(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fd24w6bsrhbeh9d.cloudfront.net%2Fphoto%2F268265_700b.jpg&hash=f69aaf34c3cc4a2e9815ccc8477fc027c1fdffd3)
That's crazy.
The Moon doesn't have arms.
More round earth propaganda.
There is only one problem with the, Earth doesn't care whether it is hospitable to us or not, hence we are only ballsing it up for ourselves.....which kind of takes the pressure off, in a funny kind of way.
If this had been iSok's first post, he would have been banned as a troll.
Don't quite understand the post, it seems really random. Funny though, in a random way.
It so ridiculous it turned out to be funny.
Mars. It's still there.
What kind of propaganda is this?! >:(
Actually, now that I've had a good look at it, this is hillarious stuff.
And mars is next, which is soooo true, although I do sometimes wonder if Mars had been first?
Love it! That was very funny. :D
very funny, thanks!!
Quote from: viriditas on September 20, 2011, 08:08:53 AM
very funny, thanks!!
That makes 10 posts! You can access the whole forum.
For me it expresses an unwelcome truth with a nice touch of black humour.
Quote from: OldGit on September 20, 2011, 09:17:43 AM
For me it expresses an unwelcome truth with a nice touch of black humour.
Quite right.
Is that why I'm "beginning to see the wedge" now?
Quote from: viriditas on September 20, 2011, 09:29:57 AM
Is that why I'm "beginning to see the wedge" now?
Yep. You'll see a whole range of descriptions between now and 1,500 posts. Watch out for the one at 666 it's only there for the one post!
Quote from: Tank on September 20, 2011, 09:33:37 AM
Yep. You'll see a whole range of descriptions between now and 1,500 posts. Watch out for the one at 666 it's only there for the one post!
I just passed 3333 :D we need something other than our older than the big bang status... Just to keep it exciting for we old timers
that's brilliant, and unfortunately far too true, thanks iSok. I guess the only thing is the Earth will survive whatever we throw at it, it's just us and millions of other species that might not!
*like*
I'm not a troll....this is the 'laid back lounge', only topic I could find to post this.
I think the message is pretty serious in a light package.
We're acting like cancer and we won't find out or act till our host 'dies' and it'll be too late.
Think we human's have our own place, our own niche just like blood has it's place or the organs in the body.
But once we start spreading like cancer, something is going wrong.
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 20, 2011, 12:38:29 PM
that's brilliant, and unfortunately far too true, thanks iSok. I guess the only thing is the Earth will survive whatever we throw at it, it's just us and millions of other species that might not!
You could see the earth as 'living' because of all the species that have been living on it for millions of years, till we human's turn up, we start multiplying and
occupy everything we face, without understanding that the whole system is connected and only caring for ourselves (that's why the analogy with a tumor).
Quote from: iSok on September 20, 2011, 06:18:30 PM
I'm not a troll....this is the 'laid back lounge', only topic I could find to post this.
No you are not, sorry iSok, I looked at the post very quickly whilst I was at work.
Wasn't till I got home that I could get a better look.
It's a fantastically funny post.
Quote from: iSok on September 20, 2011, 06:18:30 PM
I'm not a troll....this is the 'laid back lounge', only topic I could find to post this.
I think the message is pretty serious in a light package.
We're acting like cancer and we won't find out or act till our host 'dies' and it'll be too late.
Think we human's have our own place, our own niche just like blood has it's place or the organs in the body.
But once we start spreading like cancer, something is going wrong.
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 20, 2011, 12:38:29 PM
that's brilliant, and unfortunately far too true, thanks iSok. I guess the only thing is the Earth will survive whatever we throw at it, it's just us and millions of other species that might not!
You could see the earth as 'living' because of all the species that have been living on it for millions of years, till we human's turn up, we start multiplying and
occupy everything we face, without understanding that the whole system is connected and only caring for ourselves (that's why the analogy with a tumor).
And yet much of that has been due to religions telling their followers to multiply, and not really taking steps to help the situation because judgement is coming. Why bother to take care of the earth when it's merely a springboard to heaven?
Quote from: Ihateyoumike on September 20, 2011, 08:04:40 PM
Quote from: iSok on September 20, 2011, 06:18:30 PM
I'm not a troll....this is the 'laid back lounge', only topic I could find to post this.
I think the message is pretty serious in a light package.
We're acting like cancer and we won't find out or act till our host 'dies' and it'll be too late.
Think we human's have our own place, our own niche just like blood has it's place or the organs in the body.
But once we start spreading like cancer, something is going wrong.
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 20, 2011, 12:38:29 PM
that's brilliant, and unfortunately far too true, thanks iSok. I guess the only thing is the Earth will survive whatever we throw at it, it's just us and millions of other species that might not!
You could see the earth as 'living' because of all the species that have been living on it for millions of years, till we human's turn up, we start multiplying and
occupy everything we face, without understanding that the whole system is connected and only caring for ourselves (that's why the analogy with a tumor).
And yet much of that has been due to religions telling their followers to multiply, and not really taking steps to help the situation because judgement is coming. Why bother to take care of the earth when it's merely a springboard to heaven?
It's always very easy to point the finger at other's while never taking the time to examine yourself, maybe you should do that instead of me showing you.
Quote from: iSok on September 20, 2011, 06:18:30 PM
I'm not a troll....this is the 'laid back lounge', only topic I could find to post this.
I think the message is pretty serious in a light package.
We're acting like cancer and we won't find out or act till our host 'dies' and it'll be too late.
Think we human's have our own place, our own niche just like blood has it's place or the organs in the body.
But once we start spreading like cancer, something is going wrong.
We are not as much tumor-like as virus-like.
That said, the Earth doesn't give a flying duck - it will still be here if we poison the water and atmosphere and nuke ourselves to dust fron whence we came.
like...
I wonder if I can get it to show up on facebook...
edit: FB said it was too tall to post
Quote from: Asmodean on September 20, 2011, 09:37:28 AM
I just passed 3333 :D we need something other than our older than the big bang status... Just to keep it exciting for we old timers
Over the,,, what do they call those high bits of land?
You know the those things Jack and Jill came to grief on.
Quote from: Asmodean on September 21, 2011, 02:04:11 AM
Quote from: iSok on September 20, 2011, 06:18:30 PM
I'm not a troll....this is the 'laid back lounge', only topic I could find to post this.
I think the message is pretty serious in a light package.
We're acting like cancer and we won't find out or act till our host 'dies' and it'll be too late.
Think we human's have our own place, our own niche just like blood has it's place or the organs in the body.
But once we start spreading like cancer, something is going wrong.
We are not as much tumor-like as virus-like.
That said, the Earth doesn't give a flying duck - it will still be here if we poison the water and atmosphere and nuke ourselves to dust fron whence we came.
Aside of whether the Earth cares about us or not, that's a different discussion.
But we are more tumor-like than virus-like, a virus is an alien that has invaded a body where it doesn't belong.
We were part of the Earth, like the stomach is part of the body, until recently, when we decided that we need to spread....
While we are altering the environment, the Earth and life will still continue to exist however much pollution we pump out into it. Life will adapt and evolve to exist in that whatever changed environments we create. I think the change humans are causing to the environment is a lot less drastic than natural occurrences like Ice Ages. We've also had mass extinction events in the past millions of years before homo sapiens ever existed, when 75% or more of the planet's species are believed to have become extinct
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extinction_event
having said that it would be great if people were less selfish and realised the change we're causing in the environment and tried to live lives that did less environmental damage. Along with realising the planet is vastly overpopulated with people, and use birth control.
On the other hand, maybe environmental change is all part of the gods' great plan ;)
Quote from: iSok on September 21, 2011, 12:59:53 PM
But we are more tumor-like than virus-like, a virus is an alien that has invaded a body where it doesn't belong.
We were part of the Earth, like the stomach is part of the body, until recently, when we decided that we need to spread....
The stomach is a vital organ that the body requires, we haven't achieved this status yet.
We do have the opportunity to become the sane mind of Earth's biosphere, we just have to get a little bit smarter.
Quote from: iSok on September 21, 2011, 12:59:53 PM
But we are more tumor-like than virus-like, a virus is an alien that has invaded a body where it doesn't belong.
In that sense, perhaps.
However, where a virus invades a cell and destroys it, a tumor adds malfunctioning cells. Humans do not create new areas - we just move in, suck them dry while multiplying (And if it were up to assholes like the pope, we'd be doing even more of that) and then, when everything is nice and ruined, we move on to ruin the next area.
Our behaviour is thus more virus-like and as it is our behaviour, not place of origin that is the issue, I would use the term "virus" to describe us.
Has anyone read Reg Morrison? I love his articles and photos. He thinks humans are in a plague stage like other plague mammals (rodents etc.) http://regmorrison.edublogs.org/ not a cheery thought yet still I feel thankful to know I'm not the only one who feels this way.
Oh and... if this is getting too controversial for the Laid Back Lounge, let me know where it should go instead...
It's all God's fault. The all-knowing intelligent designer didn't see this coming when he made man without thinking to create something higher on the food chain that breeds slower and understands the concept of population control. Or maybe it's part of his plan to have the world auto-correct us into the stone age. I don't know I've been so confused since my prayers for rain in Texas caused floods in Vermont.
Once again, religion is the main reason we have such a problem with over population.
Aside from that, I welcome colonization of other planets. What's wrong with that?
There is an AWESOME book by Colin Tudge, Neanderthals, Bandits and Farmers which describes how humanity's discovery of agriculture enabled overpopulation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neanderthals,_Bandits_and_Farmers
Farms need a lot of hands. Religions of the time merely told people what was the best advice for them at that time: make lots of babies so that you can have many workers for your farm. It's only in the past couple centuries that we've begun to see the limit, but this mode of living was planted 10,000 years ago. The ancient seeds of our demise are finally bearing fruit.
Why is it whenever iSok posts something not religious related people always jump down his throat.
I thought it was really funny, thanks for the laugh.
If these big rocks were conscious I think they would be envious of others inhabitants to scratch there backs or simply to give them meaning.
Quote from: Crow on September 23, 2011, 12:56:59 AM
Why is it whenever iSok posts something not religious related people always jump down his throat.
I've noticed that with replies to AnimatedDirt as well.
I suppose we are expecting something disagreeable so that's what we see, sometimes anyway.
Quote from: Crow on September 23, 2011, 12:56:59 AM
Why is it whenever iSok posts something not religious related people always jump down his throat.
I thought it was really funny, thanks for the laugh.
Some people can't see past the religion. I suspect another reason is that some people can't trust theists and read negative intent into all/any actions. So posting a comical cartoon is perceived as simply a sly way of getting to be liked so one lowers one's guard and later gets sucked into the theists world view.
I generally don't trust theists who lead with their theism, I also have an inherent distrust of theists who post on atheist forums as I have only ever met a couple (out of hundreds) that really didn't appear to have an agenda of insidious conversion.
I liked the cartoon though ;D
yeah, I thought that it was a really funny cartoon too, thanks iSok. I think we can say that the world's largest religions have actively contributed to the overpopulation of the Earth without it being seen as personally aimed at iSok or any other theist.
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 23, 2011, 09:30:15 AM
yeah, I thought that it was a really funny cartoon too, thanks iSok. I think we can say that the world's largest religions have actively contributed to the overpopulation of the Earth without it being a personal attack on iSok or any other theist.
I agree. The big two religions still largely promote unfettered reproduction, to the ultimate detriment of all people and organisms that exist on Earth.
Quote from: Crow on September 23, 2011, 12:56:59 AM
Why is it whenever iSok posts something not religious related people always jump down his throat.
I'm certainly guilty of this. I actually like iSok, I just read the post wrong, didn't have time to read it properly at work.
The people here that blame religion for the environmental problem's.....you cannot be taken seriously.
For example, US inhabitants make of less than 5% of the world population, while they are responsible for 60% of the
emission of carbondioxide by human beings.
It has nothing to do with religion, in fact I would say that religion would actually help the environment.
For centuries man always found happiness in the belief in Santa Claus and all that...
While recently it has shifted to materialism, it has to do with our newly invented lifestyle, especially our consumer culture.
We (the western world) are responsible for all of this, anyone denying that is simply living in ignorance.
About overpopulation, anyone here who gave posted the above comments should read the book written
by Susan George - How the other half dies, it will be an eye opener.
While I understand and admit that religion has it's downsides, some of the 'worst' persons I know are religious and some
of the best persons I know are agnostics. But one should not fall into ignorance and have an open mind about everything...........
No human being is perfect, but I would say that the one who's constantly self-reflecting is close, we should all do that.
(P.S. The reason why I am here is because I'm brainwashing many of you in secret, so one day you'll wake up and all of a sudden you'll be a theist, Amen..............)
Quote from: iSok on September 23, 2011, 02:28:17 PM
The people here that blame religion for the environmental problem's.....you cannot be taken seriously.
For example, US inhabitants make of less than 5% of the world population, while they are responsible for 60% of the
emission of carbondioxide by human beings.
It has nothing to do with religion, in fact I would say that religion would actually help the environment.
For centuries man always found happiness in the belief in Santa Claus and all that...
While recently it has shifted to materialism, it has to do with our newly invented lifestyle, especially our consumer culture.
We (the western world) are responsible for all of this, anyone denying that is simply living in ignorance.
I agree 100% that consumerism and modern lifestyles have helped contribute to environmental change, but this isn't just a problem of the West.
I don't think that anyone's blaming religion for environmental change, we're saying Christianity and Islam have actively opposed birth control which has helped lead to a vastly overpopulated planet. Personally i think birth control is as important an issue as carbon emmisions, there are plenty of other ways that humans are fouling up the environment other than by carbon emmissions, and the more people there are, the more mess and waste they create.
Here's a link to a study that ranked each country by the environmental damage it's causing;
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/05/100505092006.htm
In absolute global terms, the 10 countries with the worst environmental impact are (in order, worst first): Brazil, USA, China, Indonesia, Japan, Mexico, India, Russia, Australia and Peru.
There are only two western countries in that list, and no European ones.
Also the world's 10 worst environmental performers according to the proportional environmental impact index (relative to resource availability) are: Singapore, Korea, Qatar, Kuwait, Japan, Thailand, Bahrain, Malaysia, Philippines and Netherlands.
There are quite a few Islamic nations in there, so I don't think it's fair to blame this solely on the West!
Quote from: iSok on September 23, 2011, 02:28:17 PM
The people here that blame religion for the environmental problem's.....you cannot be taken seriously.
For example, US inhabitants make of less than 5% of the world population, while they are responsible for 60% of the
emission of carbondioxide by human beings.
I dunno'... There is
a lot of religion over in States. :-\
That said, I don't blame humans for climate changes at all. Oh, we may be speeding them up, but causing them in the first place..? I'm not convinced. Climate has changed several times before industrial revolution, why would it not change now?
There are other environmental impacts of humans, such as habitat expansion, water, air and land pollution, disruption of ecosystems and the like. Those, we are guilty of.
That said, I'm a go burn some tires with paraffin ;D
QuoteIt has nothing to do with religion, in fact I would say that religion would actually help the environment.
Maybe. By killing off all the humans eventually...
QuoteFor centuries man always found happiness in the belief in Santa Claus and all that...
While recently it has shifted to materialism, it has to do with our newly invented lifestyle, especially our consumer culture.
How is religion a remedy against that, being a part of the consumer culture itself?
QuoteWe (the western world) are responsible for all of this, anyone denying that is simply living in ignorance.
I dunno'... Them Chinese have plenty of coal power plants and in that region (China, India/Pakistan area), there are far too many people.
QuoteAbout overpopulation, anyone here who gave posted the above comments should read the book written
by Susan George - How the other half dies, it will be an eye opener.
I'll check it out. It would help having ISBN if you have it?
The thing with overpopulation though is that if we are to get the planetary average standard of living to that of an over-middle class European or North American resident, we will deplete the resources we have available quickly and I see no reason at all for me to compromise my standard of living just so some maniac can press out 12 kids in as many years.
QuoteWhile I understand and admit that religion has it's downsides, some of the 'worst' persons I know are religious and some
of the best persons I know are agnostics. But one should not fall into ignorance and have an open mind about everything...........
I still don't see why one would want to keep an open mind in regard to religion. But then my point of view on the matter has always been "Prove your god, then we'll talk"
Quotebut I would say that the one who's constantly self-reflecting is close, we should all do that.
Why..? Why would I waste my time self-reflecting unless I find an aspect of my life that is not working like I want it to and decide that I am the root of the issue?
Quote(P.S. The reason why I am here is because I'm brainwashing many of you in secret, so one day you'll wake up and all of a sudden you'll be a theist, Amen..............)
Allahu ackbar to you too :P
The per capita comparisons aren't favourable for us, if I have two children and someone in Somalia has ten is it reasonable for my children to create five times the emissions/damage?
What responsibility do we allocate to client nations of forest destroying Indonesia, Malaysia and Brazil?
Australia is on the list and I'm sure we deserve to be, loss of species is such a problem due to us and our introduced rabbits, cats, foxes, cane toads, rats, goats, camels, pigs, horses, sheep, cattle, bees, dogs, carp, bilge water spread marine critters, Indian Minors, water buffalo, ants etc etc.
Hopefully the less delusional cultures will come up with technology that helps.
Never mind.
Quote from: The Magic Pudding on September 23, 2011, 03:58:12 PM
The per capita comparisons aren't favourable for us, if I have two children and someone in Somalia has ten is it reasonable for my children to create five times the emissions/damage?
Me, I'd say yes. But then again, I wouldn't know green if it bit me on the nose.
here are the world's top 20 pollutors, most of them aren't Western countries;
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg263.imageshack.us%2Fimg263%2F7791%2Fpollutors.png&hash=b315cabab0161da0dedffbb93f1733f2eb265ea3) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/263/pollutors.png/)
Magic Pudding, you're in at number nine, you have the planet's blood on your candied hands!
Quote from: iSok on September 23, 2011, 02:28:17 PM
The people here that blame religion for the environmental problem's.....you cannot be taken seriously.
Nobody said the religion was the only problem, but religious dogma that teaches that the will be "an end of days" and that unfettered reproduction is a good thing is a very dangerous combination.
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 23, 2011, 04:18:10 PM
Magic Pudding, you're in at number nine, you have the planet's blood on your candied hands!
Hmmmmmmm, planet's blood.
It's not our fault, the country just bursts into flame every few years.
If we feed it to sheep they just fart and burp methane.
If we farm more environmentally friendly kangaroos the Europeans protest, we just can't win.
Quote from: The Magic Pudding on September 23, 2011, 04:32:14 PM
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 23, 2011, 04:18:10 PM
Magic Pudding, you're in at number nine, you have the planet's blood on your candied hands!
Hmmmmmmm, planet's blood.
It's not our fault, the country just bursts into flame every few years.
If we feed it to sheep they just fart and burp methane.
If we farm more environmentally friendly kangaroos the Europeans protest, we just can't win.
Seriously? That's just bloody stupid. I know in America cows produce less protine per calorie than Buffalo do. They should stop farming cows ASAP.
Hm, a family of three versus a family of seven: who will do the most carbon damage?
Hm.. Hmm..
Yeah, seriously, religion is A cause, since they think the devil made birth control. *rolls eyes*
Quote from: Sweetdeath on September 23, 2011, 05:10:05 PM
Hm, a family of three versus a family of seven: who will do the most carbon damage?
Hm.. Hmm..
Yeah, seriously, religion is A cause, since they think the devil made birth control. *rolls eyes*
The family of three in the USA will do an awful lot more environmental damage than a subsistence family of seven in India. A while ago an Indian politician sent 1,000 condoms to an American congressman because the US congressman had stated that third world countries should reduce their populations to reduce carbon output. At the time one US citizen produced 30 times the carbon of one Indian citizen.
It's also worth noting that a huge amount of China's carbon output is from making consumer goods to be exported to the west. So we may not produce the carbon but we are responsible for its production elsewhere on Earth.
Whoa, you just blew my mind, Tank. :o
On a related note: I think we REALLY need to stop this outsourcing b.s anyway. I have been looking for a job for 6 months now. Uggggh
Quote from: Sweetdeath on September 23, 2011, 05:29:04 PM
Whoa, you just blew my mind, Tank. :o
On a related note: I think we REALLY need to stop this outsourcing b.s anyway. I have been looking for a job for 6 months now. Uggggh
Unfortunatly we can't stop outsourcing until we can stop shareholders in companies demanding growth and increasing profits to increase share prices and dividends. Greed, in one form or another, drives business.
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 23, 2011, 04:18:10 PM
here are the world's top 20 pollutors, most of them aren't Western countries;
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg263.imageshack.us%2Fimg263%2F7791%2Fpollutors.png&hash=b315cabab0161da0dedffbb93f1733f2eb265ea3) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/263/pollutors.png/)
Brazil?! :o That's a bit of a surprise...
Quote from: Tank on September 23, 2011, 04:38:54 PM
Seriously? That's just bloody stupid. I know in America cows produce less protine per calorie than Buffalo do. They should stop farming cows ASAP.
I hear insects are even better in that regard...we'll probably become somewhat insectivore in the future.
yeah, you Brazilians need to sort your act out ;)
I guess you're a big country with a large population and there's probably quite a lot of deforestation and industrialisation going on.
btw I'm immensely jealous of you living in Brasilia, I love Oscar Niermeyer's architecture. Must be amazing to see those buildings every day.
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 23, 2011, 04:18:10 PM
here are the world's top 20 pollutors, most of them aren't Western countries;
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg263.imageshack.us%2Fimg263%2F7791%2Fpollutors.png&hash=b315cabab0161da0dedffbb93f1733f2eb265ea3) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/263/pollutors.png/)
Magic Pudding, you're in at number nine, you have the planet's blood on your candied hands!
Not on the list, am I..? >:( I need me more tires and paraffin. NOW! >:(
you Scandinavians are far too green and healthy living for my liking. You need to drive bigger cars and burn more things!
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 23, 2011, 08:00:29 PM
you Scandinavians are far too green and healthy living for my liking. You need to drive bigger cars and burn more things!
Well, I
thought I was a big enough environmental disaster to get on that list in me own right... Apparently, needs more burning tires. >:(
Pudding! Where is Pudding?! I need his PhotoShop. I need Argentina removed from the list and replaced with Asmodean the Environmentally-Disastrous One. >:(
Quote from: Too Few Lions on September 23, 2011, 07:42:28 PM
yeah, you Brazilians need to sort your act out ;)
I guess you're a big country with a large population and there's probably quite a lot of deforestation and industrialisation going on.
btw I'm immensely jealous of you living in Brasilia, I love Oscar Niermeyer's architecture. Must be amazing to see those buildings every day.
I am genuinely surprised that we're number one...I didn't think we'd be ahead of China, even with all those factors counted. And with there being a growing emphasis on renewable energy and biofriendly fuels (not counting the farming area required to support it.)
I actually don't live there anymore :( I was just born there. Funnily enough you really start to notice and value it when you leave.
Quote from: Asmodean on September 23, 2011, 08:21:47 PM
Pudding! Where is Pudding?! I need his PhotoShop. I need Argentina removed from the list and replaced with Asmodean the Environmentally-Disastrous One. >:(
I'm not going to help because I know you have a positive effect on the world environment.
I've seen your skull collection and your intestine art. ↓ people → ↓ CO2.
Quote from: The Magic Pudding on September 24, 2011, 02:28:25 AM
I'm not going to help because I know you have a positive effect on the world environment.
I've seen your skull collection and your intestine art. ↓ people → ↓ CO2.
Ah, but when I take a skull and out come the intestines, I pack the rest in tires and burn it. :D And that ought to be more fiendish to the environment than... Driving a Hummer... Almost. 8)