Self Defense

[Kylyssa]

I don't believe that firearms are effective enough for self-defense to offset the dangers they present.  In a system where guns are easy to get there are just more guns floating around.  Sure, you might not ever do anything bad with your gun but the guy who steals it while you're at the grocery store probably will.  You might never have a gun accident and get hurt but your children might.  Never underestimate a kid's ability to get into things.  People almost always do.  And if your gun is safely locked away in a cabinet, how are you going to use it for self-defense if someone breaks into your home?  

Cops, who have a crapload of training and undergo psych evaluations, still manage to panic in the heat of the moment and shoot people they ought not to.  I don't trust your average Joe or Jane to do even as well.  I don't trust myself to do as well.    

A knife in your hand can be turned against you in a split second.  When I was an underfed street kid, weighing in at less than a hundred pounds, I took an assailant's knife away.  He was a good eight inches taller and at least fifty pounds heavier than I was.  Then again, he was distracted by raping me.  I got cut up and messed up but I survived to tell the tale.   If I could take away a knife, absolutely anyone can.  I admit I carried a knife after that but I never used it and it didn't help a bit when I was assaulted the next time.  It may have eased my ambient terror level a bit, to sleep with a knife clutched in my hand but it didn't prove useful, well, other than for cutting things and my pocket knife served that purpose well enough already.  But it sure would have been great if the guy hadn't had the knife in the first place.

[Kylyssa]

I think that killing in self-defense or in the defense of others is sometimes justified.  I'd rather try to disable the person but sometimes it might not be possible or work well enough to stop the person from continuing to attack.

[Laser Sailor]

I am going to preface everything I say with this: I am a trained military police officer.

Self defense makes sense to me.  Stuff defense?  No.  They can have it.  It's just stuff.

This does make the assumption that upon taking your stuff they won't kill you anyway. Are you willing to bet your life on the "honor" of some robber? Often the last thing a criminal expects is physical resistance, you are better off to resists as hard as possible than allow yourself to become a victim.

I prefer a ladder of force methodology. If someone threatens you, you use an equal amount of force to subdue the threat. If equal force fails, you move up the ladder until something works. At the lowest rung on my ladder is verbal force, yelling "Stop, Get away from me!" Next is physical methods, martial arts punches, kicks and take downs. Above that is chemical weapons such as pepper spray (which I always carry). Lastly is deadly force, which can be anything from a kick to the head to a firearm (which I don't always carry with me, depends on where I'm going).

If somebody threatens me, or someone else for that matter, with deadly force, I will respond with deadly force. If someone threatens me with simple physical violence, I'll rely on my hand to hand training. If that fails, I move up the ladder.

Guns in the house, especially with children, do pose a problem. There are simple fixes to negate the danger. One method is to lock the weapon up in a gun safe, this is how I treat my long arms (rifle, shotgun). If I need to get one of those out, it's all ready hit the proverbial fan. For my pistol, if it's not in the safe, I simply keep it holstered on my person. My nephew cannot get into it accidentally if I am in direct possession of it.

Of course everything is based upon what you are comfortable doing. If you're uncomfortable with the thought of carrying a gun, then don't. I certainly wouldn't want to be around someone who is carrying a gun and uncomfortable in doing so. Secondly if you are comfortable with the concept of using weapons, get training! The biggest gun the world is merely a dangerous paperweight if you don't know how to use it correctly and safely.

Cops, who have a crapload of training and undergo psych evaluations, still  manage to panic in the heat of the moment and shoot people they ought not to. I don't trust your average Joe or Jane to do even as well. I don't trust myself to do as well.

While it is true that accidents happen and sometime a bystander is shot, this is an extremely rare event. Far more often the officer, or civilian who uses a firearm for self defense doesn't even have to pull the trigger. I personally have drawn my weapon twice (in the line of duty) and haven't shot anybody, I hope I never have to. The problem is, if nobody gets shot, the news media isn't going to report the incident, so you rarely hear about someone successfully using a gun to defend themselves. There are of course rules and laws about drawing a firearm, you'll have to research those yourself if you're interested.

Self defense is far more than carrying a weapon and knowing how to use it. Your mind is the greatest weapon you could ever possess.

Situational Awareness is the biggest factor in staying alive. Next time you go out to a busy location take a moment to notice the people around you. How many of them seem to be in their own world, oblivious to what's happening around them? That oblivion is often (not always) what get's people robbed, raped or killed. Criminals know when someone is not paying attention, that will play a huge factor in who they choose to attack. So wither you choose to carry a weapon or not, don't disarm your brain. A billion years of evolution have given us an ability to sense danger before it happens, you just have to be aware.

My personal rules are as follows:

Always avoid sketchy situations whenever possible. (for example I don't go to liquor stores or quickstop type places after 10pm)
Always be aware of your surroundings.
Fighting is always bad, but if you must fight, win. <- stole that nugget of wisdom from "The Karate Kid"

[pinkocommie]

Like I said - if a situation comes to self defense, I'll defend myself.  But if someone comes up to me with a gun and asks for my stuff, I'm not going to try to hurt them over stuff.  It's just stuff.  I don't see it as being a victim, though I can understand how someone might, I see it as being reasonable in an unreasonable situation.  If I hand over my stuff and the person still tries to hurt me, that's when self defense kicks in.  This could backfire, the person could kill me as soon as I hand over my stuff, but it could just as easily backfire in any situation and for me, this seems like the safest, most logical route to take.

[Laser Sailor]

You are right, you have to choose a point at which you will begin to resist. I was making a generalization and naturally every situation is different.

For example, if I was walking downtown and someone tried to mug me, they're unarmed, I'm unarmed, I'd resist.

But if he had a knife and got to within 5-6 feet of me, even if I was armed with my gun, I'd drop my wallet and try to escape while he goes to pick it up. I'm not going to shoot someone if there's a mean by which I can escape. It's only a last resort.

[Sophus]

Self defense is fine. Which precisely why I don't understand stories like: three kids ganged up on one. The one kid knew karate. The three kids ended up in hospital. The one kid gets in trouble.

Now "turn the other cheek" is mandatory?  

[Thumpalumpacus]

Oh lordy, where did that happen?

[Kylyssa]

Always avoid sketchy situations whenever possible. (for example I don't go to liquor stores or quickstop type places after 10pm)
Always be aware of your surroundings.

Add to this -
Don't work the night shift.
Don't be a woman.
Don't be homeless.

[Kylyssa]

That oblivion is often (not always) what get's people robbed, raped or killed.

A person with criminal intent is always, 100% of the time, what gets people robbed, raped, or killed.  It's important to be aware of your surroundings but you'd be surprised how many people turn a victim's lack of such awareness for the crime itself, lessening the blame on the criminal.

[Laser Sailor]

That oblivion is often (not always) what get's people robbed, raped or killed.

A person with criminal intent is always, 100% of the time, what gets people robbed, raped, or killed.  It's important to be aware of your surroundings but you'd be surprised how many people turn a victim's lack of such awareness for the crime itself, lessening the blame on the criminal.

I was referring to prevention on the part of the would be victim. Of course it's the criminal's intentions that cause the crime. I would never insinuate that a person was attacked or raped because of something they did or didn't do. I'm just saying that an ounce of prevention is worth more than a pound of cure.

[Kylyssa]

I suppose it's a knee-jerk reaction on my part.  I actually had police respond to a report I made with "what do you expect, you're homeless?" as if that meant, "no need to investigate, no crime has been committed here."  There were worse reactions which I'm phrasing carefully so I don't get too worked up.  Put simply, many cops won't believe a homeless woman isn't a prostitute or doesn't deserve everything that happens to her, that it's 100% her fault if someone harms her.

[GAYtheist]

For me, in high school, being gay was a lot of fun...<strong sarcastic not there> I had to defend myself a lot, and I got sent home at least a half dozen times a year, but everytime I did, I told the principle that I'd do it again when it happened next. To her credit she would smile, nod and tell me that she knew. She had to follow the rules set for her. In Maine, the year I graduated, I came out by putting a kid against a wall  for harrassing an out friend of mine. Violence may not be the answer for everything, but for others it is the only one.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Oh lordy, I so had a great troll plotted out for your post, Gaytheist -- but I'm not that big a jerk.

And yes, there are times when fighting is necessary: sad, but true.

[skwurll]

The way I see it, every human has the inherent right to NOT have their teeth kicked in, the moment they act in a way that threatens either my well-being or the well-being of others, they lose that right.

I would feel fully justified defending against an attack, with lethal force if absolutely necessary.

[Tank]

The way I see it, every human has the inherent right to NOT have their teeth kicked in, the moment they act in a way that threatens either my well-being or the well-being of others, they lose that right.

I would feel fully justified defending against an attack, with lethal force if absolutely necessary.

Just a little thought here, but I have always wondered what an 'inherent right' is. And I'm not sure there is such a thing. One can't can it, or box it so it has to be a human concept, it has no physical measurable quantity and can it be described qualitatively? So I'm not 100% sure one can have 'the inherent right to NOT have their teeth kicked in', society can agree that it's a bad thing and should not happen. Is that an 'inherent right' or a an agreed position?  Just a random though, I get lots of those