one. I recomend some deep "soul searching", if you'll forgive the phase, and decide just exactly what you believe and why. If you decide that religion makes more sence fine. If you decide that Atheism makes more seance fine, but make peace with what you believe and the reasons for it. While the lack of an afterlife can be a scary proposition, the understanding that there are no invisable friends can be freeing.

Understand that this is you one shot at a life. With this understanding you have more reason to love life then theists, because you won't waste it with some foolish notion of a second chance in an afterlife.



If you are a Theist that for some reason has decided to be sneaky and pretend to be an Atheist to make some silly point....don't. Just admit it now and be done. We don't discriminate against posters here. One of our moderaters is a theist, you'll get a fair shake regardless of your beliefs.

[Tanker]

frelling

Short derail, I love that show.

[notself]

I am wondering if you "happy" atheists are just in denial or just can't wrap your head around the concept of no longer existing even if only for a brief moment. Atheism isn't really about the belief in a god or not - that's just the sideshow, and I see on this forum many of you find it entertaining to debate this. The true nature of being an Atheist is the acceptance that there is no hope of an afterlife in any shape or form for you - tell me what is so GOD damn happy about that?

What is so god damn happy about existence?  The times of pleasure are fleeting.  Materialism is ultimately unsatisfactory.  We basically eat, sleep and poop over and over again until we die.  Why fear death?  You might as well fear sleep.  Oops, are you afraid to sleep?  If so, get some help or start a garden.  The sunshine will make you feel better.

Study astrophysics----no information is lost, including the information that makes you, you.
Study quantum mechanics---things pop in and out of existence all the time and it doesn't hurt a bit.

Feel better now?

[Faradaympp]

Hey i'm 15 and I've already started wondering about dying(it's an interesting thing to grapple with). It'll come eventually wether we're ready or not. Just try to make the best of what you've got, when the time comes if you can say that you have no regrets you've lived a good life. So for now just try to not do anything you might regret. Think of it this way, after working hard all your life it's just a long rest.