Obama addresses birth control and catholic church

[fester30]

Catholics know it's human nature to want to have sex.  It's one of the gifts of God to married people, and it's one of the temptations of Satan to non-married people.  Contraceptives do three things the Catholics don't like (according to Catholics, I sure as hell don't believe this shit).

1.  Prevent fertilization of the egg.  They believe that if we use condoms, for example, we keep God's will of future babies from happening.  Therefore, they don't even want married people to use them.  (They don't like it when I ask if we're powerful enough to keep God's will from happening, or if I mention that, since whatever happens is God's will, the invention and use of condoms must have been God's idea).

2.  Contraceptives encourage unmarried sex.  The Catholics believe that any unmarried sex is adultery.  If you can have sex without as much fear of spreading disease and pregnancy, that takes away the incentive to wait until marriage.

3.  Some contraceptives, such as the pill, are abortificants.  The pill will keep a fertilized embryo (a baby in Catholic beliefs) from sticking to the uterine wall, causing the woman's body to abort that fertilized embryo.  (They also don't like it when I mention all the times this actually happens with women who aren't taking birth control and are trying to have a baby.  They say it's God's will if the embryo doesn't stick to the uterus naturally, and I say then God is committing abortion).

[Tank]

Monty Python says it best.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0kJHQpvgB8

[Beachdragon]

So that got resolved?

I had a friend on Facebook flipping out about this - Posting articles left and right, posting pictures about how Obama is so against freedom of religion, and even quoting the first amendment.

It's funny, because I seriously doubt that same friend could care any less when laws come into place that are violating the Establishment clause.

The wife of a friend who has become a Catholic Deacon (but we like him anyway) was playing the "Help help I'm being opressed" card recently in regard to this.  I was so friggin' disgusted with her I had to leave the room before my head exploded. 

[Davin]

[Sweetdeath]

LOL Davin!! That makes me wanna rewatch the princess bride.

[Amicale]

Paragraphs 2367-2371 in the Catholic Catechism: http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm explain the Catholic position on birth control as being intrinsically evil.

The relevant bit of it, from Par 2370:

Thus the innate language that expresses the total reciprocal self-giving of husband and wife is overlaid, through contraception, by an objectively contradictory language, namely, that of not giving oneself totally to the other. This leads not only to a positive refusal to be open to life but also to a falsification of the inner truth of conjugal love, which is called upon to give itself in personal totality. . . . The difference, both anthropological and moral, between contraception and recourse to the rhythm of the cycle . . . involves in the final analysis two irreconcilable concepts of the human person and of human sexuality.

So, their argument is that contraception is evil because not only does it render someone 'not open to life', but it apparently eliminates the possibility of a husband and wife fully giving of themselves to one another. To me, that's honestly absurd. Spouses and partners give completely of themselves in dozens of different ways throughout the day. Who's to say that the most complete way someone can give to someone else is to either get them pregnant, or get pregnant? You'd think the most complete way two adults in a relationship could give to one another would be to express love, responsibility, and due diligence for one another and for their health and well-being. Sometimes it's not prudent, or safe, to have a child.

Go figure.

[fester30]

I've never bought any of the potential human life arguments, either.  One egg... millions of sperm.  I guess god designed us so that there would be millions of potential human lives not finding their other half.

[Amicale]

I've never bought any of the potential human life arguments, either.  One egg... millions of sperm.  I guess god designed us so that there would be millions of potential human lives not finding their other half.

Kind of like how only a husband and wife are supposed to have sex, yet millions of people either never find a spouse/are very unhappily married/can't safely have partnered sex (and yet it's supposedly sinful to 'take care of it yourself'), or aren't attracted to the opposite gender (and of course very, very sinful to do anything with anyone of the same sex). 

Interesting 'design' work, on both the procreative and the human relations front...

[Reprobate]

Not "fucking catholics", but the fucking catholic church. The arrogance and hypocracy of the organization is ridiculous. Someone has to have the balls to show them they cannot live by their own laws. We all know how things worked out when they made the laws.

[Dobermonster]

Not "fucking catholics", but the fucking catholic church. The arrogance and hypocracy of the organization is ridiculous. Someone has to have the balls to show them they cannot live by their own laws. We all know how things worked out when they made the laws.

Agreed. The Vatican is a vile organization (basing this opinion on their practices, not just a general anti-religious statement). Catholics may be decent folks or not, depends on the person and whether they truly believe their leader (le Pope) has a direct line to God.

[Firebird]

What's interesting is that a majority of Catholics in the US support having insurance cover contraception, and 98-99% of them use it. So the Vatican doesn't even hold the same position as its own parishioners. It's all further evidence that organized religion is completely fucked up as far as I'm concerned.

[Sweetdeath]

I've never bought any of the potential human life arguments, either.  One egg... millions of sperm.  I guess god designed us so that there would be millions of potential human lives not finding their other half.

I'm glad someone brought this up.

[fester30]

Then there is the irony that all of the Catholic Church's leadership is supposed to be celibate, yet they feel they're still somehow qualified to tell us what we should do with our bathroom parts.

[Tank]

Then there is the irony that all of the Catholic Church's leadership is supposed to be celibate, yet they feel they're still somehow qualified to tell us what we should do with our bathroom parts.

Yep! Bloody stupidity at it finest!

[Amicale]

Then there is the irony that all of the Catholic Church's leadership is supposed to be celibate, yet they feel they're still somehow qualified to tell us what we should do with our bathroom parts.

Yep! Bloody stupidity at it finest!

Yep. If I were religious (ex-Catholic here, sigh), I'd at least give more credence to what the Eastern Orthodox or Anglican priests, bishops etc said on this particular subject, seeing as they don't have to be celibate and have at least a better understanding of this issue than any of the Catholic clergy possibly could, just by default of having had physical relationships. (Not that the Catholic clergy haven't had those. They just don't talk about them, hence the many scandals coming out now.)