Aren’t non-believers supposed to be suffering?

[Too Few Lions]

What an amazing piece of pointless gobbledygook. Given that you admit that your epiphany occurred on the day you took LSD your 'evidence' via experience is totally incredible. You are simply not a reliable or credible witness. All the above simple creates a safe place for you to believe exactly what you want to believe irrespective of reality.

I love psychedelics, and have had plenty of wonderful experiences on them. Many a time on mushrooms I've thought that I've sussed the meaning of life the universe and everything, and seen patterns in the whole cosmos, then I've come down off the trip and realised it was just the effect of the mushrooms on my brain...and shouldn't be taken any more seriously than that.

I find the talk of 'feeling a presence' interesting, it sounds like your temporal lobes were affected, and an awful lot like the results of the 'God helmet' experiments;

http://www.shaktitechnology.com/god_helmet.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YPOTaUyvA0

[Ecurb Noselrub]

What an amazing piece of pointless gobbledygook. Given that you admit that your epiphany occurred on the day you took LSD your 'evidence' via experience is totally incredible. You are simply not a reliable or credible witness. All the above simple creates a safe place for you to believe exactly what you want to believe irrespective of reality.

I've also informed you that that was only one experience. But selective deafness is a person's right - a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.  Personal experience is a completely valid reason for a person to adopt a point of view.  And I've seen nothing from any source that excludes the possibility of my God being a part of or even the foundation of reality.

[Tank]

What an amazing piece of pointless gobbledygook. Given that you admit that your epiphany occurred on the day you took LSD your 'evidence' via experience is totally incredible. You are simply not a reliable or credible witness. All the above simple creates a safe place for you to believe exactly what you want to believe irrespective of reality.

I've also informed you that that was only one experience. But selective deafness is a person's right - a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.  Personal experience is a completely valid reason for a person to adopt a point of view.  And I've seen nothing from any source that excludes the possibility of my God being a part of or even the foundation of reality.

My bad, I must have missed that, appologies. But LSD can lead to long term effects can it not?

[Ecurb Noselrub]

My bad, I must have missed that, appologies. But LSD can lead to long term effects can it not?

Yes, but that's not what I experience. I've never had a relapse or any effects from the few times I did LSD when I was in my late teens. But, if you choose not to believe me, what can I say?

[Tank]

I've also informed you that that was only one experience. But selective deafness is a person's right - a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.  Personal experience is a completely valid reason for a person to adopt a point of view.  And I've seen nothing from any source that excludes the possibility of my God being a part of or even the foundation of reality.

My bad, I must have missed that, appologies. But LSD can lead to long term effects can it not?

Yes, but that's not what I experience. I've never had a relapse or any effects from the few times I did LSD when I was in my late teens. But, if you choose not to believe me, what can I say?
[/quote]
Well you can tell me if the experiences differed in any ways, before putting words in my mouth. But then it's always easier to burn down a straw man that the truth isn't it

[Ecurb Noselrub]

Well you can tell me if the experiences differed in any ways, before putting words in my mouth. But then it's always easier to burn down a straw man that the truth isn't it

Well, you've already told me that your opinion is that I am not a credible witness, so I'm not sure that more testimony is going do. But, most of my personal experiences just deal with the sense of God's presence, overwhelming senses of peace or joy sometimes spontaneously occurring, experiences in which Jesus seems to be leading or providing (opportunities, open doors, various circumstances that occur at opportune times), and just an overall sense of blessedness and well-being, all giving rise to a daily sense of thanksgiving. 

[Tank]

Well you can tell me if the experiences differed in any ways, before putting words in my mouth. But then it's always easier to burn down a straw man that the truth isn't it

Well, you've already told me that your opinion is that I am not a credible witness, so I'm not sure that more testimony is going do. But, most of my personal experiences just deal with the sense of God's presence, overwhelming senses of peace or joy sometimes spontaneously occurring, experiences in which Jesus seems to be leading or providing (opportunities, open doors, various circumstances that occur at opportune times), and just an overall sense of blessedness and well-being, all giving rise to a daily sense of thanksgiving. 

Well whether I believe what you experience is due to God or not is irrelevent, but I'm still interested in what make you believe in him.

[Ecurb Noselrub]

Well whether I believe what you experience is due to God or not is irrelevent, but I'm still interested in what make you believe in him.

The sum total of my personal experiences in life, plus the historical evidence, primarily from the writings of Paul, regarding Jesus, plus hearing the experiences of other Christians. So there's a subjective prong and an objective prong to my faith.

Now, an atheist on another forum once told me that "two prongs don't make a right," and I agree that my experiences plus whatever historical evidence is in the New Testament is not enough to make a conclusive case.  But that is why my response is faith, not a claim of knowledge.  Again, it's sort of my own working hypothesis for life.  So far, it works for me.  There is always the possibility that it will stop working someday.  But that hasn't happened yet.

[The Magic Pudding]

Well whether I believe what you experience is due to God or not is irrelevent, but I'm still interested in what make you believe in him.

The sum total of my personal experiences in life, plus the historical evidence, primarily from the writings of Paul, regarding Jesus, plus hearing the experiences of other Christians. So there's a subjective prong and an objective prong to my faith.

I've never had an experience that suggests god is there.  I think you are supposed to want and prey to feel god is there.  You have to say please please please let me believe, I'm scared, I don't want to die, I don't want mine to die, protect me, I want to praise something greater than me, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe.  I find this kind of thing very dangerous, the wrongness of the process struck me at an early age.  You don't have to imagine what crazy things such a mantra may produce, it's all around.  Anyway it's nice to live in a society where you don't have to plead with yourself for a delusion or pretend success if you fail to fool yourself.

[Ecurb Noselrub]

I've never had an experience that suggests god is there.  I think you are supposed to want and prey to feel god is there.  You have to say please please please let me believe, I'm scared, I don't want to die, I don't want mine to die, protect me, I want to praise something greater than me, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe, I believe.  I find this kind of thing very dangerous, the wrongness of the process struck me at an early age.  You don't have to imagine what crazy things such a mantra may produce, it's all around.  Anyway it's nice to live in a society where you don't have to plead with yourself for a delusion or pretend success if you fail to fool yourself.

You know, that's your experience in life, and while it differs from mine, I can't fault it. If you have no experience that suggest God is there, there's probably no reason to believe in him.

[Norfolk And Chance]

My bad, I must have missed that, appologies. But LSD can lead to long term effects can it not?

Yes, but that's not what I experience. I've never had a relapse or any effects from the few times I did LSD when I was in my late teens. But, if you choose not to believe me, what can I say?

"I am deluded"?

[mayitry2answer]

I have a few questions, maybe this is the wrong place to ask this, but here it goes....
How do religious people explain all the wonderful things that happen in an atheist life?
I think they call them blessings.
Would they agree that maybe their god loves us and rewards us? But, how is that possible? Aren't non-believers supposed to be suffering because god punishes people like us?
What delusional answer could they possibly have to explain how a person is happy, prosperous and healthy without the grace or will of a god?

Actually it is the other way around. May I post Bible verses on this topic?

[Asmodean]

Actually it is the other way around. May I post Bible verses on this topic?

...And so the preaching begins. 

[OldGit]

mayitry2answer, please refer first to the Screeves of our Lady St Postula.  The answer to this and much besides will be found in the Parable of the Loud Fart and the Smelly Fart (Wailings 14 xxi - xliv).

As a general answer to this topic I would suggest that the faith-heads are suffering - from delusions - whilst we are out in the cold winds of reality.

[Tank]

I have a few questions, maybe this is the wrong place to ask this, but here it goes....
How do religious people explain all the wonderful things that happen in an atheist life?
I think they call them blessings.
Would they agree that maybe their god loves us and rewards us? But, how is that possible? Aren't non-believers supposed to be suffering because god punishes people like us?
What delusional answer could they possibly have to explain how a person is happy, prosperous and healthy without the grace or will of a god?

Actually it is the other way around. May I post Bible verses on this topic?

You can post a bible verse(s), but please make sure they are relevent.