Duke of Bullshit: "The" Donald

[Davin]

It is all a matter of perspective. Trump achievements is judged very positive by millions of Americans and overwhelmingly negative by million others. The "truth" may lie somewhere in the middle. I don't like the guy, I also think that he handled Covid-19 and some other issues very badly, but he did some good things as well and he isn't the boogie man the media portrayed him to be. I consider Trump to be a loud-mouthed, moronically ignorant and rather mediocre president. Not good, not bad but also not evil. He is more like a second-hand car salesman than a politician. As a president, I rank him a bit above Obama, but below Clinton. Biden and GW Bush are currently on the bottom of my list.

Pretty easy to come to that conclusion if you ignore almost everything he did and the effects it had on America and the world. He was not a boogie man, he was a real and present threat to the US and the world. Still is. His inaction and denial of science and reality resulted in the death of over 600,000 Americans. There is a whole reddit thread dedicated to the kind of blatant, idiotic denial of Covid-19 leading to people following his lead of denial and dying from Covid-19. Thousands of idiots posting anti-mask shit, saying it's a hoax, and being anti-vax, that died from Covid-19.

Trump and Republicans signed and put into law the largest government handout in American history, the most socialist president of all time... unless you're middle-class or poor.

He gave military secrets to Russia, just straight up told them top secret information shared with us by other governments who clearly told them not to tell Russia. We had to emergency evac US agents because of Trump telling Russia about our agents. Something no other president had ever done.

The US deficit grew by 68% during his presidency.

And yes, he has continued bad behavior done by previous presidents, but he stepped up the damage a lot.

And there's so much more.

So like what are your metrics? More Americans dead under Trump than any other president. Larger deficit growth in four years than any other president. Largest government handouts than any other president. Most US secrets leaked directly to hostile governments than any other president. Most games of golf than any other president (in his first year, he almost played more rounds of golf than Obama did over eight years). Most vacation time of any other president. Most nepotistic government positions of any other president. Most people in positions of power that were active agents of other governments than any other president. Most impeachments of any other president. Most insurrection attempts than other president... and so much more.

Trump should be at the bottom by any not-stupid metrics.

[Davin]

Tom62,
Por el amor de Dios!
Where do you get your news from?!

I just answered the question why people would or could have voted for him. It doesn't really matter if these reasons are valid or not. If you put yourself in the shoes of conservatives, libertarians or even classical liberals it easy to see why they thought that Trump was the better presidential candidate than Clinton or Biden. Looking at the way Biden runs the presidency at this moment, I can also image very well why these people want to see Trump back.

Personally, I hope that we'll never see Trump back in the White House. But, I also hope that the Democratic Party becomes more reliable, less woke, stop promoting race hustlers and move politically back more to the middle.

What exactly, and I mean in fact, do you see Trump did that appeals to "conservatives, libertarians or even classical liberals?"

What do you see Biden doing that you image very well why these people want Trump back?

Also, what is this weird issue with "woke" and why is it in any way a problem?

[Biggus Dickus]

[Dark Lightning]

I'm taking that on the rounds of my most frequently visited websites!

[Icarus]

Good shot Bruno. 

[Brian Ó Seanacháin]

I think that most Democrats just bought the CNBN/CNBC propaganda that Trump was an evil dangerous dictator, a racist, etc. etc. and ignored everything else, (1)like getting the Covid 19 vaccines ready, (2)peace deals in the Middle East, (3) not starting new foreign conflicts, (4) improving the economy, (5) making the US energy independent, (6) taking the border situation serious, (7) reducing unemployment (especially for people of colour), etc.

Yes, Trump wasn't a master of communications nor a likable person (like Obama was), but he got some things done. So I think that most conservatives judged Trump on his actions, not his person.

(1) "To make a sound of hollow laughing" You're kidding me, right?  The whole vaccine situation was a mess in the US when Biden took office, yes there were plenty bought (in fact more than the US needed), but they were badly stored in central locations with little to no provisions made to distribute them to the various states, no local storage made up for where they'd be used and little to no effort made to promote them among republitraitor state governments or voters.

(2) This is an even bigger lie than (1).  Trump's "peace deals" consisted of a) sucking Kim Jong-un's member, b) being even more of a pal to the Israeli far right than US governments usually are, and blowing what little chance remains for peace in the middle east. (As an aside every country other than Qatar that Trump "brought to the table" with Israel has since repudiated their deal because Trump made no effort to keep his side of the bargain, in fact what he promised Serbia wasn't even included in the terms of the deal with them) and c) tearing up the pre-existing peace deal with Iran which had a pretty good chance of bringing them back into the community of normal nations (and even though the mullahs of Iran are pretty crazy and homicidal, they are much less so than the US's current allies in the region).  Yeah, that's some great peace making, almost as good as my ability to slam dunk (all 5'5" of me, in platforms).

(3) Not for a lack of trying, North Korea (pre his coward's turn), Iraq, Iran and Venezuela were all targets of belligerence.  It's not from a lack of ardour for war but for a lack of competence that Trump didn't start a few new ones.

(4) I didn't know that Herr Oberststurmbanngroppenfuhrer was a black Hawai'ian with a US mother and a Kenyan father.  That's a new one for me.  Trump did shit all for the US economy.  He did however did a lot to illegally boost the share prices of companies he and his sons had recently invested in.

(5) How? US presidents have very little effect on energy independence.

(6) By spaffing billions on a wall (at least when BoJo the clown climaxes he spaffs up against pre-existing wall) which covered a tiny fraction of land nobody crosses anyway, which is already in the process of falling down and which can be surmounted using such high tech as five dollar ladders or ten dollar spades.  And the people that the US needs to keep out (what the walls were designed to stop were the kind of people who traditionally came to the US to pick crops and build buildings and go home again in the winter) have this amazing new invention to circumvent the wall anyway, it's called the boat, you may not have seen one seeing as you're not the kind of person who exists at the bleeding edge of 20,000BCE technology.

(7) See (4), again nothing to do with Trump.  Oh and the "reduction in unemployment" among people of colour?  It was 0.1% over four years, not even big enough to be a statistical blip, barely a rounding mistake.

Would you care to try again touting the squirrel toupeed one's achievements, this time by not referencing solely to the fantasy inside of your head.  Remember, Dougal:

[Magdalena]

I think that most Democrats just bought the CNBN/CNBC propaganda that Trump was an evil dangerous dictator, a racist, etc. etc. and ignored everything else, (1)like getting the Covid 19 vaccines ready, (2)peace deals in the Middle East, (3) not starting new foreign conflicts, (4) improving the economy, (5) making the US energy independent, (6) taking the border situation serious, (7) reducing unemployment (especially for people of colour), etc.

Yes, Trump wasn't a master of communications nor a likable person (like Obama was), but he got some things done. So I think that most conservatives judged Trump on his actions, not his person.

(1) "To make a sound of hollow laughing" You're kidding me, right?  The whole vaccine situation was a mess in the US when Biden took office, yes there were plenty bought (in fact more than the US needed), but they were badly stored in central locations with little to no provisions made to distribute them to the various states, no local storage made up for where they'd be used and little to no effort made to promote them among republitraitor state governments or voters.

(2) This is an even bigger lie than (1).  Trump's "peace deals" consisted of a) sucking Kim Jong-un's member, b) being even more of a pal to the Israeli far right than US governments usually are, and blowing what little chance remains for peace in the middle east. (As an aside every country other than Qatar that Trump "brought to the table" with Israel has since repudiated their deal because Trump made no effort to keep his side of the bargain, in fact what he promised Serbia wasn't even included in the terms of the deal with them) and c) tearing up the pre-existing peace deal with Iran which had a pretty good chance of bringing them back into the community of normal nations (and even though the mullahs of Iran are pretty crazy and homicidal, they are much less so than the US's current allies in the region).  Yeah, that's some great peace making, almost as good as my ability to slam dunk (all 5'5" of me, in platforms).

(3) Not for a lack of trying, North Korea (pre his coward's turn), Iraq, Iran and Venezuela were all targets of belligerence.  It's not from a lack of ardour for war but for a lack of competence that Trump didn't start a few new ones.

(4) I didn't know that Herr Oberststurmbanngroppenfuhrer was a black Hawai'ian with a US mother and a Kenyan father.  That's a new one for me.  Trump did shit all for the US economy.  He did however did a lot to illegally boost the share prices of companies he and his sons had recently invested in.

(5) How? US presidents have very little effect on energy independence.

(6) By spaffing billions on a wall (at least when BoJo the clown climaxes he spaffs up against pre-existing wall) which covered a tiny fraction of land nobody crosses anyway, which is already in the process of falling down and which can be surmounted using such high tech as five dollar ladders or ten dollar spades.  And the people that the US needs to keep out (what the walls were designed to stop were the kind of people who traditionally came to the US to pick crops and build buildings and go home again in the winter) have this amazing new invention to circumvent the wall anyway, it's called the boat, you may not have seen one seeing as you're not the kind of person who exists at the bleeding edge of 20,000BCE technology.

(7) See (4), again nothing to do with Trump.  Oh and the "reduction in unemployment" among people of colour?  It was 0.1% over four years, not even big enough to be a statistical blip, barely a rounding mistake.

Would you care to try again touting the squirrel toupeed one's achievements, this time by not referencing solely to the fantasy inside of your head?  Remember, Dougal:

Brian Ó Seanacháin, I have a feeling you and Davin are gonna get along great! 

With me, also, and a few others.

[Icarus]

Count me in too Mags, Brian, Davin, et al..

Sorry Tom, we do not mean to gang up on you but it is useful and important for, us and all, to get the facts out in the open.

[Davin]

This discussion here started by Tom62 is the a good demonstration of the problem with misinformation peddlers.

Example:

Trump wasn't so bad, he was an asshole but he got things done.

A lie that takes all of 10 seconds to say. A lie that requires no knowledge, no effort, and no time and is about as far from reality as you can get.

To correct the misinformation, it requires a lot of knowledge, a lot of effort to compile all the bad shit Trump did, and a lot of time to write out the responses.

That's why it's a popular technique of people like white supremacists, neo-nazis, fascists, and all the dishonorable people that are not discussing in good faith. They get to put in almost no effort and watch as people that actually care about reality and the truth scramble to address the bullshit.

It's difficult to respect any one who employs these dishonest tactics.

[Tom62]

Count me in too Mags, Brian, Davin, et al..

Sorry Tom, we do not mean to gang up on you but it is useful and important for, us and all, to get the facts out in the open.

Sorry, but what I tried to explain is why the Trump supporters have voted for Trump, which is something that some people here don't seem to understand (or not willing to understand). I'm just the bringer of the bad news. So, don't blame me, if the Trump voter's reasons sounds illogical, unreasonable or pure BS.

[Davin]

Count me in too Mags, Brian, Davin, et al..

Sorry Tom, we do not mean to gang up on you but it is useful and important for, us and all, to get the facts out in the open.

Sorry, but what I tried to explain is why the Trump supporters have voted for Trump, which is something that some people here don't seem to understand (or not willing to understand). I'm just the bringer of the bad news. So, don't blame me, if the Trump voter's reasons sounds illogical, unreasonable or pure BS.

This contradicts things you've just recently said.

If you put yourself in the shoes of conservatives, libertarians or even classical liberals it easy to see why they thought that Trump was the better presidential candidate than Clinton or Biden.

Yes, Trump wasn't a master of communications nor a likable person (like Obama was), but he got some things done. So I think that most conservatives judged Trump on his actions, not his person.

Looking at the way Biden runs the presidency at this moment, I can also image very well why these people want to see Trump back.

Not good, not bad but also not evil. He is more like a second-hand car salesman than a politician. As a president, I rank him a bit above Obama, but below Clinton. Biden and GW Bush are currently on the bottom of my list.

That is not you merely bringing the bad news that is you claiming to know why and very clearly you expressing your personal views.

[billy rubin]

Count me in too Mags, Brian, Davin, et al..

Sorry Tom, we do not mean to gang up on you but it is useful and important for, us and all, to get the facts out in the open.

Sorry, but what I tried to explain is why the Trump supporters have voted for Trump, which is something that some people here don't seem to understand (or not willing to understand). I'm just the bringer of the bad news. So, don't blame me, if the Trump voter's reasons sounds illogical, unreasonable or pure BS.

i understand you.

i just cant fathom how thinking human beings can support that guy. all of the stuff he claims credit for is either twisted, nonexistent, or completely false.

and almost half the people in my country are just fine with it, not counting the politicians trying to ride his coattails

[Biggus Dickus]

[Dark Lightning]

^ "Liar, liar, pants on fire!"

[Brian Ó Seanacháin]

<snipping my rant>

Brian Ó Seanacháin, I have a feeling you and Davin are gonna get along great! 

With me, also, and a few others.
[/quote]

I did get a bit carried away, but then again when I read somebody pushing bovine excrement I tend to get into high do!