We (Atheists of Florida) blasted Tampa city council AGAIN!

[VietnamVet-BRIGHT]

We had five members from our group, Atheists of Florida, (me included â€" John Kieffer) do an encore performance (as public comments) for the Tampa city Council this morning on the issue of prayer/invocation.  At the outset, the city council chairman wanted to stop Rob Curry (our executive director) as he began to speak asserting that our issue was not on the agenda, which got the chair, council members and council attorney into as heated an exchange as you’re going to get in these conservatively run meetings.  Bottom line we were allowed to speak as was appropriate for any other agenda item (invocation is on the agenda as the lead thing to do before the Pledge of Allegiance).  

Finally, I may have raised the temperature a bit by referring to “God” as an “invisible alien” (as I have for years when referring to this nonsense) and, a new replacement for the term “invocation” as the “invisible alien standing ritual.”  (I’ll post my entire little speech in one of the following posts on this thread).

Also, click on the link to read dozens of reader comments.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/localgover ... er/1070731

Atheists object again to City Council prayer

By Janet Zink, Times Staff Writer
Posted: Feb 04, 2010 11:21 AM

TAMPA -- For the second City Council meeting in a row, people opposed to a pre-meeting prayer urged the council Thursday to do away with the practice.

Rob Curry, executive director, of the nonprofit Atheists of Florida, was the first person to approach the podium during the public comment portion of the meeting. Council chairman Tom Scott tried to keep him from speaking, saying the invocation wasn't on the agenda.

"If you want to silence atheists..." Curry began.

Scott, pastor at 34th Street Church of God, banged his gavel: "Sir, you are out of order."

City attorneys intervened, with City Council attorney Martin Shelby noting that the invocation is indeed on the agenda, though not as a legislative matter.

That prompted this observation from Council member John Dingfelder: "On the front of the agenda it has the address of City Hall, but we wouldn't consider that an item on the agenda."

Shelby noted that public comment is open to any matter, but priority is given to agenda items.

Scott asked if anyone wanted to speak on any item on the agenda. When no one rose to speak, Curry took the floor, saying that roughly 10 percent of the population considers themselves atheists, and requiring people to rise and pray before government meetings discriminates against them.

"Please consider protecting atheists from discrimination, starting with something that is easy to fix, quick and harms no one. Simply replace the invocation, which is divisive, with a moment of silence or reflection," Curry said. "We're not against prayer, we're against the entanglement of religion and government."

His remarks were met with applause and Scott banged the gavel again.

"There will be no clapping," he said.

John Kieffer, president of Atheists of Florida, said since council members didn't seem to understand the points he made two weeks ago, he would try to put it in "more simple and generic terms."

"Believe it or not, there are people who believe in invisible aliens," he said. "Believers usually talk to these aliens mentally and silently, but sometimes in a standing ritual."

People who don't believe in the aliens and decline to rise, he said, stand out like a "ketchup stain on a white shirt."

"When you do the invisible alien standing ritual at your meetings, I don't know what to do. You see, I'm not a believer in invisible aliens," he said. "What should I do? Lie to fit in, or be the hated ketchup stain."

Pastor Frank R. Williams defended the prayer practice.

"If it wasn't for prayer we wouldn't be here today. Thank God for Jesus Christ," he said. "I would tell you "God bless you,'' but you've got so many nonbelievers here. I'll pray for you."

The flap over prayer at City Council meetings started in September when the invited speaker ended his remarks with a request that the council be blessed in the "name of Jesus Christ."

That prompted Council member Linda Saul-Sena, who is Jewish, to suggest that future speakers consult a brochure that describes how to deliver a public prayer without singling out any specific religion.

Two weeks ago, when the prayer opponents spoke, no City Council member responded.

"I want to apologize that no one said anything last time," Council member Mary Mulhern said Thursday. "It's not that we're not listening or considering. It's just that it's a pretty big topic."

She said she has been talking to city attorneys about how to resolve the issue.

"I will make sure that this is addressed at some point by council," she said.

As he left City Hall, Curry said his group will come to every City Council meeting until the issue is resolved.

"I really appreciate and respect the time that Mary Mulhern took to address us today," he said. "She was thoughtful and considerate."

Janet Zink can be reached at jzink@sptimes.com or (813) 226-3401.

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[Whitney]

You should be able to get Jewish community to support your quest if you don't make it so much about "athesits" as it is about freedom from state mandated religion.  They are generally just as much for separation of church and state as atheists.  Together we are closer to 20 or 30% of the population; enough to affect the polls significantly.