Animal Intelligence, do they deserve better from us?

[Heretical Rants]

Absolutely.

I wasn't arguing against zoos.

[LegendarySandwich]

Absolutely.

I wasn't arguing against zoos.

I wasn't saying that to you, I was saying that to Stevil, who I presume is against zoos.

[Stevil]

Absolutely.

I wasn't arguing against zoos.

I wasn't saying that to you, I was saying that to Stevil, who I presume is against zoos.

I feel that animals to a large extent would have been better off if humans hadn't taken control of the world. We have divided up the world and claimed ownership of it and left only small pockets for animals to maintain freedom.

With regards to Zoos, these are better places than someone's living room but are not as good as a nature reserve and are not as good as nature (e.g. forests and oceans etc). When an elephant is taken from its herd in Africa and shipped off to live its life in a zoo this is not as good as remaining with the herd. But of course there maybe special circumstances as to why that animal in particular could not remain with the herd.
Anyway, I am not about to start up a rally against zoos or people who keep dogs in their living room.

[KDbeads]

Stevil....
Dogs aren't wild animals, they have been domesticated.  Many of your toy/dust mop types couldn't function as a dog outside of the home and would be self eliminating if man weren't involved.  Man bred them to this point and therefore should take responsibility for his actions and care for the mutant creatures he's created.  We can't go back and undo several thousands of years of this either so why be upset against it and try to toss dogs back out into a Non-native habitat? (Native habitats being what we as humans bred them for, evolution had nothing to do with it).
The same thinking goes for all domesticated animals, with the exception of cats, chickens, and a large number of 'domesticated' fowl who can revert inside of a generation, we need to take care of what we created.
Truly wild animals are a different set of issues altogether.  I don't want a tiger or monkey in my house or anyone elses, that to me is cruel, yet here in TX they do it a lot.  Zoos aren't the best for them either but unfortunately these are the only breeding populations of some animals left and since we as humans destroyed whatever habitat they had, we have the responsibility to help bring them back and preserve them.  They aren't locked in little cages for a side show like they used to be, at least here in the states anyway, they get enrichment, have a small territory, are free from poachers and predators, get medical care when needed and are generally in decent health.  Granted it's not their habitat but in many cases there isn't a habitat left for them.  

Seriously, watch a few episodes of Life after People sometime.  It gives a good theory on what happens to our domesticated critters if we were not there to take care of them.

[Stevil]

It gives a good theory on what happens to our domesticated critters if we were not there to take care of them.

I haven't seen the show, but understand what you are saying, I'm not suggesting we simply take off the leashes and let our pets run free. All I am saying is that I feel we (the human race) don't treat our loved animals very well. This is the starting point on how we treat animals, the other animals are treated far worse and I don't really want to think about the awefull things we do to them, so it was easier for me to describe the treatment of pets. It is a shame what we have done to the dog species, pretty much destroyed it as an independant species, other than dingos and maybe some others around.

Personally I wouldn't consider "owning" a dog unless I had a huge amount of land for it to roam "freely" around and was able to give it lots of attention. Sitting at home in my lounge or back yard waiting for me to come home from work is not much of a life for a dog. But that is me, my personal choice. If others choose otherwise then that is their business. I am not the dog rights crusader.

[KDbeads]

It gives a good theory on what happens to our domesticated critters if we were not there to take care of them.

I haven't seen the show, but understand what you are saying, I'm not suggesting we simply take off the leashes and let our pets run free. All I am saying is that I feel we (the human race) don't treat our loved animals very well. This is the starting point on how we treat animals, the other animals are treated far worse and I don't really want to think about the awefull things we do to them, so it was easier for me to describe the treatment of pets. It is a shame what we have done to the dog species, pretty much destroyed it as an independant species, other than dingos and maybe some others around.

Most of the human race has no clue how to treat an animal properly, I most definitely agree.  And there are differing ideas as to how companion animals and domestic feed stock should be treated, which is ok as long as the welfare of the animal is paramount.  We as a species can do better, far better.  Hence why I do rescue, it's my way of helping in what way I can To help those critters who need it and can't do it for themselves.  It's also the reason I'm trying my hardest to become self sufficient when it comes to my food.  One less mindless person buying meat off the shelves that came out of a battery house, feed lot, water farm, etc.  We really should actually teach our children where their food comes from, make them see these places, same for their parents.  I think that would help get more people involved with changing the treatment our food sources.  It's a start, it will in no way fix the problem, but it's a start.