Happy Atheist Forum

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... =132766402 (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=132766402)

Wait, you mean atheists kill people too? No way!  

He couldn't have been a 'True Atheist' then.  

Quote from: "Velma"He couldn't have been a 'True Atheist' then.  

Yeah. I bet he really did believe in God.

Wait. All atheists really believe in God (the True God), according to Voter. Hm...

Quote from: "LegendarySandwich"

Quote from: "Velma"He couldn't have been a 'True Atheist' then.   :crazy:

Quote from: "Voter"http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=132766402

What's your point?

There is no reason to connect his being an atheist (someone who doesn't believe in god...no dogma attached) with his reasons for doing such a horrible thing (assuming he had a coherent reason, which I doubt).  

It's not like he was a christian who shot a gay rights activist...then you could draw a connection.

Jared Loughner was also a brunette, so your thread title could have just as easily read: "Brunette kills people".

Quote from: "Will"Jared Loughner was also a brunette, so your thread title could have just as easily read: "Brunette kills people".

If that's really you in your avatar, your hair looks pretty brown...

Quote from: "Will"Jared Loughner was also a brunette, so your thread title could have just as easily read: "Brunette kills people".

I heard an interview with his mother.  Loughner is schizophrenic*.  Given his age (22) his family was pretty much powerless to make sure he took his medication and got the other help he needed.  From what his mother was saying, he apparently thinks he's in another psychiatric hospital.  

*Most schizophrenics are more a danger to themselves than others.  You only hear about that less than 1% who are dangerous to others.

Quote from: "Velma"

Quote from: "Will"Jared Loughner was also a brunette, so your thread title could have just as easily read: "Brunette kills people".

I heard an interview with his mother.  Loughner is schizophrenic*.  Given his age (22) his family was pretty much powerless to make sure he took his medication and got the other help he needed.  From what his mother was saying, he apparently thinks he's in another psychiatric hospital.  

*Most schizophrenics are more a danger to themselves than others.  You only hear about that less than 1% who are dangerous to others.

Clearly, though, it was his atheism that made him commit these heinous acts. You can't argue with that.

Quote from: "Whitney"What's your point?

+1

Do you even have one, Voter?  Is this a simple-minded, "The murdering madman was an atheist, nyah nyah," with no other content?

How about, "White person kills people?"

"Drunkard kills people."

"One-time community college student kills people."

So on and so forth.  From reading the incoherent rants posted on youtube, I saw on the very day the shootings occurred that there was a possibility that Loughner was anti-God.  I mentioned in a thread here that it wouldn't surprise me to see this taken up by anti-atheism propagandists. If you think that posting a link to a story which mentions Loughner's alleged atheism is scoring points in some way, you have another think coming.  To me this looks like a feeble attempt to denigrate atheism based on the actions of a deranged individual.  As such, it says more about you than it does about atheism.  I'd appreciate it if you proved my conjecture about your motivation for posting the link wrong.

Let me restate this...

Voter, if you do not tell us your point (and have one that isn't trollish) by tomorrow I'm going to give you a warning for trolling.  You've been logged in and posting since all of our replies to this thread so there really is no excuse for ignoring the topic.

Or, you could apologize for making such a stupid post and that would be fine too.

(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F25.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_lezp4rFSAj1qdmsaho1_500.jpg&hash=4e35ac06c8ed8a932c0242f19e007d415f9f0679)

Quote from: "Whitney"Let me restate this...

Voter, if you do not tell us your point (and have one that isn't trollish) by tomorrow I'm going to give you a warning for trolling.  You've been logged in and posting since all of our replies to this thread so there really is no excuse for ignoring the topic.

Or, you could apologize for making such a stupid post and that would be fine too.

The article linked regards his nihilism. While atheism and nihilism are not synonymous, there can certainly be a connection.
http://atheism.about.com/od/nihilismnih ... theism.htm (http://atheism.about.com/od/nihilismnihilists/a/atheism.htm)
And, in all fairness, some atheists do abandon those positions. Most atheists (in the West, at least) tend to be materialists of one sort or another, not believing in any non-material or supernatural realm. Atheists are also generally ethical relativists, adopting one form or another of ethical nihilism. And, finally, there are plenty of atheistic existentialists who believe that human life is objectively meaningless.

Voter has received a one week ban for continued trolling, after his warning.

Why hasn't this thread got a poll?
Anyway no I haven't killed people.
People is plural right?

No I haven't killed a singular person either.
Some fish, and a few mice, but they smell really bad.

Quote from: "Velma"He couldn't have been a 'True Atheist' then.   :)

Quote from: "The Magic Pudding"Some fish, and a few mice, but they smell really bad.

:(

Quote from: "Asmodean"

Quote from: "The Magic Pudding"Some fish, and a few mice, but they smell really bad.

:(

Remove box from shed containing mice to middle of yard.
Curse dog for scaring off kookaburras who could have been of help.
Overturn box grab shovel and whack smelly uninvited mice.
I don't think I can adequately describe the thrill of the chase, under the trampoline and the diving squash.

Quote from: "McQ"Voter has received a one week ban for continued trolling, after his warning.

(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg710.imageshack.us%2Fimg710%2F9922%2Frimshot.gif&hash=77d5ac078a921ed7ff6be629eed7a4f2ac98bb10)

Quote from: "Voter"

Quote from: "Whitney"Let me restate this...

Voter, if you do not tell us your point (and have one that isn't trollish) by tomorrow I'm going to give you a warning for trolling.  You've been logged in and posting since all of our replies to this thread so there really is no excuse for ignoring the topic.

Or, you could apologize for making such a stupid post and that would be fine too.

The article linked regards his nihilism. While atheism and nihilism are not synonymous, there can certainly be a connection.
http://atheism.about.com/od/nihilismnih ... theism.htm (http://atheism.about.com/od/nihilismnihilists/a/atheism.htm)
And, in all fairness, some atheists do abandon those positions. Most atheists (in the West, at least) tend to be materialists of one sort or another, not believing in any non-material or supernatural realm. Atheists are also generally ethical relativists, adopting one form or another of ethical nihilism. And, finally, there are plenty of atheistic existentialists who believe that human life is objectively meaningless.

Oh, ok. So don't worry everyone. He's only calling me a mass murderer.

Quote from: "The Magic Pudding"Remove box from shed containing mice to middle of yard.
Curse dog for scaring off kookaburras who could have been of help.
Overturn box grab shovel and whack smelly uninvited mice.
I don't think I can adequately describe the thrill of the chase, under the trampoline and the diving squash.

My rats and I ought to call a blood feud on you.  :rant: .

I don't want hurt anyone's feelings.
But I looked up the RichardDawkin's forum.

I saw a thread about an event in Morocco where a Mosque collapsed and 36 people lost their lives. (I don't know why it had to do with religion)
For some reason this event was posted on the forum, since it was a Mosque and not a Research center on evolution.
To use this tragedy once again and to blame religion for that.


Couple of them even commented 'well if it happens again, you'll have 72 virings in heaven lol!'

I guess Voter did the same to show this... (He gets banned for it... ) . Mutual understanding is important.
People post here news articles about mothers killing their children because of religion.
Thousands of tragedy's like these happen all over the world, no direct relation with religion.

And for some reason people post certain news here to confirm their beliefs, everyone is like:


'SEE!! SEE!! RELIGION IS BAADDDDDD!!!! BADDD PEOPLE, BAAADD PEOPLE!!!'

This is what I constantly hear from Atheists, that we are fools, stupid, dumb and what not...every problem on the world
is because of religion. Voter  opened on one point..and well he didn't get a chance to get a second. A bann he didn't deserve.


Something I didn't expect from people who claim that they are open-minded.

Jared Loughner is mentally ill and belief in government conspiracies was part of that illness.  According to his mother, he thinks he's in another mental hospital - that's how out of touch with reality he is.

Quote from: "iSok"I saw a thread about an event in Morocco where a Mosque collapsed and 36 people lost their lives. (I don't know why it had to do with religion)
For some reason this event was posted on the forum, since it was a Mosque and not a Research center on evolution.
To use this tragedy once again and to blame religion for that.

So, because it was a slightly religious event in nature, and it was posted on an atheist forum, they must have thought that religion had to do with it?

QuoteCouple of them even commented 'well if it happens again, you'll have 72 virings in heaven lol!'

I guess Voter did the same to show this... (He gets banned for it... ) . Mutual understanding is important.
People post here news articles about mothers killing their children because of religion.
Thousands of tragedy's like these happen all over the world, no direct relation with religion.

And for some reason people post certain news here to confirm their beliefs, everyone is like:


'SEE!! SEE!! RELIGION IS BAADDDDDD!!!! BADDD PEOPLE, BAAADD PEOPLE!!!'


Something I didn't expect from people who claim that they are open-minded.

Most "bad things" that people do have no direct relation to religion, even if it has to do with religion. But religions are ideologies, and that mean they can influence people to do "bad things".

For example, a lot of what is contributing to the hate of gays in America is religion. Yes, gay bigotry would exist without religion (probably), but there's no denying that religion is a significant factor.

What happened, has happened.
Let it rest.

Quote from: "iSok"I don't want hurt anyone's feelings.
But I looked up the RichardDawkin's forum.

I saw a thread about an event in Morocco where a Mosque collapsed and 36 people lost their lives. (I don't know why it had to do with religion)
For some reason this event was posted on the forum, since it was a Mosque and not a Research center on evolution.
To use this tragedy once again and to blame religion for that.

I know you're busy, iSok, but would you mind posting a link to this thread when you have a chance?  It's all very well to assert that the members of a forum were blaming religion for the tragic collapse of a mosque, but it's much better to provide the evidence which convinced you that is what they were doing.

Quote from: "iSok"I guess Voter did the same to show this... (He gets banned for it... ) . Mutual understanding is important.
People post here news articles about mothers killing their children because of religion.
Thousands of tragedy's like these happen all over the world, no direct relation with religion.

Voter was asked repeatedly to clarify what he/she meant by posting the link.  When a reply finally came, it really didn't do that, but was again left rather vague.  The thread title is about the best clue, and even that says very little, but the implication seems to be that, "This is what atheism does; it makes people murderers!"  There is absolutely no evidence that Loughner was motivated by atheism to kill people.  If you think there is, then please post it.  On the other hand there is abundant evidence that religion can serve as a motivation for people to kill other people.  You say that there is "no direct relation with religion," but the evidence doesn't back up that position.  I'm surprised that an intelligent person such as yourself could really believe that there's no direct relation between religion and religiously motivated killings.
 

Quote from: "iSok"This is what I constantly hear from Atheists, that we are fools, stupid, dumb and what not...every problem on the world is because of religion. Voter  opened on one point..and well he didn't get a chance to get a second. A bann he didn't deserve.


Something I didn't expect from people who claim that they are open-minded.

Voter did get a chance to clear up the meaning of the OP, and basically ignored that chance. (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=6653&start=0#p99874)  I think that the one week ban was well deserved.  What have you read in this thread that makes you think that Voter was doing anything more than trolling?  Did he or she make an attempt to engage in a discussion, or simply start a thread with an accusatory title, then add another vaguely accusatory post when asked to clarify?  Your defense of Voter is feeble, and your assertion that atheists blame all the problems in the world on religion is ridiculous.  Finally, your remark about a lack of open-mindedness isn't justified by anything that has occurred in this thread.

Here's the link Recusant.

http://forum.richarddawkins.net/viewtop ... 3&t=110075 (http://forum.richarddawkins.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=110075)


Like I said, let it rest.

Quote from: "iSok"Here's the link Recusant.

http://forum.richarddawkins.net/viewtop ... 3&t=110075 (http://forum.richarddawkins.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=110075)

No one in that thread ever says or even implies that their religion was the reason that the building collapsed.

QuoteLike I said, let it rest.

...? Did you expect to make a post and then us not respond to it?

Quote from: "iSok"[spoiler:8ldz18ko]I don't want hurt anyone's feelings.
But I looked up the RichardDawkin's forum.

I saw a thread about an event in Morocco where a Mosque collapsed and 36 people lost their lives. (I don't know why it had to do with religion)
For some reason this event was posted on the forum, since it was a Mosque and not a Research center on evolution.
To use this tragedy once again and to blame religion for that.


Couple of them even commented 'well if it happens again, you'll have 72 virings in heaven lol!'

I guess Voter did the same to show this... (He gets banned for it... ) . Mutual understanding is important.
People post here news articles about mothers killing their children because of religion.
Thousands of tragedy's like these happen all over the world, no direct relation with religion.

And for some reason people post certain news here to confirm their beliefs, everyone is like:


'SEE!! SEE!! RELIGION IS BAADDDDDD!!!! BADDD PEOPLE, BAAADD PEOPLE!!!'

This is what I constantly hear from Atheists, that we are fools, stupid, dumb and what not...every problem on the world
is because of religion. Voter  opened on one point..and well he didn't get a chance to get a second. A bann he didn't deserve.


Something I didn't expect from people who claim that they are open-minded.[/spoiler:8ldz18ko]

I know you already said let it rest, but I think you should also note that that forum was run by different people than this forum. The kind of things that atheists were allowed to do there would not be allowed here. I've only been on this forum for a short while, but I have seen atheists warned and even banned for preaching, trolling and other things on this forum.

To say that something was allowed on a different forum but a person got banned on this forum is like lumping all "atheist" forums together. If this forum had control over that other forum then it would be fair to say that someone here got banned for the same thing that was allowed there, however because they don't, then it's just a bad comparison.

Quote from: "iSok"....
But I looked up the RichardDawkin's forum.

This is what I constantly hear from Atheists, that we are fools, stupid, dumb and what not...every problem on the world
is because of religion. Voter  opened on one point..and well he didn't get a chance to get a second. A bann he didn't deserve.

Something I didn't expect from people who claim that they are open-minded.

iSok, I suggest you take a look at this forum's rules, and also take a good look at what we allow and don't allow. Your strawman of accusing us, and in this case, me, of being closed-minded doesn't fly. Voter was banned for exactly what he was warned about. It is a one week ban, not permanent. He deserved it. If you have a problem with that, read the rules, as I mentioned.

This is not the now defunct Richard Dawkins forum. It never was. To compare the two isn't practical, nor does it support your assertion.

And don't think for one minute that you can make a post like this one, and then decide to say, let it rest, as if you didn't write it. If you're going to make an accusation of me or any moderator, in the open forum, of unjust conduct, then you had better damn well be ready to go a few rounds with me. Clear?

To avoid derailing this thread any further than it already has been, I started a different thread (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6692) to discuss what was said on the RDF forum.  Feel free to join that thread, iSok, or don't, it's up to you.

I'll add, iSok, that we have been more than lenient with your posts here as I could have justifiably banned you under both the no preaching and civility rules by now because you have repeatedly make unjust remarks regarding atheists even after being corrected and have posted mounds of koran verses as "evidence."

So, I dont' think I'd complain much about moderation here if I were you.

Voter was also given a long time to reel in his rope before he hanged himself with it....he was allowed on more than one occasion to get away with calling obviously non-troll posters trolls (for instance).

I think it is sad that neither of you (iSok or Voter; he emailed me) understand why he was banned....it wasn't just atheists who thought he needed a time out.

Quote from: "Sophus"(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F25.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_lezp4rFSAj1qdmsaho1_500.jpg&hash=4e35ac06c8ed8a932c0242f19e007d415f9f0679)

 :hail: