Happy Atheist Forum

If certain Christian groups promote their bigotry towards the gay community with slogans like "God Hates Fa*gs". Isn't it reasonable to twist that around and give them a taste of their own medicine?

(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsphotos.ak.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-ak-snc4%2Fhs184.snc4%2F37527_124134754298141_100001048513046_141592_1177228_n.jpg&hash=1c70a7a8b485be76c391b1a0465275eeb8b01864)


I know you can't hate whats not there, its more about the underlining message than anything else.

Thoughts?

Not all Gays hate God so the banner is putting words into peoples mouths that they themselves would not say. One can put any words one likes into the mouth of a myth.

So far 3 posts, 3 threads and two of those about homosexuality, am I seeing a trend here  

Quote from: "Tank"So far 3 posts, 3 threads and two of those about homosexuality, am I seeing a trend here  

I intend to post questions on other topics, this is what interests me at the moment. While many gay persons believe in god, I personally think the concept of that is ludicrous. Leviticus really sums it all up.

Fighting fire with fire won't work, especially in cases like this. Saying "Gays hate God" to them is essentially confirming what they already think and would likely backfire. Besides, even though most of my LGBT friends are Pagan, I'm sure there are LGBT liberal Christians.

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

Quote from: "Tank"So far 3 posts, 3 threads and two of those about homosexuality, am I seeing a trend here  

I intend to post questions on other topics, this is what interests me at the moment.

Thank goodness you were looking perilously close to being an agenda troll!

Quote from: "Keithzworld"While many gay persons believe in god, I personally think the concept of that is ludicrous. Leviticus really sums it all up.

Too much variation in humanity, if something can be believed then somebody will believe it, a sort of rule 34 for belief. I'm sure your banner suggestion has appeared in some form or another at some point, but to what end? Is it intended to 'change hearts and minds', simply make an 'out group' statement (argument for the sake of argument) or just piss people off?

Why is homosexuality a Hot Button topic for you at the moment, no issue, just curious.

Gays are already reviled by many Christians, but this will only harden the positions even further.  How could this possibly add to the acceptance of gays into mainstream society?

You'll get more flies with honey than vinegar.

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"Gays are already reviled by many Christians, but this will only harden the positions even further.  How could this possibly add to the acceptance of gays into mainstream society?

I suppose its an intentional slap in Christianity's face (well the homophobic ones at least). Its saying: "ok you say god hates gays, well the feeling mutual". Its taking power away from their hateful slogan.

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"Gays are already reviled by many Christians, but this will only harden the positions even further.  How could this possibly add to the acceptance of gays into mainstream society?

I suppose its an intentional slap in Christianity's face (well the homophobic ones at least). Its saying: "ok you say god hates gays, well the feeling mutual". Its taking power away from their hateful slogan.

Why do you think this?

QuoteI'm sure your banner suggestion has appeared in some form or another at some point, but to what end? Is it intended to 'change hearts and minds', simply make an 'out group' statement (argument for the sake of argument) or just piss people off?

Why is homosexuality a Hot Button topic for you at the moment, no issue, just curious.

The point of this statement or "phrase" if you will, is to put the fundamental Christians in the shoes of the victim, and to make an example of them. So they can perhaps begin to understand how self righteous they really are. It would be nice if it did change the hearts and minds of some people, mostly I just want them to think about their justification for homophobia and experience what discriminated homosexuals have experienced. I don't intend to piss people off, probably will as the religious mind is too egotistical for its own good, too prideful.

Homosexuality is not a hot topic at all. I just firstly explain that I am gay myself, so I know what sort of discrimination goes on at least in my part of the world. But ultimately its just something I wanted to discuss and hear peoples thoughts on. I have the same approach to this topic as I would to any other.

QuoteWhy do you think this?

[/quote]

I just feel me saying "Gays Hate God", that in itself makes their homophobic phrase meaningless. It doesn't matter if they look at me in a negative way, because they are just scum to me and they need to know that.

Aside from the objections listed above, it's bad PR.  Also, what happens if this motto gets the living shit beaten out of a gay theist?

Finally, you realize that the WBC is a tiny sect that is not representative of American protestantism, right?  In your effort to pay them back in their own coin, you would certainly alienate the mainstream which does not at all share this belief.

It is a bad idea, all the way around.

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

QuoteI'm sure your banner suggestion has appeared in some form or another at some point, but to what end? Is it intended to 'change hearts and minds', simply make an 'out group' statement (argument for the sake of argument) or just piss people off?

Why is homosexuality a Hot Button topic for you at the moment, no issue, just curious.

The point of this statement or "phrase" if you will, is to put the fundamental Christians in the shoes of the victim, and to make an example of them. So they can perhaps begin to understand how self righteous they really are. It would be nice if it did change the hearts and minds of some people, mostly I just want them to think about their justification for homophobia and experience what discriminated homosexuals have experienced. I don't intend to piss people off, probably will as the religious mind is too egotistical for its own good, too prideful.

Homosexuality is not a hot topic at all. I just firstly explain that I am gay myself, so I know what sort of discrimination goes on at least in my part of the world. But ultimately its just something I wanted to discuss and hear peoples thoughts on. I have the same approach to this topic as I would to any other.

Understood, just finding out about you  :hmm:  If so your retort would bounce off like peas on tank armour. How about God [strike:1t2ieqbc]hates[/strike:1t2ieqbc] loves Gays! It'll keep the moderates on side and really annoy the fundies, while retaining a sense of humour?

I think fighting back against people like the Westboro crowd is best done by making fun of them, not emulating them.  If you were to hold a sign that said 'Gays Hate God' in front of the Phelps, I imagine they would happily agree and go about their business.

Quote from: "pinkocommie"I think fighting back against people like the Westboro crowd is best done by making fun of them, not emulating them.  If you were to hold a sign that said 'Gays Hate God' in front of the Phelps, I imagine they would happily agree and go about their business.

It would be much better to hold a sign like, 'Gays love Fred Phelps, he's just in denial of his love of Pink!' or 'Give us a blow job Fred!' or 'Fancy a Righteous Fisting Freddy Baby!', 'Gays love Fred Phelps!'

I am an agenda troll:  I HATE RELIGION....  

Quote from: "Martin TK"I am an agenda troll:  I HATE RELIGION....  

Are you actually talking about yourself or are you trying to make an implication about myself. My only agenda is honesty and voicing my opinion.

Quote from: "Martin TK"I am an agenda troll:  I HATE RELIGION....  :yay:

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

Quote from: "Martin TK"I am an agenda troll:  I HATE RELIGION....  lol

I think this post was my best insult here, I did get a deserving rap across the knuckles for it, but it was worth the pain  
viewtopic.php?p=72106#p72106 (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=72106#p72106)

Quote from: "Tank"Calm down, he was talking about himself, Martin is....   shall we say.... a tad..... single minded!  

understood, thanks

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

Quote from: "Tank"Calm down, he was talking about himself, Martin is....   shall we say.... a tad..... single minded!  :D

GAYS HATE GOD! That would do more harm than good.  Frankly, It's every bit as offensive as saying God Hates Fags.  The only reason that 'God Hates Fags' is so bad (despite thee fact that god isn't real) is the connotation of being rejected by the universal concept of love. It's an alienating idea when you think about it. So wouldn't the slogan 'Gays Hate God' have the same alienating affect?

The Gay Atheist community isn't large enough for that slogan to have much support. Not all Gay folk would want to be represented as hating god. And the God Folk would have a field day with this: "Gays hate god!?! Well now we hate them even more! Let's destroy those Heathen fags before Jesus gets pissed and kills us all!" It's just the beginning of a flame war, which no one really wants to be a part of.

Bad slogan, bad idea. Try fighting back with messages of Tolerance. You cannot drive darkness with darkness, you need light for that. You cannot drive hate with hate, you need love for that.

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

QuoteWhy do you think this?

I just feel me saying "Gays Hate God", that in itself makes their homophobic phrase meaningless. It doesn't matter if they look at me in a negative way, because they are just scum to me and they need to know that.

The WBC is a bunch of idiots/lunatics who have been brainwashed beyond repair....wouldn't it be more effective to simply ignore them?  Their power comes from their media attention and if we all ignored them they'd just go away.

Quote from: "Whitney"

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

QuoteWhy do you think this?

I just feel me saying "Gays Hate God", that in itself makes their homophobic phrase meaningless. It doesn't matter if they look at me in a negative way, because they are just scum to me and they need to know that.

The WBC is a bunch of idiots/lunatics who have been brainwashed beyond repair....wouldn't it be more effective to simply ignore them?  Their power comes from their media attention and if we all ignored them they'd just go away.

Do you really think they'd go away? I'm not so sure, they live in their own little world by the looks of it from my side of the pond.

Quote from: "Tank"Do you really think they'd go away? I'm not so sure, they live in their own little world by the looks of it from my side of the pond.

They might not close shop but they wouldn't be able to spread their hate across the country in an instant or get free advertisement for their church anymore.

Quote from: "Whitney"

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

QuoteWhy do you think this?

I just feel me saying "Gays Hate God", that in itself makes their homophobic phrase meaningless. It doesn't matter if they look at me in a negative way, because they are just scum to me and they need to know that.

The WBC is a bunch of idiots/lunatics who have been brainwashed beyond repair....wouldn't it be more effective to simply ignore them?  Their power comes from their media attention and if we all ignored them they'd just go away.

I think of the Westboro Baptist Church as the Christian Al-Qaeda. Granted, their not blowing things up at nearly the same rate, but from a psychological standpoint, they are incredibly similar.

A hundred or so Family members got together and decided...

~ All other religions are an abomination
~ God hates Humanity for its 'infidelity'
~ We all need to conform to their holy book, or BURN IN HELL
~ They have a sacred mission to reform the world
~ They use this mission to justify acts of pure hate

They draw confused and pissed off people to them, and convince them that their own hate filled distortions of scripture are the correct interpretation. This is what happens when people completely abandon reason in favor of scripture.  Most religious people don't do that: they are able to use reason to determine that stoning people to death is wrong, even though it's in the bible.  Not these people: It's in the bible, it must be right, and society is evil for not conforming to this.  The Westboro Baptist Church is 1 major terror attack away from becoming the exact same fucking thing as Al Qaeda (except in Christian form). I hate those sick, evil, demented, EVIL motherfuckers.

I find this to be just as offensive as the original.

Quote from: "Tank"

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

Quote from: "Martin TK"I am an agenda troll:  I HATE RELIGION....  lol

I am not so single minded, I can be flexible... I hate religion, I hate religious dogma, I love my wife (who happens to hate religion, too)

Quote from: "Whitney"

Quote from: "Keithzworld"

QuoteWhy do you think this?

I just feel me saying "Gays Hate God", that in itself makes their homophobic phrase meaningless. It doesn't matter if they look at me in a negative way, because they are just scum to me and they need to know that.

The WBC is a bunch of idiots/lunatics who have been brainwashed beyond repair....wouldn't it be more effective to simply ignore them?  Their power comes from their media attention and if we all ignored them they'd just go away.

They won't just go away, with or without being ignored, because they have severe dogma.  But, seriously, there will always be those idiots who will buy into their brand of "religion" and hate.  I know I knock religion a lot on here, but the truth is I know a lot of good religious people, they are good inspite of their religious views, however.

The WBC are trolls, pure and simple.  Ignoring them is the best answer, imo.

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"The WBC are trolls, pure and simple.  Ignoring them is the best answer, imo.

Too bad we can't ban them from the world.

Quote from: "Whitney"

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"The WBC are trolls, pure and simple.  Ignoring them is the best answer, imo.

Too bad we can't ban them from the world.

Actually, it's good to have them around.  They remind the moderate theists what they might become if they buy too deeply into the nonsense.  Plus, they're great ammunition in online debates.  

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"The WBC are trolls, pure and simple.  Ignoring them is the best answer, imo.

That's a good way of looking at them, I don't think it will stop them due to the dogma issue pointed out by Martin, however it would marginalise their impact.

Quote from: "Whitney"

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"The WBC are trolls, pure and simple.  Ignoring them is the best answer, imo.

Too bad we can't ban them from the world.

Wouldn't it be amazing if one could wield a literal ban hammer?  Authority and Fun all wrapped into one beating instrument!

Quote from: "LoneMateria"

Quote from: "Whitney"

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"The WBC are trolls, pure and simple.  Ignoring them is the best answer, imo.

Too bad we can't ban them from the world.

Wouldn't it be amazing if one could wield a literal ban hammer?  Authority and Fun all wrapped into one beating instrument!

The Inquisition would be proud of us  

Quote from: "Tank"

Quote from: "LoneMateria"Wouldn't it be amazing if one could wield a literal ban hammer?  Authority and Fun all wrapped into one beating instrument!

The Inquisition would be proud of us  

A pungent fragrance, with overtones of lilac and irony.

Quote from: "Keithzworld"If certain Christian groups promote their bigotry towards the gay community with slogans like "God Hates Fa*gs". Isn't it reasonable to twist that around and give them a taste of their own medicine?

(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsphotos.ak.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-ak-snc4%2Fhs184.snc4%2F37527_124134754298141_100001048513046_141592_1177228_n.jpg&hash=1c70a7a8b485be76c391b1a0465275eeb8b01864)


I know you can't hate whats not there, its more about the underlining message than anything else.

Thoughts?

I can only imagine what I would be like if I was gay, given my already boiling contempt for religion.

Fact is, religions are scams to separate fools from their money. Fags are not as good for business as breeders because they don't create as many donors when the collection plate gets passed around. Ditto for the church's attitude towards condoms. Doesn't matter how much misery these doctrines create. It's all about the cash.