Title: jesus
Post by: athiest12 on February 25, 2009, 05:29:17 PM
Post by: athiest12 on February 25, 2009, 05:29:17 PM
i'm perplexed on the topic of jesus. was he actually the son of god? could he reincarnate himself?
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: Will on February 25, 2009, 09:24:36 PM
Post by: Will on February 25, 2009, 09:24:36 PM
As an agnostic atheist, I must tell you that I've come to the conclusion that if Jesus ever existed, and it's possible that there was no such individual, he was simply a normal human being. There likely isn't a god and even if there were there's no reason to think he/she/it exists due to a complete vacuum of evidence. Do you have any specific concerns regarding Jesus?
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: joeactor on February 25, 2009, 09:31:00 PM
Post by: joeactor on February 25, 2009, 09:31:00 PM
Quote from: "Will"As an agnostic atheist, I must tell you that I've come to the conclusion that if Jesus ever existed, and it's possible that there was no such individual, he was simply a normal human being.
I'd have to agree with that part of your statement. Very little evidence outside of the bible...
Agnostic Theist,
JoeActor
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: Ihateyoumike on February 25, 2009, 10:06:19 PM
Post by: Ihateyoumike on February 25, 2009, 10:06:19 PM
Quote from: "athiest12"i'm perplexed on the topic of jesus. was he actually the son of god? could he reincarnate himself?
Since I'm an atheist, I do not believe in a god. Since I do not believe in a god, I do not believe in the christian god. Since I don't believe in a christian god, I don't believe in jesus as god's son. Did jesus live? I don't care, cause he was just a man if he did.
And no, nobody has ever proven reincarnation possible, so I don't believe that happened either.
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: Kevin on February 25, 2009, 10:29:48 PM
Post by: Kevin on February 25, 2009, 10:29:48 PM
Well, he was a zombie if the story is true.
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: Whitney on February 26, 2009, 12:21:06 AM
Post by: Whitney on February 26, 2009, 12:21:06 AM
If I had reason to believe Jesus was the son of god then I'd be a Chrsitian.
If I had reason to believe Jesus was reincarnated, I'd be spiritual.
I am neither a Christian or spiritual because there is no reason to believe either of the above. Jesus, if he existed, was just like any other glorified spiritual leader who has existed throughout history. Like those leaders, his followers likely expanded on events when preaching their views.
If I had reason to believe Jesus was reincarnated, I'd be spiritual.
I am neither a Christian or spiritual because there is no reason to believe either of the above. Jesus, if he existed, was just like any other glorified spiritual leader who has existed throughout history. Like those leaders, his followers likely expanded on events when preaching their views.
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: athiest12 on February 26, 2009, 02:11:38 PM
Post by: athiest12 on February 26, 2009, 02:11:38 PM
my friend gage keeps telling me that if you doubt jesus then your a sinner. but then he continues to tell me that jesus will save my soul, he is apparently the savior of the human race. 
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: curiosityandthecat on February 26, 2009, 03:04:37 PM
Post by: curiosityandthecat on February 26, 2009, 03:04:37 PM
Quote from: "athiest12"my friend gage keeps telling me that if you doubt jesus then your a sinner. but then he continues to tell me that jesus will save my soul, he is apparently the savior of the human race.
Your friend Gage is a moron.
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: Ihateyoumike on February 26, 2009, 07:23:42 PM
Post by: Ihateyoumike on February 26, 2009, 07:23:42 PM
Quote from: "curiosityandthecat"Quote from: "athiest12"my friend gage keeps telling me that if you doubt jesus then your a sinner. but then he continues to tell me that jesus will save my soul, he is apparently the savior of the human race.
Your friend Gage is a moron.
Seconded.
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: Enoch Root on February 26, 2009, 07:38:21 PM
Post by: Enoch Root on February 26, 2009, 07:38:21 PM
I have no problem believing that a man named Jesus lived in first-century Palestine, had a significant following, and probably taught ideas that at least somewhat resemble what's recorded in the bible. It raises far too many questions to say he didn't exist, chief among them being "Then where did the Christian movement come from?"
But even Christians acknowledge that the New Testament gospels were written decades, almost a century in John's case, after Jesus died. And by then the accounts were so steeped in legend and rumour that I don't think we'll ever have a clear idea of who Jesus was.
What I find particularly funny is the insistence of Christians that we know Jesus rose from the dead because we have eyewitness accounts. A year after he died there were hundreds of people who claimed to have seen Elvis. And that's in a modern, somewhat educated society. It does not surprise me in the least that a bunch of illiterate, uneducated people 2000 years ago living under Roman rule could claim their "Messiah" had risen from the dead, and it does nothing to convince me that the resurrection account is anything other than myth.
But even Christians acknowledge that the New Testament gospels were written decades, almost a century in John's case, after Jesus died. And by then the accounts were so steeped in legend and rumour that I don't think we'll ever have a clear idea of who Jesus was.
What I find particularly funny is the insistence of Christians that we know Jesus rose from the dead because we have eyewitness accounts. A year after he died there were hundreds of people who claimed to have seen Elvis. And that's in a modern, somewhat educated society. It does not surprise me in the least that a bunch of illiterate, uneducated people 2000 years ago living under Roman rule could claim their "Messiah" had risen from the dead, and it does nothing to convince me that the resurrection account is anything other than myth.
Title: Re: jesus
Post by: dr.zalost on February 26, 2009, 10:57:49 PM
Post by: dr.zalost on February 26, 2009, 10:57:49 PM
Quotemy friend gage keeps telling me that if you doubt jesus then your a sinner. but then he continues to tell me that jesus will save my soul, he is apparently the savior of the human race.
Gage isn't much of a friend if he runs around telling people that they're going to hell.
Tell Gage that he could at least be a bit more honest and say he and some others are reading a book that claims everyone who doubts jesus is going to hell.
Then ask if people who doubt Mohammed are going to hell.
When he says no, tell him that there's another book (the koran) out there that says they, the doubters of Mohammed, will go to hell.
When he says that the Koran is worthless, tell him you have no way to distinguish between the value of one holy book verses another. They all make the same claims internally, have the same stupid flaws internally, and have no external (something outside of the holy books) evidence that verifies their claims as far as who's going to end up where.
Will and others are agnostic atheists. This simply means they have no knowledge as to wether or not a god of some sort exists. They choose not to believe because their is no evidence concerning god(s) for a rational person to accept.
I am of the gnostic (having knowledge) type of atheist. The lack of evidence for me constitutes proof that no divine being that meets most classical definitions of god(s) can exist.
Enoch root:
QuoteIt raises far too many questions to say he didn't exist, chief among them being "Then where did the Christian movement come from?
Sure, they existed. According to Josephus there were at least a dozen of them in and around Palestine between 50 B.C. and 50 A.D. The problem with saying that there were a dozen men around Palestine preaching the end of the world and spiritual renewal is the same as saying there were plenty of jesus's running around. If our current "Jesus of faith" is just a compilation of these preachers with some non- christian miracles layered on top, then there could be no "historical" Jesus.