Ok, I'm going to be discussing something that has been on my mind for the past several days. I am a bit uncomfortable with the speed at which the scientific establishment is making new discoveries. Now, as far as the knowledge uncovered by these discoveries, I am thrilled, but I fear that individuals at the cutting edge of technology are running far afield of any societal ability to set down moral guidelines so as to preserve the functioning of civilization.
To give a perfect example, many of the technological achievements in just the past ten years have changed american society so quickly that the very same society has not had time to develop precedent or social rules regarding proper use of such technology. And without any precedent to set or guide a system of cohesive societal regulations, the strain on society is causing fissures that are becoming ever wider and more indicative of a civilization that is on the verge of irreversable fracture.
It would seem that we are on the precipice of no turning back, and we are about to jump off that cliff without even checking to see how much water lies at the bottom. And at the very cutting edge of this runaway train is a vast array of enthusiastic scientists that are continually urging us to "Jump! Jump! Jump!"
Frankly, I am very terrified of what is happening, and thought I understand the emotion as a familiar reaction to unfamiliar circumstances, the very existence of such unfamiliar circumstances tells me of an approaching danger that is as ominous as it is enticing.
(Edited to revise thread title. --Recusant)
Can you give specifics of some of the technological advances that you think we are unprepared for? I have some examples in my head (such as parenting in the digital age, how to keep our kids safe on the internet when many of us didn't have the internet at home when we were kids - I was 17 before we ever had it at home. Yes, I'm old.) But I don't know that my examples are the same ones that you are thinking of. Also, this probably deserves it's own thread since I'm sure many people will be interested in weighing in on this topic.
What strain on society, in particular, are you concerned about?
I think the progress should be kept in check only by humanity's stupidity (Leading to abuse, leading to setbacks)
Off the top of my head? Lesee... the diminution of face to face communication, the loosening of standards of accountability, the loss of information rights regarding personal information, symptoms of withdrawal relating to the loss of internet connectivity, the increasing proportion of time spent occupying virtual worlds at the expense of local environmental maintenance, the increasing proportion of services that require definite technological accouterments so as to allow social participation, the eerie desertion of streets, parks, and other natural environments in favor of isolation inside private residences and automobiles, the huge surge and sexual proclivity online and corresponding decline in birth rates, the estrangement and minimal amount of contact between colleagues at the same firm, the vast stretches of both suburban and urban residential environment that one can traverse and find not a single other human soul, the corresponding abundance of feral cats and dogs that line these long stretches of roads...
(paragraph break)
...the seeming inability for any police agencies or local law enforcement to even attempt a home visit upon the failure of all other electronic means of getting in touch with you, the seeming ability for anyone without a cell phone and constant internet access to get lost in the legal, political, and corporate systems, all electronic billing, paying, texting, collaboration, the symptoms of desperation and depression that can originate over slight insults on facebook, as well as the lack of "comments" or "views" on their status updates, the decline in public meeting places, the increasing lack of bookstores, newspapers, barbershops, roadside cafes and other traditional places of social interaction...
(paragraph break)
...inability of individuals to maintain eye contact, inability of individuals to sustain bodily contact, inability of individuals to maintain long-term relationships outside of the internet, a huge decrease in neighboorhood associations, a huge decrease in individuals knowing their neighbors, a huge decrease in historical knowledge even one hundred years ago, a decline in civic participation at the local level, a decline in civic participation at the national level...
(par. break.)
...economic recession and impending depression, increasing trends of violence and instability all over the world, a sever stratification and isolation of social groups and a corresponding lack of intercommunication across social groups...
You know... I don't think this list will end any time soon...
*please note* All of these things have been observed by myself only in my local environs. Things could be different in other localities.
...And you see all those things as overall negative? Perhaps the mass communication will lead us to the next evolution of humans as biomechanical entities with networked computers integrated in our nervous system. Why should we try to prevent or limit that in any way?
I see everything you listed as a bit of a mixed bag - the loss of face to face communication isn't all bad (what's HAF, afterall? We'd have never spoken to each other without this kind of technology). I see the decrease in birth rate in some areas to be a good thing, though I don't know if it is directly corresponded to the availability of sexual material online.
RenegeReversi looks like you have a case of "mean world syndrome".
You're not called determined for nothing!
I'm sure you're not called Juliet for nothing either, now that I come to think of it.
Quote from: En_Route on June 24, 2012, 12:29:59 AM
You're not called determined for nothing!
I'm sure you're not called Juliet for nothing either, now that I come to think of it.
I have my theatrical moments. ;D
A few things I've noticed, which were already in play in my youth but have accelerated in the past decade:
1. Desire for instant gratification - everything is at your finger tips so some people have never developed a discipline to wait for something good.
2. Inability to speak in more than short sentences - long sustained thought also takes some discipline, and communication skills.
3. Inability to sit silently in thought for any significant length of time - always having to be plugged in or connected to some media device.
Whether it's good or bad, quien sabe.
I guess I just don't see things as being all that dire. Maybe it depends on where you live, by my area certainly isn't a ghost town of empty sidewalks and feral dogs. I will say that it does bother me to see a table full of people who are ignoring each other in favor of their cell phones. Usually teenagers.
Quote from: Ali on June 24, 2012, 03:10:58 PM
I guess I just don't see things as being all that dire. Maybe it depends on where you live, by my area certainly isn't a ghost town of empty sidewalks and feral dogs. I will say that it does bother me to see a table full of people who are ignoring each other in favor of their cell phones. Usually teenagers.
Maybe the people on the other side of those phones are more interesting and/or significant to them than those at the table?
Quote from: Asmodean on June 24, 2012, 03:59:29 PM
Quote from: Ali on June 24, 2012, 03:10:58 PM
I guess I just don't see things as being all that dire. Maybe it depends on where you live, by my area certainly isn't a ghost town of empty sidewalks and feral dogs. I will say that it does bother me to see a table full of people who are ignoring each other in favor of their cell phones. Usually teenagers.
Maybe the people on the other side of those phones are more interesting and/or significant to them than those at the table?
Most likely, because i certainly don't do that shit to my friends or Mimi.
I spent the entire day last night doing a Firefly mini marathon and didn't think of my cellphone once. :<
Technology now makes things easier for me. No longer do i have to worry about missing a call because i stepped out to the store. Or waiting anxiously for a job interview to call me, and not going out all day because of it.
Skype allows me to videochat with my far away friends. That is amazing!
I can join forums like these with like minded people and know i am not alone :)
I think this age of technology will help assist in eliminating some ignorance.
If some people have social and communication blunders, then that's on them, not cellphones and computers.
Quote from: Asmodean on June 24, 2012, 03:59:29 PM
Quote from: Ali on June 24, 2012, 03:10:58 PM
I guess I just don't see things as being all that dire. Maybe it depends on where you live, by my area certainly isn't a ghost town of empty sidewalks and feral dogs. I will say that it does bother me to see a table full of people who are ignoring each other in favor of their cell phones. Usually teenagers.
Maybe the people on the other side of those phones are more interesting and/or significant to them than those at the table?
Why go out with people if you don't care to speak with/interact with them?
I sometimes think they're talking to each other.
Quote from: OldGit on June 24, 2012, 05:29:44 PM
I sometimes think they're talking to each other.
Awww my post was at the end of first page. Oh well :/
They just might be. Sometimes when my friend D and I go out, we text eachother at the table if loud and irritating people are beside us.
Quote from: Sweetdeath on June 24, 2012, 05:11:20 PM
If some people have social and communication blunders, then that's on them, not cellphones and computers.
Exactly.
Quote from: Ali on June 24, 2012, 05:27:53 PM
Why go out with people if you don't care to speak with/interact with them?
One of them may well be buying food with the rest liking the idea of free lunch. OR one may find oneself in the middle of some dreadful family get-together tradition thing just in the name of keeping the peace. I never got that bit, but know people who actually do such thing in the name of peace preservation.
Another plausible situation is that a person is interested in interacting with one-two others at that table, but not while the rest hang around. Yet another possibility is boredom: I will attend because I can and have nothing better to do.
There are many reasons why people get together and then ignore each other, so the list is far from complete.
In my personal experience, however, there usually is enough communication between me and people I visit (or my visitors) even though we are inclined to glue ourselves to each hisown screen at first opportunity. Just because we are together, does not mean we should communicate exclusively within the group - I will say what I need to say when I need to say it, as will those around me. Most of it will usually even be heard.
Quote from: RenegeReversi on June 23, 2012, 09:34:35 PM
I am a bit uncomfortable with the speed at which the scientific establishment is making new discoveries. Now, as far as the knowledge uncovered by these discoveries, I am thrilled, but I fear that individuals at the cutting edge of technology are running far afield of any societal ability to set down moral guidelines so as to preserve the functioning of civilization.
It seems you are resistant to change.
Religions are often very traditional in nature and stifle progress.
I don't believe in morality, I don't need nor desire someone else making moral decisions on my behalf. Why should I miss out on the benefits of progress because someone in power is confused and scared of change?
Maybe I am a bit resistant to change. I feel a bit like I am getting left behind. But thethe cohesiveness of changes do keep coming. I will say that the technological changes seen might cause the downfall of civilization, or they migh5t transform it. What I think is important is that the cohesiveness of society be maintained. But maybe I'm just an old man.
Quote from: RenegeReversi on June 24, 2012, 10:28:12 PM
What I think is important is that the cohesiveness of society be maintained.
I think it always will. It just takes time to adjust and figure out what type of society we want to maintain. Do people want something new or do they want to keep with tradition, personally I am all for change and constantly moving forward. If a human internet existed like it does in the film "Ghost in the Shell" I would sign up for it straight away even though that opens up even more questions, but one thing is certain and thats wetware based technology is coming as is nanotechnology.
Does this have anything to do with religion? Some religious people cultivate these fears and distrust of change. I particularly find your views to be a little odd. Where does "cohesiveness of society" factor in? At what expense? What exactly do you mean by 'a cohesive society'? One where the majority view is the accepted one? What if the old status quo just doesn't work anymore in a changing world?
Personally I find it difficult to imagine a world where people give up on normal social interaction to go just online, at least just yet. But who knows? Maybe soon there will be a way to look a projected hologram of someone halfway across the world right in the eye and hold a conversation as if that person were right next to you. I think such prospects are fascinating, and will make the world a smaller place (I'm not really a fan of small inward-looking places).
But anyways, speaking for myself, I love online conversations. Firstly because I am a socially awkward person by nature and secondly because I prefer to speak in English. I won't get that as easily here. I like the idea of using cyberspace as my workplace as well, there are just so many tools and possibilities at one's disposal. :)
It's always been the case that older generations resist change and some of the younger are eager for it, only to be the older ones in a few years time. ::) That's been happening since the days of my grandparents as far as I remember. ::)
Edited to add:
The thing I think is really going to suffer in the next few years is the chance to have a simple life. That will be one of the high prices we will pay for being connected to everything all the time, and administration slowly migrating to cyberspace and computerized attendance.
I envy people who lead simple lives.