Would we all be better off without religion?

[uglyduckling]

Weigh in--would the world be a better place, by and large, without the influence of religion?  Why or Why not?

[notself]

It would be the same place with people having different excuses for being dicks.

[G-Roll]

no the world would not be any better or any worse.

im assuming that most of us agree that what one believes spiritually has little impact on the question, if they are a good person or not? so.. really, if people suck equally.... they still suck.

barring any what if games, if religion disappeared we would still fight over resources, land, money, history, race, gender, borders, and everything that we fight over now.

maybe gays would be better off without religion. maybe science would have advanced 100% better/faster. and we could cure most diseases and ect... other than that, i dont see the world that much different.

[pinkocommie]

The thing I dislike about religion is that it's a powerful tool of justification.  Without religion, there would be some other powerful tool of justification that bad people would find in order to do bad things.  The real evil of religion, as I see it, is that good people can be, at times, convinced to go along with bad people doing bad things because of the power of religious justification.  I think it's naive to think that without religion, this wouldn't happen.  I just can't imagine how it would manifest.

[ClicheGuevara]

no the world would not be any better or any worse.

im assuming that most of us agree that what one believes spiritually has little impact on the question, if they are a good person or not? so.. really, if people suck equally.... they still suck.

barring any what if games, if religion disappeared we would still fight over resources, land, money, history, race, gender, borders, and everything that we fight over now.

maybe gays would be better off without religion. maybe science would have advanced 100% better/faster. and we could cure most diseases and ect... other than that, i dont see the world that much different.

QFT.

 

It would be the same place with people having different excuses for being dicks.

So true

this thread made me think of this. .
http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/1 ... earchterm=

[Adrian Simmons]

The thing I dislike about religion is that it's a powerful tool of justification.  Without religion, there would be some other powerful tool of justification that bad people would find in order to do bad things.  The real evil of religion, as I see it, is that good people can be, at times, convinced to go along with bad people doing bad things because of the power of religious justification.  I think it's naive to think that without religion, this wouldn't happen.  I just can't imagine how it would manifest.

Hear hear. I used to be very religious and I have to say, my christian friends were mostly very easy going (and they're still my friends), whereas now I find that the atheists that I've come to know and hang out with can get quite uptight about the most trivial of things, as though they want everything to turn into an argument. It feels like they're desperate to be right all the time and to get a kick out of ridiculing others. Life's too short for all that. It's ironic, when I was a christian I always imagined it to be the other way around, but obviously it's not. I find myself being selective about what I talk about with atheists whereas I could and still can literally talk about anything at all with the christians. You'd be surprised how cool they are about most things, they're just generally easier to have conversations with. Atheists seem to have a chip on their shoulder the whole time, it's really annoying, and although I'm an atheist now it get on my nerves at times. Sometimes I say to them "chill, Winston" (like in lock stock and two smoking barrels) and I can almost see the fire in their eyes. At the end of the day, you live, then you die and you're gone, you might aswell be cool while you're here. And no one likes an uptight party pooper.

[G-Roll]

The thing I dislike about religion is that it's a powerful tool of justification. Without religion, there would be some other powerful tool of justification that bad people would find in order to do bad things. The real evil of religion, as I see it, is that good people can be, at times, convinced to go along with bad people doing bad things because of the power of religious justification. I think it's naive to think that without religion, this wouldn't happen. I just can't imagine how it would manifest.

Hear hear. I used to be very religious and I have to say, my christian friends were mostly very easy going (and they're still my friends), whereas now I find that the atheists that I've come to know and hang out with can get quite uptight about the most trivial of things, as though they want everything to turn into an argument. It feels like they're desperate to be right all the time and to get a kick out of ridiculing others. Life's too short for all that. It's ironic, when I was a christian I always imagined it to be the other way around, but obviously it's not. I find myself being selective about what I talk about with atheists whereas I could and still can literally talk about anything at all with the christians. You'd be surprised how cool they are about most things, they're just generally easier to have conversations with. Atheists seem to have a chip on their shoulder the whole time, it's really annoying, and although I'm an atheist now it get on my nerves at times. Sometimes I say to them "chill, Winston" (like in lock stock and two smoking barrels) and I can almost see the fire in their eyes. At the end of the day, you live, then you die and you're gone, you might aswell be cool while you're here. And no one likes an uptight party pooper.

what?    

[i_am_i]

When I think about all the things we could have instead of religion, I'll take religion. Look at it this way: at least the Christians don't have an army.

[Adrian Simmons]

When I think about all the things we could have instead of religion, I'll take religion. Look at it this way: at least the Christians don't have an army.

Good point, but you're forgetting about the formidable salvation army.

[pinkocommie]

The thing I dislike about religion is that it's a powerful tool of justification.  Without religion, there would be some other powerful tool of justification that bad people would find in order to do bad things.  The real evil of religion, as I see it, is that good people can be, at times, convinced to go along with bad people doing bad things because of the power of religious justification.  I think it's naive to think that without religion, this wouldn't happen.  I just can't imagine how it would manifest.

Hear hear. I used to be very religious and I have to say, my christian friends were mostly very easy going (and they're still my friends), whereas now I find that the atheists that I've come to know and hang out with can get quite uptight about the most trivial of things, as though they want everything to turn into an argument. It feels like they're desperate to be right all the time and to get a kick out of ridiculing others. Life's too short for all that. It's ironic, when I was a christian I always imagined it to be the other way around, but obviously it's not. I find myself being selective about what I talk about with atheists whereas I could and still can literally talk about anything at all with the christians. You'd be surprised how cool they are about most things, they're just generally easier to have conversations with. Atheists seem to have a chip on their shoulder the whole time, it's really annoying, and although I'm an atheist now it get on my nerves at times. Sometimes I say to them "chill, Winston" (like in lock stock and two smoking barrels) and I can almost see the fire in their eyes. At the end of the day, you live, then you die and you're gone, you might aswell be cool while you're here. And no one likes an uptight party pooper.

I think atheists are tired of being called sub human, immoral, unfit for raising children, evil, sinful, all of it.  I think atheists generally hate how some religious people control their gay friend's lives and try to dictate the lives of other people as if they know what's right for the world.  Not all Christians are like that, obviously, but I understand the knee jerk reaction to be critical of religious people when you're an atheist because for some people, they feel oppressed by religion.  Would you blame a Jewish person for refusing to give a Nazi a fair shake?  That's how some people see it.  And some people are assholes as well as atheists.  And some people are laid back and don't feel that way at all.

[Adrian Simmons]

The thing I dislike about religion is that it's a powerful tool of justification.  Without religion, there would be some other powerful tool of justification that bad people would find in order to do bad things.  The real evil of religion, as I see it, is that good people can be, at times, convinced to go along with bad people doing bad things because of the power of religious justification.  I think it's naive to think that without religion, this wouldn't happen.  I just can't imagine how it would manifest.

Hear hear. I used to be very religious and I have to say, my christian friends were mostly very easy going (and they're still my friends), whereas now I find that the atheists that I've come to know and hang out with can get quite uptight about the most trivial of things, as though they want everything to turn into an argument. It feels like they're desperate to be right all the time and to get a kick out of ridiculing others. Life's too short for all that. It's ironic, when I was a christian I always imagined it to be the other way around, but obviously it's not. I find myself being selective about what I talk about with atheists whereas I could and still can literally talk about anything at all with the christians. You'd be surprised how cool they are about most things, they're just generally easier to have conversations with. Atheists seem to have a chip on their shoulder the whole time, it's really annoying, and although I'm an atheist now it get on my nerves at times. Sometimes I say to them "chill, Winston" (like in lock stock and two smoking barrels) and I can almost see the fire in their eyes. At the end of the day, you live, then you die and you're gone, you might aswell be cool while you're here. And no one likes an uptight party pooper.

I think atheists are tired of being called sub human, immoral, unfit for raising children, evil, sinful, all of it.  I think atheists generally hate how some religious people control their gay friend's lives and try to dictate the lives of other people as if they know what's right for the world.  Not all Christians are like that, obviously, but I understand the knee jerk reaction to be critical of religious people when you're an atheist because for some people, they feel oppressed by religion.  Would you blame a Jewish person for refusing to give a Nazi a fair shake?  That's how some people see it.  And some people are assholes as well as atheists.  And some people are laid back and don't feel that way at all.

Yeah I get that but as they say, two wrongs don't make a right. I enjoy the company of my religious friends so much, that I still go to church. Yeah I know, go figure. My point being that there's always a positive way to deal with (and get along with) those who believe differently.

[Adrian Simmons]

The thing I dislike about religion is that it's a powerful tool of justification. Without religion, there would be some other powerful tool of justification that bad people would find in order to do bad things. The real evil of religion, as I see it, is that good people can be, at times, convinced to go along with bad people doing bad things because of the power of religious justification. I think it's naive to think that without religion, this wouldn't happen. I just can't imagine how it would manifest.

Hear hear. I used to be very religious and I have to say, my christian friends were mostly very easy going (and they're still my friends), whereas now I find that the atheists that I've come to know and hang out with can get quite uptight about the most trivial of things, as though they want everything to turn into an argument. It feels like they're desperate to be right all the time and to get a kick out of ridiculing others. Life's too short for all that. It's ironic, when I was a christian I always imagined it to be the other way around, but obviously it's not. I find myself being selective about what I talk about with atheists whereas I could and still can literally talk about anything at all with the christians. You'd be surprised how cool they are about most things, they're just generally easier to have conversations with. Atheists seem to have a chip on their shoulder the whole time, it's really annoying, and although I'm an atheist now it get on my nerves at times. Sometimes I say to them "chill, Winston" (like in lock stock and two smoking barrels) and I can almost see the fire in their eyes. At the end of the day, you live, then you die and you're gone, you might aswell be cool while you're here. And no one likes an uptight party pooper.

what?    

I didn't mean all atheists.

[G-Roll]

why are you an atheist?

[Adrian Simmons]

I guess it's because I'm a realist, I dunno really, I just don't buy the whole "God diddit" theory any more. It's hard to explain the transition, maybe it's just a change of mindset more than anything else. How did you become an atheist? Were you religious at any time?

[pinkocommie]

Yeah I get that but as they say, two wrongs don't make a right.

Oh if only life were that easy.  

 

I enjoy the company of my religious friends so much, that I still go to church. Yeah I know, go figure. My point being that there's always a positive way to deal with (and get along with) those who believe differently.

I've never been religious, but I hung out at a Unitarian church for a huge chunk of my childhood and those people gave me a really positive opinion of Christians at a young age.    It wasn't until I was older that I realized that the Christians I knew were one one kind of thousands of kinds of Christians and that some Christians felt they were justified in taking their beliefs and trying to make laws based on those beliefs to the exclusion of anyone else's beliefs under the guise of being god-endorsed-'right'.  That's when I went from an atheist who didn't think anything of being an atheist to a vocal and self defined atheist.  I don't care what anyone else wants to believe, but when it starts infringing on the lives of others, it's wrong.