http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylv=3?qid=20090305151758AA7dWwd
If this isn't the appropriate place to post this, tell me, but I had to show this to someone. Dang. Being as attached to stories as I am, censorship and book banning just get me, and this sort of heroism makes my year.
Interesting. I buy banned books automatically ;D
Hmm... Does a school even have the right to ban personal use of certain printed material? ???
Now I'm no child psychologist, but a list of banned books...?? Duh!
Absolutely fan-damn-tastic!
I am completly opposed to the banning of books and anyone who condones or practices it.
I mean seriously! If your belief system is so weak that you cannot condone of kids even reading a dissentiong opinion, then it is time to re-evaluate your beliefs.
Somebody give this kid a prize! Or a cookie.
QuoteTwilight is banned also, but I don't want that polluting my library.
Beautiful.
Quote from: Scissorlegs on April 04, 2012, 12:22:48 PM
Now I'm no child psychologist, but a list of banned books...?? Duh!
LOL This is what I was thinking; if you want to guarantee interest in a book, ban it!
What an awful school, I thought the Catholics had given up on banning books years ago, but old habits die hard I guess. I'm glad to see Fahrenheit 451 hasn't made it onto their blacklist yet, that would be a good book for all the students (and teachers) to read.
There should be more stories like this circulated. Its good to see someone doing what is right! Banning books is so ridiculous..
Quote from: John_5.0 on April 04, 2012, 04:50:25 PM
There should be more stories like this circulated. Its good to see someone doing what is right! Banning books is so ridiculous..
Actually, one could easily make the argument that banning a book is in fact a form of breach of the freedom of speech. When you ban a book from a certain part of the population, you are removing the authors ability to express his opinion and ideas to that part of the population.
Quote from: Guardian85 on April 04, 2012, 09:55:19 PM
Quote from: John_5.0 on April 04, 2012, 04:50:25 PM
There should be more stories like this circulated. Its good to see someone doing what is right! Banning books is so ridiculous..
Actually, one could easily make the argument that banning a book is in fact a form of breach of the freedom of speech. When you ban a book from a certain part of the population, you are removing the authors ability to express his opinion and ideas to that part of the population.
I suppose one could make the argument that, oh, the kids could read those books on their own time, but considering it's a Catholic school, the students' parents might also forbid their children from reading whatever's on the list.
A school that doesn't encourage it's students to read should be ashamd of itself.
Quote
Actually, one could easily make the argument that banning a book is in fact a form of breach of the freedom of speech. When you ban a book from a certain part of the population, you are removing the authors ability to express his opinion and ideas to that part of the population.
That is a very good point Guardian85, have you or anyone else ever heard of someone bringing that up in protest of banning books?
That's just, for lack of a better word...pathetic. I would be embarrassed to have gone to that school.
They banned the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy...blasphamous!
Wow. I know that student asked their question 3 years ago, so I'm sure they're in college/university now, causing some wonderful kind of hell :D Seriously though, good for them. That's AWESOME, what they wanted to do with their books. ;D
I hate banned book lists. Banning something's the quickest way to have it flourish, and FAST.
And some of the books on that list... seriously??? Paradise Lost? Mort, the Terry Pratchett book? A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court? Bridge to Terabithia, for goodness sake?? Wow. Just wow. I know some Catholic schools are pretty touchy about stuff that's really 'controversial', but banning that stuff goes over the top.
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 05, 2012, 03:48:59 AM
That's just, for lack of a better word...pathetic. I would be embarrassed to have gone to that school.
They banned the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy...blasphamous!
The best books i've read are on this list. What the hell...?!
Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 05, 2012, 05:01:13 AM
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 05, 2012, 03:48:59 AM
That's just, for lack of a better word...pathetic. I would be embarrassed to have gone to that school.
They banned the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy...blasphamous!
The best books i've read are on this list. What the hell...?!
I know, right?
Yeah, I wouldn't have lasted long at that school, I don't think. Then again, when I was in highschool, I spent a lot of my time at the public library, or online reading stuff, if the (public) school I was at didn't have the books I wanted. I guess I was lucky, I didn't have a family who ever once vetted the books I read. If anything, they were grateful I was a nerd and a bookworm, lol. I know a lot of kids aren't that fortunate. Their parents don't just want to raise them, they want to think for them too.
I know some people say religious schools teach better than public, but I went to public and turned out fine. Restricting books and isolating people is really ass backwards.
I feel so bad for these kids.
I see what you did there, school. ;) Very clever of you to use reverse psychology like that. Make the kids think they're doing something mischievous by learning. Ban books - suddenly reading is cool. Keep up the good work.
Quote from: Melmoth on April 05, 2012, 08:58:51 PM
Ban books - suddenly reading is cool. Keep up the good work.
Would that really work, you think? Are kids dumb enough not to see through such a transparent reverse-psychological trick?
Quote from: AsmodeanQuote from: MelmothI see what you did there, school. ;) Very clever of you to use reverse psychology like that. Make the kids think they're doing something mischievous by learning. Ban books - suddenly reading is cool. Keep up the good work.
Would that really work, you think? Are kids dumb enough not to see through such a transparent reverse-psychological trick?
I don't really think that's what the school is trying to do, just in case that wasn't obvious. I'm mocking them. Banning books always has the opposite effect of making them extremely popular. And that kind of reverse psychology works better on smart people, if anything.
Quote from: Melmoth on April 05, 2012, 10:42:58 PM
And that kind of reverse psychology works better on smart people, if anything.
Yes... They see through it and do as they please. :D
Oh, and I got that you were mocking them - was just mocking reverse psychology myself.
Quote from: Melmoth on April 05, 2012, 10:42:58 PM
Quote from: AsmodeanQuote from: MelmothI see what you did there, school. ;) Very clever of you to use reverse psychology like that. Make the kids think they're doing something mischievous by learning. Ban books - suddenly reading is cool. Keep up the good work.
Would that really work, you think? Are kids dumb enough not to see through such a transparent reverse-psychological trick?
I don't really think that's what the school is trying to do, just in case that wasn't obvious. I'm mocking them. Banning books always has the opposite effect of making them extremely popular. And that kind of reverse psychology works better on smart people, if anything.
Works splendidly on curious people. :D I mean there must be
something that's so dangerous that they're trying to hide, right? ;D
Signs of weakness, if you ask me. It all boils down to what kind of faith and followers would need to restrict info to survive? I'll bet that this day and age, when almost everything is at your fingertips, really gives the high clergy sleepless nights...
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 06, 2012, 06:28:23 AM
Quote from: Melmoth on April 05, 2012, 10:42:58 PM
Quote from: AsmodeanQuote from: MelmothI see what you did there, school. ;) Very clever of you to use reverse psychology like that. Make the kids think they're doing something mischievous by learning. Ban books - suddenly reading is cool. Keep up the good work.
Would that really work, you think? Are kids dumb enough not to see through such a transparent reverse-psychological trick?
I don't really think that's what the school is trying to do, just in case that wasn't obvious. I'm mocking them. Banning books always has the opposite effect of making them extremely popular. And that kind of reverse psychology works better on smart people, if anything.
Works splendidly on curious people. :D I mean there must be something that's so dangerous that they're trying to hide, right? ;D
Signs of weakness, if you ask me. It all boils down to what kind of faith and followers would need to restrict info to survive? I'll bet that this day and age, when almost everything is at your fingertips, really gives the high clergy sleepless nights...
It scares me the most that in this day and age with information at your fingertips, people can still be so ignorant and religious. :(
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 06, 2012, 06:28:23 AM
Works splendidly on curious people. :D I mean there must be something that's so dangerous that they're trying to hide, right? ;D
Make a big red button with "DO NOT PUSH!" on it and you can bet your ass you'll find the most curious person in the house. He/she will be the one who pushed it.
Quote from: Guardian85 on April 06, 2012, 10:16:14 AM
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 06, 2012, 06:28:23 AM
Works splendidly on curious people. :D I mean there must be something that's so dangerous that they're trying to hide, right? ;D
Make a big red button with "DO NOT PUSH!" on it and you can bet your ass you'll find the most curious person in the house. He/she will be the one who pushed it.
I always have to suppress the desire to push McQ's big red button avatar....
Quote from: Guardian85 on April 06, 2012, 10:16:14 AM
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 06, 2012, 06:28:23 AM
Works splendidly on curious people. :D I mean there must be something that's so dangerous that they're trying to hide, right? ;D
Make a big red button with "DO NOT PUSH!" on it and you can bet your ass you'll find the most curious person in the house. He/she will be the one who pushed it.
Yep.
Haha, once my family was visiting my grandma in a special retirement community (I was about 12). She pointed out a lightswitch that was close to the floor in the bathroom and said "Do not touch this." Guess who flipped it and found out that it was an alarm that would wake up the whole community and summon medical help should you fall in the bathroom and be unable to get up.....*whistles innocently*
Quote from: Ali on April 06, 2012, 04:19:34 PM
Quote from: Guardian85 on April 06, 2012, 10:16:14 AM
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 06, 2012, 06:28:23 AM
Works splendidly on curious people. :D I mean there must be something that's so dangerous that they're trying to hide, right? ;D
Make a big red button with "DO NOT PUSH!" on it and you can bet your ass you'll find the most curious person in the house. He/she will be the one who pushed it.
Yep.
Haha, once my family was visiting my grandma in a special retirement community (I was about 12). She pointed out a lightswitch that was close to the floor in the bathroom and said "Do not touch this." Guess who flipped it and found out that it was an alarm that would wake up the whole community and summon medical help should you fall in the bathroom and be unable to get up.....*whistles innocently*
LOL, gee, my money might just be on YOU... ;D
It occurs to me that adults tell kids to do things, or not do things, without often giving them a good reason why. Your grandma just said "do not touch this", but didn't mention that it was an alarm that would wake everyone up and summon medical help. Now, it's given some kids might STILL find that entertaining :D, but a lot would go "ack! I'll get in trouble if I touch that button!"
I always TRY to give my kiddo a basic reason why. Not just "don't touch the stove", but "the stove is very hot and if you touch it, you'll get burned and it'll hurt. Mama can touch it because she's a grown up and grown ups know how to. When you're grown up, you can use the stove too!" to which she responded "I don't WANNA use the stove!" :D
Aww,you're a good mom, Amicale.
I think it's great you give a honest reason, not just saying "no, don't do/touch that."
Sometimes kid feel offended when you talk to them like idiots.
Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 06, 2012, 06:23:54 PM
Aww,you're a good mom, Amicale.
I think it's great you give a honest reason, not just saying "no, don't do/touch that."
Sometimes kid feel offended when you talk to them like idiots.
Some kids ARE idiots, though. Just pointing it out.
But that is all the more reason for explaining things to them.
Quote from: Guardian85 on April 06, 2012, 06:27:06 PM
Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 06, 2012, 06:23:54 PM
Aww,you're a good mom, Amicale.
I think it's great you give a honest reason, not just saying "no, don't do/touch that."
Sometimes kid feel offended when you talk to them like idiots.
Some kids ARE idiots, though. Just pointing it out.
But that is all the more reason for explaining things to them.
I prefer the term ignorant. :) And that term covers a heck of a lot of adults, too.
There's no shame in ignorance, though. Ignorance can be corrected. Stupidity is deliberately willful. ;)
Quote from: Guardian85 on April 06, 2012, 06:27:06 PM
Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 06, 2012, 06:23:54 PM
Aww,you're a good mom, Amicale.
I think it's great you give a honest reason, not just saying "no, don't do/touch that."
Sometimes kid feel offended when you talk to them like idiots.
Some kids ARE idiots, though. Just pointing it out.
But that is all the more reason for explaining things to them.
Indeed. :)
The girl (I think) with the unauthorized library is pretty spectacular, but did anyone else think the same thing I did. This book banning thing might work well, if we ban a bunch of books and then pretend we don't notice that kids are reading them.
It encourages kids to read, and it allows them to express their natural desire to rebel and break rules harmlessly, and it gives them a sense of accomplishment for getting away with something.
Quote from: Reprobate on April 06, 2012, 08:52:35 PM
It encourages kids to read, and it allows them to express their natural desire to rebel and break rules harmlessly, and it gives them a sense of accomplishment for getting away with something.
I would not read Twilight regardless of its ban status. And I'm pretty sure I'd read something i found interesting with not a care for what other people might think of it.
Reading a banned book is nowhere near "rebelling" or "breaking the rules" - technically, it is, but it is not satisfying unless it matters and has (preferably catastrophic) real consequences for a bunch of people.
Quote from: Asmodean on April 06, 2012, 09:52:11 PM
Quote from: Reprobate on April 06, 2012, 08:52:35 PM
It encourages kids to read, and it allows them to express their natural desire to rebel and break rules harmlessly, and it gives them a sense of accomplishment for getting away with something.
I would not read Twilight regardless of its ban status. And I'm pretty sure I'd read something i found interesting with not a care for what other people might think of it.
Reading a banned book is nowhere near "rebelling" or "breaking the rules" - technically, it is, but it is not satisfying unless it matters and has (preferably catastrophic) real consequences for a bunch of people.
I would assume that students attending a Catholic school that banned such books would probably face detentions or suspensions if they were caught reading that material; possibly they'd be barred from 'fun' school activities (not that the place sounds like it would be much fun, ha) and the school would get ahold of the students' parents so that they'd get even more grief at home. I can only imagine what might happen to the student running a library out of a locker.
I was in a Catholic school for part of elementary school. I'd get detentions for normal stuff, like not having my math homework done... but also for odd stuff, like asking too many questions in religion class. ::) The times we got detentions, their idea of punishment was to keep us in at recess and make us copy long, long segments of the Bible (Old Testament) out onto foolscap. And then rip them up, and re-write them again. Their odd idea of punishment backfired, unfortunately... by the time I was 13, I'd already read good chunks of the Old Testament, and had started to have issues with it. :D
The school wasn't a nightmare, though. A few teachers there were the kindest people ever. The principal was the one with the odd detention ideas.
"...the school would get ahold of the students' parents so that they'd get even more grief at home."
That would backfire with me. I couldn't see ever paying for my kids to be "educated" by an institution (you can't really consider this a school) that would ban books, but if that were my daughter, I'd be damned proud of her.
Quote from: Reprobate on April 07, 2012, 12:31:30 AM
"...the school would get ahold of the students' parents so that they'd get even more grief at home."
That would backfire with me. I couldn't see ever paying for my kids to be "educated" by an institution (you can't really consider this a school) that would ban books, but if that were my daughter, I'd be damned proud of her.
Same, I'd be proud of my daughter if she did that, too.
I'm hoping that some of the parents who sent their kids to that school objected to the book bans. It's always a possibility (or maybe I'm just an optimist?) that some of the parents would be more sensible than the school, and would object. That post was made 3 years ago. I'd be curious to know if those particular books are still banned, or if some of the parents spoke up and got stuff changed.
How the fuck can a school ban The Divine Comedy?
Quote from: Amicale on April 06, 2012, 10:45:05 PM
I would assume that students attending a Catholic school that banned such books would probably face detentions or suspensions if they were caught reading that material; possibly they'd be barred from 'fun' school activities
They call that consequences? Unless there are like five people living in that area, I assume there are more fish in the sea. One school kicks your ass out - go for the next one. As for detention, so what..? A chance for you to make whoever is watching you miserable while sleeping. OR you could just fuck it and leave, refering to suggestion number one if any one stirs a storm in a coffee cup over it.
Quoteand the school would get ahold of the students' parents so that they'd get even more grief at home.
So you get into a screaming match at home... If you are good at screaming, you may even win. This is nothing to get into a fist fight with daddy over, is it? ???
QuoteI can only imagine what might happen to the student running a library out of a locker.
Great PR and nothing of consequence? ???
QuoteI was in a Catholic school for part of elementary school. I'd get detentions for normal stuff, like not having my math homework done... but also for odd stuff, like asking too many questions in religion class. ::) The times we got detentions, their idea of punishment was to keep us in at recess and make us copy long, long segments of the Bible (Old Testament) out onto foolscap. And then rip them up, and re-write them again. Their odd idea of punishment backfired, unfortunately... by the time I was 13, I'd already read good chunks of the Old Testament, and had started to have issues with it. :D
See! You see?! Detention is bullshit. Besides, if you didn't want to copy the OT, you could more than likely just not do it.
Quote from: Nihilist on April 07, 2012, 04:16:05 AM
How the fuck can a school ban The Divine Comedy?
The
how is easy, 'Don't read that.', it's the
why that's so stupid!!!
Quote from: Tank on April 07, 2012, 09:04:27 AM
Quote from: Nihilist on April 07, 2012, 04:16:05 AM
How the fuck can a school ban The Divine Comedy?
The how is easy, 'Don't read that.', it's the why that's so stupid!!!
Keep the cattle dumb, and they won't question the herder.
Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 07, 2012, 01:03:41 PM
Quote from: Tank on April 07, 2012, 09:04:27 AM
Quote from: Nihilist on April 07, 2012, 04:16:05 AM
How the fuck can a school ban The Divine Comedy?
The how is easy, 'Don't read that.', it's the why that's so stupid!!!
Keep the cattle dumb, and they won't question the herder.
A theist who I generally have a lot of respect for because she's a very kind, funny lady posted a question on Facebook that asked "would you rather be a sheep or a wolf?" and the discussion that followed was astounding. Not in a good way. Basically, those who answered equated Christians/theists with innocent sheep in a flock who followed God, and equated wolves with people who tried to live life their own way in a pack mentality, organizing themselves in order to take down others. And of course, almost everyone said they'd rather be a sheep, rather than a wolf... although a few people said they'd sooner be 'wolves'. ::)
I answered with "Neither. Sheep blindly follow without questioning, and wolves attack people. It's a false dilemma. Just because you live life your own way does NOT mean you try and take down others. We can also be people to try to see the best in others, and to help them out, without any belief in the supernatural." and of course... they jumped on me. Sigh. Funny how sheeple can turn into wolves so quickly...
My point as it relates to this thread is that I don't want ANYONE teaching my child how to be either. I don't want any 'educator' to discourage her from learning, thinking, or asking questions. I don't want her to EVER think she just has to blindly trust any authority figure without asking questions, and that includes me -- already, she asks 'mama, why??' and I'm proud of her for that!
Quote from: Guardian85 on April 04, 2012, 12:36:53 PM
Absolutely fan-damn-tastic!
I am completly opposed to the banning of books and anyone who condones or practices it.
I mean seriously! If your belief system is so weak that you cannot condone of kids even reading a dissentiong opinion, then it is time to re-evaluate your beliefs.
Somebody give this kid a prize! Or a cookie.
Or another copy of Catcher in the Rye!!
Quote from: Amicale on April 06, 2012, 05:26:52 PM
I always TRY to give my kiddo a basic reason why. Not just "don't touch the stove", but "the stove is very hot and if you touch it, you'll get burned and it'll hurt. Mama can touch it because she's a grown up and grown ups know how to. When you're grown up, you can use the stove too!" to which she responded "I don't WANNA use the stove!" :D
LOL
Well at least you did your part. ;)
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 09, 2012, 01:27:27 AM
Quote from: Amicale on April 06, 2012, 05:26:52 PM
I always TRY to give my kiddo a basic reason why. Not just "don't touch the stove", but "the stove is very hot and if you touch it, you'll get burned and it'll hurt. Mama can touch it because she's a grown up and grown ups know how to. When you're grown up, you can use the stove too!" to which she responded "I don't WANNA use the stove!" :D
LOL
Well at least you did your part. ;)
I'm having visions of take-out containers littering her future home... :D
Quote from: Amicale on April 07, 2012, 01:35:49 PM
Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 07, 2012, 01:03:41 PM
Quote from: Tank on April 07, 2012, 09:04:27 AM
Quote from: Nihilist on April 07, 2012, 04:16:05 AM
How the fuck can a school ban The Divine Comedy?
The how is easy, 'Don't read that.', it's the why that's so stupid!!!
Keep the cattle dumb, and they won't question the herder.
A theist who I generally have a lot of respect for because she's a very kind, funny lady posted a question on Facebook that asked "would you rather be a sheep or a wolf?" and the discussion that followed was astounding. Not in a good way. Basically, those who answered equated Christians/theists with innocent sheep in a flock who followed God, and equated wolves with people who tried to live life their own way in a pack mentality, organizing themselves in order to take down others. And of course, almost everyone said they'd rather be a sheep, rather than a wolf... although a few people said they'd sooner be 'wolves'. ::)
I answered with "Neither. Sheep blindly follow without questioning, and wolves attack people. It's a false dilemma. Just because you live life your own way does NOT mean you try and take down others. We can also be people to try to see the best in others, and to help them out, without any belief in the supernatural." and of course... they jumped on me. Sigh. Funny how sheeple can turn into wolves so quickly...
My point as it relates to this thread is that I don't want ANYONE teaching my child how to be either. I don't want any 'educator' to discourage her from learning, thinking, or asking questions. I don't want her to EVER think she just has to blindly trust any authority figure without asking questions, and that includes me -- already, she asks 'mama, why??' and I'm proud of her for that!
We are supposed to be like sheep when we have so much more in common with wolves?
We both cooperate to kill and eat other animals.
We've formed a partnership with wolves/dogs, we even use them to protect sheep.
I like that sheep live without the need to kill other animals but that's not a Christian ideal.
I suppose sheep may be seen as living together in harmony but males will fight for females.
If it's about submitting to being controlled, well wolves do that too.
There's so much wrong with the sheep and good shepherd metaphor.
The corrupt shepherd/church lived off people while "protecting" them from reality.
What's wrong with being a curious ape?
Nothing, I like apes.
Quote from: Tank on April 04, 2012, 08:12:10 AM
Interesting. I buy banned books automatically ;D
All the books I buy are banned automatically.