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How Dumb is Man?

Started by MadBomr101, April 19, 2020, 02:23:30 PM

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xSilverPhinx

Quote from: MadBomr101 on April 19, 2020, 02:23:30 PM
No matter how preposterous an idea or belief may be there's always some percentage of the population that will believe it.

It doesn't matter how demonstrably false, conceptually ridiculous or irretrievably stupid the idea is, it will find an audience that supports it. This is in evidence given the billions who believe in a god of some kind and also in the millions who insist Donald Trump is a great leader and a brilliant man.

But it gets even worse than that, There are people who believe that the earth is flat, that the holocaust never happened, that the moon landing was a hoax, that there's a dinosaur living in Loch Ness, and that an 8' tall species of man/ape lives secretly in the wilderness of the Pacific NW. They believe in ghosts, and crystal magic, and in the unfailing power of prayer. I'll bet there's at least 10.000 people globally who believe ALL of that shit.

My question is WHY?

Why do so many people insist on being ignorant and just plain dumb in the face of reality and common sense? It really irks me.

Oh, and Scientology. Goddamn Scientology!

Post 1 of 25

I think Michael Shermer wrote a whole book on 'why'. :grin:

It even starts with 'why'. ;) 

As for stupid, yeah...that's just people I guess. :shrug:
I am what survives if it's slain - Zack Hemsey


xSilverPhinx

Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 10:39:28 PM
Quote from: MadBomr101 on April 19, 2020, 09:22:30 PM
Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 02:56:21 PM
i believe in ghosts.

dunno what they are, but i think the evidence is sufficient that zomethi g has been going on there.

What sort of evidence has convinced you? The only evidence i ever see are apocryphal claims made by people who are generally agreeable to the notion of ghosts to begin with. Then there's those laughably silly ghost hunting shows on TV where badly staged "encounters" are passed off as proof of the supernatural and, of course, all those hoax photos and mistakes brought on by bad photography.

Also wouldn't the spirit remnant of a person be considered a soul? Something atheism rejects for the same lack of proof that makes all religious claims for the supernatural unsubstantiated for their a lack of evidence?

If ghosts were real they would be proof of an afterlife. I think something like that would be eligible for a Nobel prize but no one has ever won it for that particular discovery.

Pleased to meet you too.

nah i dont think ghosts are surviving spirits of dead people. probably not anyway. lots to unpack with that hypothesis.

the thing is there are so many things that we call ghosts. i ve been trying to list them:

-- unidentified sounds, like bumps or wails or speech

-- poltergeists, or physical manifestations in general. moving or moved objects.

-- unidentified sights of inanimatr stuff, like v9iewz through windows that arent there, or stuff seen in mirrors

-- feelings or emotions that onesenses only in certain times or placez

-- spectral figurez of living things, people or animals

we lump all these things together as "ghostz" and maybe some of them have non-supernatural causes and some we dont know and zome just are BS

but we have thousands of years of pretty consistent folklore observationz on some of this stuff. when i say i believe in ghosts, i mean that i think there is likely some real existence to some of them in ways we dont yet understand.

Meh, to me they're just perception artifacts/anomalies. 
I am what survives if it's slain - Zack Hemsey


billy rubin

#17
certainly most of the mabifeztations of all the things we call ghosts might be explained that way.

i dont like to deny the existence of things just becausr i dont understand them, though. not saying you do that, but its what lots of people do. todays mysteriez are tomorrowz paradigmz, after all. one example is ball lightni g

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ball_lightning

it has not been proven to exist, scientifically. but is there something there? i ztrongly suspect zo, scientifoc proof or not. maybe in 25 years the people who doubt ball lightning today will be like tbe people who doubted continental drift yezterday--old fartz with no imagination.

on things that we call ghosts, poltergeistz are the most interesting to me. they are rare and unpredictable, but when they do occur the show similar expressionz under similar conditions. are they real? dunno.

not enough data to say.



more people have been to berlin than i have

Bluenose

Quote from: MadBomr101 on April 19, 2020, 02:23:30 PM
...
My question is WHY?

Why do so many people insist on being ignorant and just plain dumb in the face of reality and common sense? It really irks me.

Oh, and Scientology. Goddamn Scientology!

Post 1 of 25

because as a friend of mine once said, 5% of people think, 15% of people think they think and 80% of people would rather do anything but think
+++ Divide by cucumber error: please reinstall universe and reboot.  +++

GNU Terry Pratchett


xSilverPhinx

Quote from: billy rubin on April 20, 2020, 10:43:25 AM
...old fartz with no imagination.

:secrets1: It's a glitch in the Matrix.

:grin:

I never heard of ball lightnings before and don't have a personal opinion on them. Still, I guess the expression 'keep an open mind but not too open that your brain falls out' (or something like that) applies. Especially since there are going to be loads of hungry zombies who will be quick to jump on your brain and eat it before you can get it back.  :'(

;)   
I am what survives if it's slain - Zack Hemsey


Icarus

The Asmo has aroused my curiosity............This quote ....................

"Mr. Trump has his flaws, and on a personal level, I dislike the man. Still, he has done my stock prices nothing but good, and personally, I'm not at all above giving him that.

Please Gray one, explain to me how the Trump has caused the global economic boom.  Was it actually some sort of Trump grand wizardry that caused the stock market to expand so much.     Or was it the natural order of world affairs, robust commercial activity, international trade agreements, or something else that caused the speculators to run the Dow Jones into the stratosphere.

I am having some reservations about giving that unpleasant man much, or any, credit for influencing the world economy in a positive way. He pulled out of the Paris Accord, Sought to trash NAFTA, Pissed off the Canadians, Germans, French, Brits, and other national leaders,  Rescinded the Iranian agreement, wants to build a fucking wall, Believes that wind mills cause cancer, Cancels funding to the WHO,  Has shepherded an administration that drove the US deficit into more trillions of debt, and a few other things that have not done the world economy any favors   I await you or other intelligent HAFers to help me understand how he has caused the world to enjoy so much prosperity. 

billy rubin

#21
Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 20, 2020, 12:16:15 PM
Quote from: billy rubin on April 20, 2020, 10:43:25 AM
...old fartz with no imagination.

:secrets1: It's a glitch in the Matrix.

:grin:

I never heard of ball lightnings before and don't have a personal opinion on them. Still, I guess the expression 'keep an open mind but not too open that your brain falls out' (or something like that) applies. Especially since there are going to be loads of hungry zombies who will be quick to jump on your brain and eat it before you can get it back.  :'(

;)

lol

you know, plate tectonics is a pretty good example of idiotic ideas that suddenly become mainstream.. if you try to piece together the contental landmasses at the 100 fathom line-- halfway down the continenetal slope-- the match is something like 95 percent perfect. i used to notice how well the y fit together.

but people disbelieved in drift for scientific generations, in spite of biogeography like th emarsup[ials on the southern continents, or weird migratiopn patters of sea turtles to mautitius. lining up of glacial striations, all that stuff.

i remember a book with an illustration of the expanding earth that explained motile contnents. another that combined all the land bridges publ;ished to ecxplain species distribution across the world-- there was no ocean left.

nobody believed it unti about 1965. then all at once, the entire scientific community shifted, and suddenly tectonics was the new paradigm.

quicker than organic evolution in the 1860s.

then all the extra evidence started piling in. people noticed islands arcs, trenches, mid ocean ridges.

now the paradigm is very different, and it all changed at once. i remember. i was a kid, but i was there.


more people have been to berlin than i have

Asmodean

EDIT: Originally posted this as Asmodean Prime. Reposting as Asmodean to maintain Prime as strictly professional.

Quote from: Icarus on April 21, 2020, 05:30:13 AM
Please Gray one, explain to me how the Trump has caused the global economic boom.  Was it actually some sort of Trump grand wizardry that caused the stock market to expand so much.     Or was it the natural order of world affairs, robust commercial activity, international trade agreements, or something else that caused the speculators to run the Dow Jones into the stratosphere.
Actually, that depends a lot on what you invest in and how. I have invested heavily in US businesses at the start of Mr. Trump's tenure. (somewhat unwillingly, but the person on whose recommendation I did so... Knows these things)

Three years later, just the yearly profits from those investments bought me a moderately-used car - something the sum-total of my stock option interest under Obama would have come short of. It's natural growth, yes, but the growth curve on my options under the current US administration is (or, was Pre Zompocalypse, but I moved most of the money around before the shit really hit the fan, so... A hit to the money place, yes, but could have been worse) pleasantly steep.

I can try to analyze the specific variables, although one would need to speak to a panel of experts to get a really good understanding of the mechanisms behind it, but part of it is certainly Mr. President's rhetoric on business and inviting new business as well as bringing the old business back to US soil. The Trump administration's corporate tax policy doesn't hurt either. A big chunk of investment is psychology, specifically that of "big money," and Trump... Is good in that regard.

QuoteI am having some reservations about giving that unpleasant man much, or any, credit for influencing the world economy in a positive way. He pulled out of the Paris Accord, Sought to trash NAFTA, Pissed off the Canadians, Germans, French, Brits, and other national leaders,  Rescinded the Iranian agreement,
Except of course he has the political, economic and military muscle to throw his weight around. At least from where I sit, he lost precious little. The "whole" world still wants to trade with the US, and as far as corporate entities go, sucking on some orange cock, if you pardon the vulgarity, is a small price to pay. Governments... They rattle their sabers, but largely, they know what they stand to lose should an economy as globally-tied and leviathan as that of the United States go to trade war.

From here, I'll go a bit selectively, then summarize including the points I omit here.

Quotewants to build a fucking wall,
Good idea, although Mexico has pretty much become Trump's wall. Still, walls work. If you don't think they do, then I'd like to invite you to live in a house with only a roof and some vertical supports for a few years.

QuoteCancels funding to the WHO
The default state of matters is not to fund something. Why should the president have continued funding the WHO? Also, how much?

QuoteHas shepherded an administration that drove the US deficit into more trillions of debt
He didn't drain that swamp, I'll grant you that.

Quoteand a few other things that have not done the world economy any favors
He is the president of the United States, not the World. His first responsibility is to his country and her people. If some random Asmo from across The Wall and with a foreign accent manages to turn profit from the president playing for the home team... Good for Him, but it's not the duty of Mr. Trump to insure that He does.

In the end, I'd like to stress this last point; you can talk about the world and the WORLD Health organization and the WORLD economic forum and the UN and all that largely-impotent globalist nonsense. At the end of the day, each leader's duty is to his people. Some leaders in Europe have forgotten that, and look what's happening to them...

This last point is not aimed at any-one specific, but if it hits home... Consider it. While it's both OK and expected to disagree with the president on matters of policy, strategy, choice of words or for that matter, his pussy-grabbing ways, it is also OK to have several thoughts in one's head. He did set foot on North Korean soil. while he's talking, the Rocket Man is not launching rockets. That's more than many before him managed to accomplish. He scrapped the Iran deal. Iran still has no nukes and we are pretty much just as close to war as we have been for the past decade or more. He's not much of an environmentalist, but as long as his policies contribute to those who faithfully care about such matters starting related businesses, indirectly, he does more than most.

None of these things he does alone, and some of these things matter to a lot of people. Some may laugh at the perceived silliness those unwashed masses, who want a border wall and no gun control... Those same people were not laughing back in 2016, or in the wake of the last general election in the United Kingdom. Why is that, I wonder? How much of this rift could have been mitigated by not dismissing the opposition's points because they are a bunch of -ists and -phobes and irrelevant manual laborers from fly-over states?

I'm sorry, Icarus, I've gone way off your question, but this is something I take every chance I can to talk about, because I think it's important. In these past years, I slid slightly towards the economic right, but I'm pretty much the insufferably-bland centrist I always was. The Right, they are more or less where I always remembered them being. The Left... Chased my ass out with pitchforks and torches. If you insist on calling me names in stead of trying to convince me to vote for your sorry asses, and when you do, you base your strategy on "But we are not that guy!" Well... 2016. UK general elections. Don't. Be. Surprised.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

TheFightSong

#23
"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." - George Carlin

"If you want to understand a society, take a good look at the drugs it uses. And what can this tell you about American culture? Well, look at the drugs we use. Except for pharmaceutical poison, there are essentially only two drugs that Western civilization tolerates: Caffeine from Monday to Friday to energize you enough to make you a productive member of society, and alcohol from Friday to Monday to keep you too stupid to figure out the prison that you are living in." - Bill Hicks

"Go back to bed, America. Your government has figured out how it all transpired. Go back to bed, America. Your government is in control again. Here. Here's American Gladiators. Watch this, shut up. Go back to bed, America. Here is American Gladiators. Here is 56 channels of it! Watch these pituitary retards bang their fucking skulls together and congratulate you on living in the land of freedom. Here you go, America! You are free to do what we tell you! You are free to do what we tell you!" - Bill Hicks

"It's all about money, not freedom, y'all, okay? Nothing to do with fuckin' freedom. If you think you're free, try going somewhere without fucking money, okay?" - Bill Hicks

https://www.healthline.com/health/average-iq

https://thegermanyeye.com/mainstream-media-and-the-shameless-manipulation-of-women-3472

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/advertising-women-female-insecurities-body-images-does-it-experts-sexism-weight-loss-gain-size-a7888901.html

I would say lots of humans are very stupid. Only a few of them have their hearts and minds mostly in the right place if they exist, though. Genuine activists, compassionate charity workers, compassionate environmentalists, and freethinkers are rare, not common. Most people become comfortable with conventional norms after they reach the age of 25 when their minds stop being easily adaptable. Once people reach an age where learning a different language becomes mostly hard, they start becoming less adaptable to change. This is what keeps humans stupid and slow at improving things. This is why advanced technology, medicine, and other things were slowly invented because of humanity's tendency to intellectually decay when they are not young adults anymore and their brains start to rot when they get older. Being easily comfortable to conventional norms is a sign of low intelligence and lack of adaptability to change. Courageously unconventional inventors are who keep humanity from going back to scared cavemen with low I.Q's that are more likely to die from wild predators because of risk-aversion and no freethinking. Courageously unconventional inventors are rare, too. Nikola Tesla, Albert Einstein, Leonardo da Vinci, Socrates, and others were rare intellectually. They were all outcasts compared to the normies. Because the normies were too busy putting on a facade to blend in with society while becoming increasingly stupid. Society really does suck out the imagination out of a child by making them become another ordinary worker drone, especially if they were born into poverty or abusively treated like a dumb sex object. I am talking about women being abusively treated like dumb sex objects. There are countries where men are legally allowed to abuse women without being imprisoned at all. I am talking about the middle eastern countries for example. This is why inventors are rare and most humans continue to be intellectually inferior. The advertisement companies are exploiting the females' insecurities and keeping those females vulnerably dumb to manipulation for profit. It's keeping ultra-wealthy men wealthier than most people internationally, especially females. It shows how dumb most people are.

Old Seer

People go where leaders take them. No matter how intelligent, ignorant or able, all are being lead to the same place. 
The only thing possible the world needs saving from are the ones running it.
Oh lord, save us from those wanting to save us.
I'm not a Theist
https://sites.google.com/site/oldseers

Ecurb Noselrub

Quote from: Old Seer on February 02, 2022, 03:41:05 PM
, all are being lead to the same place.

To the gaping jaws of Death?

billy rubin



more people have been to berlin than i have

Tank

Quote from: billy rubin on February 04, 2022, 12:21:26 AM
walmart

One of my most eye opening experiences ever was my first trip to a Walmart. They had the shotgun shells next to the bread. WTF!
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
"Religion is a culture of faith; science is a culture of doubt." ― Richard P. Feynman
'It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die. That is true, it's called Life.' - Terry Pratchett
Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.

hackenslash

Quote from: MadBomr101 on April 19, 2020, 02:23:30 PMMy question is WHY?

Why do so many people insist on being ignorant and just plain dumb in the face of reality and common sense? It really irks me.

The short answer is that it's a function of our evolutionary survival strategy. There are a couple of factors in our strategy that lend themselves to this sort of behaviour.

The first is our protracted post-natal development, some of the details of which, especially concerning our cognitive development, a degree of gullibility. This is important, because it's how we learn the hard-won lessons learned by those who went before about how to stay alive.

If we've had a solid cognitive development such that we develop good expertise in these areas, we tend away from gullibility and rely more on the intuitions we develop. Not everybody has good cognitive development.

The rest is all in our ability to spot patterns and tell ourselves stories with them, coupled with a fundamental degree of cognitive inertia; we find it very difficult to shed beliefs once we hold them.
There is no more formidable or insuperable barrier to knowledge than the certainty you already possess it.