Islam versus atheism

[Wael El-Manzalawy]

This is an imagined discussion between a muslim and an atheist. But it is based on my actual discussions with atheists.

Muslim: Do you believe in God?

Atheist: There is no God. Can you prove that there is a God?

Muslim: The universe, the land, the see, the sky, the sun, the moon,….etc are all evidences that there is a God who has created the universe.

Atheist: Can I see and hear the God?

Muslim: You cannot see the God. We have the word of the God which is the Quran. The language of the Quran is Arabic. We â€"Arabs- know very well that the Quran cannot be written by a human being. The Quran has challenged the old Arabs to write something that resembles the Quran. The old Arabs were genius poets but they could not. Nowadays, some persons tried to write something that resembles the Quran, but they made themselves a joke.

Atheist: Then the Quran is for Arabs only.

Muslim: The Quran is the word of the God for all peoples. Indeed the Arabs can feel the greatness of the Quran more than the other peoples. But the other peoples can read the translation of the meanings of the Quran. They can see the wisdom of the Quran. They can see the scientific accuracy of the Quran.

Atheist: Can you give me an example of the wisdom of the Quran?

Muslim: Islam forbids homosexuality and sex outside marriage. We can see clearly that homosexuality and sex outside marriage caused the spread of AIDS which caused or will cause the death of millions of people. Besides, with Islam, a man can be sure that his son is really his son. But in western countries, a man cannot be sure that his son is really his son.

Atheist: I want to discuss the presence of the God. The universe is created by the God. Who has created the God.

Muslim: The God has not been created. The God is eternal.

Atheist: I can say that the universe is eternal.

Muslim: The universe is changeable, so it cannot be eternal.

Atheist: You did not convince me.

Muslim: I invite you to read the Quran. I invite you to rethink about the common secular idea that there is no God. It is a common idea, but it is completely wrong.

[curiosityandthecat]

Summary:

Muslim: You don't believe in God?

Atheist: Nope. If you can prove it, I'll believe.

Muslim: Here, read this book.


Assumed result:

Atheist: ZOMG I BELIEVE NAO WTF ALLAH FTW!!!110!0!)01!(31939


Gimme a break.

[Sophus]

Muslim: Do you believe in God?

Atheist: There is no God. Can you prove that there is a God?

Muslim: The universe, the land, the see, the sky, the sun, the moon,….etc are all evidences that there is a God who has created the universe.

Atheist: I could say the same thing, meaning that our existence only proves the Big Bang Theory. Or any alternate theory of how we got here.

Muslim: The universe is too perfectly balanced to not have a God.

Atheist: We do not know how many universes there are. It is thought that the shape of our universe is like that of a folded piece of paper. Thus universes are stacked on top of each other and wormholes would lead into parallel universes. Who knows how many universes there are and how odd it is for its circumstances to support life? We cannot not because we have but only one universe to judge from. You cannot compare apples to oranges when you have never seen an orange.

Muslim: I have faith.

Atheist: Faith rejects possibilities. If I "have faith" that my car will start in the morning because it always has even though it's in bad condition, then I do not consider the possibility that it might not. However I will be surprised when it finally fails and disappointed I didn't do what I could to prevent it.


Douglas Adams compared such thinkers as you to an intelligent puddle of water. Adams said "the puddle is certain that the hole in the ground he occupies must have been designed specifically for him because it fits him so well. The puddle exists under the sun until he has entirely evaporated."


God can not be proven with any Holy texts although I certainly do find the Korans poetry moving and images beautiful. I think I will buy one.

[Asmodean]

I'm an atheist. Here is how this conversation would look like against me:

Muslim: Do you believe in God?

Atheist: Nope. There is no proof of gods and thus it's safe to assume they do not exist

Muslim: The universe, the land, the see, the sky, the sun, the moon,….etc are all evidences that there is a God who has created the universe.

Atheist: And those prove god how, exactly? The Universe is no more than all the stars and planets and the space inbetween (outer space, or what lies beyond the farthest star, excluded), the land is a jumble of minerals made up of molecules made up of atoms made up of protons, neutrons and electrons. It's all in your chemistry book; the sea is made of water, which is made by burning oxygen in hydrogen or as a bi-product of several other chemical reactions. Again, nothing divine about it; the sky is the Universe viewed through a blanket of the atmosphere; the sun is a giant nuclear reactor; the moon is a rock made of the same stuff (more or less) as Earth and much in the same way. Where do your gods fit in?

Muslim: You cannot see the God. We have the word of the God which is the Quran. The language of the Quran is Arabic. We â€"Arabs- know very well that the Quran cannot be written by a human being. The Quran has challenged the old Arabs to write something that resembles the Quran. The old Arabs were genius poets but they could not. Nowadays, some persons tried to write something that resembles the Quran, but they made themselves a joke.

Atheist: Quran was written by humans. If you claim otherwise, I will be happy to examine any scientific evidence you present. Scientific being the key word here.

Muslim: The Quran is the word of the God for all peoples. Indeed the Arabs can feel the greatness of the Quran more than the other peoples. But the other peoples can read the translation of the meanings of the Quran. They can see the wisdom of the Quran. They can see the scientific accuracy of the Quran.

Atheist: The "scientific accuracy" of the Quran? My dear, I can read Lord of the Rings and find it scientifically accurate if I am prepared to read more into the words than they actually say.

Muslim: Islam forbids homosexuality and sex outside marriage. We can see clearly that homosexuality and sex outside marriage caused the spread of AIDS which caused or will cause the death of millions of people. Besides, with Islam, a man can be sure that his son is really his son. But in western countries, a man cannot be sure that his son is really his son.

Atheist: So if I don't care if my kid is my biological kid or not because I love him, then what difference does it make? When it comes to HIV, you (or your religion) is obviously very ignorant of the medicine behind the letters. As for sex outside marriage, humans can bond for life, or not. It's their choice. Thus, the Quran is full of BS on the subject.

Muslim: The God has not been created. The God is eternal.

Atheist: Yet according to you religious types, EVERYTHING has a creator. Do I smell hypocricy?

Muslim: The universe is changeable, so it cannot be eternal.

Atheist: Eternal is a concept which means, at the core of it, that something has no beginning nor end. What shape, structure or taste that something has within eternity is irrelevant.

Muslim: I invite you to read the Quran. I invite you to rethink about the common secular idea that there is no God. It is a common idea, but it is completely wrong.

Me: Wrong, is it? Prove it.

[Sophus]

Muslim: The universe is changeable, so it cannot be eternal.

People are changeable. Guess they're not eternal either.

[rlrose328]

This is an imagined discussion between a muslim and an atheist. But it is based on my actual discussions with atheists.

Sorry, but the only thing you've shown here is your condescension toward other people.  You've shown that you believe yours is the only way to live on this earth and that, my friend, is illogical and silly.

Atheist: Can you give me an example of the wisdom of the Quran?

Muslim: Islam forbids homosexuality and sex outside marriage. We can see clearly that homosexuality and sex outside marriage caused the spread of AIDS which caused or will cause the death of millions of people. Besides, with Islam, a man can be sure that his son is really his son. But in western countries, a man cannot be sure that his son is really his son.

I'm glad YOU can clearly see that homosexuality and sex outside of marriage has spread AIDS, but that is not the case.  IV drug use among heterosexuals is one of the major sources of the spread of AIDS and in Africa, it is mainly heterosexual sex that spreads it, both inside and outside of marriage.

You project your skewed view of the world on an entire country because of the media.  In Western Countries, a man can be sure that his son (and his daughter, too, btw) is his.

Let's discuss how you treat women in your country.  How women have no rights and are tortured and beaten for crimes that men walk away from.  Let's talk about how you discard women like used tissue when they are old and/or widowed.  I have no respect for a country, civilization, or religion that treats its citizens like that.  At least in this country, I have the freedom to tell you that.

[Kyuuketsuki]

Summary:

Muslim: You don't believe in God?

Atheist: Nope. If you can prove it, I'll believe.

Muslim: Here, read this book.


Assumed result:

Atheist: ZOMG I BELIEVE NAO WTF ALLAH FTW!!!110!0!)01!(31939


Gimme a break.

ROFLMAO!!! Nicely put mate  

Kyu

[Sophus]

Let's discuss how you treat women in your country.  How women have no rights and are tortured and beaten for crimes that men walk away from.  Let's talk about how you discard women like used tissue when they are old and/or widowed.  I have no respect for a country, civilization, or religion that treats its citizens like that.  At least in this country, I have the freedom to tell you that.

You do know Islam is not a country right? And that only a few of Muslim dominated countries disregard womens rights to such extremes? You can't put every muslim into a box.

[rlrose328]

Let's discuss how you treat women in your country.  How women have no rights and are tortured and beaten for crimes that men walk away from.  Let's talk about how you discard women like used tissue when they are old and/or widowed.  I have no respect for a country, civilization, or religion that treats its citizens like that.  At least in this country, I have the freedom to tell you that.

You do know Islam is not a country right? And that only a few of Muslim dominated countries disregard womens rights to such extremes? You can't put every muslim into a box.

On the Country issue, yes I do know that Islam is not a country.  He made reference to "western countries" and I responded in kind.

On the women issue, yes, I know...  

It was a timing issue on my part because I'd just watched that video posted elsewhere here about the interview with the former American who is now a Muslim and his attitude toward women got me going.

I really do try desperately to NOT make generalizations about any group of people.

[Wael El-Manzalawy]

As regards the scientific accuracy of the Quran, I invite you to visit the following site:

http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/ ... tists.html

[curiosityandthecat]

As regards the scientific accuracy of the Quran, I invite you to visit the following site:

http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/ ... tists.html

Oh, lord, not this again.

[Whitney]

As regards the scientific accuracy of the Quran, I invite you to visit the following site:

http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/ ... tists.html

Ok..sigh..at the risk of having some thiest claim that I'm being "unfair" and that I ban all the theists (which I don't) I'm going to make this being your one and only warning to either respond to the posts others have directed towards you or not bother posting here anymore.  If you post another link as your contribution to the conversation you will get banned.  Use the brain that you think god gave you and tells us what you think in your own words.  If you don't want to use your brain I'm sure there are other sites that would love to help you pat yourself on the back in agreement...this is not that kind of site.

Links by themselves are spam (so is quoting another site by copy and paste).  This is your only warning, I don't need to give people multiple chances to follow one simple request.  Learn how to be respectful of those who have bothered wasting their precious free time responding to your post.

[Squid]

As regards the scientific accuracy of the Quran, I invite you to visit the following site:

http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/ ... tists.html

Oh, lord, not this again.

I should start a site about the scientific accuracy of The Iliad.

[Kyuuketsuki]

As regards the scientific accuracy of the Quran, I invite you to visit the following site:

http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/ ... tists.html

I cordially invite you to write the posts yourself (demonstrate you have some understanding of the stuff you claim) and post them here

Kyu

[wazzz]

IT’s like a play with no actors hehe
only death can prove all that  
so be dead and come back to tell us