Just a simple question really - if we take the teachings of christianity to be true, you go to heaven if you have been good and promise to suck up to god for eternity.
If this is the case, why is there anything to fear from death and why do we have an inbuilt biological urge to avoid dying at any cost? Surely this does not stack up?
Not a theist, but I'll answer for me.
I am not afraid of death, just dislike the prospect of dying. If one could skip that process and still get dead, I wouldn't mind it at all.
I understand your point of view, but instinctively you will avoid something that will kill you. Example, someone throws a large rock at your head, you will duck.
It is relatively easy to assume that humans (and everything else) are genetically programmed to fear death so that they can maximise their lifespan long enough to successfully reproduce so that the species lives on. The point of life really, is to reproduce life.
As theists believe you live on in sky paradise after death, then death has little meaning, and actually neither does real life because it is redundant if you live eternally anyway. So there is theistically no point to real life, no point to death, and no need for real organisms to fear death. So why do they then?
The fact that everything avoids dying in real life to the best of their ability goes completely against the grain of eternal life in heaven, after death.
Quote from: Steve JobsNo one wants to die. Even people who want to go to heaven don't want to die to get there.
I agree with Asmodean, it's the fear of
dying, rather than being dead. For myself, I can't imagine not existing. I just can't form the mental image. OK, they say it's the same as before one was born, but I can't picture that either.
Quote from: OldGit on October 23, 2011, 05:21:36 PM
Quote from: Steve JobsNo one wants to die. Even people who want to go to heaven don't want to die to get there.
I agree with Asmodean, it's the fear of dying, rather than being dead. For myself, I can't imagine not existing. I just can't form the mental image. OK, they say it's the same as before one was born, but I can't picture that either.
I agree. And obviously if you fear the process of dying then you will try to avoid something that will kill you, especially if it's likely to hurt.
Quote from: Norfolk And Chance on October 23, 2011, 04:46:01 PM
As theists believe you live on in sky paradise after death, then death has little meaning, and actually neither does real life because it is redundant if you live eternally anyway. So there is theistically no point to real life, no point to death, and no need for real organisms to fear death. So why do they then?
May depend on the religion, some use the possibility of there being a negative afterlife spent in pain and misery for the all of eternity. Take the bible for example there is no chance that a single person has been able to keep to all the rules and regulations so there may be a chance that person of that faith thinks they will go to hell.
I am in agreement with Asmodean the idea of death doesn't faze me in the slightest but dying in a hugely painful way does.
Quote from: OldGit on October 23, 2011, 05:21:36 PM
Quote from: Steve JobsNo one wants to die. Even people who want to go to heaven don't want to die to get there.
I agree with Asmodean, it's the fear of dying, rather than being dead. For myself, I can't imagine not existing. I just can't form the mental image. OK, they say it's the same as before one was born, but I can't picture that either.
Well you can't really picture nothingness. I used to fear dying a lot when I first started thinking about my atheism. The non existence for ever more was quite disturbing. It's quite hard to get your head around how you won't be around anymore and won't even know you ever existed nor have any concept of anything, time included. As you said, compare to before you existed, there's your window into death.
Over time I've grown used to it all, but I must admit I'm a bit bummed that I won't be around in 2400 or whatever, to see if we managed to colonise Mars or anything, or reached near light speed travel. Missing out on all that future stuff is upsetting, and I think the human lifespan is not near long enough. Eternity would be torture, everything has to end sometime - even stars, but 500 -1,000 years would be a decent lifespan. 80 or so years is a short straw, and I really hate Giant Tortoises.
I'm a theist. I'm not "afraid" of death, I just don't want to die. Like Git, I don't relish the process (working in a hospital and having plenty of experience with death in my own family, it's not pretty), and I'm not really afraid of the long sleep (sleep's great). But I don't want to miss anything. I love life. I want to see my grandchildren reach 100 and do amazing things. Even if I'm sitting in a wheelchair somewhere, if I could just be a spectator of everything that comes after me, that would be fine. Just sit, sip on some wine and watch the festivities. I don't understand people who want to die. Really.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on October 24, 2011, 12:35:45 AM
I just don't want to die. Like Git, I don't relish the process (working in a hospital and having plenty of experience with death in my own family, it's not pretty), and I'm not really afraid of the long sleep (sleep's great). But I don't want to miss anything. I love life.
We agree on this.
However, as a theist do you not believe in heaven? Just you mentioned not being afraid of the long sleep. Obviously that's not a problem if you go to heaven?
Quote from: Norfolk And Chance on October 24, 2011, 01:05:20 AM
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on October 24, 2011, 12:35:45 AM
I just don't want to die. Like Git, I don't relish the process (working in a hospital and having plenty of experience with death in my own family, it's not pretty), and I'm not really afraid of the long sleep (sleep's great). But I don't want to miss anything. I love life.
We agree on this.
However, as a theist do you not believe in heaven? Just you mentioned not being afraid of the long sleep. Obviously that's not a problem if you go to heaven?
Like some conservative Jews I know, I believe in resurrection, not disembodied souls or spiritual heaven. When I die, my belief is that I will stay dead until the resurrection. It will be like sleep.
I've been thinking over my previous answer.
Suppose that some mad professor out of a James Bond film has strapped you to a nuclear weapon, which you know will detonate in two minutes. You know that the transition from life to death will be entirely sensation-free: you will be vapourised and turned into plasma so quickly that your brain will not have time to register any change before it ceases to exist. Would you feel fear in those two minutes? I'm sure I would. In that case, could you give a logical explanation of what you're afraid of? I don't think I could. It would be the ancient animal emotion which Norfolk alluded to.
Quote from: OldGit on October 24, 2011, 09:28:33 AM
Would you feel fear in those two minutes? I'm sure I would. In that case, could you give a logical explanation of what you're afraid of? I don't think I could. It would be the ancient animal emotion which Norfolk alluded to.
I'm a weird, screwed-up guy, but thinking about it excites me rather than frightens. I mean... An
actual thermonuclear warhead. And I am practically on top of it in an evil lair of a mad scientist..! Does it get any cooler?! Of course, I suppose my instinct of self-preservation would kick in at some point, but I think I'd still meet my demise with more curiosity than fear.
Quote from: Grumpy LumpyDoes it get any cooler?
No, it gets a damn sight hotter!
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi647.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fuu198%2FRamblingSyd%2FLaughing_RoflSmileyLJ.gif&hash=408f9683dd143fb3e0c4dfb36ccf4b0387222924)
Quote from: OldGit on October 24, 2011, 09:57:22 AM
No, it gets a damn sight hotter!
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi647.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fuu198%2FRamblingSyd%2FLaughing_RoflSmileyLJ.gif&hash=408f9683dd143fb3e0c4dfb36ccf4b0387222924)
Super-heated plasma-hot, baby! 8)
Quote from: Norfolk And Chance on October 23, 2011, 04:00:55 PM
...why is there anything to fear from death...
As a Christian theist, I do not fear what lies on the other side of death...
Quote from: Norfolk And Chance on October 23, 2011, 04:00:55 PM
...and why do we have an inbuilt biological urge to avoid dying at any cost?
...but I do consider the termination of what lies on this side of death (my life) to be a "loss" of something of value to God.
Btw, curious that you chose the word "inbuilt". :)
Quote from: bandit4god on October 24, 2011, 03:21:23 PM
Btw, curious that you chose the word "inbuilt". :)
It's a word. It works in that sentence. Why, do you think it holds some hidden meanings and implications of a "builder"..? ::)
Seeing patterns where there are none... What do they call that again..? Super... Supersion... Superposition..?
Ah..! Superstition.
Inbuilt, square triangles, married bachelors...
I think that some people are afraid of death because they don't understand death, I would better say that they don't understand that death doesn't exists. You just live and then stop living, that is all folks, no death in it.
I wish that were true, but I'm afraid that most deaths are long-drawn-out and unpleasant. The lucky few just drop dead instantly without knowing anything about it. So death for most people is a process which we may reasonably fear for itself, separate from ceasing to exist.
I fear death - and not just the process of dying, which I also fear, but oblivion itself. I value existence. Anything I value I fear losing. Seems natural to me. Instinctive, too, I think, since I will instinctively flee in a panic from anything that seems ready and able to kill me.
I don't just fear negatives. I also fear the loss of positives. Don't you - at least in general, if not in the particular instance under discussion here on this thread?
For some, dying will be horrific and gruesome.
For others it will be like an illness and then finally fading away.
The lucky ones won't see it coming.
But unfortunately it won't be a party, where you get to have one last hurrah, say goodbye to your loved ones and check out with a smile.
I find it funny that some people worry about whether they will have regrets about their unfulfilled dreams and desires. When death is coming, you are likely to realise that none of that matters, its your time and you won't live to have any regrets.
I would also like to clarify that I am not a thesist.
Anyway, as someone who felt their mom's heartbeat slow, then stop beneath their palm; I will say death sucks.
Even in a controlled situation like my mom's death. Nurses were extremely helpful, but in the end, it was just me watching and feeling my mom's life vaporize.
I dunno. Death is something I don't fear, but I don't have to like it.
It only saddens me, cuz I know these people don't exist anymre, anywhere.
I don't believe in any ridiculous afterlife. My dad chanting "i'll see you later in heaven" annoyed the piss out of me.
Quote from: Sweetdeath on November 27, 2011, 06:48:51 AM
My dad chanting "i'll see you later in heaven" annoyed the piss out of me.
Unless he really believes it, he's probably just having trouble letting go. Many centuries have passed since dead was dead and that was that in our culture... So not accepting death for death is quite common.
Quote from: Asmodean on November 27, 2011, 09:54:18 AM
Quote from: Sweetdeath on November 27, 2011, 06:48:51 AM
My dad chanting "i'll see you later in heaven" annoyed the piss out of me.
Unless he really believes it, he's probably just having trouble letting go. Many centuries have passed since dead was dead and that was that in our culture... So not accepting death for death is quite common.
Agreed. My Grandmother recently passed away and I found it really bothersome that a lot of the adults kept telling the children in our family, "Oh, Nanny went up to heaven and now she's watching over you!" It must be so confusing for a little kid, because, obviously, if heaven is so great, why is everyone so sad? And saying "she went up to heaven" doesn't tell you anything about what actually happened to her. It's hard enough to get your head around death when you're a little kid without everyone using emotional, vague euphemisms all of the time.
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on November 27, 2011, 11:52:55 AM
It's hard enough to get your head around death when you're a little kid without everyone using emotional, vague euphemisms all of the time.
From experience, you don't have to shelter small children from "regular" death. They seem to have a much easier time dealing with it than many adults, and do not require tales of afterlife to "comfort" them.
Quote from: Asmodean on November 27, 2011, 12:16:39 PM
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on November 27, 2011, 11:52:55 AM
It's hard enough to get your head around death when you're a little kid without everyone using emotional, vague euphemisms all of the time.
From experience, you don't have to shelter small children from "regular" death. They seem to have a much easier time dealing with it than many adults, and do not require tales of afterlife to "comfort" them.
I agree with you. Furthermore, the idea that a dead person may watch over them, could give some of these kids the creeps.
Agreed, Juliet, Asmo, and Tom. It seems adults tend to seek comfort more than children. Children seem to accept death, and move on.
Btw Tom, your new icon is ace! <3
Quote from: Troll god on October 29, 2011, 10:36:49 PM
I think that some people are afraid of death because they don't understand death, I would better say that they don't understand that death doesn't exists. You just live and then stop living, that is all folks, no death in it.
My guess would be the opposite is true -- people fear death because they
do understand it. They just don't like the idea of it and want to avoid the reality but know that's not possible. It's probably more accurate to say that most people resent death rather than fear it, altho if you honestly believed there was another life after this one where you'd be judged and possibly punished, you might well fear the death that would send you into that new and unpleasant life.
And I've never thought there was anything strange about Xtians grieving the death of someone they thought was now in heaven (and presumably not being punished, tho every description of heaven I've heard sounds like punishment to me), since they're still being parted from that person, at least for awhile according to their beliefs, and separation always hurts.
By rights, if the Christians beleived in eternal happyness and joy in heaven they ought to either be happy for, or jealous of the person dying.
The person dying ought to be bloody excited.
I find it ironic that Vikings are more jubilant to die than Xtrians.
Quote from: Stevil on November 27, 2011, 06:54:20 PM
By rights, if the Christians beleived in eternal happyness and joy in heaven they ought to either be happy for, or jealous of the person dying.
The person dying ought to be bloody excited.
Maybe they are happy and/or jealous, but the point they still have to live without that person for awhile and that's where the sadness comes in.
Personally, I fear dying way more than I fear death. If I knew my death was going to be quick and painless, I don't think the prospect would bother me so much. You know, once I get a few more big "life goals" out of the way.
I absolutely do not want to be dead under any condition ever. If they open up a singularity clinic tomorrow I will be camped there waiting first person in line. I will be happy to do whatever craziness medicine comes up with in the coming years to preserve my consciousness and memories. If it means changing bodies, or floating my head in a vat, or transplanting into an animal or whatever, im down for it. I do not just fear the ways there are to die i fear death as well. And when the time comes I do not intend to be at peace or accepting. I will be stubborn and angry. I'm not sure how to think about this otherwise.
I always thought that a religious person who fears for their own mortality despite their religious upbringing is someone still open to reason, compassion, could possibly be swayed away from religion, or at least be easier to coexist with in society.
Its the ones who are no longer afraid of death that can be a serious problem.
Quote from: xm1 on December 02, 2011, 03:52:13 PM
Its the ones who are no longer afraid of death that can be a serious problem.
Being unafraid of death need not make one actively seek it.
There are many things that people are generally unafraid of, yet try to avoid. Rain comes to mind... Head aches... Jehova's Witnesses...
Quote from: Asmodean on December 02, 2011, 08:26:24 PM
Quote from: xm1 on December 02, 2011, 03:52:13 PM
Its the ones who are no longer afraid of death that can be a serious problem.
Being unafraid of death need not make one actively seek it.
There are many things that people are generally unafraid of, yet try to avoid. Rain comes to mind... Head aches... Jehova's Witnesses...
Really not what i was getting at but thats cool. Atheists who are unafraid of death are definitely not on my oh shit radar.
Quote from: Norfolk And Chance on October 23, 2011, 04:00:55 PM
Just a simple question really - if we take the teachings of christianity to be true, you go to heaven if you have been good and promise to suck up to god for eternity.
If this is the case, why is there anything to fear from death and why do we have an inbuilt biological urge to avoid dying at any cost? Surely this does not stack up?
Duplicity is the reason. We know our own hearts. When we seek God for reward, what are we really after? If we seek God to avoid punishment, what do we really seek. The answer is self. God cuts pride with His consuming fire. A cut will heal and a lesson is learned. Confucius said, "I hear and I forget. I see and I learn. I do and I understand." Doing is the point.
You might ask the question, "Why one life." This is harsh. I say what Jesus said: "You must be born again." It's not an option. You can say, WAIT just one cotton pikin' minute. I know Hebrews 9:27, and I'm not afraid to use it. I say, "Go ahead." While you are at it, read the next verse as well.
Hebrews 9:27
27 Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.
Do you know about the final judgment of mankind at the end of the age? This is a final judgment. In other words, it implies other judgments. God is long-suffering and the entire Bible is written to all generations. Salvation comes when Christ returns and we are ALL waiting. We are the temple and the veil keeps us living by faith and not the facts of our past. Faith requires us to find union, as all life finds union. How is that?
We must love to find union with a partner. Ultimately, the union with God is in love for Him. Until we find this, we are bound to the law as our master. Union with the spirit is revealed in John 3.
God created the sun and the moon. This union causes all life on earth. Sperm and egg; left and right; up and down; and so on. We are in the land of opposites by degree, all finding union to collapse the indeterminate wave of infinity. God is infinity at rest. We are mortal and in motion. Our soul cannot die. It lives again and must be born again. Proof?
John 3.
5 Jesus answered, "Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit. 6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit. 7 You should not be surprised at my saying, 'You must be born again.' 8 The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit."
This is in relation to John the Baptist and baptism in the same chapter. Context is important. A mystery is being revealed by Jesus. Baptism is our birth into the water of reality. Spirit is the next union (only by faith and love or back to the water you go). This makes our body the placenta (archatype) and the earth the womb. Does the earth care for us? Does it provide for our needs? Did you or I have anything to do with this process? Do you make your hair grow? Do you make your eyes see? Do you make the sun shine or the earth turn one degree around the galaxy every 72.22222 years? No. God makes you live one generation, give or take, as you make one degree around the galaxy. Imagine a year for God in degrees and you live 100 generations.
When did Israel become a nation? 1948 What doth we get when we add the numbers betwixt 1948 and one generation? 2018. What time is it now? 2011. How many years between 2012 and 2018?
Matthew 24
32 "Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33 Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it[e] is near, right at the door. 34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.
This generation will see 2018 come. Israel is the fig tree.
As you wait to find out why death is no big deal, consider this:
Epistle of Barnabas
Barnabas 15:3
Of the Sabbath He speaketh in the beginning of the creation; And
God made the works of His hands in six days, and He ended on the
seventh day, and rested on it, and He hallowed it.
Barnabas 15:4
Give heed, children, what this meaneth; He ended in six days. He
meaneth this, that in six thousand years the Lord shall bring all
things to an end; for the day with Him signifyeth a thousand years;
and this He himself beareth me witness, saying; Behold, the day of
the Lord shall be as a thousand years. Therefore, children, in six
days, that is in six thousand years, everything shall come to an end.
Why is this important to death?
Adam to Abraham 2000 years (2 Days)
Abraham to Noah 2000 years (2 Days)
Noah to Jesus 2000 years (2 Days)
Day of rest 1000 years. 2018ish.
You question these mere coincidences?
Consider this:
Enoch 1
And the Lord said unto Michael: 'Go, bind Semjaza and his associates who have united themselves with women so as to have defiled themselves 12 with them in all their uncleanness. And when their sons have slain one another, and they have seen the destruction of their beloved ones, bind them fast for seventy generations in the valleys of the earth, till the day of their judgement and of their consummation, till the judgement that is 13 for ever and ever is consummated. In those days they shall be led off to the abyss of fire: and 14 to the torment and the prison in which they shall be confined for ever. And whosoever shall be condemned and destroyed will from thenceforth be bound together with them to the end of all 15 generations. And destroy all the spirits of the reprobate and the children of the Watchers, because 16 they have wronged mankind.
These were the divine beings form Genesis 6 that deceived mankind. Enoch lived 365 years and was taken. We normally see judgment committed at the end of the life of the prophet. Consider this. 70 generations to the doom of the angels. 70*70.2222 = 5055 years. Enoch died in 987. Depending on when the prophecy was engaged, we get 6000. That's now.
One more consideration.
The Prophecy ... Ezekiel 4:4-6
"Then God said to Ezekiel,
'Now lie on your left side for 390 days
to show Israel will be punished for 390 years
by captivity and doom.
Each day you lie there represents
a year of punishment ahead for Israel.
Afterwards, turn over and lay on your right side
for 40 days, to signify the years of Judah's punishment.
Each day will represent one year . . .'"
(Ezekiel 4:4-6)
390 days Judgment against the 10 northern tribes 'Israel'
+ 40 days Judgment against the 2 southern tribes 'Judah'
= 430 years Judgment against the nation of Israel
Fulfillment
430 years of judgment determined against nation Israel
- 70 years fulfilled during the Babylonian captivity
= 360 years remaining in judgment against the nation of Israel
Where are the 360 years?
"And after all this, if you do not obey Me,
then I (God) will punish you seven times more for your sins."
(Leviticus 26:18)
"Then, if you walk contrary to Me,
and are not willing to obey Me,
I (God) will bring on you seven times more plagues,
according to your sins."
(Leviticus 26:21)
"And after all this,
if you do not obey Me,
but walk contrary to Me,
then I (God) also will walk contrary to you in fury;
and I, even I will chastise you seven times for your sins.:
(Leviticus 26:27-28)
"I (God) will scatter you among the nations
and draw a sword after you;
your Land shall be desolate
and your cities waste."
(Leviticus 26:33)
This is a factor of 7 (7X)
360 Remaining years of judgment
x 7 The prophetic '7X' factor
= 2,520 Years of judgment remained against nation Israel
360 day years for prophecies, then add the appropriate 'leap months' to the schedule. So, the easiest way to unravel this prophecy is to first convert this prophecy into days ...
2,520 years
x 360 days
= 907,200 days of judgment remained against nation Israel after the Babylonian captivity
907,200 days รท 365.25 days = 2,483.78 years of God's judgment remained
Now have another look.
606 B.C Israel taken into Babylonian captivity
- 70 Years for 70 years
= 536 B.C. End of first 70 years of judgment
+ 2483 Years Now add the 2,483 years remaining in this judgment
+ 1 Year Add 1 year because there is no "0" B.C. or A.D.
= 1948 AD! End of judgment against nation Israel
Your answer: If God can do this, why is death important? "You must be born again." It's not an option. Stick around and see what happens next. God is good and worthy of love. To treat Him as a vending machine only reveals our duplicity. If we seek God for reward, what do we seek? If we seek Him to avoid punishment, what's the aim? We seek God as His own reward. He proves Himself with evidence we can verify. Death is rebirth. No fears unless your master is sin and death. According to the Jubilee laws, a kinsmen must redeem us. God is our kinsmen. Faith is the transfer of our debt to a new master. We are bond-servants again to God by choice.
Yay, Soups is back :D
Could you expand on that, Soups?
Quote from: Norfolk And Chance on October 23, 2011, 04:00:55 PM
Just a simple question really - if we take the teachings of Christianity to be true, you go to heaven if you have been good and promise to suck up to god for eternity.
If this is the case, why is there anything to fear from death and why do we have an inbuilt biological urge to avoid dying at any cost? Surely this does not stack up?
Christian, but I can only answer this from a non-Theists pov. It is simply the fear of the unknown. Have you ever died? Can you say for a fact that there is a Heaven or a Hell? Did you see God and live to tell about it? Was He wrathful and angry, like so many Atheist believe, or was He loving and kind like the Theists say? And then on a bit of a broader scale, is the Christian God real? Or is it the teaching of Allah that we should be following? What about Buddha? Reincarnation? Am I gonna get turned into a flower, or will I be a lowly rat? All are questions that can't be answered until met head on, but without knowing the end results, people are afraid to test it since death is so... permanent. And the most frightening one of all, what if there is nothing after death? Ashes to ashes, dust to dust, what if we are nothing at all once we are done on earth? Not a pleasant thing to think about. The only person to have ever been said to have conquered the beast that is death has been long gone, never to answer the questions of this era. So I guess what I'm really saying is that while people may believe in God, in some cases it's really just their safety blanket. Some people never grow too old for their blankie.
Uh, not speaking for all atheists, but since I don't believe in a God, there is no reason for me to believe said non-exiestant being is angry/wrathful.
Btw, in the bible myths, it has the temper tantrums of a child.
Also, i'm pretty sure it's most theists that believe it is angry, hence why they love to threaten people with 'eternal damnation.' e__e
Quote from: Sweetdeath on December 05, 2011, 07:49:38 PM
Uh, not speaking for all atheists, but since I don't believe in a God, there is no reason for me to believe said non-exiestant being is angry/wrathful.
Btw, in the bible myths, it has the temper tantrums of a child.
Also, i'm pretty sure it's most theists that believe it is angry, hence why they love to threaten people with 'eternal damnation.' e__e
Inward belief that he is wrathful when you sin or displease him, but go to a church and they'll constantly preach about his love and compassion, like about how hard it must have been for him so give his only son to save all of humanity. I know, polar-opposite from what you're probably used to, but most theists don't take very well to people that don't share their beliefs.
Welp, most theists are idiots who dance at the sky, never questioning common logic. Perhaps they think victims or kidnapping and human trafficking just didn't pray hard enough? e__e
SuperiorEd missed out a carry-one and let the decimal point slip back there. This means uncertainty - jebus could come back any time and send us all to hell, or even Mexico. Great floods may come and uproot the seal of the third temple. Ezekiel's closed door may be flung open, and the double glazing units could then get condensation between the panes. Satan shall walk abroad and there may be scattered showers in the afternoon.
This worries me; I think I'd rather live for ever.
Quote from: OldGit on December 05, 2011, 07:58:59 PM
I think I'd rather live for ever.
This thought has crossed my mind numerous times. But in the end I always decide to face whatever torment death has awaiting my coming. With living forever, wouldn't you also age forever? Becoming more and more likely to contract illness, but never perishing from it? Losing the ability to do the things you love, like reading, writing, and whatever other hobbies you may have? That halts me from the choice of eternal life, and yet, that is what's promised with Christianity. Anything that last forever, is ultimately a frightening thing. Maybe it's just me, but the thought of forever seems far too long. Being dead forever, being completely non-existent, that is a comforting thought, not having to deal day in and day out with any horrid thought that could pop into my mind and potentially spill out of my mouth. Non-existence is my comfort.
Personally I think that those who find comfort in the idea of living forever don't really know what 'forever' means. Forever. For ever and ever and ever as in never ending, permanent, eternal and infinite.
Not the kind of 'forever' used in everyday language.
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on December 05, 2011, 08:16:08 PM
Personally I think that those who find comfort in the idea of living forever don't really know what 'forever' means. Forever. For ever and ever and ever as in never ending, permanent, eternal and infinite.
Not the kind of 'forever' used in everyday language.
Someone else who gets that forever is proabaly the only scary thing about death. If you could die and per say, go to hell for 80 years, but then come back and just live again, then I don't think anyone would fear death. In fact, they might begin to fear life.
XD this is why I shall harnest the power of the pilosipher stone. I'll give you a bottle of elixier, Oldgit. <3
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on December 05, 2011, 08:16:08 PM
Personally I think that those who find comfort in the idea of living forever don't really know what 'forever' means. Forever. For ever and ever and ever as in never ending, permanent, eternal and infinite.
Not the kind of 'forever' used in everyday language.
...And that, my friends, is an awfully long time to be alive. Imagine after "half a forever", that you have seen everything you consider worth seeing and done everything worth doing and are deathly bored... Only you can't die - you still have the rest of forever to go.
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on December 05, 2011, 08:16:08 PM
Personally I think that those who find comfort in the idea of living forever don't really know what 'forever' means. Forever. For ever and ever and ever as in never ending, permanent, eternal and infinite.
Not the kind of 'forever' used in everyday language.
Agreed.
This is surely the definition of hell for me.
Btw, Asmo, why are some user icons bigger suddenly? XD
Quote from: Sweetdeath on December 05, 2011, 08:42:45 PM
Btw, Asmo, why are some user icons bigger suddenly? XD
Because they just increased the allowed size from 65x65 to 130x130.
Quote from: OldGit on December 05, 2011, 07:58:59 PM
Satan shall walk abroad and there may be scattered showers in the afternoon.
:D
Quote from: Scissorlegs on December 05, 2011, 08:27:13 PM
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on December 05, 2011, 08:16:08 PM
Personally I think that those who find comfort in the idea of living forever don't really know what 'forever' means. Forever. For ever and ever and ever as in never ending, permanent, eternal and infinite.
Not the kind of 'forever' used in everyday language.
Agreed.
This is surely the definition of hell for me.
Me and a few friends put
Zardoz on at an independent cinema the weekend before last, it has exactly that theme (amongst many about religion, genetics, evolution and history!) It has a society of people who are immortal and are just plain bored of it, and crave death and release, and their saviour is someone who they bring into their society to kill them all. Like you said, people really haven't quite thought about what eternity means.
Quote from: Too Few Lions on December 05, 2011, 09:40:55 PM
Me and a few friends put Zardoz on at an independent cinema the weekend before last, it has exactly that theme (amongst many about religion, genetics, evolution and history!) It has a society of people who are immortal and are just plain bored of it, and crave death and release, and their savior is someone who they bring into their society to kill them all. Like you said, people really haven't quite thought about what eternity means.
Sounds interesting. I think I'll check it out.