I'm stunned by how U.S. citizens keep getting dumber and lazier.
http://gma.yahoo.com/k-e-diet-brides-using-feeding-tubes-rapidly-080053646--abc-news-health.html
Quote
Brides-to-be looking to shed that final 10, 15 or 20 pounds in order to fit into their dream wedding gown have taken a controversial approach to crash dieting that involves inserting a feeding tube into their noses for up to 10 days for a quick fix to rapid weight loss.
Quote"It was emotionally difficult, the 10 days of not eating," Schnaider said. "And sometimes I had to give excuses to people who were asking are you sick? And I was like, 'No, I'm not sick, I'm not dying, I'm fine.'
"I was tired. I didn't feel like exercising. The doctor told me that if you can compliment with walking for a half an hour on the beach, that would be great, but I didn't feel like doing that. I'm a very energetic person, but those days I was a little tired."
Quote"The main side effects are bad breath; there is some constipation because there is no fiber in the food," he said.
Quote
Although the K-E diet is new to the United States, it has been around for years in Europe. Dr. Di Pietro charges $1,500 for the 10-day plan, and says the before-and-after pictures sell themselves.
It's good to know Europeans are trying to make
Idiocracy a reality as well.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808/
This sort of thing does make one worry about the sanity of some people when faced with the intense peer pressure of US media. I don't see it getting better either. >:(
Jeeze. When I get a little pudgy around the middle, I just borrow Vinnie's neck sweat to use while I run.
And all the patients who actually require naso-gastric feeding for therapeutic purposes say, "Are you fucking kidding me?"
How desperate do you have to be to do that? Just getting the damn tube down is an extremely uncomfortable procedure. I remember one poor patient crying and gagging while the nurse tried to feed the tube past the soft palate . . . it kept getting stuck . . .:(
Isn't that how they used to torture suffragettes?
(https://encrypted-tbn1.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQX_5VFpJMXKoFs9xYSwpacRn2g53-Ft0Tw8sodG0SpaOez0u9N)
Oh, the irony.
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on April 19, 2012, 08:26:41 PM
Isn't that how they used to torture suffragettes?
(https://encrypted-tbn1.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQX_5VFpJMXKoFs9xYSwpacRn2g53-Ft0Tw8sodG0SpaOez0u9N)
Oh, the irony.
It wasn't done to torture or punish (although that was undoubtedly considered an advantageous side effect by some) but to prevent successful hunger strikes.
Yeah, I guess saying they did it "to torture" might not be the most accurate. But that's how I'd probably consider it if I was the person getting a tube shoved into my body against my will.
Nonetheless, it makes me sad that people think this is a good idea. :(
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on April 19, 2012, 08:39:57 PM
Yeah, I guess saying they did it "to torture" might not be the most accurate. But that's how I'd probably consider it if I was the person getting a tube shoved into my body against my will.
Nonetheless, it makes me sad that people think this is a good idea. :(
Absolutely true.
When we had patients who we thought were faking unconsciousness, most times someone in the local lock up who thought they would rather spend the night in the ER instead of jail. We used to "Secure their airway" by inserting a nasopharyngeal cannula.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.picturescream.com%2Fimages%2Fnasopharyngealairway.jpg&hash=a74aa502fa5a69eb28cb2f405ce55f6a30e5baa5)
Inserting the device is unpleasant enough that someone who is faking has a hard time lying still.
As for this K-E Diet feeding tube, I don't see it as either dumb or lazy. Anyone who thinks only lazy people are over wight is just narrow minded and doesn't understand the issue. I admit it's over the top but many people are pretty desperate. I also think it sounds safer and less drastic then liposuction and thats been used for decades.
Why be so hateful and condescending to people who are trying something thats new?
Quote from: Crocoduck on April 21, 2012, 03:29:27 AM
As for this K-E Diet feeding tube, I don't see it as either dumb or lazy. Anyone who thinks only lazy people are over wight is just narrow minded and doesn't understand the issue. I admit it's over the top but many people are pretty desperate. I also think it sounds safer and less drastic then liposuction and thats been used for decades.
Why be so hateful and condescending to people who are trying something thats new?
Because I was responding to the article which focused on the dumb brides undergoing this treatment to loose a few pounds before their wedding. Exercise and eat right.
Added: Also this treatment wouldn't appear to work for people who need to lose a lot of weight. So yes, the brides are lazy and stupid, in my opinion. People who weren't lazy would diet and exercise to fit into their dress.
Quote from: Crocoduck on April 21, 2012, 03:29:27 AM
I admit it's over the top but many people are pretty desperate. I also think it sounds safer and less drastic then liposuction and thats been used for decades.
I agree that it is much less drastic than surgery...of course I'm not a big fan of those methods either since the only sustainable approach is to eat right and exercise even if someone does have medical condition.
I think ultimately it's personal choice. I actually gained some weight before our wedding (moving to a new town to a new job then getting married a month later was probably not such a great idea) and didn't flip out over it; still fit in the dress but I also didn't buy a dress that was too small. If I have a special event coming up that I want to look good for I know that I'll have to work really hard at least 3 months out if there is something I want to fix...we are actually coming up on our 5 year anniversary and I was planning on being as fit as when we first met and it's still looking possible despite setbacks and I'll be happy with just dropping one size instead of 2 or 3. I think more women should work on being okay with how they look now...took me a while to get in that mindset and it's hard to keep it up but it's a lot healthier approach than trying to be a certain size overnight.
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 04:06:42 AM
Quote from: Crocoduck on April 21, 2012, 03:29:27 AM
As for this K-E Diet feeding tube, I don't see it as either dumb or lazy. Anyone who thinks only lazy people are over wight is just narrow minded and doesn't understand the issue. I admit it's over the top but many people are pretty desperate. I also think it sounds safer and less drastic then liposuction and thats been used for decades.
Why be so hateful and condescending to people who are trying something thats new?
Because I was responding to the article which focused on the dumb brides undergoing this treatment to loose a few pounds before their wedding. Exercise and eat right.
Added: Also this treatment wouldn't appear to work for people who need to lose a lot of weight. So yes, the brides are lazy and stupid, in my opinion. People who weren't lazy would diet and exercise to fit into their dress.
What amazes me is how many women buy a dress that is too small and then at virtually the last minute decide that NOW is the time to lose that 10 or 15 pounds so that they can fit into it. Of course they are going to wind up resorting to idiotic stuff like this - they have convinced themselves that if they don't fit into THAT dress, their wedding day is going to be a disaster.
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 04:06:42 AM
Quote from: Crocoduck on April 21, 2012, 03:29:27 AM
As for this K-E Diet feeding tube, I don't see it as either dumb or lazy. Anyone who thinks only lazy people are over wight is just narrow minded and doesn't understand the issue. I admit it's over the top but many people are pretty desperate. I also think it sounds safer and less drastic then liposuction and thats been used for decades.
Why be so hateful and condescending to people who are trying something thats new?
Because I was responding to the article which focused on the dumb brides undergoing this treatment to loose a few pounds before their wedding. Exercise and eat right.
Added: Also this treatment wouldn't appear to work for people who need to lose a lot of weight. So yes, the brides are lazy and stupid, in my opinion. People who weren't lazy would diet and exercise to fit into their dress.
Yeah narrow minded and hateful.
Narrow minded because your judging people after reading one article. and Hateful because calling people you don't know stupid is hateful.
Quote from: Crocoduck on April 21, 2012, 04:51:06 AM
Yeah narrow minded and hateful.
Narrow minded because your judging people after reading one article. and Hateful because calling people you don't know stupid is hateful.
It's sad that people are made to feel that fat is bad in western society today and that only skinny beauties hold any value. But it is also sad that some lazy and stupid people use that sentiment as a vindication of their self-destructive eating habits - to the detriment of tax payers who must pay for their healthcare.
So, on the one hand we have the liberal crybabies calling for a change in attitudes whereby fat people are not considered second class citizens and on the other we have an obesity crisis requiring some direct action.
Yes, I know some people just can't help being fat - its in the genes, have an over active thyroid, are depressed, can't afford healthy food etc...etc...etc... But let's get real - most people are fat because they eat too much - however healthy the actual food is. It's a simple equation: Calories in > calories out. Some people find this harder than others to control, but that's life. Let's not allow those unwilling to sacrifice their gluttonous intake of extraneous food to tell us that its not their fault while at the same time jamming up the healthcare system for people who are able to control their desire to overeat. I'm sure a lot of this comes down to education - a generation of unhealthy eaters have bred unhealthy eaters so that some families simply haven't the tools to cook or eat healthily. But this is exactly the reason we cannot pussy-foot around the issue. I see no benefit in trying to de-stigmatise the fat condition. In fact to help us in tackling this we really need to confront the proponents with pragmatic candour.
If some people want to try this method to lose some weight then be my guest. But is it a cure for overeating? No! The fact that there's a market for this (and many other outrageous, unhealthy, dangerous and costly endeavours) shows us that people are willing to go to extraordinary lengths to lose weight rather than simply not eating so much. I'd call that lazy and stupid.
Please note there are a number of members who do or have suffered from eating disorders of different types. Making personalised observations about the position/attitude of non-members could well be unintentionally offensive/hurtful/upsetting to some of our own members. Please take care in the way comments are phrased and recognise that generalisations are generally not helpful.
Thank you
Tank
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:08:33 AM
Please note there are a number of members who do or have suffered from eating disorders of different types. Making personalised observations about the position/attitude of non-members could well be unintentionally offensive/hurtful/upsetting to some of our own members. Please take care in the way comments are phrased and recognise that generalisations are generally not helpful.
Thank you
Tank
...And Asmo wasn't even anywhere near this thread. :( His Aura of Grayness must have corrupted people :D
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:08:33 AM
Please note there are a number of members who do or have suffered from eating disorders of different types. Making personalised observations about the position/attitude of non-members could well be unintentionally offensive/hurtful/upsetting to some of our own members. Please take care in the way comments are phrased and recognise that generalisations are generally not helpful.
Thank you
Tank
...and therein lies the problem!
Noted.
This really strikes a nerve with me!! My mum was on a feeding tube for the entire 3 weeks in ICU. It was extremely depressing...
Why are some wome so stupid? It really gives a bad nane to the lot of us. Is vanity that important you put your health/life at risk??
I am going to get a damn donut now. *fume*
Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 21, 2012, 04:13:54 PM
This really strikes a nerve with me!! My mum was on a feeding tube for the entire 3 weeks in ICU. It was extremely depressing...
Why are some wome so stupid? It really gives a bad nane to the lot of us. Is vanity that important you put your health/life at risk??
I am going to get a damn donut now. *fume*
I think some women are that stupid because they are told time and time again that their bodies are a commodity. Their beauty and thinness, in a very real sense, are a measure of their worth as a human being. I hate to play the same ol' tune of "The media tells us we have to look a certain way". But it's true. There is a lot of pressure on brides to fit the "bride mould". And guess what? The ideal bride isn't fat. You don't see fat brides in movies, t.v., books, magazines, anywhere.
So, women feel, that if they are "fat" (and, in some cases, that can mean average, or even underweight), they aren't a "real" bride. That's a lot of pressure for someone. Everyone wants to feel like a "real bride" on their wedding day.
So, yeah, this sort of thing makes me sad, but it doesn't make me angry at the people who are doing it, per se.
Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 21, 2012, 04:13:54 PM
This really strikes a nerve with me!! My mum was on a feeding tube for the entire 3 weeks in ICU. It was extremely depressing...
Why are some wome so stupid? It really gives a bad nane to the lot of us. Is vanity that important you put your health/life at risk??
I am going to get a damn donut now. *fume*
Oh, vanity can drive people just as far as love, hate or jealousy can, I think.
Quote from: Asmodean on April 21, 2012, 04:37:27 PM
Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 21, 2012, 04:13:54 PM
This really strikes a nerve with me!! My mum was on a feeding tube for the entire 3 weeks in ICU. It was extremely depressing...
Why are some wome so stupid? It really gives a bad nane to the lot of us. Is vanity that important you put your health/life at risk??
I am going to get a damn donut now. *fume*
Oh, vanity can drive people just as far as love, hate or jealousy can, I think.
Yeah..sadly.
And lots of good points, DJ.
I agree, the media is constantly objectifying women, but then these women turn about and objectify themselves. Even eachother. *sigh*
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on April 21, 2012, 04:36:08 PM
I think some women are that stupid because they are told time and time again that their bodies are a commodity. Their beauty and thinness, in a very real sense, are a measure of their worth as a human being. I hate to play the same ol' tune of "The media tells us we have to look a certain way". But it's true. There is a lot of pressure on brides to fit the "bride mould". And guess what? The ideal bride isn't fat. You don't see fat brides in movies, t.v., books, magazines, anywhere.
So, women feel, that if they are "fat" (and, in some cases, that can mean average, or even underweight), they aren't a "real" bride. That's a lot of pressure for someone. Everyone wants to feel like a "real bride" on their wedding day.
So, yeah, this sort of thing makes me sad, but it doesn't make me angry at the people who are doing it, per se.
So, to appease the sensibilities of the overweight we are to fill our magazines and TV with a representative spread of body sizes? By so doing we run the risk of normalising obesity... and ruin my visual pleasure. How depressing would it be to be confronted in our armchairs with a vision of ill-health every day?
I'm sorry if seeing beautiful images of (airbrushed) women is uncomfortable for some.... actually, no I'm not!
Quote from: Scissorlegs on April 21, 2012, 06:40:08 PM
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on April 21, 2012, 04:36:08 PM
I think some women are that stupid because they are told time and time again that their bodies are a commodity. Their beauty and thinness, in a very real sense, are a measure of their worth as a human being. I hate to play the same ol' tune of "The media tells us we have to look a certain way". But it's true. There is a lot of pressure on brides to fit the "bride mould". And guess what? The ideal bride isn't fat. You don't see fat brides in movies, t.v., books, magazines, anywhere.
So, women feel, that if they are "fat" (and, in some cases, that can mean average, or even underweight), they aren't a "real" bride. That's a lot of pressure for someone. Everyone wants to feel like a "real bride" on their wedding day.
So, yeah, this sort of thing makes me sad, but it doesn't make me angry at the people who are doing it, per se.
So, to appease the sensibilities of the overweight we are to fill our magazines and TV with a representative spread of body sizes? By so doing we run the risk of normalising obesity... and ruin my visual pleasure. How depressing would it be to be confronted in our armchairs with a vision of ill-health every day?
I'm sorry if seeing beautiful images of (airbrushed) women is uncomfortable for some.... actually, no I'm not!
I think size comes for all people. Some are naturally waist 25", some 30".
I dont like obesity. I think people can control their portions and be healthy. But i also dont likw hairless, flawless skinned people that dont exist except with extreme dieting and photoshop.
I dont as a parent, you should want less objectifying of women. People in general who grow up to hate themselves because their hair is too curly , or skin is too dark. I think people considered more "beautiful" than others get special treatment. I think women always get told to put on makeup and look attractive.
In my new job, my female boss asjed me if i wore make up. I said very rarely, then she was like "well , get some tinted lipgloss please"
I wanted to tell her to fuck off,but i just said no..i would not.
Quote from: Scissorlegs on April 21, 2012, 06:40:08 PM
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on April 21, 2012, 04:36:08 PM
I think some women are that stupid because they are told time and time again that their bodies are a commodity. Their beauty and thinness, in a very real sense, are a measure of their worth as a human being. I hate to play the same ol' tune of "The media tells us we have to look a certain way". But it's true. There is a lot of pressure on brides to fit the "bride mould". And guess what? The ideal bride isn't fat. You don't see fat brides in movies, t.v., books, magazines, anywhere.
So, women feel, that if they are "fat" (and, in some cases, that can mean average, or even underweight), they aren't a "real" bride. That's a lot of pressure for someone. Everyone wants to feel like a "real bride" on their wedding day.
So, yeah, this sort of thing makes me sad, but it doesn't make me angry at the people who are doing it, per se.
So, to appease the sensibilities of the overweight we are to fill our magazines and TV with a representative spread of body sizes? By so doing we run the risk of normalising obesity... and ruin my visual pleasure. How depressing would it be to be confronted in our armchairs with a vision of ill-health every day?
I'm sorry if seeing beautiful images of (airbrushed) women is uncomfortable for some.... actually, no I'm not!
I don't recall asking you to be sorry. I was simply pointing out to Sweetdeath that there is a reason
why women are compelled to extremes. I also didn't ask anyone to normalize obesity and, quite frankly, I feel like you are putting words in my mouth.
Edit: the kind of "fat" I was talking about was not "obese".
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on April 21, 2012, 04:36:08 PM
I think some women are that stupid because they are told time and time again that their bodies are a commodity. Their beauty and thinness, in a very real sense, are a measure of their worth as a human being. I hate to play the same ol' tune of "The media tells us we have to look a certain way". But it's true. There is a lot of pressure on brides to fit the "bride mould". And guess what? The ideal bride isn't fat. You don't see fat brides in movies, t.v., books, magazines, anywhere.
So, women feel, that if they are "fat" (and, in some cases, that can mean average, or even underweight), they aren't a "real" bride. That's a lot of pressure for someone. Everyone wants to feel like a "real bride" on their wedding day.
So, yeah, this sort of thing makes me sad, but it doesn't make me angry at the people who are doing it, per se.
I personally find the medias view of beauty disgusting. I have never been into skeleton skinny though and I dislike boxy figures. Give me an hourglass with big breasts any day. I also find that women are making themselves uglier in their quest for beauty. Breast implants are a great way for women to gain confidence after having breast cancer, but how is it attractive for a girl with a 24 inch waist to have stiff DD breasts? I kind of expect small perky breasts if you have such a small waist, otherwise starts looking ridiculous.
As much as I hate HSN and QVC, I have to give them props for using models that represent their clients. They have the "normal" ones that aren't sickly skinny, but attractively skinny as well as some chubbier ones.
I hope no skinny women or men with skinny wives get offended because I'm speaking my mind here as well...
*Edit: Rephrased something that could be construed as a little insulting.
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 07:53:08 PM
{snip}
I hope no skinny women or men with skinny wives get offended because I'm speaking my mind here as well...
There is no one form of objective beauty. There are some stereotypes and they rise and fall with time and culture. I have met stunningly beautiful ball-busting bitches and the sexiest of women you wouldn't look at twice. It's an oft used truism that 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' and that, to me, is why this thread is such an unmitigated mine field. So stating one's own personal preference is fine. While criticising another persons opinion is really futile as preferences differ so much.
And never forget THE major sex organ is the brain ;)
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:12:34 PM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 07:53:08 PM
{snip}
I hope no skinny women or men with skinny wives get offended because I'm speaking my mind here as well...
There is no one form of objective beauty. There are some stereotypes and they rise and fall with time and culture. I have met stunningly beautiful ball-busting bitches and the sexiest of women you wouldn't look at twice. It's an oft used truism that 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' and that, to me, is why this thread is such an unmitigated mine field. So stating one's own personal preference is fine. While criticising another persons opinion is really futile as preferences differ so much.
And never forget THE major sex organ is the brain ;)
Totally agree.
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:12:34 PM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 07:53:08 PM
{snip}
I hope no skinny women or men with skinny wives get offended because I'm speaking my mind here as well...
There is no one form of objective beauty. There are some stereotypes and they rise and fall with time and culture. I have met stunningly beautiful ball-busting bitches and the sexiest of women you wouldn't look at twice. It's an oft used truism that 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' and that, to me, is why this thread is such an unmitigated mine field. So stating one's own personal preference is fine. While criticising another persons opinion is really futile as preferences differ so much.
And I'm not criticizing how people choose to look. People are free to look however they choose, I don't care. I just felt like complaining about how there seem to be fewer beautiful women today due to the odd standards of beauty currently set. And yes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but it annoys me that so many attractive women change their appearance when they hit their early 20's inadvertently making themselves less attractive to me.
Quote
And never forget THE major sex organ is the brain ;)
Only when another body part isn't hogging the blood flow. ;D
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 08:23:37 PM
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:12:34 PM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 07:53:08 PM
{snip}
I hope no skinny women or men with skinny wives get offended because I'm speaking my mind here as well...
There is no one form of objective beauty. There are some stereotypes and they rise and fall with time and culture. I have met stunningly beautiful ball-busting bitches and the sexiest of women you wouldn't look at twice. It's an oft used truism that 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' and that, to me, is why this thread is such an unmitigated mine field. So stating one's own personal preference is fine. While criticising another persons opinion is really futile as preferences differ so much.
And I'm not criticizing how people choose to look. People are free to look however they choose, I don't care. I just felt like complaining about how there seem to be fewer beautiful women today due to the odd standards of beauty currently set. And yes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but it annoys me that so many attractive women change their appearance when they hit their early 20's inadvertently making themselves less attractive to me.
I understood that. Sorry if it came over as a criticism of your observation, that was not my intention.
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on April 21, 2012, 08:19:20 PM
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:12:34 PM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 07:53:08 PM
{snip}
I hope no skinny women or men with skinny wives get offended because I'm speaking my mind here as well...
There is no one form of objective beauty. There are some stereotypes and they rise and fall with time and culture. I have met stunningly beautiful ball-busting bitches and the sexiest of women you wouldn't look at twice. It's an oft used truism that 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' and that, to me, is why this thread is such an unmitigated mine field. So stating one's own personal preference is fine. While criticising another persons opinion is really futile as preferences differ so much.
And never forget THE major sex organ is the brain ;)
Totally agree.
This.
And i super agree, Think anrchy. I dislike the growing number of people getting cosmetic surgery in their late teens, early 20's.
My girlfriend told me it is a growing epedimic in Asian countries; like major face reconstructive surgery.
I compliment her beautiful eyes and face all the time. I hate asians who get the eyelid surgery. Fucking gross.
As long as they like what they see in a mirror after, it's ok though, no?
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:28:00 PM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 08:23:37 PM
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:12:34 PM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 07:53:08 PM
{snip}
I hope no skinny women or men with skinny wives get offended because I'm speaking my mind here as well...
There is no one form of objective beauty. There are some stereotypes and they rise and fall with time and culture. I have met stunningly beautiful ball-busting bitches and the sexiest of women you wouldn't look at twice. It's an oft used truism that 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' and that, to me, is why this thread is such an unmitigated mine field. So stating one's own personal preference is fine. While criticising another persons opinion is really futile as preferences differ so much.
And I'm not criticizing how people choose to look. People are free to look however they choose, I don't care. I just felt like complaining about how there seem to be fewer beautiful women today due to the odd standards of beauty currently set. And yes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but it annoys me that so many attractive women change their appearance when they hit their early 20's inadvertently making themselves less attractive to me.
I understood that. Sorry if it came over as a criticism of your observation, that was not my intention.
Don't worry, it didn't come across like that. I just wanted to clarify for others, just to err on the side of caution.
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 08:23:37 PM
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:12:34 PM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 07:53:08 PM
{snip}
I hope no skinny women or men with skinny wives get offended because I'm speaking my mind here as well...
There is no one form of objective beauty. There are some stereotypes and they rise and fall with time and culture. I have met stunningly beautiful ball-busting bitches and the sexiest of women you wouldn't look at twice. It's an oft used truism that 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' and that, to me, is why this thread is such an unmitigated mine field. So stating one's own personal preference is fine. While criticising another persons opinion is really futile as preferences differ so much.
And I'm not criticizing how people choose to look. People are free to look however they choose, I don't care. I just felt like complaining about how there seem to be fewer beautiful women today due to the odd standards of beauty currently set. And yes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but it annoys me that so many attractive women change their appearance when they hit their early 20's inadvertently making themselves less attractive to me.
Yeah, I don't think anyone really read it that way. At least I didn't :)
And I do remember seeing a study where researchers showed both sexes pictures of women and asked them which set of pictures were more attractive. One set of pictures featured supermodel-skinny women and the other set of pictures featured "shapely" women. Most women said the supermodel-skinny women looked more attractive and most men said that the shapely women looked more attractive.
Of course, then we get into whether the women gave those answers because THEY actually thought the supermodel skinny women looked better, or if they made that decision because, through the media, they were conditioned to think that's what men want. It's sort of a weird catch-22.
Personally, I have spent a lot of time and effort not giving a flying fuck what people think about how I look. Sometimes I
like dressing up all girlie girl. Sometimes I
like slumping around in sweat pants. As for my weight, I like being able to ride my bike or walk for 40 minutes without it exhausting me, so that's something that I take into consideration for my life. I like eating a balanced diet because I feel better when I do and I know it has better health benefits, but I DON'T give myself hell when I decide I want to eat a chocolate bar/pizza/drink a couple of pints.
I didn't always feel this way, but I'm happier and I haven't heard any complaints from my husband. ;)
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on April 21, 2012, 06:51:46 PM
I don't recall asking you to be sorry. I was simply pointing out to Sweetdeath that there is a reason why women are compelled to extremes. I also didn't ask anyone to normalize obesity and, quite frankly, I feel like you are putting words in my mouth.
Edit: the kind of "fat" I was talking about was not "obese".
I was addressing the general argument about 'media pressure', not your post in particular.
To continue, I do believe that the problems we are now experiencing with the obese fat (as opposed to personal image dysmorphia 'fat') are the result of passed-down ignorance. So, a person who was raised surrounded by overeaters grows into unhealthy eating habits and knows nothing else. It's difficult for a person to take responsibility for their eating habits when they're simply living by learned behaviours. If this is going to change we must be frank, open and honest, not only about the fundamental causes and the cure but also about ones own responsibility. If we can help a person to 'own' their own eating habits this is step one in finding personal solutions. There is only one cure. Appeasing sensibilities and endulging the 'it's not my fault' myth does not help.
Thus, I call for pragmatic candour on this subject. The truth often hurts, but should not be avoided for that reason alone.
Quote from: Scissorlegs on April 21, 2012, 09:49:45 PM
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on April 21, 2012, 06:51:46 PM
I don't recall asking you to be sorry. I was simply pointing out to Sweetdeath that there is a reason why women are compelled to extremes. I also didn't ask anyone to normalize obesity and, quite frankly, I feel like you are putting words in my mouth.
Edit: the kind of "fat" I was talking about was not "obese".
I was addressing the general argument about 'media pressure', not your post in particular.
To continue, I do believe that the problems we are now experiencing with the obese fat (as opposed to personal image dysmorphia 'fat') are the result of passed-down ignorance. So, a person who was raised surrounded by overeaters grows into unhealthy eating habits and knows nothing else. It's difficult for a person to take responsibility for their eating habits when they're simply living by learned behaviours. If this is going to change we must be frank, open and honest, not only about the fundamental causes and the cure but also about ones own responsibility. If we can help a person to 'own' their own eating habits this is step one in finding personal solutions. There is only one cure. Appeasing sensibilities and endulging the 'it's not my fault' myth does not help.
Thus, I call for pragmatic candour on this subject. The truth often hurts, but should not be avoided for that reason alone.
I also think you have to take into consideration an individuals economic level. It is admittedly better they have food options that are cheap but unhealthy. It' better than starving and being skinny. But low cost food tends to be unhealthy and cause the consumer to store more fat. It's why I get annoyed when people criticize a poor person for being obese and saying, "It's clear they aren't suffering for food." It annoys me more because I used to think that way when I was younger.
I'm not saying you are incorrect. There are many people out there who are obese due to pure laziness or not giving a shit. Others do have legitimate health conditions that cause weight problems and others simply can't afford to eat healthy foods.
For an example, there was this guy who would go to the same restaurant twice a week. He always ordered the 24 oz steak for two, two baked potatoes, an entire loaf of bread, and used nearly a stick of butter for all of it. He had to use the backs of chairs for support to get to his table. He would have only ever annoyed me if he complained about his weight though. :)
Personally I may have refused him service if I owned the restaurant. I know other customers lost their appetites while he was there, but he may have singlehandedly kept the restaurant in business.
And yes, I agree that these topics should be talked about.
On a side note, I dated a girl back in high school who I still think is one of the most beautiful women ever. She had an obese mother, I can't remember if it was caused by a medical condition or gluttony, but it's unimportant to this story. The girl, let's call her A, had major image problems. She wasn't fat, but had naturally wide hips and a flat tummy. Due to her fear of becoming her mother she would purge her body for multiple days on nothing but water. She flirted with anorexia while never losing the weight because it was simply the way her body was built, and a beautiful body it was, and still seems to be from her current facebook photos. Needless to say, it bothered the hell out me she couldn't just be happy with the way she looked. Her breasts were always to small and her hips to wide, no matter how often I tried to tell her she was beautiful and how often other men tried to get her to cheat on me, she continued to have the terrible image of herself.
I really can't wait for this skeletor fad to end... Thankfully I have a nice full figured wife that knows she is pretty without being bitch about it.
Thus ends another rambling post by ThinkAnarchy. ;)
Quote from: ScissorlegsI was addressing the general argument about 'media pressure', not your post in particular.
To continue, I do believe that the problems we are now experiencing with the obese fat (as opposed to personal image dysmorphia 'fat') are the result of passed-down ignorance. So, a person who was raised surrounded by overeaters grows into unhealthy eating habits and knows nothing else. It's difficult for a person to take responsibility for their eating habits when they're simply living by learned behaviours. If this is going to change we must be frank, open and honest, not only about the fundamental causes and the cure but also about ones own responsibility. If we can help a person to 'own' their own eating habits this is step one in finding personal solutions. There is only one cure. Appeasing sensibilities and endulging the 'it's not my fault' myth does not help.
Thus, I call for pragmatic candour on this subject. The truth often hurts, but should not be avoided for that reason alone.
I don't disagree in principle, but it's very hard to talk about a healthy weight without addressing body image issues. I mean, being anorexic and being morbidly obese are both unhealthy, but the reaction that we have to those people are widely different. People who are dangerously underweight are either glamorized or begrudgingly accepted, whereas it's becoming acceptable to publicly shame and humiliate obese people. It makes me wonder where the motives are: do we tell people who are fat that they're making bad choices because we are genuinely concerned about the health of the public, or are we doing it because we find it unacceptable for them to
look that way? I think it's very hard to know.
Quote from: Tank on April 21, 2012, 08:12:34 PM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on April 21, 2012, 07:53:08 PM
{snip}
I hope no skinny women or men with skinny wives get offended because I'm speaking my mind here as well...
There is no one form of objective beauty. There are some stereotypes and they rise and fall with time and culture. I have met stunningly beautiful ball-busting bitches and the sexiest of women you wouldn't look at twice. It's an oft used truism that 'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' and that, to me, is why this thread is such an unmitigated mine field. So stating one's own personal preference is fine. While criticising another persons opinion is really futile as preferences differ so much.
And never forget THE major sex organ is the brain ;)
Very, very true.
I need to lose weight, I am working on it. I am obese. However, my husband finds me sexy as I am - I just want to make sure I'm around a very long time to enjoy his company.