Commencement of suicide

[Kylyssa]

[...]there are mental health services to provide therapy and medicine.

Only if you can afford them.  Nearly all mental health services for poor people are religiously based.  In going to a free or low cost mental health clinic one runs the risk of getting told to "pray and feel Jesus with you" while having a panic attack.

[Kylyssa]

Suicide is a selfish and ungrateful act. You got to live, so many don't.

Cite is suffering from depression.  It is an illness.  If he had diabetes would you call him selfish for having symptoms?  

Many religious people don't believe mental illness is real, they think it is possession by demons or poor willpower or lack of a good relationship with Jesus.  If you are an atheist, what is your reasoning for thinking that mental illness isn't real?

The human mind isn't some mystical, invulnerable soul, it is the result of what happens in the brain.  I assume you know body parts can be harmed and not function as they are supposed to.  You probably also know that people can be born with body parts that don't function properly.  The brain is part of the body.  Think about it.  Before you judge someone for being sick, simply because there's no bleeding wound you can see, think about the brain's function.  Think about what would happen to you if you suffered a head injury.  You might suffer brain damage.  In that case, would you be responsible for the abnormal functioning of your brain as caused by brain damage?

[Cite134]

I thought you were white because of suicide statistics. Profiling. That's it. I'm sorry you can't make meaning in your life, best of luck.

Statistics are useful, but it is best to not assume anything.  

[Stevil]

Hmm, this is a difficult topic to post on. I am certainly not qualified to help you.
I have never been suicidal so cannot understand what you are going through.
I have never been addicted to anything nor have I been seriously depressed.

I don't think there is a simple solution to your problem. I certainly don't think suicide is the answer.
Obviously the alcohol must go. An AA group could provide you with support there.
With regards to relationships, I don't believe you should base your existence on having a GF. You really need to find value in yourself and having a GF is not really the answer. I would think it would be hard to get a GF if you don't feel positive about yourself. If your GF dumped you and you were deeply in love then that might be the straw that breaks the camel's back. If you are lonely then there are internet interest forums, dating forums etc, clubs in the real world. Activities you can do. Maybe volunteer work, if you are an able bodied person, at least you could help others but this might be risky for someone that is depressed. I don't really know.

I was slightly depressed once. It lasted for 4 years. For most of it I didn't even realise I was depressed. But one day I came to a realisation and discovered the cause for my depression. Basically I had been in denial that where I was and where I wanted to be were two completely different places. Once I realised then that very day I felt like an enormous weight went off my shoulders. It was an incredibly odd feeling and very noticable. After that my depression went away.

Anyway, I am not suggesting that is how it will happen for you. Your case is much more serious and complex than mine was. All I can say is that life holds many surprises. You might feel down and stagnant for years, but there is always the potential that things will change. There is no real reason why you can't be happy 5-10 years from now, or even tomorrow. I am sure you don't feel that this is the case. But shit happens mate. Hang in there. I hope everything works out for you eventually.

[Asmodean]

Living is a choice, as is suicide.

Since life is forced on you in the beginning, IS living really a choice..? I mean, past a certain point, sure, but overall...

Additionally, the hospital staff will do their best to revive you after a suicide attempt. They are required to do so by law, in my country at least. Euthanasea is illegal too... So on a social scale, it's not really a choice either, now is it? I think it SHOULD be, but, unfortunately, it's not.

Life itself has no meaning, it is 100% YOUR responsibility to create your own happiness.

Yes and no. It's complicated. For instance, your surroundings, which you can not always choose, can contribute massively to your happiness or lack thereof.

Suicide is a selfish and ungrateful act. You got to live, so many don't.

What exactly should someone contemplating suicide be grateful for..? Life (s)he probably resents? What does it matter if I got to live while gazillions of others did not? Maybe it makes me special, doesn't mean I have to want to act on it though.

This is the only life you get, its such abeautiful accident

Not for everyone. For some, it's more of a terrible accident

no more pity party, there is too much to celebrate

Like what..? Imagine you were on the brink of suicide. What would be the first thing you'd celebrate?

Evaluate your life, what do you love? Want? Dream about? Nothing is impossible.

When achieving something requires more effort than you are capable of producing, it doesn't really matter, now does it..? Chasing something you realize you can not have is not exactly a recipie for happiness for most people, now is it..?

By the same, living for love is good and well, unless life has given you more shit than you can carry on the momentum of love alone. (Or the combined momentum of love, ambitions, dreams and that instinct of self-preservation)

[Stevil]

Asmodean, have you ever considered working for a helpline? There would be far less suicidal people in the world with your support. LOL

Stop being a victim and feeling sorry for yourself. Life is what you make of it, you are in the driver's seat. Don't be too proud to reach out for help when you need it. There are many people out there that want to help you. Life has its ups and downs.

[Asmodean]

Asmodean, have you ever considered working for a helpline? There would be far less suicidal people in the world with your support. LOL

No... I did, however, consider couples therapy... And LOOK at the divorce rates!   (Actually, I'm not victimizing nor pitying myself. My capacity for pity, if you know me at all, is somewhat... reduced. And victimization... Well, I consider it a tad too close to labeling oneself a loser, which I most certainly am not. Just lousy at life, you know... Among other things)

Life is what you make of it, you are in the driver's seat.

Yup. and sometimes them trucks coming at me look very tempting... I love word play!  

[Stevil]

The second part was not directed at you necessarily but if it applies to you then yes.

I am not a therapist so really don't know what is the right thing to say to people that are feeling depressed and/or suicidal. When I said "many people" I wasn't implying that you had many close family and friends, of course they would likely be the best kind of help but there are an aweful lot of lonely people out there. In my country there are free helplines, of course these people probably get paid by government or someone, but they are experienced in helping people with these types of issues. I don't think they can count as friends but maybe they can help you understand why you are feeling the way you are, maybe they can help you make steps towards a brighter future. You potentially could have many years of life in front of you. If it takes a few of those to sort yourself out then you will still have many years to enjoy after that. Nothing is impossible (within reason), your future might surprise you.

[Davin]

Nothing is impossible (within reason), your future might surprise you.

Some people only go by what is sure. When I've lived a life that's full of pain and misery, thinking about suffering more, just for the slim possibility that something might make all the suffering I've already experienced worth it, is very unappealing. You might think that a life full of pain less a few years of happiness is worth it for the few years of happiness, I however think that a life full of pain is not worth the few years. I also find the statement to appear to assume that when one is considering suicide, that they hadn't considered the possibilities that lie in the future.

However I do know that I'm a little off kilter from the majority of the population in my lack of connection to my emotions. So this may work on more people, than I think. I only know a few people and myself that have either attempted, succeeded and/or seriously thought about suicide. So take my opinion on the matter with the understanding that my sample is very much subject to bias.

[Thumpalumpacus]

The idea that suicides ought to judged on a moral basis is silly when one considers the influence of mental illness on suicide rates.

[Kylyssa]

The idea that suicides ought to judged on a moral basis is silly when one considers the influence of mental illness on suicide rates.

Exactly!  We don't judge people with cancer for developing symptoms so why do we judge people with mental illness when they have symptoms?  I still think it's a throwback to religious thinking that people consider the mind to be separate from the body rather than as a function of the brain.

[The Magic Pudding]

Don't know why, but this thread makes me start whistling an old tune.

Life's a piece of shit
When you look at it
Life's a laugh and death's a joke, it's true.
You'll see it's all a show
Keep 'em laughing as you go
Just remember that the last laugh is on you.

[Thumpalumpacus]

The idea that suicides ought to judged on a moral basis is silly when one considers the influence of mental illness on suicide rates.

Exactly!  We don't judge people with cancer for developing symptoms so why do we judge people with mental illness when they have symptoms?  I still think it's a throwback to religious thinking that people consider the mind to be separate from the body rather than as a function of the brain.

I agree.  It took me a long time to come around to this view, too; but when you really look at it, our "modern" view of mental illness is not very different from the "demon possession" model posited a couple of thousand years ago.  We still demonize them, right?

[Cite134]

It has been a while since I first posted this thread, and I just wanted to announce that I am coping and doing better. Death still looks very tasteful from time to time, but I think I am making 'progress'.
 It took weeks after fulling indulging in introspection and reflection to come to the conclusion that I need to fight my insecurities.
ON another note, again, I appreciate everyones' responses.

[Thumpalumpacus]

That's good news, Cite.

You do what you need to do, and know that you can come here when the shit gets thick.

Much love, brotha.