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I am wanting educated opinions on if there is any validity to hypnosis and its ability to cause changes in people.  Does it classify as a valid science, is it pseudoscience, or is it just bs?  My husband calls it brainwashing...I can see why he calls it that...but it would be brainwashing by choice if the suggestions were what you wanted.  Along these same lines, is there any benefit to self hypnosis?

I've found it difficult to get much of a straight answer researching online.  I have found some self-hypnosis recordings beneficial for help falling asleep...but that might just be because they sound soothing.  So, it has gotten me curious about what they really can and can't do.

Hey Whit,

I'd put it into the psychology arena (is that science?)

I've been through "Guided Imagery", "Biofeedback", and "Hypnosis".
There are quite a few parallels between the three.

All require the subject's cooperation.

Biofeedback gave me the most tangible results (got me off of meds for IBS).
It's also the one with the most potential for being studied scientifically.
The others have helped me with career focus, and relaxation.

In the end, they're just tools.  What works for me may not for someone else.

YMMV,
JoeActor

I've never been hypnotized, but I know people who have. It's a completely voluntary thing. There's absolutely nothing you won't do after hypnosis that you wouldn't do before. So, I look at it like... being drunk. A hypnotized person's actions are just those an unhyptonized person would still do, just maybe lacks the willpower or drive to do.

Aside from that, who knows.  

(So, yeah, I'm with Joe.)

Quote from: "curiosityandthecat"I've never been hypnotized

You know what?  I don't believe you.

It might be better to say you've never been formally hypnotized by a "professional."
All hypnosis is self hypnosis.

The easiest form of hypnosis for me to obtain is intense focus.  While reading I usually selectively ignore all input except what for the story.  If I am injured, the pain goes away for a while.  If someone tries to tell me something, I probably won't hear them.  I'll also perceive time in a similar manner to sleep.  This also happens to me when I perform repetitive tasks, such as whittling.  I can get complacent, and end up cutting myself.

You can use this as a gateway to increased suggestibility.

According to this (http://www.trans4mind.com/spiritual/brainwashing.htm) article, many church leaders are also hypnotists.  The suggestions they give are, of course, spiritual in nature (for example, "you're going to hell!").

Conversion, as described in the article, isn't quite the same as regular hypnosis, though.  It's more like systematically breaking people down.  So yeah, these last two paragraphs are pretty off-topic.

Quote from: "Heretical Rants"

Quote from: "curiosityandthecat"I've never been hypnotized

You know what?  I don't believe you.

It might be better to say you've never been formally hypnotized by a "professional."
All hypnosis is self hypnosis.

The easiest form of hypnosis for me to obtain is intense focus.  While reading I usually selectively ignore all input except what for the story.  If I am injured, the pain goes away for a while.  If someone tries to tell me something, I probably won't hear them.  I'll also perceive time in a similar manner to sleep.  This also happens to me when I perform repetitive tasks, such as whittling.  I can get complacent, and end up cutting myself.

Very well put. If you've ever cut the grass, or been to the cinema you have probably been hypnotized.

There's something called Neuro Linguistic Programming (NLP) that can influence very minor behaviors and immediate decisions. What studies have been done have concluded that there is little to no substantial evidence that NLP can create drastic long term changes in an individual. There's a mentalist named Derren Brown who uses NLP and simple magic tricks to get people to behave in strange ways. You can find some of his stuff on youtube. He's amazing, a total skeptic, a debunker, an atheist and an incredible entertainer. He explains some of his tricks and it's really revealing about how vulnerable our brains are to even the simplest suggestions. You'd probably like him.

Thank you thiolsulfate! That is absolutely fascinating.  

QuoteDerren Brown

This is my favorite one by him:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-TURhK90_8
I tried it on my dad and it worked.
I think it's really just the same as when you lose things, except instead of setting something down and wandering off, you hand it over without really thinking about it.
Here's the full version:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DR4y5iX4 ... re=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DR4y5iX4uRY&feature=related)

Actually, I like all the ones related to theft:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j25qV5RO-nU
The scary thing is, some real pickpockets actually are that good.

OOO, and the ones that show how unaware most people are:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1aEqBaK3aM

This one is ESPECIALLY funny.

Derren Brown the Seance

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDXQTBUCpYw&feature=fvst (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDXQTBUCpYw&feature=fvst)

There's part one. The rest can be found on Youtube.

It is equal parts scary and hilarious, not the show, however. The show itself is vastly entertaining and the reveals are equally insightful. The scary/funny parts are the call-ins. Nearly every show he does begins with him conceding that everything he does are mind tricks. There is no real breaking the fundamental laws of science or reality but that does not stop people being ridiculous. The original was filmed live and had viewers call in to the show to leave comments about weird things that happen to them while in their home totally separated from the "haunted" building being filmed in.

[spoiler:vl9xesfq]There was a guy who called in and said that he saw his dead mother. I couldn't stop myself from saying, aloud, "oh don't be stupid."[/spoiler:vl9xesfq]

Darren Brown is amazing. If you can find his stuff, you should watch it. It's a wonderful trip into the vulnerability of our minds.

Oh another interesting about Derren Brown's shows is that nothing is unintentional. Everything has a purpose. Every flicker, every gesture is calculated. For me it's fun to figure out what he's getting at before he actually does it. I always watch twice, one to experience it, two to break it down.

Also This:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJ02I6Qy ... &index=17# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJ02I6QyagM&feature=PlayList&p=9B8816C0C355454F&index=17#)

Derren Brown: Messiah

Absolutely fantastic. YOU MUST WATCH THIS!

Quote from: "Heretical Rants"

Quote from: "curiosityandthecat"I've never been hypnotized

You know what?  I don't believe you.

It might be better to say you've never been formally hypnotized by a "professional."

That's what I was referring to.

Quote from: "joeactor"Hey Whit,

I'd put it into the psychology arena (is that science?)

I've been through "Guided Imagery", "Biofeedback", and "Hypnosis".
There are quite a few parallels between the three.

All require the subject's cooperation.

Biofeedback gave me the most tangible results (got me off of meds for IBS).
It's also the one with the most potential for being studied scientifically.
The others have helped me with career focus, and relaxation.

In the end, they're just tools.  What works for me may not for someone else.

YMMV,
JoeActor

So, there must be some science stuff going on in these processes somewhere, right? Surely It is quantifiable by some kind of scientific standard.

I've seen hypnosis done to my sister. It was certainly rather compelling.

Quote from: "karadan"So, there must be some science stuff going on in these processes somewhere, right? Surely It is quantifiable by some kind of scientific standard.

I've seen hypnosis done to my sister. It was certainly rather compelling.

Sure.  Plenty of studies are out there, I'm sure.

It's easier to get consistent results when there are measurable factors.  Biofeedback has a number of documented effects.

I've been able to alter my heart rate, blood pressure, pulse height, body temperature and more.  All while being monitored.

cool stuff,
JoeActor

Quote from: "joeactor"

Quote from: "karadan"So, there must be some science stuff going on in these processes somewhere, right? Surely It is quantifiable by some kind of scientific standard.

I've seen hypnosis done to my sister. It was certainly rather compelling.

I've been able to alter my heart rate, blood pressure, pulse height, body temperature and more.  All while being monitored.

cool stuff,
JoeActor

Are you sure you're human, Joe?  :D

Quote from: "karadan"Are you sure you're human, Joe?  

You'll have to ask the guys in the biolab - I've lost track of the mods...

Further evidence that hypnotic suggestion has tangible results:

 :D

I'd agree that it's psychological so would be a soft science.  I did a session with a therpist in Plano about two Summers ago for smoking cessation and I have to say it really worked.  But, while he was talking me out of smoking and had me all relaxed, watching the aves on a beach, and the "white noise" was playing I still was very aware of my surroundings and at any moment could have sat up, said "this is bunk" and not have had any problem. (Like when people walk around hypnotized until the hypnoist snaps them out of it on tv.)  However, I was hoping it would help, since my addiction to cigarettes is psychlogical why not use something that is psychological to combat it?  So, I was receptive and although I felt silly at first that went away and I laid back and kept an open mind.  Actually after ward I felt as thought I'd had the best nap EVER, even though I never "went to sleep".

Now, I still had to wear the patch for the chemical addiction, and to keep from rapidly swinging into mood filled rages, but truly the desire for a cig went away with the triggers he gave me and I was smoke free for months with no relapse.

Of course, I have a teenage son who provided the perfect excuse for me to jump back on the Marlboro train...I keep meaning to listed to the CD the guy made for me.  I don't because I'm not a willing participant so I think it would be a waste of time at this point.

Quote from: "Whitney"I am wanting educated opinions on if there is any validity to hypnosis and its ability to cause changes in people.

Hey Whitney,

I can give you an educated opinion.  About 10 years ago I studied with a hypnotist to learn what it was all about.  There are many people who will tell you different, but hypnotism is no more or less than a way to reach the subconscious mind more easily.

The reason why this can sometimes help change people is that your subconscious mind to a large extent controls your life, your actions, your thoughts.  I'm not sure if I can explain this as well as I understand it, but, for example, let's say that the entire time you were growing up, your parents always told you that you were worthless, good for nothing, etc.  So then a "proper" use of hypnosis would an attempt to reach your subconscious mind to counteract that.  Because reaching the subconscious mind is a faster way to make changes.

Someone mentioned NLP (Neuro Linguistic Programming) and they are right, this is all pretty much the same thing.

But the idea that hypnotism is somehow magical or that it can make you do things that you don't really want to do is BS.

All of the above based on my experience and training.

Hmm, I suppose a late comment is better than no comment at all.

I've only taken high school psychology, but I do remember the subject a little.

One type of change that can be almost instantaneous is change brought about by the use of hypnosis to remember repressed memories.  Essentially there is a memory you intentionally don't want to think about because it makes you uncomfortable, but without facing the memory many people wind up having destructive personalities.  Hypnosis puts you in a state of ease that allows you to face things you might otherwise not want to.

However the use of reclaiming memories with hypnosis often yields false memories, not necessarily to the fault of hypnosis, but more likely due to the fault of human memory retention.  

I watched a news story once that showed a person who used hypnosis instead of regular numbing agents for his root canal. He didn't make a noise the entire time.  I was shocked.

Thank you for sharing such a nice and informative thoughts and experience here. Hypnosis is a scientifically verified and effective technique that can promote accelerated human change. I have seen lot of improvement and changes in me after trying the Hypnosis. I got the complete information and Hypnotherapy from  thoughtsbecomereality.co.uk.

admin edit:  your post seems like spam so I removed the url.  If it was not intended to advertise the website then be aware that posting a link with promotional text for a site on your first post without any real content is spammish.

Since this thread is brought back to life (and since I only read the spam part) i'm going to point out that Penn and Teller did a Bullshit! episode on Hypnosis (season 2 episode 13).  Check it out if you think it has any remote relation to science.

I think it's a placebo.

Hypnosis helps to make us normal and relieve us from stress, smoking, insomnia, etc. Even though its a brain washing it is good for us. By the way i go more information about the hypnosis from thoughtsbecomereality. I took a good hypnosis treatment from them to quit from smoking. They provide a best treatments and better advice. And they also provide a hypnosis DVD it was very helpful for me. TO get more information about the hypnosis go to thoughtsbecomereality site

squidmin edit: This is the second post with this url from two different accounts.  This is suspect.

Quote from: "Alrick_Benjamin"Hypnosis helps to make us normal and relieve us from stress, smoking, insomnia, etc. Even though its a brain washing it is good for us. By the way i go more information about the hypnosis from thoughtsbecomereality. I took a good hypnosis treatment from them to quit from smoking. They provide a best treatments and better advice. And they also provide a hypnosis DVD it was very helpful for me. TO get more information about the hypnosis go to thoughtsbecomereality site

squidmin edit: This is the second post with this url from two different accounts.  This is suspect.

Somebody obviously didn't watch Penn and Teller's Bullshit! episode.

Quote from: "Alrick_Benjamin"squidmin edit: This is the second post with this url from two different accounts.  This is suspect.

Thanks, IP matches Destin897.

I'm going to assume they are simply spammers and ban both of the accounts.  Alrick_Benjamin and Destin897; if you just happened to both be friends/siblings/spouses or whatever that are simply really excited about the link you posted then you can email me to request access to the forum. admin at happyatheistforum.com