This is just plain fucking insane.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/church-stages-fake-kidnapping-youth-group-students/story?id=16012844#.T3NCSDEgdo1
Once again, the american evangelical churches give good reason for people to declare them insane.
Living out your persecution fantasies in real life. Nice.
I think the DA needs start filing some charges.
Church Stages Kidnapping of Youth Group Members (http://abcnews.go.com/US/church-stages-fake-kidnapping-youth-group-students/story?id=16012844#.T3OKVDLvfjr)
QuoteLEEN CURRY
March 27, 2012
A church pastor in Pennsylvania could face felony charges for staging a fake kidnapping of youth group students in order to teach them about religious persecution.
Teenagers at the Glad Tidings Assembly of God Church in Middletown, Pa., were surprised when they attended a youth group meeting at the church on March 21 and were ambushed by what seemed to be real kidnappers.
Adults, including an off-duty cop, brandished weapons and put bags over the heads of the children, ages 13 through 18, and forced them into a church van. The group was driven to the home of an assistant pastor, who was presented before the group with a seemingly bloodied and bruised face, according to Dauphin County District Attorney Fran Chardo.
One of the adults used a real AK-47, though the gun was unloaded, Chardo said.
ABC News
Members of a youth group were tied up and... View Full Size
Teen Accused of Faking Own Kidnapping Watch Video
Cops: Couple Faked Their Kidnapping Watch Video
Carjacking Hoax: Daughter Tells Her Story Watch Video
The church leaders who organized the fake hostage situation later told law enforcement that the event was meant to be a lesson to the children on how Christians are persecuted in places around the world, but the "educational" event may actually constitute a crime, Chardo said.
Our resident Ninja beat you to this. Sneaky ninjas.
You know what would be quite incredibly funny? If one or two of them kids were packing heat and decided to defend themselves with lethal force.
What would those wannabe-kidnappers do then with their unloaded AK? Use it as a club?
Tank! Apparently, we need a thread merge.
I hope these morons are locked up for a good long time. If I were the parent of a traumatized child (I understand that some of the kids might have known what was going on but the girl on the video was a guest and did not?) I'd be out for blood. Post traumatic stress syndrome is nothing to sneeze at, and if it had been me, I'd probably be a basket case, especially at that age.
Quote from: Ali on March 28, 2012, 11:28:07 PM
Our resident Ninja beat you to this. Sneaky ninjas.
Yes we are.
Quote from: Ali on March 28, 2012, 11:28:07 PM
Our resident Ninja beat you to this. Sneaky ninjas.
Doh....I didn't think to look for it there. He was first to post but I was first to post it in this section.
Quote from: Asmodean on March 28, 2012, 11:39:09 PM
You know what would be quite incredibly funny? If one or two of them kids were packing heat and decided to defend themselves with lethal force.
What would those wannabe-kidnappers do then with their unloaded AK? Use it as a club?
I think their suffering enough trauma. I can't imagine how one would feel if they had shot a member of their church.
Oh, I forgot to make my point beyond how that story could have been made more interesting.
My point is this: When staging a kidnapping of one or several unsuspecting victims, use real weapons loaded with real ammo - if the shit goes sour, it could save your ass from getting holes shot through it.
That said, the title of Ninjathread is not descriptive enough to indicate the same story, so this double-threading is quite understandable.
EDIT:
Quote from: Crocoduck on March 28, 2012, 11:47:05 PM
I think their suffering enough trauma. I can't imagine how one would feel if they had shot a member of their church.
I don't know... There is probably a fair point in that, but personally, I think I would be very pleased with myself if I managed to take down what I percieved to be an immediate threat to my life and health, even if that threat was later shown to be fake.
Unless that was to teach them that they aren't being persecuted here and need to shut up about that false persecution, that's a bad lesson. Well, it's a bad lesson either way, but I'm sick of hearing about the false persecution of Christians.
Seriously, though, I've heard that churches can actually get away with doing some pretty inhumane things like this. :(
Quote from: Asmodean on March 28, 2012, 11:48:27 PM
My point is this: When staging a kidnapping of one or several unsuspecting victims, use real weapons loaded with real ammo - if the shit goes sour, it could save your ass from getting holes shot through it.
I see your point now. I wonder if the off duty cop at least had some ammo in his pocket. Most cops I've know where pretty uptight about being unarmed.
Please tell me this isn't legal...
How sickening.
It kind of reminds me, on a larger more psycho-scale, of when I was in a youth group and the adult running it described in excruciating detail the process of crucifixion. I'm talking rusty-spikes piercing arms and feet with a hammer, the process of bleeding to death (dehydration, hallucination, etc.), the excruciation of bearing your weight as you hang there for hours and hours - getting stabbed with a spear, thorns tearing up your scalp and eyes, having your legs broken to make sure you're dead. All of it. With the sole intent of horrifying us and (I guess?) making us feel, generally, like shit. We had an entire "class" dedicated to this bullshit.
I was probably 9, I think? I'm pretty sure some people cried. And at the end the adult was all satisfied and like "yes, now you understand what Jesus went through. For YOU."
People who consider these "lessons" valuable to children really shouldn't be given access to them.
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on March 29, 2012, 03:44:29 AM
It kind of reminds me, on a larger more psycho-scale, of when I was in a youth group and the adult running it described in excruciating detail the process of crucifixion. I'm talking rusty-spikes piercing arms and feet with a hammer, the process of bleeding to death (dehydration, hallucination, etc.), the excruciation of bearing your weight as you hang there for hours and hours - getting stabbed with a spear, thorns tearing up your scalp and eyes, having your legs broken to make sure you're dead. All of it. With the sole intent of horrifying us and (I guess?) making us feel, generally, like shit. We had an entire "class" dedicated to this bullshit.
I was probably 9, I think? I'm pretty sure some people cried. And at the end the adult was all satisfied and like "yes, now you understand what Jesus went through. For YOU."
People who consider these "lessons" valuable to children really shouldn't be given access to them.
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on March 29, 2012, 03:44:29 AMhaving your legs broken to make sure you're dead.
I know Jesus
had puncture wounds to display to the disciples but how about his legs.
Were they repaired or did he stumble about on broken legs?
Damn, HAF ate my post! :(
LOL
Maybe jesus invented crutches... ( or was that the Chinese?)
Quote from: The Magic Pudding on March 29, 2012, 05:32:48 AM
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on March 29, 2012, 03:44:29 AMhaving your legs broken to make sure you're dead.
I know Jesus had puncture wounds to display to the disciples but how about his legs.
Were they repaired or did he stumble about on broken legs?
Yeah, that's a good point! I guess we were too horror-stricken to think all that critically about it.
Quote from: Asmodean on March 28, 2012, 11:41:26 PM
Tank! Apparently, we need a thread merge.
Well spotted and done ;D
what a fucked up story. Maybe they could round up a few non-believers next week and get the children to torture and burn them at the stake to remind them how Christians have also persecuted many people in the past...
Quote from: Too Few Lions on March 29, 2012, 12:39:48 PM
what a fucked up story. Maybe they could round up a few non-believers next week and get the children to torture and burn them at the stake to remind them how Christians have also persecuted many people in the past...
How about a good old public cruxifiction?
Quote from: Too Few Lions on March 29, 2012, 12:39:48 PM
what a fucked up story. Maybe they could round up a few non-believers next week and get the children to torture and burn them at the stake to remind them how Christians have also persecuted many people in the past...
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.picturescream.com%2Fimages%2F3b9f4cf5burnthewitch.jpg&hash=d6eeee5a5b939703104fcc0b3e3cec4a427de4d3)
Quote from: Asmodean on March 28, 2012, 11:39:09 PM
You know what would be quite incredibly funny? If one or two of them kids were packing heat and decided to defend themselves with lethal force.
What would those wannabe-kidnappers do then with their unloaded AK? Use it as a club?
Heh...that's a good point. If the kid decides to shoot the guy and then invokes the Stand Your Ground laws as his/her defense, who's right? Personally, I'd think they're all fucked up, but that's just me.
In Spy Catcher there is a story about interrogation training, both doing it and resisting it. The trainee 'victim' was told to wait in a flat for the trainee interrogation team to arrive and not tell them anything. He sat there for hours and the team didn't turn up. He called his controller. They said that the team had confirmed they had arrived. He said they hadn't. The controller checked with the interrogation team who confirmed they had captured the 'victim' and he was doing a great job of giving the impression of not knowing anything!
The interrogation team had gone to the wrong address!!!
The unsuspecting 'victim' received 'significant' financial compensation :D
The worst part of all this is that somehow these people thought they were genuinely helping these kids. They think they're going to be violently and religiously persecuted...in American. What kind of paranoia is bubbling under the surface of this society that this can happen?
Quote from: cgmccall on April 08, 2012, 08:57:05 PM
The worst part of all this is that somehow these people thought they were genuinely helping these kids. They think they're going to be violently and religiously persecuted...in American. What kind of paranoia is bubbling under the surface of this society that this can happen?
Funny to think just how distorted people's perceptions become. If one of the the kids got violent, would they be surprised?
Some would probably end up with post traumatic stress disorder, maybe that girl crying in the video.
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 09, 2012, 01:35:00 AM
Quote from: cgmccall on April 08, 2012, 08:57:05 PM
The worst part of all this is that somehow these people thought they were genuinely helping these kids. They think they're going to be violently and religiously persecuted...in American. What kind of paranoia is bubbling under the surface of this society that this can happen?
Funny to think just how distorted people's perceptions become. If one of the the kids got violent, would they be surprised?
Some would probably end up with post traumatic stress disorder, maybe that girl crying in the video.
The first thing that came to mind for me is the controversy about the shootings at Virginia Tech University. A lot of conservatives were arguing that students should be allowed to carry guns in the class rooms so they can shoot people who threaten them and or protect the class.
Fast forward to this story, what if one of these students was so armed and shot the "kidnappers"...particularly freaking morons who are pointing real guns at people. I don't think there would be any fault at all. It's not like they identified themselves. It was a bonafide kidnapping when they stole the kids, gagged (masked) them and dragged them off without disclosing who they were.
I remember once when my parents were still alive and running a bakery business, someone came in and had his hand in his pocket and threatened my mother for money. He showed that he had something perceived as dangerous in his pocket.
He was caught and went to court and his defense said that it was only a roll of quarters in his pocket and not dangerous.
The judge scolded the defendant and said that it was the perceived threat that made it an armed robbery, gun or not. Mom had no way of knowing it wasn't a gun so it may as well have been a gun for all she knew.
Same thing here.
In our times of digital cameras, why was this dramatization NOT recorded by the organizers themselves?
If it would have been discussed (the recording of a fake hostage scene), the event would not have taken place due to good old reasoning by the organizers.
Once again we have a case of minor's testimony versus adults (and no recordings). Just another religious sad story. :(
If charges have not been filed than than they should be.