Hi,
I've not posted anything for a while, so I thought I would throw this in.
I was in a meeting this morning at work when a colleague of mine just happened to mention that he was atheist (not sure why this came out) but I was surprised by the response of my boss, who replied "I don't think you are really" this was then backed up by a comment from his number two "you don't find any atheists on a crashing plane". Both my manager and his number two are both active Christians.
This made me think about those believers who refuse to accept that there are true atheists. Of course as the plane falls to earth with all engines on fire there will be those who will be praying like mad, there may be atheists not praying and those who would not normally call themselves believers who will be praying just in case. In reality the plane is going to crash, when was the last time the hand of God came out of the sky and placed the plane safely on the ground.
Back in May when Harold Camping (I think that was his name) was predicting rapture and the end of the world, many websites were talking about the many atheists who were building shelters to protect themselves, why would someone build a shelter to protect against something that you did not believe was going to happen? This is just propaganda that does nothing but frighten those who do believe but may not be quite sure that they are good enough.
In my mind a true atheist will still not believe in god regardless of any situation, however human nature will try anything to aid self preservation, and it is this doubt and a "what if it is true" culture that has allowed religion to take over so many people.
Sorry forgot to add link regarding shelters http://judgementday2011.com/rapture-2011/
Where did the comments about atheists building shelters come from?
Quote from: Tank on August 18, 2011, 02:56:17 PM
Where did the comments about atheists building shelters come from?
Sounds like more lies spread by the religious wrong.
Quote from: Happy with no god on August 18, 2011, 02:34:14 PM
when was the last time the hand of God came out of the sky and placed the plane safely on the ground.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lJy1idHwCc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lJy1idHwCc)
Quote from: Stevil on August 18, 2011, 08:39:30 PM
Quote from: Happy with no god on August 18, 2011, 02:34:14 PM
when was the last time the hand of God came out of the sky and placed the plane safely on the ground.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lJy1idHwCc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lJy1idHwCc)
or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9q113rIwVo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9q113rIwVo)
I was recently on a flight that encountered some insane turbulence on approach (it was so bad that our plane fish-tailed a couple of hundred feet above the rocky coastline, our pilot refused to land and we flew several hundred kilometers away to another airport). My exact thoughts where "well. It'd suck if we go down, but most people don't get to choose how they go."
I think the thing that some theists don't get is that being atheist makes death a whole lot LESS scary for a lot of people.
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on August 19, 2011, 10:15:37 PM
I was recently on a flight that encountered some insane turbulence on approach (it was so bad that our plane fish-tailed a couple of hundred feet above the rocky coastline, our pilot refused to land and we flew several hundred kilometers away to another airport). My exact thoughts where "well. It'd suck if we go down, but most people don't get to choose how they go."
I think I would be having a panic attack if that happened (I don't do well with heights so even light plane turbulence puts me on edge). But, while I wouldn't have a calm response, I can't imagine me suddenly thinking that praying would fix it.
Quote from: Whitney on August 19, 2011, 10:21:27 PM
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on August 19, 2011, 10:15:37 PM
I was recently on a flight that encountered some insane turbulence on approach (it was so bad that our plane fish-tailed a couple of hundred feet above the rocky coastline, our pilot refused to land and we flew several hundred kilometers away to another airport). My exact thoughts where "well. It'd suck if we go down, but most people don't get to choose how they go."
I think I would be having a panic attack if that happened (I don't do well with heights so even light plane turbulence puts me on edge). But, while I wouldn't have a calm response, I can't imagine me suddenly thinking that praying would fix it.
I can understand why people have a fear of flying, when a plane is in a downward spiral you can have quite a bit of time to think about your impending doom.
I am terrified of heights!!!. I don't even like driving over bridges.
I would have pissed myself in your situation, Juliet. X_x
The theists at home would probably blame the atheists, on board of that plane, for the plane not being saved by their Gods.
^ That is so sad! I'm sure they would. The same horrible concept some theists have towards countries hit with major natural disasters. But I digress, as I don't want to anger myself before 6am. *yawn*
Quote from: Whitney on August 19, 2011, 10:21:27 PM
Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on August 19, 2011, 10:15:37 PM
I was recently on a flight that encountered some insane turbulence on approach (it was so bad that our plane fish-tailed a couple of hundred feet above the rocky coastline, our pilot refused to land and we flew several hundred kilometers away to another airport). My exact thoughts where "well. It'd suck if we go down, but most people don't get to choose how they go."
I think I would be having a panic attack if that happened (I don't do well with heights so even light plane turbulence puts me on edge). But, while I wouldn't have a calm response, I can't imagine me suddenly thinking that praying would fix it.
My husband, who is also an atheist, was a little less calm and kept repeating "This is so scary! This is so scary!" , but there was no mention of god from him, either.
I think that maybe because of mostly black-and-white thinking, many theists simply can't see how an atheist thinks. They simply see atheism as a negation of what they are (which in some cases, is really not all that bad ;D ). I think that those who say that there are no real atheists have that sort of fundamental misunderstanding.
Secondly, people (and all other animals) want to survive and will practically do anything to survive. In some cases, maybe that extends to wanting a soul to survive when death seems inevitable and imminent. ???
Though maybe you could ask her if she would suddenly start believing in any other god other than her own if she were in that sort of situation. You don't just start believing in something at will.
I happen to find a big chunk of Atheists and Theist extremely alike. I've had the luck to be on many a forum and be friends with a many a different belief system. Both sides sound similarly alike.
Quote from: Medusa on August 22, 2011, 09:53:14 AM
I happen to find a big chunk of Atheists and Theist extremely alike. I've had the luck to be on many a forum and be friends with a many a different belief system. Both sides sound similarly alike.
Which just goes to show that there is a lot more that binds humanity together than drives it apart when one gets down to the personal level :)
Quote from: Tank on August 22, 2011, 09:55:18 AM
Quote from: Medusa on August 22, 2011, 09:53:14 AM
I happen to find a big chunk of Atheists and Theist extremely alike. I've had the luck to be on many a forum and be friends with a many a different belief system. Both sides sound similarly alike.
Which just goes to show that there is a lot more that binds humanity together than drives it apart when one gets down to the personal level :)
Amen brotha! In fact this very thing is why my fiance and I get along so well. Though completely different religions, we thrive on finding commonality amongst our friends and world around us.
As a Satanist, there is seriously no other religion that gets the shit from all spectrums of religions. Even the secular people dis us.
*sits all alone in her Satanic cave.
nobody knowsssss the trouble I've seeeeennnnnn :P
*Long story skipped*
...And so there was Asmodean, spinning wildly out of control in his VW and a huge rock coming at him, disregarding right of way and a bunch of other rules.
What did Asmodean think right then..? "Oh, this is bloody EMBARRASSING!"
(I did hit the rock eventually, but thanks to some masterful maneuvering, the damage was pretty much negligable - both to me, car and the rock)
Truth be told, I can't imagine a situation where I would feel the urge to pray or otherwise communicate with somebody else's imaginary friend. Well, there is one possibility. 200 Euro an hour will probably get me to say a few prayers.
^oh my gosh. Are you and your car alright?
Quote from: Sweetdeath on August 22, 2011, 04:33:43 PM
^oh my gosh. Are you and your car alright?
Car got new front suspension, a new rim and overhauled steering plus a speck of bodywork as a result of that thing eventually. Me... Walked away with not a scratch. And that after saying zero prayers. Chew on that, fundies!
Hooray!
I love the pompous self-righteousness of people to assume that someone's "not really" what they say they are because they disagree with it. As though atheists go around telling people that to get a rise out of them or for shock value, and perhaps if they ignore it, it will just go away. My wife and I recently went to Salem, Mass. on vacation and upon telling a friend that, she promptly replied "oh, I don't believe in witches". I just as promptly informed her that I hadn't asked. She quickly defended "well, I mean people can believe what they want, I just do believe in witches". I tried, to no avail, to explain that she could believe what she liked, and could believe that the witches beliefs were wrong, but saying "I don't believe in witches is akin to saying "I don't believe in snakes". That's all well and good, but don't be surprised when you get bitten on the ass-cheek. I'm a pretty solid 6 on the theism scale, only in that I can't disprove any more than the pope can prove, but after 13 or 14 accidents on the road and a fall out a second story window, I don't recall any praying. I used to pray to a god and goddess when I considered myself pagan, and used to prayer to a god before that when I had a brief stint as a JW, and got about the same results as I would if I shouted "I'm a Little Teapot" at the stars.
Quote from: Happy with no god on August 18, 2011, 02:34:14 PM
I was in a meeting this morning at work when a colleague of mine just happened to mention that he was atheist (not sure why this came out) but I was surprised by the response of my boss, who replied "I don't think you are really" this was then backed up by a comment from his number two "you don't find any atheists on a crashing plane". Both my manager and his number two are both active Christians.
I've never been in a crashing plane, but I have been in a crashing car and I can tell you my thoughts were not "oh god help me!" but "how can I get out of this?". I'm also fairly certain that when I do come to the moment of death, if I have time to think anything at all, it's less likely to be "god forgive me for doubting you" than "ah shit, it's over".
There's a theory that religions, most of which promise an afterlife, were created specifically to deal with human fear of death and I can see how someone who is absolutely terrified of non-existence would find it hard to believe that this fear, while commonplace, is not universal. Hence all the variations to "no atheists in foxholes" -- they can't believe that anyone could simply accept non-existence when the possibility of a god who provides supernatural immortality is on offer.
Yeah, I agree, Cats.
It is the fear of not existing. 'Of course I'm worth more than a freakish outbreak of senscience with a finite existence? Surely noone can believe that outlandish assertion'.
It is an overinflated self-importance clinging to the life-raft of faith. Desire over rationale.
Quote from: Scissorlegs on September 13, 2011, 01:12:49 AM
Yeah, I agree, Cats.
It is the fear of not existing. 'Of course I'm worth more than a freakish outbreak of senscience with a finite existence? Surely noone can believe that outlandish assertion'.
It is an overinflated self-importance clinging to the life-raft of faith. Desire over rationale.
Yep. "I can't possibly really, truly die forever -- I'm too
me not to exist!"
Quote from: Medusa on August 22, 2011, 09:59:21 AM
Amen brotha! In fact this very thing is why my fiance and I get along so well. Though completely different religions, we thrive on finding commonality amongst our friends and world around us.
As a Satanist, there is seriously no other religion that gets the shit from all spectrums of religions. Even the secular people dis us.
I'm interested to know what your fiances religion is, and how far do HIS desires weave themselves into your own LaVeyan thinking? (I'm guessing you are LaVeyan rather than Theistic). Is it possible for a dedicated LaVeyan to be monogamous, sympathetic to human weakness or empathic? Or is this yet another social compromise that obviates the LeVayan system to pointlessness? I would argue that any 'weak' (part-time) LaVeyan Satanists are no different in outlook or action than most conscientious atheists.
Concerning your propensity for being the self proclaimed ass-wipe of humanity, this is certainly born of ignorance as to the real nature of your system (for the record I have no problem with it other than it's futility). You must agree that you do nothing to assuage this issue.