I'm not going to get into the details of the rape case (unless someone truly is unaware of it) since it's been all over the media for the last few days, but I did think this post, from one of my favorite Xtian bloggers, was worth noting: To Brock Turner's Father, from another Father (http://johnpavlovitz.com/2016/06/06/to-brock-turners-father-from-another-father/).
QuoteAnd to be clear, Mr. Turner, "alcohol and sexual promiscuity" are not the story here. The story here, is that young men have choices to make and these choices define them, even if those choices are made when temptation is great and opportunity is abundant. In fact, our humanity is most expressed when faced with such things, we choose integrity and decency; when we abstain from doing what is easy but wrong.
"Affluenza" again? And there's no way a black kid would have gotten only six months for rape. Not that he didn't deserve more than that (clearly he did), but the disparity between how blacks and whites are treated in this country's justice system blows my mind.
Thumbs up for the man who wrote that letter.
Quote from: Icarus on June 09, 2016, 05:26:52 AM
Thumbs up for the man who wrote that letter.
It was from the victims father to the rapists father.
QuoteThis is why white privilege is real and insidious and usually those with it are oblivious to it.
Was she not white?
I have two daughters a wife zero sons and am perfectly happy with my family configuration.
If any of them were offended against I'd want him impaled Vlad style with his balls around his neck, not too much lube, you don't want rush it.
But of course that's just white male me being outraged by a hypothetical transgression of my property.
I think society would benefit if more more melatonined people got conspicuously wealthy so we could get back to class/wealth as the basis of rivalry.
Quote from: Tank on June 09, 2016, 12:44:54 PM
Quote from: Icarus on June 09, 2016, 05:26:52 AM
Thumbs up for the man who wrote that letter.
It was from the victims father to the rapists father.
Where did you get that information? I thought that the victim's identity was not public knowledge.
Quote from: Recusant on June 09, 2016, 05:17:20 PM
Quote from: Tank on June 09, 2016, 12:44:54 PM
Quote from: Icarus on June 09, 2016, 05:26:52 AM
Thumbs up for the man who wrote that letter.
It was from the victims father to the rapists father.
Where did you get that information? I thought that the victim's identity was not public knowledge.
I saw a news report on fb it quoted that passage from the letter and the announcer said it was the father.
Ah, OK. I just looked around, and in this story about the letter (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2016/06/08/dad-dad-open-letter-blasts-father-stanford-rapist/85591394/), Pavlovitz is described as "a pastor and blogger in Wake Forest, N.C.," but no mention is made of any relationship with the victim. Also this story (http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/08/us/pastor-letter-father-brock-turner-rape-stanford/) seems to indicate that he has no direct relationship with the victim.
Quote from: Recusant on June 09, 2016, 06:30:57 PM
Ah, OK. I just looked around, and in this story about the letter (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2016/06/08/dad-dad-open-letter-blasts-father-stanford-rapist/85591394/), Pavlovitz is described as "a pastor and blogger in Wake Forest, N.C.," but no mention is made of any relationship with the victim. Also this story (http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/08/us/pastor-letter-father-brock-turner-rape-stanford/) seems to indicate that he has no direct relationship with the victim.
It looks like it probably wasn't then.
That is a very sad story and I am appalled that the guy got only six months.
I heard about the letter that the father of the rapist wrote, and I couldn't believe that anyone would try to use "20 minutes of action" as a justification to be lenient. Then I read the letter and was more disgusted. It's like the father intentionally ignored the suffering that his son caused another person and tried to distill it down to just drunkenness and promiscuity.
Quote from: Tank on June 09, 2016, 06:49:16 PM
Quote from: Recusant on June 09, 2016, 06:30:57 PM
Ah, OK. I just looked around, and in this story about the letter (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2016/06/08/dad-dad-open-letter-blasts-father-stanford-rapist/85591394/), Pavlovitz is described as "a pastor and blogger in Wake Forest, N.C.," but no mention is made of any relationship with the victim. Also this story (http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/08/us/pastor-letter-father-brock-turner-rape-stanford/) seems to indicate that he has no direct relationship with the victim.
It looks like it probably wasn't then.
John Pavlovitz isn't related to the victim, he was just writing about it in his blog, responding to the letter the rapist's father sent to the judge requesting leniency. I've shared some of Pavlovitz's posts here before, he's one of my favorite Xtian bloggers.
Where was the father of the victim in this scenario. Fathers are protective of their male offspring, but fiercely, even homicidally, protective of their daughters. And "that is the way it was" in times past. (Apologies to Walter Cronkite for using his sign off phrase).
My daughter was almost raped a long time ago. The antagonist did not anticipate that her 85 pound dog would, and did, rip him up for putting his hands on my daughter, Terri. The fool was angry, pained, and bloody. He returned in a matter of minutes with a firearm. He shot the dog, Peaches. Terri rushed Peaches to the vet. The vet notified the sheriff. The sheriff had the miserable creep in irons within hours. That saved me from a life sentence in prison because I had an absolute 100% intent to kill the bastard and furthermore I had the prior training and ability to do it with the garrotte that I made for the purpose.
I am a really nice guy who demonstratably cares for others. That is so, except for one thing; dare to harm my daughter and you are a dead man.
...Also, should Judge Aaron Persky be removed from the bench for decision in Brock Turner rape case?
Some people think so:
QuoteRemove Judge Aaron Persky
We the people would like to petition that Judge Aaron Persky be impeached from his Judicial position for the lenient sentence he allowed in the Brock Turner rape case. Despite a unanimous guilty verdict, three felony convictions, the objections of 250 Stanford students, Jeff Rosen the district attorney for Santa Clara, as well as the deputy district attorney who likened Turner to " a predator searching for prey" Judge Persky allowed the lenient sentence suggested by the probation department. Turner has shown no remorse and plans to attempt to overturn his conviction....
Petitioning California State House and 43 others
Remove Judge Aaron Persky from the Bench For Decision in Brock Turner rape case. (https://www.change.org/p/california-state-house-recall-judge-aaron-persky).
Personally, I think we should take all the rapists, child molesters, and murders incarcerated now and give the a one way trip to the desert. Where a massive hole has been dug. Throw them all in and bulldoze the hole over, while they are still breathing.
Secondly, anyone in the future who disregards human decency and breaks these laws, once convicted gets to spin the wheel of death. Whatever their punishment is, will be carried out within 60 minutes. No last meal. No getting to say goodbye to your loved ones. Just spin the wheel and await your doom.
Punishments shall include, but not be limited to;
Being used as a crash test dummy, without a seat belt. Stick you in the front seat and drive the car as fast as it goes into an immovable object.
Being used as lab rats.
Having a white hot poker inserted into your poop shoot, searing it shut. Then being fed nothing but soluble fiber.
Last, but not least, my favorite. This will take longer than an hour.
We take you, break both your legs, and your good arm. Put you on a boat, travel out into the middle of the ocean, miles, and miles away from any inhabited lands, toss your sorry ass overboard. If you can make it to shore, you are free.
If go out of your way to intentionally harm another human being, you forfeit your right as one. Simple as that. I have zero pity for these parasites.
Quote from: No one on June 10, 2016, 05:47:21 AM
Personally, I think we should take all the rapists, child molesters, and murders incarcerated now and give the a one way trip to the desert. Where a massive hole has been dug. Throw them all in and bulldoze the hole over, while they are still breathing.
...
Good idea. But only if you are prepared to join them as you too will be a bona fide murderer. How many innocent people would you kill? Just one of them and you'd be no better than the worst of them.
I admire your total faith in the US judicial system.
Quote from: Tank on June 10, 2016, 08:29:34 AM
Quote from: No one on June 10, 2016, 05:47:21 AM
Personally, I think we should take all the rapists, child molesters, and murders incarcerated now and give the a one way trip to the desert. Where a massive hole has been dug. Throw them all in and bulldoze the hole over, while they are still breathing.
...
Good idea. But only if you are prepared to join them as you too will be a bona fide murderer. How many innocent people would you kill? Just one of them and you'd be no better than the worst of them.
I admire your total faith in the US judicial system.
Yes but a certain amount of those buried in the desert would have been released and re-offended, so you by quashing No ones' worthy plan are responsible for a whole bunch of murders, rapes and child molestations.
An innocent locked up for life with a bunch of murderers and rapists or buried in a hole, I might well choose the hole.
And I don't think you really admire his faith in the US judicial system.
When I was a nipper I was told, you don't hit girls, I questioned a lot of accepted wisdom but not that.
Maybe that's sexist but I'd have taught it if I'd had sons.
[gif of the big bald guy from the Hogfather, "Our mam said don't hit girls"]
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 11:46:01 AM
Quote from: Tank on June 10, 2016, 08:29:34 AM
Quote from: No one on June 10, 2016, 05:47:21 AM
Personally, I think we should take all the rapists, child molesters, and murders incarcerated now and give the a one way trip to the desert. Where a massive hole has been dug. Throw them all in and bulldoze the hole over, while they are still breathing.
...
Good idea. But only if you are prepared to join them as you too will be a bona fide murderer. How many innocent people would you kill? Just one of them and you'd be no better than the worst of them.
I admire your total faith in the US judicial system.
Yes but a certain amount of those buried in the desert would have been released and re-offended, so you by quashing No ones' worthy plan are responsible for a whole bunch of murders, rapes and child molestations.
An innocent locked up for life with a bunch of murderers and rapists or buried in a hole, I might well choose the hole.
And I don't think you really admire his faith in the US judicial system.
When I was a nipper I was told, you don't hit girls, I questioned a lot of accepted wisdom but not that.
Maybe that's sexist but I'd have taught it if I'd had sons.
[gif of the big bald guy from the Hogfather, "Our mam said don't hit girls"]
I realise the 'hole in the ground' is not a serious proposition. But going from a though process idea the death sentence is never acceptable, however distasteful the crime, because the state should never have the right of life and death over its citizens.
And of course how would the relatives of the innocent people you advocate killing feel?
Quote from: Tank on June 10, 2016, 12:34:51 PM
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 11:46:01 AM
Quote from: Tank on June 10, 2016, 08:29:34 AM
Quote from: No one on June 10, 2016, 05:47:21 AM
Personally, I think we should take all the rapists, child molesters, and murders incarcerated now and give the a one way trip to the desert. Where a massive hole has been dug. Throw them all in and bulldoze the hole over, while they are still breathing.
...
Good idea. But only if you are prepared to join them as you too will be a bona fide murderer. How many innocent people would you kill? Just one of them and you'd be no better than the worst of them.
I admire your total faith in the US judicial system.
Yes but a certain amount of those buried in the desert would have been released and re-offended, so you by quashing No ones' worthy plan are responsible for a whole bunch of murders, rapes and child molestations.
An innocent locked up for life with a bunch of murderers and rapists or buried in a hole, I might well choose the hole.
And I don't think you really admire his faith in the US judicial system.
When I was a nipper I was told, you don't hit girls, I questioned a lot of accepted wisdom but not that.
Maybe that's sexist but I'd have taught it if I'd had sons.
[gif of the big bald guy from the Hogfather, "Our mam said don't hit girls"]
I realise the 'hole in the ground' is not a serious proposition. But going from a though process idea the death sentence is never acceptable, however distasteful the crime, because the state should never have the right of life and death over its citizens.
And of course how would the relatives of the innocent people you advocate killing feel?
A degree worse than what they'd feel if they were jailed for life perhaps.
How do the relatives of violent offenders, the wife say, feel when a violent offender is released to put her in hospital again, bugger her children again?
I'm not advocating for now, that'll have to wait until I've take control the judicial system and its sorted out.
That bold bit is just a personal conviction, it doesn't convince of anything other than that you've come to a conclusion.
Is it OK for states to kill the people of other states?
Ah ha, don't listen to them No one, you're a soldier.
As I have said, if you go out of your way to intentionally harm another human being, you forfeit your right to be one.
I have ZERO pity for them. I have absolutely no pity for their families. Too bad, so sad, bye, bye!
I can tell you this, if someone intentionally harmed someone I care about, I would kill them! Without a second thought. Their death would be long, slow, and excruciatingly painful!
Quote from: No one on June 10, 2016, 02:48:58 PM
As I have said, if you go out of your way to intentionally harm another human being, you forfeit your right to be one.
I have ZERO pity for them. I have absolutely no pity for their families. Too bad, so sad, bye, bye!
I somewhat agree that if a person decides to harm another that they forfeit some rights. Rapists and murderers are those I think need the most amount of separation from society. However, even just a cursory search into the justice system (any justice system), should reveal how inaccurate it is. So many innocent people have been killed. People that didn't do the crimes they were convicted of were executed by the state.
Also here (https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2706&dat=20000225&id=_BBKAAAAIBAJ&sjid=tB4NAAAAIBAJ&pg=1139,2473709&hl=en), the woman killed her fifth husband, I would say in self defense. And she was convicted of murder and executed. Too bad. So sad. bye, bye. No pity for her.
Quote from: No oneI can tell you this, if someone intentionally harmed someone I care about, I would kill them! Without a second thought. Their death would be long, slow, and excruciatingly painful!
As in the case above, if the abusive husband had been your brother, you would have killed the battered woman slowly and painfully. Good call.
Now let's look at another case of convicted murderer being executed, Cameron Todd Willingham (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cameron_Todd_Willingham)
The facts are:
There was an expert witness that confirmed that the fire that killed his family was set intentionally.
He lied about going back in to try and save the youngest kids.
He was found at the scene of the fire.
He was convicted of starting that fire.
If it had been your sister, after hearing the expert, and all the people that pointed to him as a murderer, you would likely have slowly tortured this man to death.
However, things get bad, because the supposed expert was using outdated, bad, and scientifically inaccurate methods to determine the cause of the fire. Too bad. So sad. Bye, bye.
An innocent man. You would have put an innocent man through a slow and painful death when he didn't do anything wrong. Too bad. So sad. Bye, bye.
I'm not a bleeding heart, though I do have empathy, but we as a society have to admit our limited abilities to determine the truth. I am not willing to murder innocent people, and it frankly frightens me that you and other people are willing to kill innocent people with ZERO pity.
acceptable losses
I wonder too, what No one or Bad Penny II would do, if the state murdered someone close to them. Do they then slowly and painfully torture the state to death even though the state was doing what No one and Bad Penny II wanted? Or just accept the loss of their family member? And if it were them that were wrongly convicted of rape or murder?
Or is Bad Penny II just putting in low effort posts just get people to respond to it for its own amusement? In other words: is Bad Penny II trolling?
Oh well, I went too far off topic myself anyway.
Quote from: Davin on June 10, 2016, 03:51:36 PM
I wonder too, what No one or Bad Penny II would do, if the state murdered someone close to them. Do they then slowly and painfully torture the state to death even though the state was doing what No one and Bad Penny II wanted? Or just accept the loss of their family member? And if it were them that were wrongly convicted of rape or murder?
Or is Bad Penny II just putting in low effort posts just get people to respond to it for its own amusement? In other words: is Bad Penny II trolling?
Oh well, I went too far off topic myself anyway.
What I do at my best can easily be confused by the easily confused as trolling, but it's actually capering.
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 04:17:44 PM
Quote from: Davin on June 10, 2016, 03:51:36 PM
Or is Bad Penny II just putting in low effort posts just get people to respond to it for its own amusement? In other words: is Bad Penny II trolling?
Looks like it.
Quote from: No one on June 10, 2016, 02:48:58 PM
I can tell you this, if someone intentionally harmed someone I care about, I would kill them! Without a second thought. Their death would be long, slow, and excruciatingly painful!
That assumes that they are not far more dangerous than you. It's not unlikely that you would be the one treated to a slow, painful death.
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 04:17:44 PMWhat I do at my best can easily be confused by the easily confused as trolling, but it's actually capering.
After the edit.
I have no problem with that, but since you don't seem be able to do it while carrying on a rational conversation, I guess my best course of action will just be to ignore you.
Quote from: Asmodean on June 10, 2016, 04:33:13 PM
Quote from: No one on June 10, 2016, 02:48:58 PM
I can tell you this, if someone intentionally harmed someone I care about, I would kill them! Without a second thought. Their death would be long, slow, and excruciatingly painful!
That assumes that they are not far more dangerous than you. It's not unlikely that you would be the one treated to a slow, painful death.
No way, we'd form up posse and hunt down No one's transgressors and make sausages of their more palatable bits.
That's what a forum does pilgrim.
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 04:46:53 PM
Quote from: Asmodean on June 10, 2016, 04:33:13 PM
Quote from: No one on June 10, 2016, 02:48:58 PM
I can tell you this, if someone intentionally harmed someone I care about, I would kill them! Without a second thought. Their death would be long, slow, and excruciatingly painful!
That assumes that they are not far more dangerous than you. It's not unlikely that you would be the one treated to a slow, painful death.
No way, we'd form up posse and hunt down No one's transgressors and make sausages of their more palatable bits.
That's what a forum does pilgrim.
Screw that.
Ok, time for The Asmo's Spookily-Divine Revenge School, lesson one.
Revenge is at its finest when you can ruin someone's life without exposing yourself. A Mona Lisa of vengeance is when you also do not break a single law (technically, as that may be) doing it. It takes a special kind of person to do it right. If you know you are not one such, yet you are determined to go forth, the best way is to contact someone who
is.
If you jump straight to killing, by the way, you are not the kind of person I describe. There is less mess in getting your target into massive trouble with the law, getting them fired and preferably unhireable, breaking up their relationships, getting their kids taken away... The list of hands-off ways of fucking people up is near-endless. Besides, they give you the almost certain advantage og
you not ending up just another victim of the bad, bad person who hurt your loved one(s).
If you do go it alone, don't act on emotion - research your target. Research your exit strategies. Spend a lot of time contemplating how your target may get the satisfaction of foiling your righteous vengeance and make contingency plans.
It's a process, and it's not simple. It can, however, give you some massive endorphin boosts. Especially on success.
Quote from: Davin on June 10, 2016, 04:38:56 PM
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 04:17:44 PMWhat I do at my best can easily be confused by the easily confused as trolling, but it's actually capering.
After the edit.
I have no problem with that, but since you don't seem be able to do it while carrying on a rational conversation, I guess my best course of action will just be to ignore you.
But I am so often the spark, you're all such a boring bunch of dried up old husks
You can also eliminate the bad guys with the drone attack. Advantages: no need for any expensive, long trials and killing innocent people is just collateral damage.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazing-animations.com%2Fanimations%2Fmonkeys11.gif&hash=e03cabe9633f9dbcc1614e3f5b9a45c84f27d8b1)
2nd grade... Srsly?!
look at him, we must beat him.
we must beat him because he is mighty and strong
if our wives ever knew him they'd never be satisfied with us
Beat him
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 05:11:25 PM
Quote from: Davin on June 10, 2016, 04:38:56 PM
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 04:17:44 PMWhat I do at my best can easily be confused by the easily confused as trolling, but it's actually capering.
After the edit.
I have no problem with that, but since you don't seem be able to do it while carrying on a rational conversation, I guess my best course of action will just be to ignore you.
But I am so often the spark, you're all such a boring bunch of dried up old husks
Argh! Here we go with the name calling...
I don't want to hear it.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmusicandmaterialculture.web.unc.edu%2Ffiles%2F2015%2F11%2Fstarlordheadphones.gif&hash=b7590d935aeecb5a26312228b5578bdfdc96bca8)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F65.media.tumblr.com%2Fd1653af21f8ecdcacac8f9828f1c024a%2Ftumblr_inline_nqrkmjEVVj1s6q2b7_500.gif&hash=2afb9307897fcb27ff8706c860ad91cf80247717)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages-cdn.moviepilot.com%2Fimages%2Fc_fill%2Ch_209%2Cw_500%2Ft_mp_quality_gif%2Fhp3nb8flr7z83hhbw0tq%2Fwho-or-what-is-stan-lee-this-new-wild-theory-might-have-the-answer-amazing-spider-man-478003.gif&hash=6003a8070fe9c1f4b6bf8b97b5bb39d6996d24f8)
Quote from: Magdalena on June 11, 2016, 09:06:57 PM
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 05:11:25 PM
Quote from: Davin on June 10, 2016, 04:38:56 PM
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 04:17:44 PMWhat I do at my best can easily be confoused by the easily confused as trolling, but it's actually capering.
After the edit.
I have no problem with that, but since you don't seem be able to do it while carrying on a rational conversation, I guess my best course of action will just be to ignore you.
But I am so often the spark, you're all such a boring bunch of dried up old husks
Argh! Here we go with the name calling...
I don't want to hear it.
[gifs redacted]
I dispute 'all'. I like to think myself the epitome of young and moist. And Mags, while no spring chicken, is at least dampish...
Quote from: Siz on June 12, 2016, 12:13:20 AM
Quote from: Magdalena on June 11, 2016, 09:06:57 PM
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 05:11:25 PM
Quote from: Davin on June 10, 2016, 04:38:56 PM
Quote from: Bad Penny II on June 10, 2016, 04:17:44 PMWhat I do at my best can easily be confoused by the easily confused as trolling, but it's actually capering.
After the edit.
I have no problem with that, but since you don't seem be able to do it while carrying on a rational conversation, I guess my best course of action will just be to ignore you.
But I am so often the spark, you're all such a boring bunch of dried up old husks
Argh! Here we go with the name calling...
I don't want to hear it.
[gifs redacted]
I dispute 'all'. I like to think myself the epitome of young and moist. And Mags, while no spring chicken, is at least dampish...
Dispute your moisture content all you want, mouldy or desicated you're still a husk.
Anyway I'm going go talk to god, he's much nicer to me than you nasty atheists.
Could be a prophet position coming up, some walrus like creatures are too happy.