Sexism: Is It Acceptable?

[penfold]

The female interviewer was a bit taken aback, she did push him on it a bit but he's Hitchens, what can you do?

Don't get me wrong, I'm no fan of Hitchens, both he and his brother Peter stike me as terrible snobs. He was dead wrong on Iraq too.

[LegendarySandwich]

I'm sure all of us (probably) would, in general, be opposed to unfair discrimination against men, or women.  But let's be practical.  Present a scenario, and we'll weigh in.

How about locker rooms?

I remember reading a pro-Christian, anti-gay article a long time ago giving a "reason" to ban homosexuality (at least, that's what I felt he was implying) -- that is, locker rooms. We have separate ones for men and women because, primarily, they generally feel more uncomfortable being naked around the opposite sex. However, when you add homosexuality into the equation, it becomes a bit more confusing. Should we just keep locker rooms, bathrooms, etc. the way they are, ignoring that gay people (presumably) effectively render the reason why we have separation between the sexes meaningless to them? Should we change something? If so, what?

I'd also like to add that I think that one of the main reasons why we have such separation of the sexes is because of our culture. If we begin to change and remove separation, I think it's likely that more casual attitudes towards the opposite sex will follow.

[The Magic Pudding]

Don't get me wrong, I'm no fan of Hitchens, both he and his brother Peter stike me as terrible snobs. He was dead wrong on Iraq too.

Ye the putting woman on a pedestal, it seems kind of nice, but it suggests there may be another side.
If woman are so fragile and in need of protection, they're not going to be fit for hard work.
Do men become less worthy of care, no big deal sending them to war?

However, when you add homosexuality into the equation, it becomes a bit more confusing. Should we just keep locker rooms, bathrooms, etc. the way they are, ignoring that gay people (presumably) effectively render the reason why we have separation between the sexes meaningless to them? Should we change something? If so, what?

You could have shower cubicles with doors on them, oh no! then they might misbehave behind the door!

[Whitney]

considering that I don't get nude in same sex locker rooms nor do I show anything more than would be visible at the beach I don't think coed locker room would bother me.  Yet I also expect people to change quickly and not just walking around letting everything air out.

I think the reason we separate is cultural...my only concern would be during the transition to coed with those who wouldn't have been taught how to behave (yet that's probably a problem even with same sex).

Anyway, I learned how to change with boys in the room when I was in middle school because the boys use to climb through the ceiling and look in yet the school wasn't doing a good job of stopping them.  There are ways to go from street clothes to gym clothes without showing anything; but you have to be wearing a skirt.

[LegendarySandwich]

considering that I don't get nude in same sex locker rooms nor do I show anything more than would be visible at the beach I don't think coed locker room would bother me.  Yet I also expect people to change quickly and not just walking around letting everything air out.

I think the reason we separate is cultural...my only concern would be during the transition to coed with those who wouldn't have been taught how to behave (yet that's probably a problem even with same sex).

Anyway, I learned how to change with boys in the room when I was in middle school because the boys use to climb through the ceiling and look in yet the school wasn't doing a good job of stopping them.  There are ways to go from street clothes to gym clothes without showing anything; but you have to be wearing a skirt.

Yeah, I'd like to see more co-ed locker rooms. Not only do they nicely solve the problem of what to do about gays (and other people with "nontraditional" sexualities, such as transgenders), I think they also let kids develop a more healthier view of nudity, the human body, and the opposite sex.

I'm glad you mentioned the beach, as that's something else that bothers me -- namely, that, in most places, showing breasts is illegal. It's such an obvious double-standard and so unnecessary it makes me cringe. I think that full nudity should be allowed on beaches and other such areas (such as swimming pools), but at the least allow girls to have the same liberties as men when it comes to chests.

[Whitney]

but at the least allow girls to have the same liberties as men when it comes to chests.

I think it is legal in texas for women to go topless (unless they changed it)...though I can't say I've seen any women taking advantage of the freedom.

[elliebean]

Not only do they nicely solve the problem of what to do about gays (and other people with "nontraditional" sexualities, such as transgenders)...

I don't see that there ever was a "problem of what to do with gays", etc. Also, transgender isn't a sexuality, just so you know. But as for what to do with us (yup), wrt locker rooms and restrooms, or really anything, simply treat us the same as you would other members of our true genders. Pretty straightfoward.  

[Tank]

Not only do they nicely solve the problem of what to do about gays (and other people with "nontraditional" sexualities, such as transgenders)...

I don't see that there ever was a "problem of what to do with gays", etc. Also, transgender isn't a sexuality, just so you know. But as for what to do with us (yup), wrt locker rooms and restrooms, or really anything, simply treat us the same as you would other members of our true genders. Pretty straightfoward.  

EDIT. Actually does that make an arse grab in a heterosexual bar acceptable?  

[pilchardo]

Of course men and women are different. And if two things are different from each other, then it stands to reason that sometimes it's appropriate or best to treat them differently. Unfortunately, there's a trend in certain societies to try and pretend that men and women are the same, for fear of being considered sexist. Fortunately, such people have always been in a minority. I call it as I see it, and I treat men and women differently. I also treat black and white people slightly differently, although you would probably have to be black to notice the difference.

[Ultima22689]

Of course men and women are different. And if two things are different from each other, then it stands to reason that sometimes it's appropriate or best to treat them differently. Unfortunately, there's a trend in certain societies to try and pretend that men and women are the same, for fear of being considered sexist. Fortunately, such people have always been in a minority. I call it as I see it, and I treat men and women differently. I also treat black and white people slightly differently, although you would probably have to be black to notice the difference.

And how do you treat people differently? How do you treat black people differently?

[pilchardo]

Of course men and women are different. And if two things are different from each other, then it stands to reason that sometimes it's appropriate or best to treat them differently. Unfortunately, there's a trend in certain societies to try and pretend that men and women are the same, for fear of being considered sexist. Fortunately, such people have always been in a minority. I call it as I see it, and I treat men and women differently. I also treat black and white people slightly differently, although you would probably have to be black to notice the difference.

And how do you treat people differently? How do you treat black people differently?

Why do you ask?

[Ultima22689]

Of course men and women are different. And if two things are different from each other, then it stands to reason that sometimes it's appropriate or best to treat them differently. Unfortunately, there's a trend in certain societies to try and pretend that men and women are the same, for fear of being considered sexist. Fortunately, such people have always been in a minority. I call it as I see it, and I treat men and women differently. I also treat black and white people slightly differently, although you would probably have to be black to notice the difference.

And how do you treat people differently? How do you treat black people differently?

Why do you ask?

Because i'm curious.

[pilchardo]

Could you elaborate on your questions. What exactly do you want to know?

[Ultima22689]

Could you elaborate on your questions. What exactly do you want to know?

It's simple, the people that you treat differently, like black people. How do you treat black people differently?

[pilchardo]

Could you elaborate on your questions. What exactly do you want to know?

It's simple, the people that you treat differently, like black people. How do you treat black people differently?

Is that all you want to know or don't you want to know how I treat people differently in general? Why are you focussing on black people?