Happy Atheist Forum

Are there any religions who don't believe in life after death? Just curious.

Here's a useful chart.

http://www.religionfacts.com/big_religion_chart.htm (http://www.religionfacts.com/big_religion_chart.htm)

That is very interesting. Thank you.

Some Christians think that they will be "raptured" directly to heaven without dying at all.

Quote from: "grim-reaper"Some Christians think that they will be "raptured" directly to heaven without dying at all.

How does that work?

The "Rapture" is a delusional false belief held by some Christians. They think that Jesus will suddenly appear in the clouds and magically pull all true Christians up to him and then take them to heaven.

Quote from: "grim-reaper"The "Rapture" is a delusional false belief held by some Christians. They think that Jesus will suddenly appear in the clouds and magically pull all true Christians up to him and then take them to heaven.

This may be a stupid question, but why?

This may be a stupid question, but why?

I'm not sure what you mean. Are you asking why Christians have false beliefs? Or are you asking why they want to be pulled up to heaven? In any case, it's hard for me to answer either question, since I'm not a Christian.

Quote from: "grim-reaper"This may be a stupid question, but why?

I'm not sure what you mean. Are you asking why Christians have false beliefs? Or are you asking why they want to be pulled up to heaven? In any case, it's hard for me to answer either question, since I'm not a Christian.

I guess I was asking both.

Yeah I was one of those christians. I remember my dad telling me about it when I was about 8 years old; I didn't say anything, but I was thinking,  "wait, we have to believe that too?! WTF!"  

So, this whole rapture thing... Let's see if I can phrase my question so that it'll make sense...

Why does this rapture need to happen? They're gonna die someday anyway, why rush it?

Why does this rapture need to happen? They're gonna die someday anyway, why rush it?

They don't think they'll die. They imagine that they will be taken straight to heaven without ever dying.

Quote from: "grim-reaper"Why does this rapture need to happen? They're gonna die someday anyway, why rush it?

They don't think they'll die. They imagine that they will be taken straight to heaven without ever dying.

Then what's the difference between being dead in heaven and being alive in heaven?

I don't know the difference. Most likely Christians don't know either. But I'm not the person to explain what they know or don't know, since  I'm not one of them, and so much of what they say doesn't make any sense to me.

They also believe all the dead people will come back to life at that moment. Well, all the 'saved' ones, anyway. Yep.

Quote from: "elliebean"They also believe all the dead people will come back to life at that moment. Well, all the 'saved' ones, anyway. Yep.

So, they switch places in a way?

Quote from: "Cecilie"

Quote from: "elliebean"They also believe all the dead people will come back to life at that moment. Well, all the 'saved' ones, anyway. Yep.

So, they switch places in a way?

Nope, the dead are called to heaven first then the living according to 1 Thessalonians 4:
4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Sounds almost like an alien abduction doesn't it?  I did say that in church, got into serious trouble too..........

Oh... you guys will love this site:

http://www.raptureletters.com/ (http://www.raptureletters.com/)

QuoteThe rapture: When all the believers in Jesus Christ, who have been born again, are
taken up to heaven.

After the rapture, there will be a lot of speculation as to why millions of people have
just disappeared. Unfortunately, after the rapture, only non believers will be left to come up with answers. You probably have family and friends that you have witnessed to and they just won't listen. After the rapture they probably will, but who will tell them?

We have written a computer program to do just that. It will send an Electronic Message (e-mail) to whomever you want after the rapture has taken place, and you and I have been taken to heaven.

See?  Makes perfect sense.

(I wonder how they verify that you're one of the people taken in the rapture?)

Quote from: "Cecilie"

Quote from: "elliebean"They also believe all the dead people will come back to life at that moment. Well, all the 'saved' ones, anyway. Yep.

So, they switch places in a way?

No, it's more like all the zombies pop up at the same time and then everyone is 'translated' into spirit form and relocated to heaven - all in like a flash.

The whole thing's very sci-fi/fantasy/apocolyptic/B-horror flick/made-up/bullshit/makes-scientology-look-half-reasonable, and of course there are different versions of just how it's supposed to happen and in what order, including tales of battling armies on horseback, swashbuckling, oceans of blood, plagues, flesh melting off the bones, and worldwide destruction, which they love to get into heated debates over. Come to think of it, I'm so bored these days I might start going back to my old church just for the entertainment value.

Pretty sure that during the Christian rapture, the Earth get's destroyed or close to it anyway. So in order to prevent harm from coming to his loyal followers, god takes them (and no one else) off this world before any of the destruction begins. That's why they don't die before going to heaven.  

The world gets destroyed either then, or seven years later, depending on who you ask. It's one of the bigger points of contention I alluded to earlier.

ETA: In the seven years later version, in many cases... all those people who disappeared, including all the formerly dead christians... they come back riding white horses, led by Jesus, and kill everyone else. Isn't that fun?  :shake:

Read the Left Behind series, authored by Tim LaHaye; or, alternatively, watch the movie trilogy, starring Kirk Cameron (I know how all of you guys love him). They explain what Christians actually believe regarding the rapture/"end of days".

Quote from: "joeactor"Oh... you guys will love this site:

http://www.raptureletters.com/ (http://www.raptureletters.com/)

QuoteThe rapture: When all the believers in Jesus Christ, who have been born again, are
taken up to heaven.

After the rapture, there will be a lot of speculation as to why millions of people have
just disappeared. Unfortunately, after the rapture, only non believers will be left to come up with answers. You probably have family and friends that you have witnessed to and they just won't listen. After the rapture they probably will, but who will tell them?

We have written a computer program to do just that. It will send an Electronic Message (e-mail) to whomever you want after the rapture has taken place, and you and I have been taken to heaven.

See?  Makes perfect sense.

(I wonder how they verify that you're one of the people taken in the rapture?)

Any connection to Eternal Earthbound Pets (http://eternal-earthbound-pets.com/Home_Page.html)?

QuoteYou've committed your life to Jesus. You know you're saved.  But when the Rapture comes what's to become of your loving pets who are left behind?   Eternal Earth-Bound Pets takes that burden off your mind.

We are a group of dedicated animal lovers, and atheists. Each
Eternal Earth-Bound Pet representative is a confirmed atheist, and as such will still be here on Earth after you've received your reward.  Our network of animal activists are committed to step in when you step up to Jesus.

We are currently active in 24 states.  Our representatives have been screened to ensure that they are atheists, animal lovers, are moral / ethical with no criminal background, have the ability and desire to  rescue your pet and the means to retrieve them and ensure their care for your pet's natural life.  
Our service is plain and simple; our fee structure is reasonable.
For $135.00 we will guarantee that should the Rapture occur within ten (10) years of receipt of payment, one pet per residence will be saved.  Each additional pet at your residence will be saved for an additional $20.00 fee.   A small price to pay for your peace of mind and the health and safety of your four legged and feathered friends.

Quote from: "Sophus"Any connection to Eternal Earthbound Pets (http://eternal-earthbound-pets.com/Home_Page.html)?

That seems like a good way to make money off of [strike:1027i5kx]Christians saps[/strike:1027i5kx] concerned Christian pet owners while still being charitable to those poor animals left behind if the slightest chance in Hell comes true and the Rapture is a real event that will come to take place.

Quote from: "joeactor"Oh... you guys will love this site:

http://www.raptureletters.com/ (http://www.raptureletters.com/)

QuoteThe rapture: When all the believers in Jesus Christ, who have been born again, are
taken up to heaven.

After the rapture, there will be a lot of speculation as to why millions of people have
just disappeared. Unfortunately, after the rapture, only non believers will be left to come up with answers. You probably have family and friends that you have witnessed to and they just won't listen. After the rapture they probably will, but who will tell them?

We have written a computer program to do just that. It will send an Electronic Message (e-mail) to whomever you want after the rapture has taken place, and you and I have been taken to heaven.

See?  Makes perfect sense.

(I wonder how they verify that you're one of the people taken in the rapture?)

So how do they trigger that mass email to send? They either have to know when it'll be or leave an unbeliever behind to send it.

I never understood that zombie thing of the rapture. Even from a Christian perspective, it doesn't make much sense. Those dead people were already in heaven, happily playing on their harps. Now God sent them back to their rotting bodies, which must be quite annoying for the dead, and than take them back to heaven again. Or could it be, that God sent the dead back, because they are extremely bored in heaven. In that case, he gives them the opportunity to have some fun by scaring the living shit out of the living for a short while. In both cases however, God acts like an immoral, bad (or at least a lousy) manager. Not that kind of guy that I would like to have as a boss.

With the religion it seems like the more questions you ask and get answered, the more confused you get because the answer doesn't make sense. At least that's how I feel about it.

Quote from: "Cecilie"With the religion it seems like the more questions you ask and get answered, the more confused you get because the answer doesn't make sense. At least that's how I feel about it.

I think that may be the point. Either that, or it's a natural consequence of making it up as they go along.

In answer to the zombies coming back from heaven, though: adherents to that particular apocryphal mythology don't believe they will go to heaven or hell until after "The Judgement"; prior to that they just lie around dead, like the rest of us.

Quote from: "Tom62"I never understood that zombie thing of the rapture. Even from a Christian perspective, it doesn't make much sense. Those dead people were already in heaven, happily playing on their harps. Now God sent them back to their rotting bodies, which must be quite annoying for the dead, and than take them back to heaven again.

That stance is called the Pre-Tribulation Rapture.  Hence why it is of utmost importance to understand the state of the dead.  I think you are correct that most Christianity believes that at death the saved go directly to heaven, but then as you say, and as the Bible sheds light on, Christ, by resurrecting Lazarus, plucked him out of heavenly bliss and returned him to the sinful earth!  Simply not a good interpretation.  If the dead do go directly to heaven, the better lesson in the story is that death is our friend.  I think the story clearly makes the opposite point.

Quote from: "elliebean"In answer to the zombies coming back from heaven, though: adherents to that particular apocryphal mythology don't believe they will go to heaven or hell until after "The Judgement"; prior to that they just lie around dead, like the rest of us.

Not my understanding at all.  Speak to most any Christian and he/she will acknowledge to you that they do go to heaven.  Primarily because the Judgment of the saved happens at the point of accepting Christ.

Quote from: "AnimatedDirt"

Quote from: "elliebean"In answer to the zombies coming back from heaven, though: adherents to that particular apocryphal mythology don't believe they will go to heaven or hell until after "The Judgement"; prior to that they just lie around dead, like the rest of us.

Not my understanding at all.  Speak to most any Christian and he/she will acknowledge to you that they do go to heaven.  Primarily because the Judgment of the saved happens at the point of accepting Christ.

Some Christians believe differently. I used to be one of them. Those who taught me when I was growing up pretty well fit my characterization of them as making shit up as they go along. Not that I don't see all possible interpretations of "End Times" prophecy as ultimately in the same category of incredibility. We might just as well debate the comparative authenticity of various Star Trek fan fiction, as far as I'm concerned.

I think it should be pointed out that it's actually a minority of Christian denominations which hold to any version of the  Rapture doctrine (apparently there are a few different versions).  The Catholics don't subscribe, neither do any of the Orthodox (I'm pretty sure), nor do Unitarians, UCC, United Methodists, Episcopalians, Presbyterians, Quakers, Lutherans, Northern Baptists, American Baptists or Congregationalists.  You're most likely to find the Rapture tommyrot in Pentecostal, Southern Baptist, "Bible Church," Assembly of God, and (not all) Evangelical churches.  This isn't an exhaustive list; I'm just saying that in no way is the Rapture (which is a relatively recent idea) a belief common to all Christians.

Quote from: "LegendarySandwich"That seems like a good way to make money off of [strike:2c4ryb5b]Christians saps[/strike:2c4ryb5b] concerned Christian pet owners while still being charitable to those poor animals left behind if the slightest chance in Hell comes true and the Rapture is a real event that will come to take place.

I've always wanted to start a Rapture insurance company. For a mere $1 per month, you will have an insurance policy which will be paid out upon your "disappearance confirmed to be Rapture related" to your remaining family members or friends or whoever you wish to leave it too. They will get $250,000.

The problem is, I think, that you have to have at least the amount of money you underwrite the policy for.

But... $1 a month... I'm pretty sure I could eventually get 5,000 people to pay me $1 a month, and I'd never have to work again, nor would I have to have any risk of paying out a quarter mil to anyone. Sounds foolproof to me.

Anyone know the actual insurance laws?

Quote from: "joeactor"Oh... you guys will love this site:

http://www.raptureletters.com/ (http://www.raptureletters.com/)

Quote from: "Sophus"Any connection to Eternal Earthbound Pets (http://eternal-earthbound-pets.com/Home_Page.html)?

LOL...!!  I hadn't read this prior to my last post.  Good ones.

Quote from: "DJAkuma"So how do they trigger that mass email to send? They either have to know when it'll be or leave an unbeliever behind to send it.

I found this explanation here (http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/856509/youve_been_left_behind_rapture_insurance.html).

Quote from: "You've Been Left Behind article"Since this website is run by Christians you may wonder how these email will be sent since the people running it should be gone if "the rapture" takes place. Don't worry they have that all figured out. If three out of the four people who run the website all fail to log in for 6 days straight the emails will be sent out. You really gotta hope these folks don't all take a mountain getaway together for a week. Can you imagine the mass hysteria that would engulf the Christian culture in this country if millions of people suddenly started receiving emails proclaiming "the rapture" had taken place?

Emphasis is mine.

Probably this Rapture Letters site is set up in a similar fashion. The guy that runs Rapture Letters is one of the interviewees in the documentary The God Who Wasn't There (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_God_Who_Wasn%27t_There). He seems like a giant tool.

QuoteThat seems like a good way to make money off of [strike:3hjoea7s]Christians saps[/strike:3hjoea7s]concerned Christian pet owners while still being charitable to those poor animals left behind if the slightest chance in Hell comes true and the Rapture is a real event that will come to take place.

What an excellent business idea!! Man, I wish I woulda thought of that! I wonder if there are any other worthless things out there Christians would be willing to pay for?? Hmmmmm....  

Maybe I can get them to pay me to change their Facebook status to "Taken by God into Heaven" after they get raptured away??

Quote from: "AnimatedDirt"

Quote from: "joeactor"Oh... you guys will love this site:

http://www.raptureletters.com/ (http://www.raptureletters.com/)

Quote from: "Sophus"Any connection to Eternal Earthbound Pets (http://eternal-earthbound-pets.com/Home_Page.html)?

LOL...!!  I hadn't read this prior to my last post.  Good ones.

Your sense of humor is appreciated.  

Quote from: "hismikeness"

Quote from: "DJAkuma"So how do they trigger that mass email to send? They either have to know when it'll be or leave an unbeliever behind to send it.

I found this explanation here (http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/856509/youve_been_left_behind_rapture_insurance.html).

Quote from: "You've Been Left Behind article"Since this website is run by Christians you may wonder how these email will be sent since the people running it should be gone if "the rapture" takes place. Don't worry they have that all figured o

ut. If three out of the four people who run the website all fail to log in for 6 days straight the emails will be sent out. You really gotta hope these folks don't all take a mountain getaway together for a week. Can you imagine the mass hysteria that would engulf the Christian culture in this country if millions of people suddenly started receiving emails proclaiming "the rapture" had taken place?

Emphasis is mine.

Probably this Rapture Letters site is set up in a similar fashion. The guy that runs Rapture Letters is one of the interviewees in the documentary The God Who Wasn't There (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_God_Who_Wasn%27t_There). He seems like a giant tool.

Ok, that makes sense, pretty brilliant idea getting superstitious people to pay for that.