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George Floyd

Davin

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #90 on: June 12, 2020, 03:37:38 PM »
Sorry to say so, but I find the arguments of this pastor very convincing

I can't listen right now, so I cannot form an opinion. See how that works Bruce? First you hear what the person is saying, and then you form an opinion based off of what they are saying.

What parts of his argument do you find convincing and why?
Always question all authorities because the authority you don't question is the most dangerous... except me, never question me.

Davin

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #91 on: June 12, 2020, 03:52:02 PM »
Billy, What he said was that all cops are not bad cops. He had been intimidated by a cop on more than one occasion, he had instructed his son about how to behave when he was stopped when driving while black. The minister was careful to say that most cops are not bad guys and most of them are not dedicated racists.

When we translate the pastors commentary, it means that our society is a mixed bag and that there are some of us that are fucked up with some kind of learned hate.   I concur. There are some of us, mostly the unsophisticated clods who never read a book or newspaper, who are either closeted or outed racists.
...

My sermon: Some cops are stupid bastards who have some sort of superiority complex that they believe entitles them to abuse or even kill people that they believe are unworthy.  Well surprise, surprise. The problem is not exclusive to cops.  I have worked with engineers who were stupid bastards with a complex. Some of our Lawyers, accountants, politicians, and doctors also suffer from the hate syndrome. Most of those professionals have actually read books and newspapers but have  chosen sources that cater to the preconceived notions that they had already embraced. In defense of the above professionals, I agree that most of them do not kill people directly. Neither do the vast majority of cops kill people as a sport.
Cops need to be held to a higher standard than the rest of us. Currently and for a long time, cops have been held to a lower standard. If one of them engineers got on a power trip and killed someone, it's highly likely that that engineer would be subject to consequences. Not so much for cops, it's about the opposite. Cops that have killed people while on a power trip have rarely faced consequences, and those that did, it's even rarer that they will lose their job.

Near where I live, an unarmed man was shot dead by a cop. The cop had a body cam that clearly showed the guy trying to comply with contradictory orders. When the guy went to pull up his pants, the cop shot him several times with an assault rifle. The cop was let off because the jury was instructed to only consider the one second of video before the cop shot him. That cop eventually got fired because of the story getting nationwide media attention. Then the cop got rehired for three months so that he could get his pension, so now the public is paying both the shitty cop for the rest of his life and the family of the man he murdered.

Yes, there are people that go on power trips in all walks of life. But when that person has a gun and their job is to protect and serve, then their behavior needs to be held to a higher standard than the rest of us because of the power that they have. With great power, should come great responsibility.
Always question all authorities because the authority you don't question is the most dangerous... except me, never question me.

Anne D.

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #92 on: June 13, 2020, 07:41:27 AM »
Well, it appears Davin does not want to tell us his plan to defund police.  I suppose I must remain in my ignorance.

I'm not Davin, but I'll tell you what defunding police means for my community.

I live in Minneapolis and have done for the past 5+ years. I am ecstatic that my city councilmember is among those who’ve pledged to dismantle the MPD. Dismantling the MPD doesn’t mean there’s no law enforcement. It means that, in the short term, Minneapolis may end up contracting for law enforcement from another jurisdiction. And it means that, in the long term, we build a new Minneapolis law enforcement agency from the ground up, with a much smaller footprint than the current MPD. And we funnel much of the funding previously earmarked for MPD to non-law-enforcement (social work and treatment) entities that can respond to 911 calls involving mental health or drug crises.

When all you’ve got is a hammer (police), everything starts to look like a nail. The US locks up a ridiculous percentage of our citizens for behavior that shouldn’t be criminalized. And once you’re in the “system,” it’s difficult to get out, especially if you’re poor. Once you’re on probation, you’ve got someone in your business 24-7.

But I digress.

MPD is beyond repair or reform. Citizens have been trying to reform it since the 1960s. Every X number of years, an officer murders a resident, and a new citizen review board is set up, with no actual power. And after a few years, the citizen review board is dismantled. As a local organization that is committed to defunding MPD, MPD 150, has pointed out, what's more "pie in the sky," defunding MPD and starting anew, or thinking that a new tweak to the existing department will improve outcomes in the future?

Monthly, MPD pays out thousands of dollars to settle excessive-force suits.

It does no good to fire the “bad apples.” The police union (which broke with the mainstream US labor movement in the 1930s) is all powerful, and the city is forced to hire back the fired cops a few months later. The union contract is negotiated between the city and the union reps, but if the city council chooses not to approve the new contract, that just means that the old contract continues.

MPD has had the feds step in to review the department, but MPD has yet to implement those reforms. And there’s no consequence for not implementing them, so why would MPD comply?

I don’t think simply slashing the MPD budget is the answer either. I’ve heard it pointed out that doing that means the younger, possibly more progressive officers are fired, leaving us with older officers already steeped in MPD’s racist culture and failed ways.

It doesn’t matter that there are good cops. They can have very little impact when the department as a whole and as an institution is rotten and beyond rehabilitation and when the majority of cops give their fealty to the racist police union. Time for a completely new agency.

And the problems in Minneapolis and MPD aren’t unique to here. This needs to happen nationwide.

Tank

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #93 on: June 13, 2020, 07:54:26 AM »
Thanks for your local insight Anne D. This is the sort of thing I love about social media, direct experience.
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
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Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.

Magdalena

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #94 on: June 13, 2020, 08:33:53 AM »
Thanks for your local insight Anne D. This is the sort of thing I love about social media, direct experience.
:this:

“I've had several "spiritual" or numinous experiences over the years, but never felt that they were the product of anything but the workings of my own mind in reaction to the universe.” ~Recusant

Randy

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #95 on: June 13, 2020, 01:42:33 PM »
Anne D., That is more informed than I could get on the news. Please continue to enlighten us.
"Maybe it's just a bunch of stuff that happens." -- Homer Simpson
"Some people focus on the destination. Atheists focus on the journey." -- Barry Goldberg

xSilverPhinx

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #96 on: November 23, 2020, 05:09:06 PM »
Where I live a black man was beaten to death by a security guard and police officer few days ago in a supermarket, which sparked a national wave of protests, riots and vandalism.

Killing of black man by guards at Brazil supermarket sparks protests (BBC)

Even with all the racial intermixing, Brazilian society is steeped in both veiled and obvious racism, despite what the feeble-minded "president" says. I'm sceptical this will effect any enduring change, though.   :-\
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Tank

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #97 on: November 23, 2020, 05:26:07 PM »
Didn't even get a sniff of that on the news here.
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
“Religion is a culture of faith; science is a culture of doubt.” ― Richard P. Feynman
'It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die. That is true, it's called Life.' - Terry Pratchett
Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.

Dark Lightning

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #98 on: November 23, 2020, 06:07:43 PM »
That's horrible. That, and the 5 people killed by the police per day in Brasilia in 2019.   :???:

I'll bet those guards plead "not guilty" when they go to court. Hopefully the prosecution has the video.

xSilverPhinx

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #99 on: November 23, 2020, 10:59:54 PM »
Didn't even get a sniff of that on the news here.

I didn't either, but then again I no longer watch or read the news.  ;)

The video of him getting beaten to death spread like wildfire through social media.
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I'm not a slave to greed
I don't embrace your make believe
I've never been for sale no matter what they think I need



xSilverPhinx

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Re: George Floyd
« Reply #100 on: November 23, 2020, 11:01:29 PM »
That's horrible. That, and the 5 people killed by the police per day in Brasilia in 2019.   :???:

I'm not surprised.

Quote
I'll bet those guards plead "not guilty" when they go to court. Hopefully the prosecution has the video.

It would be stupid to do so, practically everybody with access to a smartphone has seen the footage already, it would seem. The prosecution no doubt would have to.
I lose myself infused in something more than what they've seen
I'm not a slave to greed
I don't embrace your make believe
I've never been for sale no matter what they think I need