Israeli-Hamas war

[billy rubin]

well, here we go.

Newborns die of hunger and mothers struggle to feed their children as Israel's siege condemns Gazans to starvation

https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/06/middleeast/israel-gaza-starvation-siege-mothers-babies-intl

[Icarus]

The Israelis are justified in trying to kill all the Hamas people. Hamas are the ones who started the brutal war.  Were the first offenders expecting to be excused for their bad behavior?

Seen from another perspective.......... the Israelis are practicing "Chinese Justice" in the extreme. Chinese Justice is when it is known that there are twelve  murder suspects. It is known that only one of them is the guilty party. The solution, CJ, is to execute all of them. That done, it is fairly certain that the real culprit has been sufficiently punished.

[Asmodean]

[billy rubin]

its a nasty business

Israelis protest food shipments to Gaza | CNN

https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/08/middleeast/gaza-israelis-aid-trucks-protests/index.html?iid=cnn-mobile-app

[zorkan]

I still don't know why Egypt won't take in Palestinian refugees.
Both are mainly the same type of Muslim which is Sunni.
It's a conspiracy theory to say if Egypt takes them in then Israel won't allow them back.
Israel targets Hamas.

Bigger picture is that this has been going on for 14 centuries, the crazy argument about the true successor to Mohammed and the role of all Muslims to conquer the infidel.
But not just an argument. It may have led to 1 billion deaths in Islamic wars of conquest across 3 continents against innocent people who just happen to have been born into a different belief. Christians, Hindu's, Jains, Buddhists, Sikhs and Jews.

Gaza, just the latest chapter.
Next it will be Europe as a whole.

[Asmodean]

I still don't know why Egypt won't take in Palestinian refugees.
Both are mainly the same type of Muslim which is Sunni.

I think it's for pragmatic reasons, and broadly similar ones to those being raised in the American and European immigration debate.

Egypt wants control over precisely who they let across the border, and Egypt and Palestine are not that "tight" on national level. Egypt and Israel - less so.

It's a conspiracy theory to say if Egypt takes them in then Israel won't allow them back.
Israel targets Hamas.

That's the problem though. Israel wants control over their borders as well, and so they will certainly let some people back in, but what do you do about those who had to leave their identification papers behind, or those who never had them in the first place? And then, how do you stop terrorist infiltration with returning refugees?

Yes, the blanket stetement of "Israel won't let them back" is a bit of a conspiracy theory at this point. However, it's not entirely without merit. Mass border crossings across closed (as in, access-controlled) borders is... Complicated.

Next it will be Europe as a whole.

It is stoppable, this trend. The question is, will it be stopped?

[billy rubin]

why ask egypt to take the palestinians?

why not put them in yorkshire?

[Asmodean]

"They(tm)" could ask Egypt or the United Kingdom or even Yorkshire specifically, but it would still be up to that entity to accept or reject "Their" request.

Similarly, you can put a person somewhere, but it should be up to them to go there or not, unless there is a reason to force them. Otherwise, there is a word for that. It starts with a baby goat and ends with sleeping for a spell.

"Some entity must do things to this person, nevermind their choices" seems a bit of an authoritarian approach to me. You get to ask to be let into a nation. A nation may request or even demand your presence. What business is it of "Theirs(tm)?"

Of course, if you mean that a Palestinian should or should not ask for entry to Egypt, that's a different question. Being "put" in Yorkshire (or wherever it may be), however... Way to promote human trafficking, my dude. I repudiate the very notion. (Unless of course you meant "offer asylum in Yorkshire," but then why put it into the terms used rather than just say that?)

[billy rubin]

interestingly, nobody asked the palestinians when they were deciding where to put the jews.

putting people in someone else's country was how this whole mess started.

[Asmodean]

interestingly, nobody asked the palestinians when they were deciding where to put the jews.

putting people in someone else's country was how this whole mess started.

There was not a Palestine when They(tm) were deciding upon the establishment of a Jewish state. It's not that interesting whether the Palestinians were asked at all - more whether the nations governing the land were, and how they approached their citizens residing in the breakaway areas.

To the best of my knowledge, putting peoples somewhere is a Chinese, Soviet, Nazi or just-conqueror way of going about things.

Did the British put their Jews in Israel? The Americans? Who were they put there by?

You can establish a nation for me specifically, but unless you also deport me there, you have not put me anywhere at all.

[billy rubin]

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2024-02-16/rafah-gaza-hospitals-surgery-israel-bombing-ground-offensive-children

On one occasion, a handful of children, all about ages 5 to 8, were carried to the emergency room by their parents. All had single sniper shots to the head. These families were returning to their homes in Khan Yunis, about 2.5 miles away from the hospital, after Israeli tanks had withdrawn. But the snipers apparently stayed behind. None of these children survived.

[Recusant]

Future Hamas terrorists nipped in the bud. Once the logic of "justice" referenced by Icarus is adopted, there are no illegitimate targets. The mindset has been pretty obvious for a while. Recall the Israeli hostages waving white flags who were shot down. A "mistake" but only a mistake in that they happened to be Israelis.

[billy rubin]

that is the explicit attitude. i have listened to interviews with israeli civilians who state exactly that

in 18th century ohio some european-american colonists would kill any native american they encountered, of any age or sex.

when asked why he killed native children, one man quipped,

"nits make lice."

its the same attitude, 300 years apart.

[Tank]

I do wonder how this is going to end and how.

[Tom62]

I do wonder how this is going to end and how.

I think there will be a ceasefire after Hamas returns the remaining hostages in exchange for Palestinian terrorists. Hamas will rebuild their tunnels and replenish their missile arsenal and the story will then repeat itself.