Happy Atheist Forum

The article seems to have been pulled from alot of news sites.I wonder why.

QuoteDarwin's theory called racist
In book, Creation Museum founder says evolution fuels genocide
 
LOUISVILLE, Ky. -- The founder of a popular Kentucky Christian museum that rejects evolution says in a new book that Darwin's theory fuels racism and genocide.

Ken Ham, who opened the Creation Museum last year, and co-author Charles Ware, president of Crossroads Bible College in Indianapolis, have written "Darwin's Plantation: Evolution's Racist Roots," arguing that the theory inspired the Nazi belief in racial superiority and the murderous policies of Soviet dictator Josef Stalin.

"What Darwinian evolution did I would say is provide what people thought was a scientific justification for separation of races," Ham said in an interview.

Ham is not the first to try to tie Darwin with racism. The charge has been made for years. It came up last month in arguments over science curriculum at a South Carolina state school board meeting. In 2001, Louisiana's state legislature considered a bill that said Darwin supported racist ideologies.

David Schultz, associate professor of biology at Nicholls State University in Louisiana, said Darwin was egalitarian and had a history of speaking out against slavery. "Darwin was not a racist," he said.

The article : http://www1.pressdemocrat.com/article/20080209/LIFESTYLE/802090313/-1/SPECIAL&THEMES=HOMEGARDEN

Other articles : http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/318976.aspx
http://www.lubbockonline.com/stories/020908/rel_245288762.shtml

Nothing like mistaking correlation for causation to make yourself look like a total freaking idiot.

To put it this way: If evolution causes cancer, well, so do potatoe chips.

And thank goodness that a belief in a divine creator has led to nothing but peace in this world.

 

Idiots.  That Ken Ham has done more to sully the name of Christians than anyone since Hitler.

Well anyone that starts a 25 million dollar place about jesus and the dinosaurs is missing a few marbles anyway.

Quote from: "news article""What Darwinian evolution did I would say is provide what people thought was a scientific justification for separation of races," Ham said in an interview.

Back when different races were not allowed in intermarry in the US in some states, a religious and racist judge made this statement:

Quote from: "racist judge"Almighty God created the races white, black, yellow, Malay and red, and He placed them on separate continents. And but for the interference with His arrangement there would be no cause for such marriages. The fact that He separated the races shows that He did not intend for the races to mix.

I found the quote related to the Loving vs. Virginia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loving_v._Virginia) case.

Quote"What Darwinian evolution did I would say is provide what people thought was a scientific justification for separation of races," Ham said in an interview.

Also, germ theory gave a scientific justification for bioweapons.

Quote from: "rlrose328"And thank goodness that a belief in a divine creator has led to nothing but peace in this world.

Amen brother!

* * *

Quote from: "afreethinker30"Well anyone that starts a 25 million dollar place about jesus and the dinosaurs is missing a few marbles anyway.

Yeah seriously, who are they to talk? Seems kind of like a boring place to me...

I don't see how anyone can compare the two.Darwin said that we all come from the single being.That makes all of us black,white,asian,hispanic everyone a decedent.We are all brothers and sisters in this world whether we like it or not.Yes some are a different color but that all has to do with our enviroment.You can look at my skin and clearly tell that I came for a cold sheltered land without much sun.My skin is very fair which helps my body in a vitamin d deficiency.With my skin being for fair a short amount of sun light helps me "absorb" more of the suns rays.Blacks usually have a problem with high blood pressure in that their bodies have more salt intake.Which helped when they were traveling.I'm sure it also helps with a huge amount of sunlight and skin damage.I think this also shows evolution.Our bodies adapt to what is best for us.

http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/922301987.html
http://genetics.suite101.com/article.cfm/when_caucasians_turned_white

Social Darwinism is not Darwinism. Only a complete and total idiot would try to equate them. It's very well documented that Darwin believed that egalitarian and sympathetic social systems developed via natural selection, and that human morality was a survival trait. It's deeply shameful to try and rewrite history, blaming one of the worst atrocities on one of our greatest minds.

I wonder how many protestants are aware that Martin Luther, father of the protestant reformation, was a horrible anti-semite.
(warning the following link is extremely offensive both to people who understand and reject bigotry and to religious people who don't like religion being shown for what it is. Discretion is advised.)
http://www.humanitas-international.org/ ... r-jews.htm (http://www.humanitas-international.org/showcase/chronography/documents/luther-jews.htm)

QuoteSocial Darwinism is not Darwinism. Only a complete and total idiot would try to equate them.

Right. It's what's called the is-ought fallacy. Mistaking a claim about the way things are for a claim about the way things should be.

Considering the location of the primates from which humans evolved, it is apparent that all U.S. citizens are African-Americans.  (Wish I could take credit for this insight, but I saw it somewhere.)  

Occam

Quote from: "Occam"Considering the location of the primates from which humans evolved, it is apparent that all U.S. citizens are African-Americans.  (Wish I could take credit for this insight, but I saw it somewhere.)  

Occam

Not very useful. When reminded other races evolved from Africans, the clever racist simply responds "Operative word 'evolved.' "

Evolution does the exact opposite.  It says that there is no "human race" to the exclusion of others.  There is one human species with several genetic variances which produce only superficial changes (phenotypes) while the basic genetic structure (genotype) remains the same consistently.  It's basic genetics, people.

Thats what creationists do-they twist words around and make it into what they are not-or rationalize for questions they cannot answer.

creationist is asked for scientific proof
creationist=

Quote from: "Deicideisfunny"Thats what creationists do-they twist words around and make it into what they are not-or rationalize for questions they cannot answer.

creationist is asked for scientific proof
creationist=

Think of all the money they lose if people stop believing.They can't have that!

QuoteChristianity has a built-in defense system: anything that questions a belief, no matter how logical the argument is, is the work of Satan by the very fact that it makes you question a belief. It's a very interesting defense mechanism and the only way to get by it -- and believe me, I was raised Southern Baptist -- is to take massive amounts of mushrooms, sit in a field, and just go, "Show me."
Bill Hicks

Evolution=Racism.

I am glad.
Do you really believe over billions of years of evolution that we stayed the same? Get your head of your asses.

Race is deeper than skin. It's ancestry and genetics, DNA.

Quote from: "DeathSShead1488"Evolution=Racism.

I am glad.
Do you really believe over billions of years of evolution that we stayed the same? Get your head of your asses.

Race is deeper than skin. It's ancestry and genetics, DNA.

Bigotry is not in your DNA. It is learned. In your case, probably from your racist parents.

Quote from: "karadan"Bigotry is not in your DNA. It is learned. In your case, probably from your racist parents.

Indeed ... I don't think I've seen anyone be quite so proud of being such an asshole for quite some time.

Kyu

Quote from: "DeathSShead1488"Evolution=Racism.

I am glad.
Do you really believe over billions of years of evolution that we stayed the same? Get your head of your asses.

Race is deeper than skin. It's ancestry and genetics, DNA.

Actually, there's no genetic information that codes for a "race." None at all. Only pigment in skin, shapes of facial attributes, etc. Check it out: "Race: The Power of an Illusion (http://www.pbs.org/race/000_General/000_00-Home.htm)."

[youtube:1monsdic]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voTIVY-2iys[/youtube:1monsdic]

Quote from: "curiosityandthecat"Actually, there's no genetic information that codes for a "race." None at all. Only pigment in skin, shapes of facial attributes, etc.

Which actually makes a lot more sense than this crap DeathsSh**Head is advancing about race or sexuality (gay) genes.

Kyu

Quote from: "Kyuuketsuki"Which actually makes a lot more sense than this crap DeathsSh**Head is advancing about race or sexuality (gay) genes.

Like THAT's hard to do.   Racist bigots are afraid, pure and simple. They feel the need to be superior, and this is normally because they know they are in some way lacking, be it intelligence, physical prowess, or even just attention. Scapegoating, at it's essence.

That being said, 99% of Whites in the United States are racist, just as 99% of males are sexist. That's not to say they're bigots. Racism is a power structure in which the hegemonic group (in this case being Whites) have privilege and use that privilege, either consciously or unconsciously, to their advantage. Easy way to tell if a White person is racist: ask them if they'd like to be Black. If they hesitate or say No, then they are fully aware of the societal challenges that impede Black folk. (Some say, "But I just like being me. Is there something wrong with that?" I usually respond, "No, nothing wrong with that. I'm just talking about your skin color; everything else about you can stay the same. Does that change your mind at all?") It's insidious and invisible and almost completely pervasive.

This is one of the reasons Obama being elected is such a monumental thing for Americans.

Quote from: "curiosityandthecat"That being said, 99% of Whites in the United States are racist, just as 99% of males are sexist. That's not to say they're bigots. Racism is a power structure in which the hegemonic group (in this case being Whites) have privilege and use that privilege, either consciously or unconsciously, to their advantage. Easy way to tell if a White person is racist: ask them if they'd like to be Black. If they hesitate or say No, then they are fully aware of the societal challenges that impede Black folk. (Some say, "But I just like being me. Is there something wrong with that?" I usually respond, "No, nothing wrong with that. I'm just talking about your skin color; everything else about you can stay the same. Does that change your mind at all?") It's insidious and invisible and almost completely pervasive.

I don't (can't) agree with that because I think your argument misses some factors. Try re-framing the argument and using gay instead ... I'm as certain as I can be that I wouldn't want to be gay yet I have nothing against gays. I think it would be more valid to ask if someone would spend their life with someone regardless of skin colour and I know I wouldn't have such a problem however I would be very aware of the problems that could arise because of such a relationship, something that would probably have the greatest effect on kids but then  (shrug) society has to start somewhere I guess.

The one I really don't like though is so-called "positive discrimination" ... as far as I'm concerned all reasonless discrimination based on sex, gender, race, religion is wrong.

Kyu

Quote from: "Kyuuketsuki"I don't (can't) agree with that because I think your argument misses some factors. Try re-framing the argument and using gay instead ... I'm as certain as I can be that I wouldn't want to be gay yet I have nothing against gays. I think it would be more valid to ask if someone would spend their life with someone regardless of skin colour and I know I wouldn't have such a problem however I would be very aware of the problems that could arise because of such a relationship, something that would probably have the greatest effect on kids but then  (shrug) society has to start somewhere I guess.

The one I really don't like though is so-called "positive discrimination" ... as far as I'm concerned all reasonless discrimination based on sex, gender, race, religion is wrong.

Kyu

I quite see your point and am sympathetic to it. However, it doesn't quite work to replace the race with sexual orientation. (I'm trying to figure out how to word this without sounding a fool.) Gender, race, age, etc., are things that you are regardless of action or behavior. Alternative sexual lifestyles are just that: lifestyles. I'm not saying that people can't say "Gay is what I am" but it's not a physical characteristic. Having dark skin, two X chromosomes and a vagina, or wrinkles and age spots are all physical characteristics outside the control of that person.

One thing we do agree on is the idea that any discrimination should be avoided, either good or bad. Then again, that's when we start getting into meritocracy and the problems associated with it.

When is the last time you spent time with your wife instead of on a forum of strangers?  She really misses you.

Edit:
Oops, wife has breached my security.  Apparently wants attention.  Must go and save marriage.

That's like saying "because some preists are molesters all religion fuels pedophilia''

Quote from: "Tanker"That's like saying "because some preists are molesters all religion fuels pedophilia''

There's a lot going on in this thread... mind mentioning to what you're referring?

The fact was that darwin was a racist and a sexist becacause he was a product of his times and attempted to fit his thereries with the beliefs of the day. Creationists try to disregard his scientific befeilf because he personal beliefs were flawed. So making the generalisatin that evolution promotes racism is the same as say that since a few priests are child molesters all religion promote child molestation.

OK, Curio, I think your question fails because it's totally unnecessary.  The first thing that would flash through my head would be "why would I?"  And that'd be your moment of hesitation.  We could ask a Japanese fellow if he'd rather be white, and I suspect he'd answer "no" or "why would I?" and I'd answer the same way if you asked me if I'd rather be Asian.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I haven't met a whole lot of Asians that long to be white . . .

And even then, drop the thought of racism, there's still the culture divide!  I like rap, but I like country too (on the radio, I'd never buy a CD of either.  CDs are reserved for classic rock, and anything that is hard to find.  And I like a lot of stuff that's hard to find).  That is culturally normal for a white kid where I live.  Not so much a black kid.  And I think that's a matter of culture, rather than racism.  Even if I'm wrong, some of my actions as a white kid must be explicitly cultural otherwise you disclaim all culture as racism.  And because I'm a white kid, and belong to that culture, no I'd rather not be thrown into a different one.

If that's racism to you, meh, add me to your list.