Hello, everyone!
How to start...? Goddess knows I am not good at introductions. (When I say "goddess," it is to replace "god" and question why a creator deity has to be male. Or white. Or even old. I am an atheist, but since I have to find common ground with theists in my family and at work, I have banished my image of the nasty old man with a long beard and instead imagine Whoopi Goldberg as Guinan in Star Trek: The Next Generation. This image of a hip mother goddess with dreads and wonderful hats helps me to maintain my poise when listening to godtalk.)
I may start a war with Trek fans--not a good idea in my first post!--but I have always felt that Troi and Riker should be transferred off the Enterprise so that Guinan could be both ship's counselor and Number One. And then maybe she could marry Jean-Luc Picard and be a better mother to Wesley (Picard's son, in my opinion) than Bev.
I may have just gotten myself banned from the board. ;) Maybe I can redeem myself...
Guinan is one of my six favorite Trek characters; the others are Leonard McCoy (TOS), Ro Laren (TNG), Gul Dukat (DS9), Kai Winn (DS9), and Kathryn Janeway (VOY). Who am I? A cross between Hoshi (ENT) and Tom Paris (VOY)--with liberal amounts of Monica from Friends thrown in.
Some quick stats...
Location: New York City
Age: Will be 47 in August. Don't feel my age, though.
Spirituality: Atheist since 2004, but was agnostic more than a decade earlier. Still healing from Christian Fundamentalist abuse.
Sexual Identity: Gay Male
Sexually out of the closet: August 1, 1988
First Kiss: February 18, 1990, age 24 and a half. (Yes, I was still a virgin then. It was hard to break from what Christianity said about gay men even after I came out.)
Native Language: Northeast American English
Also speak: French and Italian
Occupation: ESL (English as a Second Language) Professor and freelance writer
Hobbies: Science fiction, classic literature, comic books, podcasts, and long walks through interesting sites here in New York or elsewhere
Madly in love with: My cat
----
What else?
I may have signed onto this site for the wrong reason, as I have just been bashed by a Christian and am feeling sorry for myself. I don't usually wallow in self-pity, but I got to thinking that if I had more support from fellow atheists I might not hurt as badly when I am attacked. My closest friend and another good friend are also gay atheists, but everyone in my family and most of my other friends are Christians.
My screen name... Why am I The Walking Contradiction? I am a left-leaning political liberal but very conservative in my private life. I believe in freedom of choice and lifestyle for all, including the right to non-monogamy or polyamory, yet I can only envision monogamy for myself and have no desire to sleep with anyone outside of a committed relationship. (I know there are other gay men who think that way, but most of them are religious and it is hard to find such a non-theist who is also decent and single.)
I was never Mormon, but my friends call me The Mormon since I don't drink coffee, have never smoked, never having done recreational drugs, and have never been drunk. (I do drink socially once in a blue moon--but then only one or two drinks, usually a red wine or Woodpecker Cider. Well, actually... When I was in Brussels one December I really did enjoy the mulled wine they sold in the streets near the Grand' Place.)
Far from being a wallflower, though, I have no problem doing a lot of crazy stunts in my classroom to make my students laugh and relax so that they are not so uptight about speaking English. When I was a university student, I was hated by my peers just as I was hated in high school. Now, my university-age students enjoy my classes, seek me out, confide in me, and give me top evaluations every semester. I had to enter middle age to be accepted by young people. Go figure!
O.K., this is already too long (which is usual for me), so I had better stop here.
What else do you want to know?
More importantly, what can I contribute to the board?
Welcome! I am sorry to hear that you've had such painful experiences in the past. We have a wide range of members here who have signed up for similar reasons, including to find a support group of like-minded individuals. Several members have shared experiences they've had with less than sympathetic religious folks, and some even come from religious families who have not always been accepting of their atheism. I encourage you to browse some of the previous posts for these. We're a friendly bunch :)
I like Guinan, but no way she would marry Picard; their relationship just doesn't seem right that way. But Troi is a pretty useless character. Would have been interesting to see Riker and Ro in a real relationship, instead of that one-off when the whole crew had amnesia. Yes, fellow Trekkie here. Wife and I are watching TNG all the way through and are up to season 7.
Anyway, welcome to HAF!
Hello and welcome to HAF,
Walking Contradiction. I enjoyed your intro post! I can't speak for everyone, but I think that if you contribute your voice to conversations here, that will be plenty.
QuoteNotes for new members from Tank:
The Rules. (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=1522.0)
Users who comply with forum rules will graduate to full membership after 10 posts. Till that time your ability to post is limited to the "Getting to Know You" (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php#2) section of the forum. It is our hope that this small restriction improves the overall atmosphere of HAF.
Some threads you might find interesting.
Where did you get your username from? (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=5133.0)
10 Things About Yourself (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=4940.0)
Tell us A Bit About Where You're From (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=8215.0)
Photography (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=7607.0)
Non-religious pet peeves (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=6917.0)
Pets...what do you have? (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=7.0)
How to tell your family you are an atheist. (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=5111.0)*
"Rules for Conducting a Discussion" by Dr. Mortimer J. Adler (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=5631.0)*
*You will need 10 posts before you can add a post to this thread, but you can read it at any time.
I hope you enjoy your time reading and posting here! (https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg825.imageshack.us%2Fimg825%2F7082%2Fsmileykp.gif&hash=44804682878b80211a94c6a1e69670528bd9c4a7)
Welcome. A few contradictions never hurt anyone. Well not usually. I am not sure about Trekkies though.
Hello TWC
That was a top notch first class introduction, thank you very much for taking the time and effort to produce and post it.
A couple of questions, you say your first kiss happened after you came of of the closet. So was that your first ever kiss or your first gay kiss? Just curious.
I think your simple presence here is going to be a great contribution if/when you get involved in discussions (you have to make 10 posts before you can read the whole board). Your introduction illustrates you are intelligent (All Star Trek fans are intelligent), literate and thoughtful all good qualities in a good forum member.
Personally I'd have ejected Janeway and Chuckles out of an airlock. Voyager (or Star Trek with handbags) was the low point in the ST franchise for me; that's not to say I didn't watch every episode avidly but it was a good idea done so badly it was ridiculous. It was just Lost in Space (originally an idea by Gene Roddenberry) set in the ST universe.
What's the first thing a captain of a starship should do at the end of the intro episodes of Voyager? Well you have a finite number of crew, you can guarantee some will die on the way home and you're looking at a multi-generational crew. So firstly you create an interdisciplinary training program that immediately starts cross training crew members so vital skills and knowledge or disseminated. So engineers rotate through the science disciplines and visa versa. Secondly you create space and time for people to get to know each other and fraternisation rules are binned. Now if the producers had done this the scope for relationship investigation would have gone through the roof. Also you gain the critical factor that you can't spot the 'Red Shirts' any more. We know who can't die (Janeway, Chuckles, 7 of 9 etc etc) but by dispersing the skill set through the crew and broadening out the character pool you can afford to kill off a 'key' character now and then. If you want to see this done get the UK TV series about spys called Spooks. All bar one character has been killed off during the 6 series so if somebody points a gun at somebody you know the writers are not constrained to having some million-to-one lucky break to save them. Voyager was the ST series that could have been the best but ended up the worst; although still good compared to most SciFi on TV, with the exception of the modern Battlestar Galactica.
Welcome to HAF.
Regards
Chris
Welcome!
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 08, 2012, 07:17:15 AMI have banished my image of the nasty old man with a long beard and instead imagine Whoopi Goldberg as Guinan in Star Trek: The Next Generation. This image of a hip mother goddess with dreads and wonderful hats helps me to maintain my poise when listening to godtalk.)
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FaXA0R.png&hash=023dd59568020de1917b90dc96f8b7321487e2e4)
Ye Whoopi is OK but most of her hats were cast-offs of mine that I let her use.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ft3.gstatic.com%2Fimages%3Fq%3Dtbn%3AANd9GcQevd0eNxauNgBz4MXSS5QtOMJy0shlH786xUN3iSO9v-8nWAxksuefMQ&hash=ef58e5025664ad9132b9dba16794800629fbf3fb)
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 08, 2012, 07:17:15 AM
When I say "goddess," it is to replace "god" and question why a creator deity has to be male. Or white. Or even old.
My opinion? Because the father of modern god was a rather insecure old patriarch with limited imagination, and, being a white(-ish) sort of fellow, he could not imagine his god to be anything else.
Thank you for the replies!
Firebird: Great screen name! It makes me think of a phoenix; those of us who have been through religion do indeed rise up from the ashes.
I want to look around a bit before I post specifics on my negative experiences with religion. I was on an atheist board years ago, and I had to leave because too many Christians were critical of my observations. I never mind when someone is critical or disagrees, and, because of my experience with religion, I encourage my students to disagree with me and make it clear that teachers are not always right, The New York Times is not always right, their textbooks are not always right, I am not always right... But what I needed at the time was support, not Jesus-wants-you-to-come-back-to-him. There were also atheist members in good standing who were trolls, and I did not need that either. From what I have seen, I think this board is run a bit better, so I am a tad optimistic.
My parents (senior citizens) and my sister (a few years younger than I) are now in a very liberal Christian church and accept me as I am, but much of the extended family does not. Then again, much of the extended family has always thought I was strange and lazy because --GASP!-- I like to read. Many years ago when I became a teacher, my great uncle asked me when I was going to get a real job.
Indeed, Riker and Ro would have been interesting. I suppose my ideas on Picard and Guinan as a married couple have been strongly influenced by Peter David's New Frontier novels. Love Mackenzie Calhoun!
Recusant: Thank you for the welcome--and for the wonderful list of places for me to post. Count on my visiting some.
I have read the forum rules and understand that my first ten posts are limited to this section. (I am confused, though, as I have seen both ten and fifty as the number of posts one needs to be a full member. Would ten grant ensign status and fifty lietuenant status? Does one need ten or fifty posts to modify a profile? [I cannot currently modify my age and gender, for example].) I can see why these rules are in place, and I do think it is a good idea to limit a newbie.
markmmcdaniel: Oh, there are even more contradictions than the ones I have listed...
Tank: Did you know that there was a 1980s comic book super-hero, a member of The DNAgents, with your screen name? He's the guy with the red visor: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_DNAgents
Yes, my first kiss in 1990 was also my first gay kiss. I had kissed a few young women on the cheek over the years but had never had a --passionate-- kiss with anyone until that one.
I agree that Star Trek fans are often very intelligent and think outside of the box. I would add general science fiction or comic fans, general geeks/nerds, goths and punk rockers, and a host of other people who are 'different' to the list. I try to nurture all my students, but I am especially pleased with the work of these 'different' folks. (I teach four classes every semester, and at least one is always a beginners ESL class. However, most of my classes are for students who already speak English kinda sorta well enough but need to bring it up to an academic level for study in the U.S. 'Difference' in a foreign accent, particularly from countries like Saudi Arabia and China, is something I cherish. And the cool thing this summer semester is how well my Saudi and Israeli students get along and even hang out together. Love it--especially since I am half Arab myself and support both Israel and Palestine; I choose people, not governments!)
I am also Sicilian on my father's side, and I get stereotyped in many different ways as a person of Arabic and Sicilian/Italian descent.
I guess 'Chuckles' is Chakotay(?). I was not fond of him, as Robert Beltran cannot act and the character is a stereotype. (But he is hardly my least favorite Trek character. That honor goes to the unbelievably annoying Keiko O'Brien.)
Your take on what Voyager should have been is very interesting, and I can see where it would have made for a more enoyable series. Alas, what could have been... I agree that not being able to spot the redshirts would have been a positive step. And yes, in British series main characters are never safe.
Hee hee... I could conceivably spend all my time on this board writing about Star Trek and never get to atheism...
xSilver Phinx: Thank you!
The Magic Pudding: How could you ever cast off such wonderful hats?!!
Asmodean: Love what you wrote--and agree.
:D
You just wasted 6 posts AND made it difficult for anybody to reply to your post. It's a good idea to quote each post you want to reply to and reply to it, then a response can be made to your reply without having to de-construct your reply etc etc.
You don't get charged by the post here.
Hi TWC,
Welcome.
I'm sorry to inform you that you are SOOOO wide of the ST-TNG mark ;D. As a gay man, you must have missed the best-presented characters in the show - specifically Deannas two closest friends...
And cardboard as she may be - (and not a little confused to be shacked up with that rainbow-faced dufus Neelix) - Kes ticks many of my boxes with her elvish naivete.
As for deep philosophical coupling - there can be only one; Catherine (I'm a sucker for powerful women)
I also feel a certain sympathy for the Ferengi. They're given a bad rap just because their values are DIFFERENT from those of humans; not worse, just different. Quark is my Objectivist hero!
Anyway, glad to have set you straight... :D And, yes, 'superficial' is my middle name...
Hope to hear more of your input. Have fun...
Quote from: Tank on July 08, 2012, 04:34:02 PM
:D
You just wasted 6 posts AND made it difficult for anybody to reply to your post. It's a good idea to quote each post you want to reply to and reply to it, then a response can be made to your reply without having to de-construct your reply etc etc.
You don't get charged by the post here.
I am happy to reply with a series of many posts, one after the other as I will do now, if that is the preferred way of communicating on this forum. I don't care about how many posts I write or when I become a full member, though; I am more concerned with quality discussion. Also, wouldn't it be boring to see six posts in a row from the same person? Putting them all together seems so much tidier, he says in his anal-retentive mindset...
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 08, 2012, 05:05:55 PM
Quote from: Tank on July 08, 2012, 04:34:02 PM
:D
You just wasted 6 posts AND made it difficult for anybody to reply to your post. It's a good idea to quote each post you want to reply to and reply to it, then a response can be made to your reply without having to de-construct your reply etc etc.
You don't get charged by the post here.
I am happy to reply with a series of many posts, one after the other as I will do now, if that is the preferred way of communicating on this forum. I don't care about how many posts I write or when I become a full member, though; I am more concerned with quality discussion. Also, wouldn't it be boring to see six posts in a row from the same person? Putting them all together seems so much tidier, he says in his anal-retentive mindset...
It's not boring at all to read 6 replies and whether displayed in one or six posts by quoting and replying one always has a context in which to read your reply.
Quote from: Scissorlegs on July 08, 2012, 04:57:41 PM
Hi TWC,
Welcome.
I'm sorry to inform you that you are SOOOO wide of the ST-TNG mark ;D. As a gay man, you must have missed the best-presented characters in the show - specifically Deannas two closest friends...
And cardboard as she may be - (and not a little confused to be shacked up with that rainbow-faced dufus Neelix) - Kes ticks many of my boxes with her elvish naivete.
As for deep philosophical coupling - there can be only one; Catherine (I'm a sucker for powerful women)
I also feel a certain sympathy for the Ferengi. They're given a bad rap just because their values are DIFFERENT from those of humans; not worse, just different. Quark is my Objectivist hero!
Anyway, glad to have set you straight... :D And, yes, 'superficial' is my middle name...
Hope to hear more of your input. Have fun...
Remember... Walking contradiction. I horrify fellow gay men when I say that Tom Welling is not good looking. ("You should have your gay membership revoked," says a friend.) My tastes are unbelievably eclectic and suit neither my straight friends nor my gay friends. There is usually much eye rolling when I discuss my tastes.
Of course, after a friend asked me to name three women I would have the hots for if I were straight (Nichelle Nichols, Elizabeth Montgomery, and Erica Durance), I asked him to name one man he would sleep with if he were gay. He said... Richard Nixon. (No, I am not kidding. I should add that this friend is a Republican.)
Jensen Ackles is my main squeeze. I watch
Supernatural only for him--I love his character as much as his physical appearance but, in general, I don't care at all for the show. Still, I never miss it. So yes, call me superficial too.
I have also adored Scott Bakula since
Quantum Leap, and I think he gets better and better looking with age.
Kes has a great voice, but I just don't see anything else in her. At times she has charm or an interesting storyline, so I don't dislike her. She just isn't one of my favorites. Neelix... UGH!
Kathryn Janeway: One of my favorite characters, so we definitely agree here. She also beats Picard as best Captain by only a teeny tiny bit. But... I think Picard would make the more interesting best friend.
I used to hate the Ferengi but now love them for reasons similar to yours. The same is true of my relationship with the Cardassians. And if you want to read an excellent
Star Trek novel, a gem among all the trash, try
The Neverending Sacrifice by Una McCormack. She understands the Cardassians even better than the
Star Trek writers--not surprising since she is a Professor of sociology and has constructed their society based on the hints we get in the various episodes. The book is about 95% Cardassian (including most of the Cardassians we know from
DS9) and 5% Federation.
Conversely, I used to love Julian Bashir but now can't stand him.
Me, I like the Ferengi, but that shouldn't surprise too many people here... Cardassians too, which is equally unsurprising, really.
Welcome!
I need to alert my husband as to the star trek debate. I'm sure he'd love to contribute. ;D
Welcome! Nice intro, 203% better than mine. ;D
Quote from: Budhorse4 on July 08, 2012, 05:53:44 PM
Welcome! Nice intro, 203% better than mine. ;D
208% actually ;D
Welcome, TWC! I'll shorten you to TWC because WC alone might give an unsalubrious impression. ;)
Quote from: Tank on July 08, 2012, 06:38:36 PM
Quote from: Budhorse4 on July 08, 2012, 05:53:44 PM
Welcome! Nice intro, 203% better than mine. ;D
208% actually ;D
I actually don't have anything snarky to say about that.
Hello and welcome! What can you contribute? Well I speak somewhat decent Spanish and I heard Italian is very similar so... teach us Italian!!!
Another Star Trek fan, good stuff! By the way, are we Trekkies or Trekkers? I always get that confused. I've been addicted to ST since I saw the first episode in 1966 -- I was eleven then and already deep into sci fi.
I would also liked to have seen Guinan in a bigger part, and love the idea of her being the ship's Counselor. To me, Troi never seemed like more than pretty stage setting. As for her two best friends, it struck me as sad that a ship like Enterprise apparently didn't have a sauna in it, or did I miss the Troi/sauna scenes?
I agree with what Tank wrote about Voyager, except I would keep Kathryn Janeway (it's a woman thing). As for fraternizing allowed among the crew, I get first dibs on Tuvok. If time-warping cross-overs are allowed, I get first dibs on Tuvok and T'Pol -- I'm a bisexual with a Vulcan fetish, sue me.
Really should say something about atheism here, but I can't think of anything. And on a Sunday, too.
I remember watching Voyager with my brother. We would always crack jokes about how Tuvok sounded like Tupac.
The Walking Contradiction, welcome! :)
Awesome intro, very glad to meet you! I'm somewhat of a Star Trek fan, but not nearly as much of one as most of the folks here, it seems. The other neat thing I saw mentioned in your first post is that you're an ESL teacher. I am too, but instead of a classroom I work from home and teach folks in several different countries. It's SO awesome speaking with them, and really, really rewarding. Like you, I love using humour and being silly whenever it's possible - it really DOES help them reduce their stress/anxiety levels. I'm teaching mostly adults and a few kids right now, and wearing funny hats, scarves, and silly shirts etc go a long way towards making the kids giggle. The adults too, occasionally. In our field, we can't take ourselves too seriously. ;D
I have to echo Tank's criticism of Voyager, but personally the only characters I find really appealing in the whole series are Tom Paris and the Doctor (though since I've become a hardcore Whovian, Voyager's Doctor is just kinda white bread). I liked Kes, but she left too early. Chakotay, imo, was a failed attempt to add depth, Tuvok was just plain bland, Harry was uninteresting, B'Elanna had only 2 (maybe 3) stories that kept getting recycled, Seven was just eye candy (not to mention an inferior parallel to Data's quest for humanity), and Neelix may be the single most annoying/useless Trek main in the history of the franchise. Janeway, while I didn't mind her too much, is simply a lesser Picard.
As for the Picard/Guinan dynamic, I don't think they'd ever get married. Picard consistently classifies their relationship as being "beyond friendship, beyond family," which I take to also connote an absence of any kind of physical or sexual desire. Picard also tends to favour ladies who are more adventurous (Vash, even Anij from Insurrection), which Guinan's soft-spoken personality and general mellowness seems to exclude her from being.
Next Gen will likely always be my fav, but DS9 is definitely by far the most critically interesting of the series (though I thoroughly enjoy the grittiness of Enterprise as well).
Oh yes, and welcome to the forum, TWC! ;D
I wonder if this thread comes under "Don't post controversial topics" rule.
Hi,
Tank. Maybe I can compromise and keep everything in one post but also provide all the quotes...?
Quote from: Asmodean on July 08, 2012, 05:44:47 PM
Me, I like the Ferengi, but that shouldn't surprise too many people here... Cardassians too, which is equally unsurprising, really.
I love these two races because they are so different from other humanoids in their core beliefs, motivation, and deception. As much as I love
Voyager, its aliens races are not nearly as interesting as those explored in
Deep Space Nine. Alien races of even induviduals (humans or aliens) with unusual make-up and motivations make for interesting shows. This is particularly true of the five
Treks where, in my opinion, only one episode in four is really good.
I also adored the first two seasons of
Andromeda because of its interesting alien races and premise. Unfortunately, I only liked a few of the episodes in seasons three and four, and I hated almost everything about season five. Still, there was one reason to watch everything, even season five: Seamus Harper is just plain hilarious. One of the best characters in any science fiction series... EVER! I also like the way the very strong women (Bekka, Rommie, and post-metamorphosis Trance) were usually written. I could have done without Kevin Sorbo, though.
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on July 08, 2012, 05:45:58 PM
Welcome!
I need to alert my husband as to the star trek debate. I'm sure he'd love to contribute. ;D
The more Trekkers, the merrier! :D
Quote from: Tank on July 08, 2012, 06:38:36 PM
Quote from: Budhorse4 on July 08, 2012, 05:53:44 PM
Welcome! Nice intro, 203% better than mine. ;D
208% actually ;D
Wow, I'm flattered! :D
Quote from: OldGit on July 08, 2012, 07:06:14 PM
Welcome, TWC! I'll shorten you to TWC because WC alone might give an unsalubrious impression. ;)
While it is true that I do not wish to be called toilet, I don't mind being compared to W.C. Fields. I heard that he left money to build an orphanage--with the provision that children in it were never to be taught religion. I don't know if that is true, but if it is then he is my hero.
Quote from: Anti-antidisestablishmentarianism on July 08, 2012, 07:19:37 PM
Hello and welcome! What can you contribute? Well I speak somewhat decent Spanish and I heard Italian is very similar so... teach us Italian!!!
I am always amused when my Spanish, Italian, and Brazilian Portuguese students understand each other even though each is using his or her native language. This only works in basic language, though, as more advanced vocabulary and grammar can differ sharply.
I am not a native Italian speaker, but I can hold my own with people who do not speak English and make time to read and listen to videos in Italian.
Not sure if you are talking about real lessons, beginning with basic vocabulary and grammar, or if you just want some useful words and phrases.
In my opinion, the most useful phrase is
Dov'è il gabinetto? (Where's the bathroom?). The accent in
Dov'è goes on the second syllable (do VAY) since the word is a contaction of "where" (
dove) and "is" (
è)--similar to "doesn't" (does not) or "won't" (will not) in English. Unlike English, the contraction is mandatory. If you put the accent on the first syllable (DO vay), you say the sentence without a verb ("Where bathroom?").
Gabinetto means cabinet, as in water closet or WC. The "tt" is voiced and should be pronounced midway between an English T and D.
Some useful Italian words for atheists:
atheist (noun or adjective) =
ateoatheists =
ateiagnostic (noun or adjective) =
agnostico. (Note: Italian
gn is pronouced like Spanish
ñ.)
heathen =
paganosecular humanism =
umanesimo secolareI am not sure about the difference between
secolare and
laico for "secular" as an adjective. They may be interchangeable.
Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on July 08, 2012, 08:49:54 PM
Another Star Trek fan, good stuff! By the way, are we Trekkies or Trekkers? I always get that confused. I've been addicted to ST since I saw the first episode in 1966 -- I was eleven then and already deep into sci fi.
I would also liked to have seen Guinan in a bigger part, and love the idea of her being the ship's Counselor. To me, Troi never seemed like more than pretty stage setting. As for her two best friends, it struck me as sad that a ship like Enterprise apparently didn't have a sauna in it, or did I miss the Troi/sauna scenes?
I agree with what Tank wrote about Voyager, except I would keep Kathryn Janeway (it's a woman thing). As for fraternizing allowed among the crew, I get first dibs on Tuvok. If time-warping cross-overs are allowed, I get first dibs on Tuvok and T'Pol -- I'm a bisexual with a Vulcan fetish, sue me.
Really should say something about atheism here, but I can't think of anything. And on a Sunday, too.
As I understand it, the original term was Trekkie, but that is now a put-down. Trekker is more, um, PC.
I was barely out of diapers when I first saw
Star Trek seated on my father's knee.
Nothing wrong with a Vulcan fetish. I have a Romulan fetish, and I suppose that just means Vulcans with emotions... Then there is my Andorian fetish... You know that in fan literature you need four Andorians for sex, right? ;D
Quote from: Budhorse4 on July 08, 2012, 08:54:11 PM
I remember watching Voyager with my brother. We would always crack jokes about how Tuvok sounded like Tupac.
I like that!
Quote from: Amicale on July 08, 2012, 09:31:02 PM
The Walking Contradiction, welcome! :)
Awesome intro, very glad to meet you! I'm somewhat of a Star Trek fan, but not nearly as much of one as most of the folks here, it seems. The other neat thing I saw mentioned in your first post is that you're an ESL teacher. I am too, but instead of a classroom I work from home and teach folks in several different countries. It's SO awesome speaking with them, and really, really rewarding. Like you, I love using humour and being silly whenever it's possible - it really DOES help them reduce their stress/anxiety levels. I'm teaching mostly adults and a few kids right now, and wearing funny hats, scarves, and silly shirts etc go a long way towards making the kids giggle. The adults too, occasionally. In our field, we can't take ourselves too seriously. ;D
A teacher is a teacher is a teacher. It isn't the location that makes a teacher a teacher. You sound really cool, and I am sure your students have a wonderful time learning from you.
Quote from: Yodas_Apprentice on July 08, 2012, 10:08:44 PM
I have to echo Tank's criticism of Voyager, but personally the only characters I find really appealing in the whole series are Tom Paris and the Doctor (though since I've become a hardcore Whovian, Voyager's Doctor is just kinda white bread). I liked Kes, but she left too early. Chakotay, imo, was a failed attempt to add depth, Tuvok was just plain bland, Harry was uninteresting, B'Elanna had only 2 (maybe 3) stories that kept getting recycled, Seven was just eye candy (not to mention an inferior parallel to Data's quest for humanity), and Neelix may be the single most annoying/useless Trek main in the history of the franchise. Janeway, while I didn't mind her too much, is simply a lesser Picard.
As for the Picard/Guinan dynamic, I don't think they'd ever get married. Picard consistently classifies their relationship as being "beyond friendship, beyond family," which I take to also connote an absence of any kind of physical or sexual desire. Picard also tends to favour ladies who are more adventurous (Vash, even Anij from Insurrection), which Guinan's soft-spoken personality and general mellowness seems to exclude her from being.
Next Gen will likely always be my fav, but DS9 is definitely by far the most critically interesting of the series (though I thoroughly enjoy the grittiness of Enterprise as well).
Oh yes, and welcome to the forum, TWC! ;D
I agree that Tom Paris and the Doctor were two of the more interesting characters in
Voyager. While I did like Seven and Janeway very much and must disagree with you there, I agree with your assessment of how poor some of the other characters were. I wanted to like Tuvok, Harry, and B'Elanna, but could not. Chakotay and Neelix... Double ick!
One great addition to
Voyager towards the end of its run, however, was one of my favorite characters, Icheb. He was everything Wesley should have been but wasn't--and aside from a couple of embarrassing scenes Icheb had none of Wesley's annoying qualities and did not put the ship in danger every other week. And then there is that delicious episode with Icheb and Q, Jr.--oh, the slash potential!
Hmmm... I did say that Picard and Guinan should marry, but I said nothing of sex. "Beyond friendship, beyond family" can also be beyond sex. In my opinion, theirs can be an intensely loving asexual pairing.
Quote from: Tank on July 08, 2012, 10:15:15 PM
I wonder if this thread comes under "Don't post controversial topics" rule.
Hope not!!! :o :o :o
TWC please do separate posts so others don't have to dig out bits from your posts. ;D
Thanks
Quote from: Tank on July 08, 2012, 10:31:58 PM
TWC please do separate posts so others don't have to dig out bits from your posts. ;D
Thanks
Will do from now on. No problem.
Almost forgot... Here is the love of my life. Her name is Roscoe.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1155.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp544%2Fmaj280%2FRoscoeandthecomputer-3-01-19-12.jpg&hash=81c94517adf09d1aa41e1afb87a80de32452d24a)
Personally I think Q had the best line in Voyager when he referred to Nelix as "bar rodent".
Or possibly this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=circ3_-JJy0
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 08, 2012, 10:36:21 PM
Quote from: Tank on July 08, 2012, 10:31:58 PM
TWC please do separate posts so others don't have to dig out bits from your posts. ;D
Thanks
Will do from now on. No problem.
Almost forgot... Here is the love of my life. Her name is Roscoe.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1155.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp544%2Fmaj280%2FRoscoeandthecomputer-3-01-19-12.jpg&hash=81c94517adf09d1aa41e1afb87a80de32452d24a)
What a magnificent pussy!!!
Yay! Another cat person! I think we have officially taken over!
I have a black and white kitty, as well as a ticked tabby. They're my boys and I love them (even though one is kinda an asshole and the other requires daily medication and throws up a lot).
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 08, 2012, 10:30:11 PM
Hmmm... I did say that Picard and Guinan should marry, but I said nothing of sex. "Beyond friendship, beyond family" can also be beyond sex. In my opinion, theirs can be an intensely loving asexual pairing.
Call me old-fashioned, but I just don't see any point to marrying if you're not getting sex out of it. Marriage without sex is just friendship, unless you're doing it for legal benefits and I don't imagine that's an issue any more in the ST:TNG universe.
And I'm another of the cat people around here -- my DeeDee:
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm8.staticflickr.com%2F7149%2F6827732863_e0c5e0615c.jpg&hash=3a53c2f691ff8a2f06de62667fbb46c2097e0015)
Quote from: Tank on July 08, 2012, 10:38:34 PM
Personally I think Q had the best line in Voyager when he referred to Nelix as "bar rodent".
Or possibly this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=circ3_-JJy0
If I remember correctly, I think I saw that episode with a friend the first time around, and I think he applauded at the "bar rodent" line. Q nailed that one!
Roscoe thanks you for calling her magnificent. "Tank nailed that one," she said.
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on July 08, 2012, 10:45:29 PM
Yay! Another cat person! I think we have officially taken over!
I have a black and white kitty, as well as a ticked tabby. They're my boys and I love them (even though one is kinda an asshole and the other requires daily medication and throws up a lot).
Roscoe also needs medication and sometimes throws up. She was a street cat I rescued at the end of August 2011, when Hurricane Irene was about to hit New York. I had been feeding her for a while before that and was also looking for a home for her. We had bonded, and there was no way I was going to leave her out in a hurricane. A vet my sister knows well put her up during the storm, and I paid for a bath and a thorough medical exam. (Unfortunately, she has FIV.)
I was not looking for a first pet, but everything has worked out beautifully. Roscoe and I get along well and respect each other's space. She also sleeps in my bed (despite having her own cat bed) about 50% of the time.
Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on July 08, 2012, 10:50:51 PM
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 08, 2012, 10:30:11 PM
Hmmm... I did say that Picard and Guinan should marry, but I said nothing of sex. "Beyond friendship, beyond family" can also be beyond sex. In my opinion, theirs can be an intensely loving asexual pairing.
Call me old-fashioned, but I just don't see any point to marrying if you're not getting sex out of it. Marriage without sex is just friendship, unless you're doing it for legal benefits and I don't imagine that's an issue any more in the ST:TNG universe.
And I'm another of the cat people around here -- my DeeDee:
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm8.staticflickr.com%2F7149%2F6827732863_e0c5e0615c.jpg&hash=3a53c2f691ff8a2f06de62667fbb46c2097e0015)
DeeDee is gorgeous! I especially love the brownish patches on the white beneath her nose.
You are not old-fashioned; I just tend to be too PC for my own good.
But that aside, I know and respect asexuals and am often saddened when people don't accept asexuality as a sexual identity. Devoted asexual couples do exist, and they get married for reasons other than sex since they have no interest in sex. There are also couples in which one person is asexual (Guinan?) and one is not (Picard). That necessitates a lot of patience and negotiations. I believe Guinan and Picard could make it work. I do not know if I could make it work.
But please feel free to disagree. I know my idea is not popular.
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 08, 2012, 10:36:21 PM
Quote from: Tank on July 08, 2012, 10:31:58 PM
TWC please do separate posts so others don't have to dig out bits from your posts. ;D
Thanks
Will do from now on. No problem.
Almost forgot... Here is the love of my life. Her name is Roscoe.
(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1155.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp544%2Fmaj280%2FRoscoeandthecomputer-3-01-19-12.jpg&hash=81c94517adf09d1aa41e1afb87a80de32452d24a)
Roscoe looks very full of herself. She and my lizard would get alond fabulously.
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 09, 2012, 12:00:42 AM
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on July 08, 2012, 10:45:29 PM
Yay! Another cat person! I think we have officially taken over!
I have a black and white kitty, as well as a ticked tabby. They're my boys and I love them (even though one is kinda an asshole and the other requires daily medication and throws up a lot).
Roscoe also needs medication and sometimes throws up. She was a street cat I rescued at the end of August 2011, when Hurricane Irene was about to hit New York. I had been feeding her for a while before that and was also looking for a home for her. We had bonded, and there was no way I was going to leave her out in a hurricane. A vet my sister knows well put her up during the storm, and I paid for a bath and a thorough medical exam. (Unfortunately, she has FIV.)
I was not looking for a first pet, but everything has worked out beautifully. Roscoe and I get along well and respect each other's space. She also sleeps in my bed (despite having her own cat bed) about 50% of the time.
Aww, that's a lovely story. I worked in a vet clinic for two years (doing reception/assistant type stuff) and there are a lot of people who would have put an FIV positive kitty down right away. You're good to take care of her. I call Ollie my "Gentleman Kitty" because he's gentle and also spends a lot of time in our bed (he usually comes to say goodnight to me every evening, at the very least). There's nothing like a warm bed with a ball-of-fur companion. :)
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 09, 2012, 12:07:17 AM
DeeDee is gorgeous! I especially love the brownish patches on the white beneath her nose.
Yeah, I think it makes her look like she's been eating butterscotch.
QuoteBut that aside, I know and respect asexuals and am often saddened when people don't accept asexuality as a sexual identity. Devoted asexual couples do exist, and they get married for reasons other than sex since they have no interest in sex.
I have no problem accepting asexuality, and I can see a sexless marriage in a society where you get benefits out of it that aren't availabe to the unmarried (personally think the inconvenience of no sex in the marriage would out-weigh any number of benefits, but that's just me), just doesn't seem that sort of unequal distribution of benefits would still exist in -- what is it? -- the 26th century.
Ok more than a few contradictions might be a problem. I would still watch out for the Trekkies first.
Quote from: Budhorse4 on July 09, 2012, 01:21:15 AM
Roscoe looks very full of herself. She and my lizard would get alond fabulously.
In the photo, Roscoe is very proud of herself. I had asked her to include a message in the e-mail I was sending a friend, and she typed several K's and 8's...
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on July 09, 2012, 02:11:05 AM
Aww, that's a lovely story. I worked in a vet clinic for two years (doing reception/assistant type stuff) and there are a lot of people who would have put an FIV positive kitty down right away. You're good to take care of her. I call Ollie my "Gentleman Kitty" because he's gentle and also spends a lot of time in our bed (he usually comes to say goodnight to me every evening, at the very least). There's nothing like a warm bed with a ball-of-fur companion. :)
Ah yes, that warm ball of fur has cheered me up many times.
As to putting down an FIV kitty... Just look into Roscoe's eyes. How could anyone do that?
Hee hee. Love the butterscotch line.
I also love your screen name. Cats and books are two of the greatest joys in life!
Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on July 09, 2012, 02:33:45 AM
I have no problem accepting asexuality, and I can see a sexless marriage in a society where you get benefits out of it that aren't availabe to the unmarried (personally think the inconvenience of no sex in the marriage would out-weigh any number of benefits, but that's just me), just doesn't seem that sort of unequal distribution of benefits would still exist in -- what is it? -- the 26th century.
I don't think I would be very happy in a sexless marriage either.
As I understand it, asexuals can be heteroromantic (romantically but not sexually attracted to the opposite sex), homoromantic (romantically but not sexually attracted to the same sex), biromantic (romantically but not sexually attracted to both sexes), or aromantic (not romantically or sexually attracted to anyone). People in the first three categories--not aromantics--would cuddle, lightly kiss, want to be together... Just not have sex. So, aside from tax benefits and health plans, there are couple-oriented reasons for some asexuals to be together.
Of course, this is quite a blanket statement/generalization on my part, and I am but an outsider looking in and really wanting to understand and be supportive. Not every asexual fits into these constructs so smoothly just as others do not fit so smoothly into the modern Western constructs of heterosexual, biseuxal, lesbian, and gay.
---
To all:
If anyone here is looking for a really, really good board where you can talk to other asexuals, here is one on which I posted as a guest years ago when someone I know came out as asexual: http://www.asexuality.org/home/
Quote from: markmcdaniel on July 09, 2012, 03:14:26 AM
Ok more than a few contradictions might be a problem. I would still watch out for the Trekkies first.
Yes, contradictions and Trekkies can both be a problem if allowed to run around unsupervised at a convention. Have you ever seen the video of fans in Klingon dress and mode practically terrorizing the waiters in a Thai restaurant? ;D
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 09, 2012, 12:00:42 AM
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on July 08, 2012, 10:45:29 PM
Yay! Another cat person! I think we have officially taken over!
I have a black and white kitty, as well as a ticked tabby. They're my boys and I love them (even though one is kinda an asshole and the other requires daily medication and throws up a lot).
Roscoe also needs medication and sometimes throws up. She was a street cat I rescued at the end of August 2011, when Hurricane Irene was about to hit New York. I had been feeding her for a while before that and was also looking for a home for her. We had bonded, and there was no way I was going to leave her out in a hurricane. A vet my sister knows well put her up during the storm, and I paid for a bath and a thorough medical exam. (Unfortunately, she has FIV.)
I was not looking for a first pet, but everything has worked out beautifully. Roscoe and I get along well and respect each other's space. She also sleeps in my bed (despite having her own cat bed) about 50% of the time.
No. You sleep in HER bed. You haven't got this cat thing sorted yet have you :D
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 09, 2012, 03:41:29 AM
Quote from: markmcdaniel on July 09, 2012, 03:14:26 AM
Ok more than a few contradictions might be a problem. I would still watch out for the Trekkies first.
Yes, contradictions and Trekkies can both be a problem if allowed to run around unsupervised at a convention. Have you ever seen the video of fans in Klingon dress and mode practically terrorizing the waiters in a Thai restaurant? ;D
I have not seen the video, but I imagine that it shows why the true Trekkie should not be allowed to breed. Obviously no one in this forum is a true Trekkkie I hope *cringes in fear*.
Quote from: markmcdaniel on July 09, 2012, 10:59:45 AM
I have not seen the video, but I imagine that it shows why the true Trekkie should not be allowed to breed. Obviously no one in this forum is a true Trekkkie I hope *cringes in fear*.
Somehow, I don't think preventing that is much of a problem.
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 08, 2012, 07:17:15 AM
Spirituality: Atheist since 2004, but was agnostic more than a decade earlier. Still healing from Christian Fundamentalist abuse.
Hello and welcome from a Christian. Sorry for my fundie bretheren.
Quote from: Tank on July 09, 2012, 08:45:19 AM
No. You sleep in HER bed. You haven't got this cat thing sorted yet have you :D
You got that right! ;D :D ;)
Quote from: markmcdaniel on July 09, 2012, 10:59:45 AM
I have not seen the video, but I imagine that it shows why the true Trekkie should not be allowed to breed. Obviously no one in this forum is a true Trekkkie I hope *cringes in fear*.
EEEEEEKKKKK!!!!!!! It's the beginning of a logical fallacy debate. :o
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman)
Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on July 09, 2012, 02:53:09 PM
Quote from: markmcdaniel on July 09, 2012, 10:59:45 AM
I have not seen the video, but I imagine that it shows why the true Trekkie should not be allowed to breed. Obviously no one in this forum is a true Trekkkie I hope *cringes in fear*.
Somehow, I don't think preventing that is much of a problem.
Well, the old joke is that female
Star Trek, science fiction or super-hero comic fans will never be lonely since guys at conventions outnumber them ten to one...
(Sounds like a lovely place for a single gay guy like me... ;D )
The discussion of the Christian stance in regard to homosexuality has been split off to its own thread (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=10273.0).
Quote from: Recusant on July 10, 2012, 02:46:19 AM
The discussion of the Christian stance in regard to homosexuality has been split off to its own thread (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=10273.0).
Thank you very, very much for that,
Recusant! In truth, I hope to stay out of this debate. I did not come here to debate Christians and, at present, I really do just want to get to know people via this section even though I am past ten posts.
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 10, 2012, 02:53:58 AM
Quote from: Recusant on July 10, 2012, 02:46:19 AM
The discussion of the Christian stance in regard to homosexuality has been split off to its own thread (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=10273.0).
Thank you very, very much for that, Recusant! In truth, I hope to stay out of this debate. I did not come here to debate Christians and, at present, I really do just want to get to know people via this section even though I am past ten posts.
It looks like your avatar is from an Archie comic. Which character is that? :)
Quote from: Amicale on July 10, 2012, 02:55:48 AM
Quote from: TheWalkingContradiction on July 10, 2012, 02:53:58 AM
Quote from: Recusant on July 10, 2012, 02:46:19 AM
The discussion of the Christian stance in regard to homosexuality has been split off to its own thread (http://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/index.php?topic=10273.0).
Thank you very, very much for that, Recusant! In truth, I hope to stay out of this debate. I did not come here to debate Christians and, at present, I really do just want to get to know people via this section even though I am past ten posts.
It looks like your avatar is from an Archie comic. Which character is that? :)
Seymour, about whom there were only ever two comics. Both came out in 1963, and both are hilarious. Unlike
Sabrina the Teenage Witch, That Wilkin Boy, Josie and the Pussycats, Wilbur, The Madhouse Glads, and all the other spin-offs through the years,
Seymour never took off.
The drawing is by my favorite Archie artist, the late Dan DeCarlo (husband to the Belgian woman on whom Josie was based and father to the current Dan DeCarlo, whose Archie artwork is not as good as his father's was).
Here are some captures from
Seymour, My Son and
More Seymour: http://superitch.com/?p=15968
In terms of all comic artists, DeCarlo is my third favorite after Steve Rude (who is still alive and still writing/drawing super-heroes--and does incredible work on
Nexus) and the late Kurt Schaffenburger (known largely but not exclusively for his work on 60s/70s/80s Superman companion titles like
Lois Lane, Jimmy Olsen, Superman Family, and
Superboy).
Add a few pounds and years, and Seymour is basically what I look like.