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Have You Begun To Fester And Rot Yet?

Started by The Magic Pudding., February 17, 2023, 08:09:43 AM

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The Magic Pudding.

Have You Begun To Fester And Rot Yet?
I'm afraid I have.


There are terms that I hear that start me twitching, in a noble righteous way of course, words like feminazi.
Must be something wrong with the person using it, I suppose there are over the top feminists but I don't seem to come across them much.

Woke, I think the woke folks hearing me use it would go Ah Ha! he's a Nazi!
They can be so tedious though, I might agree with them on an issue but they can seem self-righteous to me.

Apparently the USA religious loons didn't care about abortion, that was a Catholic thing.  Then feminists and progressive types (their evil enemies) starting protesting against people protesting against abortion.  So the evangelists decided abortion was evil.

Does all the woke furore over Ukraine and Putin make some side with Putin 'cause they have to oppose the woke?  Did something similar happen with climate change?

There's more to say but I have to go drink beer and watch Picard, he's woke I suppose but,,, he's Picard.



Asmodean

The Asmo. He is being baited, is He not..? :unsure:

Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

No one


Asmodean

#3
...Another thing The Asmo is, is weak. :hooked:

Although not really. I think there is a legitimate discussion to be had here, and I shall try to have it well. As for how to bait an Asmo? Poke at His trench in the "culture ""war.""" He will almost-invariably come out and play. In any case, I shall attempt a well-thought-out response, although being my response, trigger-warnings may apply for those easily-bruised by opinions.

Feminazi is a deliberately-derogatory term that combines "feminist" and "Nazist." That is self-explanatory, but then "Nazi" can mean anything or (mostly) nothing these days, depending on the circles in which you walk.

Personally, I prefer "screeching harpy," which is more of an umbrella term with regard to an individual's behaviour, which I can assess directly, as opposed to their ideology, which I more often than not have to at least partly assume. When I say "feminazi," I mean an adherent to a prescriptive ideology requiring an out-group to function, prone to top-down steering/arrangement and disregarding of an individual as the core unit of society. It's basically what would happen if an ideological Nazist was also a feminist.

It should be mentioned also, that I would not necessarily call a person who mostly holds such views, but is moderate/balanced in their approach to putting them into practice a feminazi. It would normally take a certain amount of "revolutionary zeal" on top of the ideology - so not only what, but also how.

So to return to your statement, I guess I wouldn't call an over-the-top feminist a feminazi. They may or may not be. It's not just a matter of magnitude, but one of underlying ideology. Is there something beyond or above your agenda? Does everything have to be designed and created with your [collective "you"] sensibilities in mind? Do you attempt to silence the opposition and neutralise competition? Is there, to bring it full circle, "nothing but the state and nothing above the state?" [metaphorical "state"] If yes, then the shoe fits.

Woke may follow broadly similar trends, but not necessarily. Oh, it is certainly built around the principle of "where there is a we, I can go fuck itself," but you don't technically have to be an authoritarian collectivist to be woke. For example, I'm pretty sure Bill Maher is pretty woke. Still he calls out those counterproductive elements of wokeness on a regular basis.

My personal world view butts against the woke in that I am a staunch proponent of citizen rights. You see, when it comes to such, I don't care whether you are a man or a woman, a part of the majority or a minority population, whether you prefer penises, vaginas or both, how many of your ancestors were Jewish... I care about what it says on your passport. If it says the same thing as it does on mine, then you should have the same societal rights, privileges and obligations as I. So, if I can move freely across the nation, so should you be able to. If I get to elect its leadership, so should you be able to. If I may legally own land - so should you be able to. Etc. The woke who I would describe as woke tend to divide the society across many more lines than that, though it ultimately boils down to who can be perceived as being somehow victimised by whom, with special rights and privileges awarded to the former... Unless they are ideologically opposed to the orthodoxy.

And this brings us neatly to what I think is "the problem." Religion. Both "wokeism" and "feminazism" are examples of such, I think. There is an in-group ("my people") and an out-group that "seeks to destroy them." (give or take) There is the original sin, the devil, of course, the need to be saved and a narrow, life-long path to "salvation," with the associated ritualistic/superstitious behaviour. There is a greater regard for the felt than the observable, ignoring of "inconvenient" facts... The list of similarities, it is a lengthy thing. There may be gods of sorts, even. Saints and martyrs, certainly. Add an unhealthy dollop of "jihadism," squeeze it into someone's head, and you have a person I would unapologetically call one of the abovementioned "cringe words" to their face. Whether or not my choice of verbage bothers them, does not bother me.

As for the latter part of your question, the answer is yes - to a degree. Some people take their tribal nature to the extreme of "what my enemy supports, I always oppose." I'm certain that there are plenty of people who support Russia's efforts at empire-building or my personal efforts at making the climate conducive of owning a banana tree in the garden "just" to spite the opposition. Some just think that it's not their fight - and to be fair, they do have a point.

The first seasons of Picard were pretty appalling in... How far he has fallen with no particular reason or explanation, I guess. Still, I must admit to having some hope for the third season. I hear rumours that the studio may be trying to turn that ship around - and sincerely best of luck to them. I just want good sci-fi.

...So doth The Asmo fester and rot? No. He might, however, sprout an occasional patch of Divine Mould right there behind them eyebrows. (As in; those are my opinions, yes. However, there is no vitriol, resentment or bitterness there, with the possible exception of attempting for an extra-colourful turn of phrase or to make a point with an armour-piercing tip, metaphorically speaking - just an analysis of what is, as perceived by me. I deal with most "hot topics" thusly.)

The Asmo wanders off, yet again promising Himself not to forget to re-watch Falling Skies. He liked Falling Skies.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

Icarus

MP,  I am also beginning to fester and rot. Well not just the beginning.The situation began some time ago. The state of my society is observably badly messed up.  Not just individuals but great masses of individuals who are thoroughly irrational. There are people here who believe that the Russia-Ukraine war is a staged event and that the people who left Ukraine are only paid actors.  :sadshake:

Feminazi for me is merely an overbearing loudmouthed woman with an IQ number similar to her shoe size. These are being called Karens.  Alas, some of them, not the Karens, have been able to make some valid points about gender equality and a whole bunch of other attitudes that are slowly being repaired.

There are a lot of American women Named Karen. I have no idea how that name became descriptive only of shithead women. One of my lifelong best and most intelligent friends was named Karen. She was a closet lesbian who was smarter and more skilled and more intelligent than most of the people I have even known. We truly cared for one another in the most respectful way.  Because f that I am offended when the term Karen is used to vilify a woman.

The anti abortion, anti gay, anti-books, anti- certain parts of American history tidal wave in the US is largely held by unsophisticated or uneducated men and women who are quite certain that they know what God wishes them to believe and requires them to practice.. They are not necessarily Catholics. Even moderate Christian types can have strong opinions about what they believe to be proper morality.

The meaning of the word: Woke, is not universally agreed upon. On the one side, the anti-woke people claim that the other side is surely a bunch of socialist crackpots who are sure to destroy the nation. They are quite vocal about that distinction. On the other side we want to simply tell it like it is.

We do have some extreme kooks who are terribly afraid that they might offend someone by the mere utterance of the wrong word. Those kooks invent all sorts of euphemisms to soften the meaning of whatever point, or description,they had wished to make. I am not on board with all of that namby pamby stuff. A turd is still a turd no matter how it is described.

One of the keen observations that is going around is this one: A dog gets more reliable information, when he sniffs another dogs ass, than humans can hope to get while watching FOX news.   



P.S. Meg Ryan is not a Feminazi in real life. 

The Magic Pudding.

Quote from: Asmodean on February 17, 2023, 11:21:41 AMFeminazi is a deliberately-derogatory term that combines "feminist" and "Nazist." That is self-explanatory, but then "Nazi" can mean anything or (mostly) nothing these days, depending on the circles in which you walk.

Personally, I prefer "screeching harpy," which is more of an umbrella term with regard to an individual's behaviour, which I can assess directly, as opposed to their ideology, which I more often than not have to at least partly assume. When I say "feminazi," I mean an adherent to a prescriptive ideology requiring an out-group to function, prone to top-down steering/arrangement and disregarding of an individual as the core unit of society. It's basically what would happen if an ideological Nazist was also a feminist.

I think the word "feminazi" is pretty stupid, I associate with creeps who can't abide assertive woman.
Do you have an example of a feminazi behaviour?





Quote from: Asmodean on February 17, 2023, 11:21:41 AMThe first seasons of Picard were pretty appalling in... How far he has fallen with no particular reason or explanation, I guess. Still, I must admit to having some hope for the third season. I hear rumours that the studio may be trying to turn that ship around - and sincerely best of luck to them. I just want good sci-fi.

The Asmo wanders off, yet again promising Himself not to forget to re-watch Falling Skies. He liked Falling Skies.

But it's got a Borg queen in it, how can you resist a borg queen, I mean... it's futile.















The Magic Pudding.

Quote from: Icarus on February 18, 2023, 01:28:07 AMFeminazi for me is merely an overbearing loudmouthed woman with an IQ number similar to her shoe size. These are being called Karens.  Alas, some of them, not the Karens, have been able to make some valid points about gender equality and a whole bunch of other attitudes that are slowly being repaired.


Yes the Karen thing, if you're named Karen I suppose you have to laugh it off, or be called a Karen Karen.
Imagine if a group started labelling Muslim men Mohameds whenever they did something they didn't agree with, there'd be outrage.  Principles only apply to others apparently.



Tank

Quote from: The Magic Pudding. on February 18, 2023, 05:21:33 AM
Quote from: Icarus on February 18, 2023, 01:28:07 AMFeminazi for me is merely an overbearing loudmouthed woman with an IQ number similar to her shoe size. These are being called Karens.  Alas, some of them, not the Karens, have been able to make some valid points about gender equality and a whole bunch of other attitudes that are slowly being repaired.


Yes the Karen thing, if you're named Karen I suppose you have to laugh it off, or be called a Karen Karen.
Imagine if a group started labelling Muslim men Mohameds whenever they did something they didn't agree with, there'd be outrage.  Principles only apply to others apparently.




The trouble is the most Muslim men are named Mohammed, or some allusive variation of it. They are already ruled by Poe's law.
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
"Religion is a culture of faith; science is a culture of doubt." ― Richard P. Feynman
'It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die. That is true, it's called Life.' - Terry Pratchett
Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.

No one

Karens are just twats.

Muslim men who would be referred to as mohammeds as karens are referred as karens would have to publicly start fucking pigs, every time they had sand in their vaginas.

Asmodean

#9
Quote from: The Magic Pudding. on February 18, 2023, 05:15:09 AMI think the word "feminazi" is pretty stupid, I associate with creeps who can't abide assertive woman.
There are some such creeps, certainly. That's not necessarily who and what the word is for, however. It's... A bit like certain people would call me a Nazi. They are (or have been listening-and-believing to) just different kind of creeps with as little of a clue.

QuoteDo you have an example of a feminazi behaviour?
Oh, certainly. I think I have listed such behaviours in my original response. Do you want me to name names?

...It was a bit of a long and unweildy thing, that reply, so I guess I shall at least (re-)iterate some points;

Charitably speaking, a Feminist argues for equal rights and/or opportunities for both sexes, with a few additional privileges for women where biology speaks to their necessity. For example, a Feminist may argue for ways of making maternity leave not affect a woman's career/pay, or in cases of reported domestic violence, for the initial presumption that the man is the instigator/perpetrator. That sort of thing.

A feminazi may or may not be a Karen, or "screeching harpy," as I referred to them. Not every one of them would take every opportunity to scream about patriarchy to any-one even half-willing to listen, hence my distinction between assessing a person's behaviour and their ideology. One may infer a connection from one to the other, buuut... Too simplistic for complexity-loving The Asmo.

Anyhoo, there is a point to this; a feminazi's behaviour is secondary to their ideology. Sometimes, it's quite apparent. Other times - not. Again, I'd be naming names to clarify, and may if desired, but in general terms, a feminazi is of the opinion that the world must cater to them (and/or their agenda - depending on how you look at it) specifically, as in, they must have a say in everything or, at the very least, everything must be designed with them in mind. They (insert the and/or from before) are "the state" in the Nazi analogy. They will tolerate "private enterprise" (as seen through the lens of the same metaphor) only as long as it serves them and will seek to remove criticism and silence and/or discredit rather than out-compete the opposition. (Broadly speaking, think "cancel culture," except as applied specifically by Feminists)

That's not the only way to feminazism, but I'd say that a component of prescriptive ideological totalitarianism is required. The nationalist component here is more metaphorical in nature, but then unquestioning allegiance to a cause is hardly different to that to a nation. From there, the ideology is about specifically privileging a certain group at the expense of another. (For a-slightly-risky-because-not-all-there-is-to-it example, a feminazi would support a law that requires companies to have a certain percentage of C-level position filled with women, but would oppose the same law if it also required the same percentage of C-level men)

...Yeah. That long and unwieldy thing The Asmo was trying to bite-size? He failed. Miserably. He's not displeased with the failure though. :smilenod:

Quote from: Asmodean on February 17, 2023, 11:21:41 AMBut it's got a Borg queen in it, how can you resist a borg queen, I mean... it's futile.
Ah, but you can't Borg a Q, and if you rotate The Asmo's eyebrows just so, a Q is what you get.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

The Magic Pudding.

More on the Karen matter.

I postulate that causing others pain or suffering or just making them feel bad is a bad thing, prima facie at least.

Sufficient reason not to act in a racist way.
Who wants to make trans people suffer?
Be nice, teach your children to be nice.
Simple.

Do some people have to get a message from Woke Central as to how to behave?
They can't work out using "Karen" hurts people, or they don't care, these people that demand others care ABSOLUTELY about whatever their current fad is.

06:25 a nice sounding Karen has something to say about it, the rest of the segment isn't worth hearing.

https://www.abc.net.au/sydney/programs/afternoons/gets-my-goat-parking-motorbikes-trolleys-karen/102010288

Asmodean

Quote from: The Magic Pudding. on February 23, 2023, 07:47:59 AMcausing others pain or suffering or just making them feel bad
One of those things is not like the other.

It could be made to be - there is such a thing as psychological abuse, for example. One should not forget though, that a hurt given is not the same thing as a hurt taken, and ripping someone's fingernails out with pliers does not belong in the same "universe" of hurt as "Shut up, Karen."

QuoteSufficient reason not to act in a racist way.
It is, though I'd think that it would be very easily out-weighed by greater concerns than being nice. I'm all for at least somewhat gentlemanly behaviour, but... Can't demand it of someone unwilling to offer it, and personally, I can count on one hand the number of people I've known for a while who "always" do. But then, I tend to hang out with gamers, and we do call each other all sorts of faggot on a regular basis. It's crude, but it's how a lot of us talk - and those who do not, don't mind. Oh, there is an occasional person who will make a thing out of it, but they rarely stick around - participation is strictly voluntary, after all.

Back to the relevant, I think we ["the West"] will see an increase in racist behaviour, if nothing else because it's more acceptable with the general watering down of the term - in a way not too unlike what you propose, through putting a lynching in the "same sentence" as an off-colour joke. One may think that one equalises things one way - another... At worst, another may see opportunities there.

QuoteWho wants to make trans people suffer?
I'm sure a lot of people do, actually. It's far from uncommon to find transgenderism all sorts of degenerate. I see the rhetorical question though, and yeah, I imagine most "regular" people don't care that much - as long as the trans "community agenda" is not inflicted on them.

QuoteDo some people have to get a message from Woke Central as to how to behave?
Nah. One points and laughs at messages from Woke Central.

That being said, I actually wanted to respond to this particular point here, so the above ramblings are largely because I'm me and can be ignored;

QuoteBe nice, teach your children to be nice.

...Keep your head very low indeed if you do - and teach your children to. Otherwise, the world will chew you and them alike up and what it spits out won't be very pretty.

Maybe I'm being overly-nuanced, as I am prone to on occasion, still, I'd suggest being nice initially and in response to others being so. Beyond a certain point, however, know how to fight - literally and metaphorically - for you and yours.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

Icarus

There are some folks who do things, for fun, that cause gag reflex in others.  I am thinking of a current Aussie fad called "shooies"

MP likely knows about that party stunt

The Magic Pudding.

Quote from: Icarus on February 24, 2023, 12:13:23 AMThere are some folks who do things, for fun, that cause gag reflex in others.  I am thinking of a current Aussie fad called "shooies"

MP likely knows about that party stunt

Shooies are gross, who wants to imbibe shoeness with their goonness?

Goon of Fortune on the other hand is a proper piece of culture.

"A number of goonsacks are pegged around the outside of a rotary washing line. Players sit underneath it at the edges and agree how much wine each "win" involves. One player spins the hoist, and when the spin stops the winner(s) nearest a bag or the bags must drink that amount. Players may not touch the clothesline, and penalties for breaking the rules vary."