Today is it. The final day of what future historians will surely record as the " End of Times", especially for those of us living in the US, but I also worry about all of you who are on the other side of the wall, and how you will fare during these dark, dystopian years.
Please remember some of us were good and decent, and fought the good fight against tyranny and stupidity. We didn't want Trump or any of this "Make America Great Again Fascism" crap, but maybe this is our time here in the US, similar to Europe during the last century...maybe the only way to clean house is allow the fascists to burn it down, and hope some decency survives.
I also realize I haven't made as many friends here on the forum as I'd had liked, rubbed some of you the wrong way, but I've enjoyed our time together, I was both entertained and educated reading your posts, and enjoyed the ribald exchange of barbs back and forth between us. (Except for Crow)
Be good out there. Be safe. Remember us kindly, and good luck.
Afraid I'm not very optimistic about the future am I, in fact during the holiday break I had a discussion with my daughter, and she told me that I was taking this too far, she told me she was really sad, as it appeared I was giving up hope. I told her that I wasn't going to stop protesting or fighting back against Trump and the Republicans, but rather that I honestly don't think the human race has much chance to survive itself, that the odds are not very good for us all.
We're destroying the planet, making it totally inhospitable, and now have someone in the White House who during a briefing asked more than once,..."Why are nuclear weapons off the table if we have them, why not use them"?
In fact like the great Harry Seldon from the Foundation Series, Math Historians are now predicting Society could collapse during the next decade. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/peter-turchin-cliodynamics-society-collapse_us_586f1e22e4b02b5f85882988)
My son said I was a pessimist for believing the human race would destroy itself, and that for the sake of other life forms possibly should destroy itself.
Quite like what Rust Cohle from True Detective said,
QuoteI think human consciousness is a tragic misstep in evolution. We became too self-aware. Nature created an aspect of nature separate from itself - we are creatures that should not exist by natural law... We are things that labor under the illusion of having a self, that accretion of sensory experience and feelings, programmed with total assurance that we are each somebody, when in fact everybody's nobody... I think the honorable thing for our species to do is to deny our programming. Stop reproducing, walk hand in hand into extinction - one last midnight, brothers and sisters opting out of a raw deal.
Anyway this is the last day, going to go for a long walk in a park nearby at lunch, maybe buy some flowers. Sing a Larry Cohen song to myself.
Well, could be the end of The New York Times!
Just the start of something else for the rest of you, and us to some degree no doubt!
Hari got it wrong in the end - is Trump a Mule as well as being an ass?
I understand Bruno's concerns, but prophesies of the end have, so far, always been wrong. I just take it a day at a time, and I'm finding some meaning in resisting Trump's Wall. I've elected to take on one specific aspect of his agenda, and the prospect of a fight has me pumped up. Something to live for, etc. Don't give up.
You know what, many people felt the same way during the Cold War, and yes, we came uncomfortably close to blowing ourselves to smithereens. But we didn't then. We also fucked up the environment in other ways (ozone, acid rain) but pulled ourselves back from the precipice then too.
This undoubtedly has the chance of being much, much worse. We've never had someone like Trump before and climate change is a much bigger risk than the others were. My guess is that things will be much harder for us over the next 30-40 years, and we might have to build floodwalls in our coastal cities, and there will be casualties from wars and the climate. But I don't think we're fucked. Hell, we survived the fall of Rome, the Dark Ages, the Black Death, two World Wars, and Justin Bieber. Clearly we've got perseverance.
Yeah, I have to convince myself of this too, but firechicklet's going to grow up in this world and I'm not going to give up on it just because we've entered one of those periods where everyone went crazy. It's happened before, and it'll happen again. But there's hope. The Republicans will do a lot of damage, but it'll be because they're attempting to undo the progress the Democrats managed to make over the last 70 years, and they won't be able to go all the way back. There's already backlash against repealing Obamacare and touching Medicare, gay marriage won't go anywhere, and more young people are non-religious than ever before.
And if we are fucked in the end, at least we had our little corner of the internet here to scream about it. Seriously, I come back here when I need to remind myself that there are other people like me who care and are not completely nuts. Thank you for that.
Even though you're distracting me from work :)
Then I read this in the NY Times:
QuoteWASHINGTON — When President-elect Donald J. Trump offered Rick Perry the job of energy secretary five weeks ago, Mr. Perry gladly accepted, believing he was taking on a role as a global ambassador for the American oil and gas industry that he had long championed in his home state.
In the days after, Mr. Perry, the former Texas governor, discovered that he would be no such thing — that in fact, if confirmed by the Senate, he would become the steward of a vast national security complex he knew almost nothing about, caring for the most fearsome weapons on the planet, the United States' nuclear arsenal.
Ok, maybe we're fucked.
Quote from: Firebird on January 19, 2017, 04:56:58 PM
Then I read this in the NY Times:
QuoteWASHINGTON — When President-elect Donald J. Trump offered Rick Perry the job of energy secretary five weeks ago, Mr. Perry gladly accepted, believing he was taking on a role as a global ambassador for the American oil and gas industry that he had long championed in his home state.
In the days after, Mr. Perry, the former Texas governor, discovered that he would be no such thing — that in fact, if confirmed by the Senate, he would become the steward of a vast national security complex he knew almost nothing about, caring for the most fearsome weapons on the planet, the United States' nuclear arsenal.
Ok, maybe we're fucked.
Oh, fucking, dear.
There is no need to fear the inevitable "end of times", it will come no matter what. That's the way it works. Everything eventually ends. Individual lifeforms. Species. Planets. Stars. Galaxies. And even at some point, the universe.
Everything is not going to be alright. Some of our destiny may be twisted a bit but I have high hopes that Mr. T will be drummed out of the corps. He is clearly incompetent, dishonest, and emotionally incapable of fulfilling his duties as POTUS. But so far a lot of citizens still believe that he is actually the key to prosperity and sound government. The numbers are shrinking daily.
Right now DT is in deep shit because of his numerous conflicts of interest. Lord help us if we actually allow that condition to continue.
Here is what worries me. Some loony tune who dislikes the man, and feels that he has been wronged, may take a pot shot at him. I definitely do not want that to happen but it is a real possibility. Over time Trump enterprises has wronged countless small business owners and poor working stiffs. There are people who hate him more than we do.
If T were to be dismissed by impeachment or other means we would still have VP Pence who is a flaming flat earth fundie.
Here is my salute to Bruce, and to Bruno and to all the rest of our HAFers who have some actual powers of reasoning. Hang in there everyone, we will survive. We have to survive because of our obligation to so many little ones like Firechiclet. Tomorrow is not the end of the world, It just feels like it.
Would Trump really be such a bad president, like J.W. Bush was (or worse)?
There are lot of things that I don't like about Trump, but some of his politics would be beneficial.
For example, to invest money in the infrastructure is a very good idea.
Reducing military expenditure is another one.
Having a better relationship with Russia is not so bad either.
What Tom said.
He says things but that doesn't mean he is going to do them. He has been known to contradict himself and lie on multiple occasions. Also, the reasons he's doing these things? Don't seem like anything more than a grasp for power.
Except we don't actually know what any of that entails. Trump just says shit. There's no substance behind it at all. Stating positions means shit when you have no actual plan, and consistently switch positions while lying about it. The plans that he has outlined amount to benefits for the wealthy. There is no reason to believe his comments about infrastructure are not attempts to use businesses he refuses to separate from for his own benefit. There is absolutely no evidence he has idea what he's even talking about as far as infrastructure, given his multiple bankruptcies, gross miscalculations of project costs and timelines, and habit of not actually paying people.
I'm skeptical of how he's going to reduce military expenditures. Especially after the Air Force One bullshit he pulled. And the way vets are already screwed in this country.
And someone needs to define was "better relationship with Russia" means. I don't think we should be antagonizing Russia by any means but, allowing Russian interference into the election, being all cool with a nuclear arms race and ignoring the human rights crises (like LBGTQ) happening? Yeah, no.
I will be thrilled if he is only as bad as Bush Jr.
Quote from: Tom62 on January 20, 2017, 06:51:51 AM
Would Trump really be such a bad president, like J.W. Bush was (or worse)?
There are lot of things that I don't like about Trump, but some of his politics would be beneficial.
For example, to invest money in the infrastructure is a very good idea.
Reducing military expenditure is another one.
Having a better relationship with Russia is not so bad either.
He was on the radio this morning saying he was going build up the armed forces.
I recall hearing something about Trump saying that his speech will be "philosophical" rather than stating policies.
Sounds like he may have no real idea what his own stance is. My guess us that analysis of his speech could end up "zero content"
I cannot see Trump as truly "philosophical"!
It will be a great speech, a tremendous speech. One of the best speeches you've ever heard. Other speeches will tremble in awe from the greatness of this tremendous speech. After all he's the best at speaking; I'll tell you what, in business he speaks a lot. And business will make America great again. We'll do that by being really just super at business until we have the best businesses again...
For like a fucking hour
Quote from: Tom62 on January 20, 2017, 06:51:51 AM
Would Trump really be such a bad president, like J.W. Bush was (or worse)?
There are lot of things that I don't like about Trump, but some of his politics would be beneficial.
For example, to invest money in the infrastructure is a very good idea.
Sure, if it's the government spending directly on infrastructure. That's not what Trump is planning to do. He basically wants to give tax breaks to private developers who then reap the benefits:
Build he won't (https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/21/opinion/build-he-wont.html)
Quote
To understand what's going on, it may be helpful to start with what we should be doing. The federal government can indeed borrow very cheaply; meanwhile, we really need to spend money on everything from sewage treatment to transit. The indicated course of action, then, is simple: borrow at those low, low rates, and use the funds raised to fix what needs fixing.
But that's not what the Trump team is proposing. Instead, it's calling for huge tax credits: billions of dollars in checks written to private companies that invest in approved projects, which they would end up owning. For example, imagine a private consortium building a toll road for $1 billion. Under the Trump plan, the consortium might borrow $800 million while putting up $200 million in equity — but it would get a tax credit of 82 percent of that sum, so that its actual outlays would only be $36 million. And any future revenue from tolls would go to the people who put up that $36 million.
Quote from: Tom62 on January 20, 2017, 06:51:51 AM
Reducing military expenditure is another one.
Nope, now he wants to increase it:
Trump's military spending flip-flop (http://www.politico.com/story/2016/08/trump-military-spending-flip-flop-226705)
Quote
The turnaround is the latest example of the confusing and often contradictory positions that Trump has staked out on the military. Just three months from Election Day, he has yet to even lay out a specific defense policy program.
He has, however, repeatedly called the military a "disaster" as a result of the policies pursued by the Obama administration and the GOP-led Congress, and he's vowing to rebuild it.
"I'm going to make our military so big, so powerful, so strong, that nobody — absolutely nobody — is going to mess with us," Trump says in a 23-second video stating his position on "the military" on his campaign website.
Quote from: Tom62 on January 20, 2017, 06:51:51 AM
Having a better relationship with Russia is not so bad either.
Really?
They don't have a good relationship with Russia because Russia's trying to manipulate democracies in what they perceive to be "their" territory, like Ukraine and Georgia, and funding far-right groups in Europe to undermine NATO. Not to mention the US.
Also, that dossier they keep bringing up? The golden showers are not the problem. The problem is that the Russians may be laundering money through his properties by buying them up, in return for turning a blind eye to Ukraine and removing it from the GOP platform. Now he's talking about removing the sanctions imposed on them because of how they screwed with Ukraine.
If "good relations" with Russia means allowing them to manipulate the world and my country, I want nothing to do with it, and neither should you.
One of my paranoid thoughts, though I'm not convinced by it, but I thought it was a good idea for a novel. If Russia wanted to disrupt the American Government to weaken us, they try to hurt the democratic process by interfering and then even beyond what they expected, their candidate gets elected. So do they waste their chance? Hell no, they go in to put into place, people that would either intentionally destroy what their position is supposed to oversee or is just wholly unqualified. Which will weaken America even more than it already was getting weakened.
One thing I think would be hilarious, is if it is true, that Trump is going to go for an oppressive government, in which case they will have voted for the very person they were scared of... and Trump is going to need all those private guns.
Davin, you seem to have gone batty!
:D
Quote from: Davin on January 20, 2017, 04:26:29 PM
One of my paranoid thoughts, though I'm not convinced by it, but I thought it was a good idea for a novel. If Russia wanted to disrupt the American Government to weaken us, they try to hurt the democratic process by interfering and then even beyond what they expected, their candidate gets elected. So do they waste their chance? Hell no, they go in to put into place, people that would either intentionally destroy what their position is supposed to oversee or is just wholly unqualified. Which will weaken America even more than it already was getting weakened.
One thing I think would be hilarious, is if it is true, that Trump is going to go for an oppressive government, in which case they will have voted for the very person they were scared of... and Trump is going to need all those private guns.
Sort of "Digital Fortress" combined with "The Manchurian Candidate" ?
Quote from: Gloucester on January 20, 2017, 04:42:43 PM
Quote from: Davin on January 20, 2017, 04:26:29 PM
One of my paranoid thoughts, though I'm not convinced by it, but I thought it was a good idea for a novel. If Russia wanted to disrupt the American Government to weaken us, they try to hurt the democratic process by interfering and then even beyond what they expected, their candidate gets elected. So do they waste their chance? Hell no, they go in to put into place, people that would either intentionally destroy what their position is supposed to oversee or is just wholly unqualified. Which will weaken America even more than it already was getting weakened.
One thing I think would be hilarious, is if it is true, that Trump is going to go for an oppressive government, in which case they will have voted for the very person they were scared of... and Trump is going to need all those private guns.
Sort of "Digital Fortress" combined with "The Manchurian Candidate" ?
I haven't read "Digital Fortress" but I think you've got the idea.
You can easily replace the headline below, dated Berlin, 1934, with the following:
"AMERICA HOPEFUL, DESPITE TRUMP"
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FmLb63l6.jpg&hash=0eb453ec5798b3c231447bf043cec21bd780f23e)
Here's what I hoped would have happened today.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi64.tinypic.com%2Fvgljc0.jpg&hash=4ba0533ac123289d62a42f08cb5c18dcbcb30c9e)
Quote from: Pasta Chick on January 20, 2017, 02:06:31 PM
It will be a great speech, a tremendous speech. One of the best speeches you've ever heard. Other speeches will tremble in awe from the greatness of this tremendous speech. After all he's the best at speaking; I'll tell you what, in business he speaks a lot. And business will make America great again. We'll do that by being really just super at business until we have the best businesses again...
For like a fucking hour
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FcrIAeAZ.jpg&hash=a262e04f8f119e6fcc99614454befe491963d5d9)
QuoteA reporter who is in DC reporting on the Inauguration, was speaking to his home office and reported seeing two persons wearing masks, one as Hitler, and the other as Mussolini and the reporter said they were unsure whether the two were part of the revelers or protesters, so they didn't show them during the live feed. WTF.
This totally fake-ass photo is what Trump sent out as his official picture before the inauguration, supposedly showing him writing his speech.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi63.tinypic.com%2Fwldsnn.jpg&hash=7f5dfd98754f4b535f866706d8868ea80600819f)
FINALLY(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi67.tinypic.com%2F28u330i.jpg&hash=676d18b3b79e5b39f8b756d05d77f835208247af)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi63.tinypic.com%2F2wej283.jpg&hash=9d7583337271b693a344d7009418f95774a4169b)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi65.tinypic.com%2F23sxcuh.jpg&hash=236649754cb718512b4d41371a62ff227c5eacee)
Look at this, within only hours Dickhead's Administration removed all mentions of LGBTQ people & rights from the White House Website. (https://www.whitehouse.gov)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FWpejrk0.jpg&hash=157a43c218c55da96f458f75431b7e8979edbcbc)
...also removed the climate change web page, healthcare and civil rights.
Butt everything will be okey-dokey.
^^I heard he did the same for disabilities.
Quote from: Harmonie on January 20, 2017, 11:53:41 PM
^^I heard he did the same for disabilities.
But of course :'(... also after taking office today Dick-Head signed an order mandating a National Day of Patriotism. Who else "mandated" patriotism you ask? Well the Germans did it in the 1930's.
Speaking of investing money in the infrastructure, he probably needs good roads to make it easier to transport people to relocation and detainment camps. (Going to need those if you are planning to forcibly deport millions of illegal, and non-illegal immigrants, such as children of illegal immigrants who were born here, and who have obtained birth-right citizenship per the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution)
Or to detain Muslims after re-establishing the useless program of the Bush administration which was officially called "NSEERS", and was more commonly known as "special registration".
And in efforts to justify a Muslim registry while on Fox News, Dickhead surrogate Carl Higbie positively invoked Japanese internment as a legal precedent for the program, as well as for detainment camps.
I'm sure things will be just peachy.
QuoteI'm sure things will be just peachy.
Except for the maggot eating it from the inside.
1.21.17 Day 1
We've survived day 1, somehow. Here inside the bunker things are currently ok, but we need to get sniffer dogs placed by the entrances to sniff out his supporters, and members of the alt-right.
This should be an easy task for the dogs as they all reek from a pungent odor of entitlement, racism, privilege, fascism, sexism,etc...sort of mixture of right wing talk show host and conspiracy nut Alex Jones, neo-Nazi Richard Spencer (Who got socked yesterday) and Archie Bunker.
Not promoting violence, but when you incite hate things are going to happen? (You may recall this was the DB who at a rally soon after Dickhead won the election was seen at the podium with his hand straight out in the air "Hailing Trump" in a nazi salute)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FLda50fe.gif&hash=bbbe86358900d7020f2619a523b57d9cd2311f48)
Quote from: Father Bruno on January 21, 2017, 12:56:11 PM
1.21.17 Day 1
We've survived day 1, somehow. Here inside the bunker things are currently ok, but we need to get sniffer dogs placed by the entrances to sniff out his supporters, and members of the alt-right.
This should be an easy task for the dogs as they all reek from a pungent odor of entitlement, racism, privilege, fascism, sexism,etc...sort of mixture of right wing talk show host and conspiracy nut Alex Jones, neo-Nazi Richard Spencer (Who got socked yesterday) and Archie Bunker.
Not promoting violence, but when you incite hate things are going to happen? (You may recall this was the DB who at a rally soon after Dickhead won the election was seen at the podium with his hand straight out in the air "Hailing Trump" in a nazi salute)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FLda50fe.gif&hash=bbbe86358900d7020f2619a523b57d9cd2311f48)
Well, as much as I despise this guy's message, a hooded man giving him a sucker punch and then running away is not exactly the way to handle this. Now is the time to speak out publicly against the problems you see with Trump. Pick a topic - any topic - and start getting the message out. We were asleep at the wheel and let him get elected. Now we need to wake up and speak. Find a cause, a platform, and go for it.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on January 21, 2017, 06:52:14 PM
Quote from: Father Bruno on January 21, 2017, 12:56:11 PM
1.21.17 Day 1
We've survived day 1, somehow. Here inside the bunker things are currently ok, but we need to get sniffer dogs placed by the entrances to sniff out his supporters, and members of the alt-right.
This should be an easy task for the dogs as they all reek from a pungent odor of entitlement, racism, privilege, fascism, sexism,etc...sort of mixture of right wing talk show host and conspiracy nut Alex Jones, neo-Nazi Richard Spencer (Who got socked yesterday) and Archie Bunker.
Not promoting violence, but when you incite hate things are going to happen? (You may recall this was the DB who at a rally soon after Dickhead won the election was seen at the podium with his hand straight out in the air "Hailing Trump" in a nazi salute)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FLda50fe.gif&hash=bbbe86358900d7020f2619a523b57d9cd2311f48)
Well, as much as I despise this guy's message, a hooded man giving him a sucker punch and then running away is not exactly the way to handle this. Now is the time to speak out publicly against the problems you see with Trump. Pick a topic - any topic - and start getting the message out. We were asleep at the wheel and let him get elected. Now we need to wake up and speak. Find a cause, a platform, and go for it.
It looks like that the US has their own version of anti-fascist tugs, similar like the ones that I've seen here in Germany and in the Netherlands. They use violence and destruction to get their "opinion" across, thus being no better than the people they hate. I assume that they also smashed windows and damaged private properties in Washington DC.
Did anyone else march today? I'm pretty equidistant between 3 major cities and ended up in Hartford CT. The Facebook page for the event had about 3000 going, it was difficult to tell in the crowd but felt like more like 5000. Now that it's over I'm reading estimates of 10,000!
The speaker system was very bad, so mostly people were mingling. It was very uplifting just being surrounded by everyone - and this is coming from someone who abhors crowds. Most people kept with the feminist theme overall but there were also BLM protesters, LGBTQ activists, and people concerned with climate change and health care in general. Many signs had messages including all of the above. I think everyone just really wants to be heard.
Highlites I didn't feel comfortable or wasn't able to photograph:
A boy probably 8-9 years old wearing Finn (Star Wars) jacket carrying a sign he made that said "Science is real, Deal with it".
A older gay couple standing on the edge of the crowd wearing rainbow sashes and holding hands.
A sign that said simply "we'll take the bear".
Very early on - I arrived about 15 min early to park. The crowd at least quadrupled from this
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/16195998_10208456417063962_6802584258060472022_n.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=7414d57ca342868d0c24b1ec547674c3&oe=5900F182)
Rainbow for the captial
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/16195876_10208457356647451_320958883930845777_n.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=7c8b0b03fabb1270f1bbb3bd5957f45e&oe=591FB773)
Looking back at the crowd - this spills over the hill into Bushnell Park
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/16195341_10208457357607475_5364624105104904135_n.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=6df8cdefe69719dc6e2c1a8176bd3e0e&oe=5917B8AA)
It appears that the backlash from women is larger and more militant than could have been imagined. Woman Marches all over the country were beyond impressive. Way to go girls, you really do have power and plenty of it. Men are sometimes grudgingly aware of the reality that women control half the money and all the ....well you know. A clip of a woman speaker in D.C. reminded the listeners of who it is that is responsible for bearing children like MLK, like Socrates, Jonas Salk, G. Washington, and more. . She even reminded that a woman gave birth to Jesus. There were more than a few large signs being held up. More than a few of them used a two word message: Fuck Trump. My goodness ladies is that any way to behave? I say yes, you are damned right yes.
A clip from yodays speech by the New Press secretary ...Sean Whatzisname, the new guy, is an almost mirror image of the Donald. He got all upset about the supposed underestimation of the size of the inauguration crowd. Like that actually mattered. I take that back. Evidently "size does matter" to the new regime. He also viciously attacked the press as deliberate liars and cheats. That sounds every bit like the Donald. I have a news flash for this dipshit dude, and Donald too. The press and other media have influence that can overwhelm the bloviations of political hacks. . They buy ink by the barrel and they control the broadcast media and public opinions as they damned well please. Best not to antagonize them too badly or too frequently.
Quote from: Pasta Chick on January 22, 2017, 12:23:25 AM
Did anyone else march today?
Wish we could have, but tough to do so with firechicklet's right now, and my father-in-law is also visiting this weekend to see her for the first time. But we will be in the future, hopefully. Sadly, I'm sure there will be many more reasons to do so.
Quote from: Tom62 on January 21, 2017, 10:24:32 PM
It looks like that the US has their own version of anti-fascist tugs, similar like the ones that I've seen here in Germany and in the Netherlands. They use violence and destruction to get their "opinion" across, thus being no better than the people they hate. I assume that they also smashed windows and damaged private properties in Washington DC.
Tom, it seems like you have been more interested in criticizing the opposition to Trump than Trump himself, and I remember arguing with you about Putin before too. I'm curious how you really feel about his election.
Quote from: Icarus on January 22, 2017, 01:07:00 AMI have a news flash for this dipshit dude, and Donald too. The press and other media have influence that can overwhelm the bloviations of political hacks. . They buy ink by the barrel and they control the broadcast media and public opinions as they damned well please. Best not to antagonize them too badly or too frequently.
Unless Donald does an Erdoğan on them.
;)
Quote from: Firebird on January 22, 2017, 06:55:34 AM
Quote from: Tom62 on January 21, 2017, 10:24:32 PM
It looks like that the US has their own version of anti-fascist tugs, similar like the ones that I've seen here in Germany and in the Netherlands. They use violence and destruction to get their "opinion" across, thus being no better than the people they hate. I assume that they also smashed windows and damaged private properties in Washington DC.
Tom, it seems like you have been more interested in criticizing the opposition to Trump than Trump himself, and I remember arguing with you about Putin before too. I'm curious how you really feel about his election.
Whilst being against Trump I was also concerned about reports that anti-Trump demonstrators had caused damage and violence. That is not going to help the justified cause of the majority. But, there are always those who seek any excuse for violence.
Quote from: Gloucester on January 22, 2017, 08:06:15 AM
Quote from: Firebird on January 22, 2017, 06:55:34 AM
Quote from: Tom62 on January 21, 2017, 10:24:32 PM
It looks like that the US has their own version of anti-fascist tugs, similar like the ones that I've seen here in Germany and in the Netherlands. They use violence and destruction to get their "opinion" across, thus being no better than the people they hate. I assume that they also smashed windows and damaged private properties in Washington DC.
Tom, it seems like you have been more interested in criticizing the opposition to Trump than Trump himself, and I remember arguing with you about Putin before too. I'm curious how you really feel about his election.
Whilst being against Trump I was also concerned about reports that anti-Trump demonstrators had caused damage and violence. That is not going to help the justified cause of the majority. But, there are always those who seek any excuse for violence.
I fully agree with Gloucester. I'm against Trump as well. As a matter of fact, I think he is unpredictable and has major angry management issues. Although that makes him potentially dangerous, I would however not write him off [yet] as being evil. To become as bad as Nixon or J.W. Bush, responsible for the deaths of thousands of innocent people, some "work" still needs to be done.
Quote from: Tom62 on January 22, 2017, 09:44:21 AM
Quote from: Gloucester on January 22, 2017, 08:06:15 AM
Quote from: Firebird on January 22, 2017, 06:55:34 AM
Quote from: Tom62 on January 21, 2017, 10:24:32 PM
It looks like that the US has their own version of anti-fascist tugs, similar like the ones that I've seen here in Germany and in the Netherlands. They use violence and destruction to get their "opinion" across, thus being no better than the people they hate. I assume that they also smashed windows and damaged private properties in Washington DC.
Tom, it seems like you have been more interested in criticizing the opposition to Trump than Trump himself, and I remember arguing with you about Putin before too. I'm curious how you really feel about his election.
Whilst being against Trump I was also concerned about reports that anti-Trump demonstrators had caused damage and violence. That is not going to help the justified cause of the majority. But, there are always those who seek any excuse for violence.
I fully agree with Gloucester. I'm against Trump as well. As a matter of fact, I think he is unpredictable and has major angry management issues. Although that makes him potentially dangerous, I would however not write him off [yet] as being evil. To become as bad as Nixon or J.W. Bush, responsible for the deaths of thousands of innocent people, some "work" still needs to be done.
Taking the last part of your post, Tom, I am as much concerned by Trump's "indirect" actions as much as his direct policies. Is there a chance that he will "enable" others, through bigotted, knee-jerk or poorly thought out policies, to cause social and financial mayhem, even encourage violence?
It's important to remember that whatever your struggle against Trump, it's a marathon not a sprint. This is the beginning of 4 years of fighting, so keep it up. Make it your New Year's resolution to resist.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on January 22, 2017, 11:10:07 AM
It's important to remember that whatever your struggle against Trump, it's a marathon not a sprint. This is the beginning of 4 years of fighting, so keep it up. Make it your New Year's resolution to resist.
Unless he gets reelected :o.
Quote from: Tom62 on January 22, 2017, 11:37:51 AM
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on January 22, 2017, 11:10:07 AM
It's important to remember that whatever your struggle against Trump, it's a marathon not a sprint. This is the beginning of 4 years of fighting, so keep it up. Make it your New Year's resolution to resist.
Unless he gets reelected :o.
Perish the thought. I think he's a one termer, but no prediction about him has been true so far.
Quote from: Gloucester on January 22, 2017, 07:59:16 AM
Quote from: Icarus on January 22, 2017, 01:07:00 AMI have a news flash for this dipshit dude, and Donald too. The press and other media have influence that can overwhelm the bloviations of political hacks. . They buy ink by the barrel and they control the broadcast media and public opinions as they damned well please. Best not to antagonize them too badly or too frequently.
Unless Donald does an Erdoğan on them.
;)
That, fortunately, is not possible here (yet). Trump doesn't have nearly the personality cult of Erdoğan, so the government isn't stock full of his acolytes, and there would be a huge, huge outcry if he tried to jail journalists. Right now they're just continuing their campaign of delegitimization of the media, which is still quite dangerous considering how easily so many people fall for that crap.
Quote from: Tom62 on January 21, 2017, 10:24:32 PMIt looks like that the US has their own version of anti-fascist tugs, similar like the ones that I've seen here in Germany and in the Netherlands. They use violence and destruction to get their "opinion" across, thus being no better than the people they hate. I assume that they also smashed windows and damaged private properties in Washington DC.
Yes, there are people and groups in the US that use "black bloc" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_bloc) tactics, and yes there was a black bloc element in the demonstrations on the day of Trump's inauguration, though it was a very small minority. These people don't care that their actions tend to delegitimize peaceful demonstrations. They're parasites who I think are there more for juvenile thrill-seeking than for anything else.
Quote from: Pasta Chick on January 22, 2017, 12:23:25 AM
Did anyone else march today? I'm pretty equidistant between 3 major cities and ended up in Hartford CT. The Facebook page for the event had about 3000 going, it was difficult to tell in the crowd but felt like more like 5000. Now that it's over I'm reading estimates of 10,000!
The speaker system was very bad, so mostly people were mingling. It was very uplifting just being surrounded by everyone - and this is coming from someone who abhors crowds. Most people kept with the feminist theme overall but there were also BLM protesters, LGBTQ activists, and people concerned with climate change and health care in general. Many signs had messages including all of the above. I think everyone just really wants to be heard.
Highlites I didn't feel comfortable or wasn't able to photograph:
A boy probably 8-9 years old wearing Finn (Star Wars) jacket carrying a sign he made that said "Science is real, Deal with it".
A older gay couple standing on the edge of the crowd wearing rainbow sashes and holding hands.
A sign that said simply "we'll take the bear".
Very early on - I arrived about 15 min early to park. The crowd at least quadrupled from this
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/16195998_10208456417063962_6802584258060472022_n.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=7414d57ca342868d0c24b1ec547674c3&oe=5900F182)
Rainbow for the captial
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/16195876_10208457356647451_320958883930845777_n.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=7c8b0b03fabb1270f1bbb3bd5957f45e&oe=591FB773)
Looking back at the crowd - this spills over the hill into Bushnell Park
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/16195341_10208457357607475_5364624105104904135_n.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=6df8cdefe69719dc6e2c1a8176bd3e0e&oe=5917B8AA)
Hi PC, very cool you were able to attend an event close to you, and like you it was very uplifting to simply participate, especially with my son by my side, he made me very proud yesterday.
My son and I were headed to Ann Arbor, MI yesterday so we went down early and joined the march there, very large crowd...unfortunately we arrived late due to all of the traffic coming into the city so we missed the speeches, but we were both happy and excited to be able to participate.
My daughter attended a march in Traverse City, MI with some friends, and my sister and her wife were in Washington DC for the main event!
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FejQYLHn.jpg&hash=32adc461718c83132c25dfc08a788017d0d1f7f1)
My Sista Representing!
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F9izt6FD.jpg&hash=1a6ef4410c787882a5c9b71a71d637b0a554c9eb)
I loved this guy and his sign.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F1csPTTT.jpg%3F1&hash=fdd10efc0223f9565b47afe7ecca57787cf0cd28)
Quote from: Tom62 on January 21, 2017, 10:24:32 PM
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on January 21, 2017, 06:52:14 PM
Quote from: Father Bruno on January 21, 2017, 12:56:11 PM
1.21.17 Day 1
We've survived day 1, somehow. Here inside the bunker things are currently ok, but we need to get sniffer dogs placed by the entrances to sniff out his supporters, and members of the alt-right.
This should be an easy task for the dogs as they all reek from a pungent odor of entitlement, racism, privilege, fascism, sexism,etc...sort of mixture of right wing talk show host and conspiracy nut Alex Jones, neo-Nazi Richard Spencer (Who got socked yesterday) and Archie Bunker.
Not promoting violence, but when you incite hate things are going to happen? (You may recall this was the DB who at a rally soon after Dickhead won the election was seen at the podium with his hand straight out in the air "Hailing Trump" in a nazi salute)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FLda50fe.gif&hash=bbbe86358900d7020f2619a523b57d9cd2311f48)
Well, as much as I despise this guy's message, a hooded man giving him a sucker punch and then running away is not exactly the way to handle this. Now is the time to speak out publicly against the problems you see with Trump. Pick a topic - any topic - and start getting the message out. We were asleep at the wheel and let him get elected. Now we need to wake up and speak. Find a cause, a platform, and go for it.
It looks like that the US has their own version of anti-fascist tugs, similar like the ones that I've seen here in Germany and in the Netherlands. They use violence and destruction to get their "opinion" across, thus being no better than the people they hate. I assume that they also smashed windows and damaged private properties in Washington DC.
An estimated 500,000 people attended the march yesterday in Washington, and there were
"Zero" arrests made. Zero. (http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/315529-womens-march-on-washington-yields-zero-arrests-report)
With regards to R. Spencer getting sucker punched. Let's remember we're not discussing differences of opinion here such as should we cut corporate subsidies in the Federal Budget, increase defense spending, or lower capital gains.
No, this is person who publicly advocates a white homeland for what he calls the dispossessed white race, and who also calls for the peaceful ethnic cleansing of minorities to halt the deconstruction of what he refers to as the superior European culture here in the US, and a man who has openly criticized Jewish people.
Again, I'm not advocating violence, a sucker punch as evident in the video is a cowardly way to voice opposition. However, if I was on that sidewalk, and he was present I would have done everything within my means to square off and confront him directly and let him know exactly how I feel about his rhetoric of hate, and exactly what I will do to oppose it. And remind him that his vision of an non-inclusive America is not going to come about peacefully, not if I have the means to stop it.
Here's some more good news only just released.
Doomsday Clock: Humanity might be edging closer to its end.
(http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/26/world/doomsday-clock-2017/index.html)
QuoteThe Chicago-based Bulletin of Atomic Scientists has moved the "Doomsday Clock," a symbolic countdown to the end of the world, to two and a half minutes to midnight.
It marks the first time since 1953 -- after hydrogen bomb tests in the US and then Soviet Union -- that humanity has been this close to global disaster.
THANKS DONALD
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FINi636p.jpg&hash=b205f5da701b9fbfbca7533c9904a33b8784327b)
The news today, Jan 27, is about the Doomsday Clock having been advanced by a half minute. That is to say; doomsday is nearer.
This is a serious question: Has anyone had any experience with the Neptune Society and its' services after the fact.?
Quote from: Father Bruno on January 26, 2017, 06:59:59 PM
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FINi636p.jpg&hash=b205f5da701b9fbfbca7533c9904a33b8784327b)
Pic is now my Facebook cover. Thanks Bruno, I needed that.