Title: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 11, 2011, 09:17:36 PM
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 11, 2011, 09:17:36 PM
Hello everyone! A pleasure to see a group of intelligent people gathering via' the internet, especially on a forum with seemingly effective control over trolling.
But, a bit about me.
I'm currently 18 years old, and have been homeschooled all of my life. The past four years or so, however, my parents stopped teaching me and allowed me to take the reigns of my own education. And my, what an amazing path it has led me down.
My father (Actually my great grandfather. I'm adopted.) was and still is a very passionate "HELLLLFIREEE" screaming Southern Baptist Preacher, and my mother though not quite so... enthusiastic as he is, is still an ardent Christian. Needless to say, the things I was taught for so many years and the well intentioned mind control they both instilled in me was hard to break off, but now that it has, thank The Great X it has!
Living in Alabama (Somewhere that the only religions bigger than Christianiy are Fox Newsism and Footballanity.) on a goat farm in the middle of nowhere on a dirt road about thirty minutes away from the nearest town on 200+ acres of wild forest and rough terrain has given me plenty of time, whether working, studying, or simply wandering about, to see the natural world, the beauty in it, and the marvelous creatures it has produced.
My religious life was a strange one, at best. Of course for the first ten years or so of my life I never questioned Christianity and the Bible as being the only unquestionable sources of truth in the world, and knew full well that to question them by refusing the man Jesus (Though there's little to no evidence to even support he actually exited.) would certainly mean I'd be sent to an eternity of torture, and crying, and pain, and anguish, and agony, and blindness, and deafness, and choking, and gnashing of teeth. (By a loving God, no less!) I was never given any education about other religions or worldviews other than that of the Conservative Republican Christians. The only mention I even remember my parents making of other religions (At least before 9/11.) was making fun of Buddah for being fat.
I was happy, somewhat, but always confused about different things, and when I raised a question about the things happening in the world, or why God would allow such suffering, or why certain parts of the Bible made no sense, I would tend to get the usual responce of "We're just not meant to understand!/God works in mysterious ways!/God killed/sentenced these people to eternity of suffering because of ________, and He's justified in doing so!" Something inside of me was always empty, however.
Then, around the age of 12, I gained access to a marvelous thing called the internet. And books, oh man, the many books I found! The articles! The information overload was astounding! And all of a sudden, other ways to look at things actually seemed to exist. And of course, I dissagreed with every single one of them. But wouldn't you dissagree with 2+2=4 if all your life you were told the answer was 3?
Not willing to give up my belief in a higher power, but fed up with the nonsensical and rather boring (In comparison, at least.) beliefs of Christianity, I converted to being a Wiccan. (My parents never knew.) I studied every work of magic and the occult I could get my hands on, whether from the library or the internet. I studied, I learned, I cast spells, but still, nothing. It was interesting, no doubt. (The ability to contact spirits and elves was very appealing to me at the time.) But I was still left with a nonsensical system with so many holes in the "logic" of it all, that it just hurt.
So, for the next four years or so, I went back to Christianity. Not just out of habit, no, with a full fledged resolve to find the God presented to us by the Bible. And how did I do that? Well, by not reading the Bible, of course! But by listening to the multitudes of classy young Christian speakers who all gave their wonderful examples and metaphors to attempt to prove the existence of the Biblical God. (And, I admit, some of the arguments were compelling, but at the time, ALL of them appeared to be to a young man who was looking for the very thing they were presenting.) And at the age of 14, I accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Saviour.
Or, so I thought.
What did I get? A warm fuzzy sensation. Check. Emotional and "spiritual" highs. Check. A sense of peace and calm. Check. TOTAL belief, no matter what ANYONE said that Christianity was the one true way. Check.
I became so closed minded that it pains me now to think of the things I used to believe. Though it wasn't to last, because in the past year and a half I actually put together all of the information I've gathered. You could call me an information junkie, I want to know everything about everything. I buy a large box full of books every other week at the flea market in town for around 10 bucks, consume the contents, and repeat. (Great store, paperbacks for 50 cents, hard backs for one dollar. And they have every book imaginable at some point.) I scour hundreds of internet articles and watch more videos than I can count every month. What am I looking for? Truth. Whatever the fuck that may be. I reached a point where I finally just said "ALRIGHT, this makes NO sense AT ALL, it has led me to losing people who were wonderful friends simply because they believe differently than I, has held back the very instincts that God is supposed to have given me, and made me a very undesireable person to be around! No more. Time to see what else is possible." And so, here I am now. Happier than I've ever been. Thank The Great X I didn't go through with trying to pursue becoming a minister, 'cause I know it would've only led me further down the path of ignorance.
It started with a turn towards spirituality, which turned me on to Quantum Physics, which turned me on to great minds like Bill Hicks and George Carlin, which turned me towards Richard Dawkins and Carl Sagan. But above all else, I actually read my Bible, and studied history and archaeology. And, my goodness, I've come to the conclusion that the leading cause of Atheism among Christians could quite possibly be reading the very text they claim to be the word of the living God. Saying why is a lecture in and of itself. Aside from that, I saw the absolute hatred that arose from in the deeply religious. Wars over how to worship in the East, homophobia the world over, gross misunderstanding of other worldviews, and in my own home, when I finally lost it and said to my father "Your God is a hypocrite. He expects more of us than he does of Himself. He creates a world which makes it possible for the very ones he claims to love to be able to suffer for an eternity, and then guilt trips us into thinking He gave us out of the infinite goodness of his black heart a way to salvation by sacrificing his son who He could have spared had He only said the very words He commands us to say, being, I FORGIVE YOU?" At which point my father's blood was obviously boiling, since his face turned red, and he pointed his finger at me in a "righteous" fury, and yelled "HERECEY!" I could tell his was ready to attempt to kick my ass (I work out quite regularly, know 4 maritial arts, and can do 65 chin-ups, but for a 75 year old man, he's rather intimidating, even to me.)
This seems to be dragging on and on, though, but I had some spare time, and wanted to make a good introduction. All in all, I am now, through the truth I have found, the logic I've come across, the information I have taken in, am an Agnostic Atheist with a slight lean towards the existence of a god being possible. (Though, if he is real, he definately is not a personal god.) I consider whatever we call "God" to be the creative force, the initial cause, what was before anything was. It doesn't even have to exist as far as I'm concerned, but that's what I refer to when I say The Great X, or That Which Cannot Be Named. (Though I don't always say The Great Ex. Sometimes a "ZEUS DAMN YOU!" or "BY POSEIDON'S SALTY BALLS!" will suffice.)
The only mature stance I think one can take, logically, in regards to the existence of god, is "I don't know if god exists, but if he does, he certainly isn't the one presented to us by the major faiths."
Either way, this has been typed in somewhat of a rush, and I don't know if it's as articulate as it should be, but regardless, it's a pleasure to join your ranks, and I look forward to future discussions here.
Hasta la bye bye for now.
[EDIT] No, I'm not a bot, and I didn't copy/paste this from another website, I just tend to make dreadfully long posts sometimes.
But, a bit about me.
I'm currently 18 years old, and have been homeschooled all of my life. The past four years or so, however, my parents stopped teaching me and allowed me to take the reigns of my own education. And my, what an amazing path it has led me down.
My father (Actually my great grandfather. I'm adopted.) was and still is a very passionate "HELLLLFIREEE" screaming Southern Baptist Preacher, and my mother though not quite so... enthusiastic as he is, is still an ardent Christian. Needless to say, the things I was taught for so many years and the well intentioned mind control they both instilled in me was hard to break off, but now that it has, thank The Great X it has!
Living in Alabama (Somewhere that the only religions bigger than Christianiy are Fox Newsism and Footballanity.) on a goat farm in the middle of nowhere on a dirt road about thirty minutes away from the nearest town on 200+ acres of wild forest and rough terrain has given me plenty of time, whether working, studying, or simply wandering about, to see the natural world, the beauty in it, and the marvelous creatures it has produced.
My religious life was a strange one, at best. Of course for the first ten years or so of my life I never questioned Christianity and the Bible as being the only unquestionable sources of truth in the world, and knew full well that to question them by refusing the man Jesus (Though there's little to no evidence to even support he actually exited.) would certainly mean I'd be sent to an eternity of torture, and crying, and pain, and anguish, and agony, and blindness, and deafness, and choking, and gnashing of teeth. (By a loving God, no less!) I was never given any education about other religions or worldviews other than that of the Conservative Republican Christians. The only mention I even remember my parents making of other religions (At least before 9/11.) was making fun of Buddah for being fat.
I was happy, somewhat, but always confused about different things, and when I raised a question about the things happening in the world, or why God would allow such suffering, or why certain parts of the Bible made no sense, I would tend to get the usual responce of "We're just not meant to understand!/God works in mysterious ways!/God killed/sentenced these people to eternity of suffering because of ________, and He's justified in doing so!" Something inside of me was always empty, however.
Then, around the age of 12, I gained access to a marvelous thing called the internet. And books, oh man, the many books I found! The articles! The information overload was astounding! And all of a sudden, other ways to look at things actually seemed to exist. And of course, I dissagreed with every single one of them. But wouldn't you dissagree with 2+2=4 if all your life you were told the answer was 3?
Not willing to give up my belief in a higher power, but fed up with the nonsensical and rather boring (In comparison, at least.) beliefs of Christianity, I converted to being a Wiccan. (My parents never knew.) I studied every work of magic and the occult I could get my hands on, whether from the library or the internet. I studied, I learned, I cast spells, but still, nothing. It was interesting, no doubt. (The ability to contact spirits and elves was very appealing to me at the time.) But I was still left with a nonsensical system with so many holes in the "logic" of it all, that it just hurt.
So, for the next four years or so, I went back to Christianity. Not just out of habit, no, with a full fledged resolve to find the God presented to us by the Bible. And how did I do that? Well, by not reading the Bible, of course! But by listening to the multitudes of classy young Christian speakers who all gave their wonderful examples and metaphors to attempt to prove the existence of the Biblical God. (And, I admit, some of the arguments were compelling, but at the time, ALL of them appeared to be to a young man who was looking for the very thing they were presenting.) And at the age of 14, I accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Saviour.
Or, so I thought.
What did I get? A warm fuzzy sensation. Check. Emotional and "spiritual" highs. Check. A sense of peace and calm. Check. TOTAL belief, no matter what ANYONE said that Christianity was the one true way. Check.
I became so closed minded that it pains me now to think of the things I used to believe. Though it wasn't to last, because in the past year and a half I actually put together all of the information I've gathered. You could call me an information junkie, I want to know everything about everything. I buy a large box full of books every other week at the flea market in town for around 10 bucks, consume the contents, and repeat. (Great store, paperbacks for 50 cents, hard backs for one dollar. And they have every book imaginable at some point.) I scour hundreds of internet articles and watch more videos than I can count every month. What am I looking for? Truth. Whatever the fuck that may be. I reached a point where I finally just said "ALRIGHT, this makes NO sense AT ALL, it has led me to losing people who were wonderful friends simply because they believe differently than I, has held back the very instincts that God is supposed to have given me, and made me a very undesireable person to be around! No more. Time to see what else is possible." And so, here I am now. Happier than I've ever been. Thank The Great X I didn't go through with trying to pursue becoming a minister, 'cause I know it would've only led me further down the path of ignorance.
It started with a turn towards spirituality, which turned me on to Quantum Physics, which turned me on to great minds like Bill Hicks and George Carlin, which turned me towards Richard Dawkins and Carl Sagan. But above all else, I actually read my Bible, and studied history and archaeology. And, my goodness, I've come to the conclusion that the leading cause of Atheism among Christians could quite possibly be reading the very text they claim to be the word of the living God. Saying why is a lecture in and of itself. Aside from that, I saw the absolute hatred that arose from in the deeply religious. Wars over how to worship in the East, homophobia the world over, gross misunderstanding of other worldviews, and in my own home, when I finally lost it and said to my father "Your God is a hypocrite. He expects more of us than he does of Himself. He creates a world which makes it possible for the very ones he claims to love to be able to suffer for an eternity, and then guilt trips us into thinking He gave us out of the infinite goodness of his black heart a way to salvation by sacrificing his son who He could have spared had He only said the very words He commands us to say, being, I FORGIVE YOU?" At which point my father's blood was obviously boiling, since his face turned red, and he pointed his finger at me in a "righteous" fury, and yelled "HERECEY!" I could tell his was ready to attempt to kick my ass (I work out quite regularly, know 4 maritial arts, and can do 65 chin-ups, but for a 75 year old man, he's rather intimidating, even to me.)
This seems to be dragging on and on, though, but I had some spare time, and wanted to make a good introduction. All in all, I am now, through the truth I have found, the logic I've come across, the information I have taken in, am an Agnostic Atheist with a slight lean towards the existence of a god being possible. (Though, if he is real, he definately is not a personal god.) I consider whatever we call "God" to be the creative force, the initial cause, what was before anything was. It doesn't even have to exist as far as I'm concerned, but that's what I refer to when I say The Great X, or That Which Cannot Be Named. (Though I don't always say The Great Ex. Sometimes a "ZEUS DAMN YOU!" or "BY POSEIDON'S SALTY BALLS!" will suffice.)
The only mature stance I think one can take, logically, in regards to the existence of god, is "I don't know if god exists, but if he does, he certainly isn't the one presented to us by the major faiths."
Either way, this has been typed in somewhat of a rush, and I don't know if it's as articulate as it should be, but regardless, it's a pleasure to join your ranks, and I look forward to future discussions here.
Hasta la bye bye for now.
[EDIT] No, I'm not a bot, and I didn't copy/paste this from another website, I just tend to make dreadfully long posts sometimes.
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: Cecilie on February 11, 2011, 10:07:57 PM
Post by: Cecilie on February 11, 2011, 10:07:57 PM
Are you sure you're only 18? No, but interesting story indeed. Welcome to HAF. 
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 11, 2011, 11:22:16 PM
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 11, 2011, 11:22:16 PM
Quote from: "Cecilie"Are you sure you're only 18? No, but interesting story indeed. Welcome to HAF. :D
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: Recusant on February 12, 2011, 12:25:33 AM
Post by: Recusant on February 12, 2011, 12:25:33 AM
Hello and welcome to HAF, ForTheLoveOfAll. That was a fine introduction; well written and fun to read. It sounds as if you've so far had a life that many would envy. 200 acres of woods to wander around in is a rare treasure which a lot of youngsters won't ever know. (I grew up out in the sticks too.) I don't really have any pithy comments to make about your intro, just that I agree that reading the Bible is one fine way by which many honest searchers have started divesting themselves of belief in Christianity.(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg830.imageshack.us%2Fimg830%2F860%2Fsmilew.gif&hash=8238eab24d16418eb1c8cd60d971239ab1363c74)
I hope you enjoy your time reading and posting here.
I hope you enjoy your time reading and posting here.
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: terranus on February 12, 2011, 12:44:21 AM
Post by: terranus on February 12, 2011, 12:44:21 AM
Hello there my northern neighbor.
I must admit, I am a faithful follower of this as well.
At any rate,
Bonvenon al la Forumo!
[spoiler:2biyhuxn]Welcome to the Forum![/spoiler:2biyhuxn]
QuoteFootballanity
I must admit, I am a faithful follower of this as well.
At any rate,
Bonvenon al la Forumo!
[spoiler:2biyhuxn]Welcome to the Forum![/spoiler:2biyhuxn]
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 12, 2011, 02:21:50 AM
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 12, 2011, 02:21:50 AM
Quote from: "Recusant"Hello and welcome to HAF, ForTheLoveOfAll. That was a fine introduction; well written and fun to read. It sounds as if you've so far had a life that many would envy. 200 acres of woods to wander around in is a rare treasure which a lot of youngsters won't ever know. (I grew up out in the sticks too.) I don't really have any pithy comments to make about your intro, just that I agree that reading the Bible is one fine way by which many honest searchers have started divesting themselves of belief in Christianity.(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg830.imageshack.us%2Fimg830%2F860%2Fsmilew.gif&hash=8238eab24d16418eb1c8cd60d971239ab1363c74)
I hope you enjoy your time reading and posting here.
Ah! I thank you.
I certainly have no reason to complain. I lead a wonderful life. Not easy, but definately not bad. And yes, most of the children (And adults.) of the world today only know four walls and a screen. Tis' a shame.
Only issue I'm seeing here so far is that the site isn't allowing me to upload my avatar or signature yet. Does a moderator need to do something first?
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: Whitney on February 12, 2011, 03:04:05 AM
Post by: Whitney on February 12, 2011, 03:04:05 AM
Quote from: "ForTheLoveOfAll"Only issue I'm seeing here so far is that the site isn't allowing me to upload my avatar or signature yet. Does a moderator need to do something first?
As soon as you hit 50 posts it will open up that option. Unfortunately a lot of spammers and trolls made me feel it necessary to implement this 50 post feature when I discovered it as an option; you are one of the first to have to try it out (was just started end of last month). Let me know if you end up having trouble meeting your 50 within a reasonable time frame (so far it's only taken a few days).
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: JoeBobSmith on February 12, 2011, 06:49:46 AM
Post by: JoeBobSmith on February 12, 2011, 06:49:46 AM
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: JoeBobSmith on February 12, 2011, 06:52:37 AM
Post by: JoeBobSmith on February 12, 2011, 06:52:37 AM
ignore this
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: Tank on February 12, 2011, 10:13:44 AM
Post by: Tank on February 12, 2011, 10:13:44 AM
Hi ForTheLoveOfAll
Welcome to Happy Atheists.
Regards
Chris
Welcome to Happy Atheists.
Regards
Chris
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 12, 2011, 02:38:38 PM
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 12, 2011, 02:38:38 PM
Quote from: "Whitney"Ah! Well, no worries then. I thought it might've been something like that.Quote from: "ForTheLoveOfAll"Only issue I'm seeing here so far is that the site isn't allowing me to upload my avatar or signature yet. Does a moderator need to do something first?
As soon as you hit 50 posts it will open up that option. Unfortunately a lot of spammers and trolls made me feel it necessary to implement this 50 post feature when I discovered it as an option; you are one of the first to have to try it out (was just started end of last month). Let me know if you end up having trouble meeting your 50 within a reasonable time frame (so far it's only taken a few days).
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 12, 2011, 02:41:43 PM
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 12, 2011, 02:41:43 PM
Quote from: "JoeBobSmith"the bible is mostly what's wrong with ChristianityEh, I have trouble seeing how people can claim to get morality from any of the "holy" scriptures. Whether it's in Islam, Hinduism, or Christianity. Or a host of others, all the gods tend to be jealous, malovolent, sadistic bullies, who proclaim continually their own goodness despite the evils they do.
It's written in such a way that if you read it literally you can go insane...IMO
And whenever I try and bring up something about the Bible, I usually hear the dribble about "But in the New Testament Jesus comes along and mercy is introduced to the world! The old law is overcome blahblah." Yeah, I know. I was training myself to become a minister at one point. And yes, from taking it literally, I almost did go insane.
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: JoeBobSmith on February 12, 2011, 10:48:47 PM
Post by: JoeBobSmith on February 12, 2011, 10:48:47 PM
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 13, 2011, 12:12:37 AM
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 13, 2011, 12:12:37 AM
Quote from: "JoeBobSmith"Quote from: "ForTheLoveOfAll"Quote from: "JoeBobSmith"the bible is mostly what's wrong with ChristianityEh, I have trouble seeing how people can claim to get morality from any of the "holy" scriptures. Whether it's in Islam, Hinduism, or Christianity. Or a host of others, all the gods tend to be jealous, malovolent, sadistic bullies, who proclaim continually their own goodness despite the evils they do.
It's written in such a way that if you read it literally you can go insane...IMO
And whenever I try and bring up something about the Bible, I usually hear the dribble about "But in the New Testament Jesus comes along and mercy is introduced to the world! The old law is overcome blahblah." Yeah, I know. I was training myself to become a minister at one point. And yes, from taking it literally, I almost did go insane.
It is really a compilation of a lot of random drivel from a lot of different sources... someone at one point probably pieced it together somewhat so that it would have some continuity (old testament)
The new testament is much more coherent, but may have been written with more motive...IMO
I think it was written, if for any particular purpose, to make the Bible seem more tolerable. (End time predictions aside.)
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: JoeBobSmith on February 13, 2011, 12:45:23 AM
Post by: JoeBobSmith on February 13, 2011, 12:45:23 AM
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: McQ on February 13, 2011, 05:59:53 AM
Post by: McQ on February 13, 2011, 05:59:53 AM
Quote from: "JoeBobSmith"the bible is mostly what's wrong with Christianity
It's written in such a way that if you read it literally you can go insane...IMO
JoeBob, please just stick to welcoming people in your responses to intros. Between this post and your others in this thread, you've gone off on some weird tangent. You don't need to post every thought that pops into your head.
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: McQ on February 13, 2011, 06:00:55 AM
Post by: McQ on February 13, 2011, 06:00:55 AM
FTLOA, welcome and thanks for your fine intro.
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 13, 2011, 04:59:56 PM
Post by: ForTheLoveOfAll on February 13, 2011, 04:59:56 PM
Quote from: "McQ"FTLOA, welcome and thanks for your fine intro.I thank you good sir.
Title: Re: Good day gents and ladyfolk.
Post by: xSilverPhinx on March 14, 2011, 05:25:26 AM
Post by: xSilverPhinx on March 14, 2011, 05:25:26 AM
Welcome!