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RIP Roe v. Wade

Started by Ecurb Noselrub, June 28, 2022, 01:01:34 AM

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Magdalena

^^^
 ;D

We all know how much that word is abused.


"It's true."
"Believe me."
"Honestly."
"Ask anyone."
"I'm not lying."
"To tell you the truth."
"Let me be clear."
"The fact is."
"I'm being honest."
"I am all about truth."

 ::)



"I've had several "spiritual" or numinous experiences over the years, but never felt that they were the product of anything but the workings of my own mind in reaction to the universe." ~Recusant

Asmodean

To tell you the truth, everybody lies.

Honestly, that sounds like a linguistic paradox, but is not. The question is not so much whether everybody lies, as it is... How does it affect you, I suppose.

If it doesn't - yeah, whatever. If it does - is it to your advantage or detriment? The latter case could necessitate a flow chart of its own. That applies to the truth as much as it does lies, of course, so... Does it even matter that people lie?

Heh... I may have explained politics right there.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

No one

I AM UTTERLY OFFENDED!!!!

Never ever have I lied.

Side note: I love humans.

Tom62

#33
Maybe we should put a disclaimer when we say that something is true. Didn't Biden for example say that you can't get Covid if you are vaccinated? Well, that turned out very well for him. Also, nowadays the truth doesn't seem valid any more in comparison with our truth. You can even get cancelled for telling the truth. A common trend is to redefine words (like recession or racism) sothat anything you say can be considered to have an element of truth.
The universe never did make sense; I suspect it was built on government contract.
Robert A. Heinlein

Asmodean

Quote from: No one on July 27, 2022, 02:58:25 PMI AM UTTERLY OFFENDED!!!!
I am Stephen Fry.  8)

Quote from: Tom62 on July 28, 2022, 06:26:30 AMAlso, nowadays the truth doesn't seem valid any more in comparison with our truth.
This right here.

What is the difference between my truth, the truth and a lie?

Well, if my truth is a single unit of faith, the truth is a large enough number of such units of faith. A lie is also a unit of faith, though if we assume that the liar knows that he's lying, then the faith is from those he lies to.

It may not seem intuitive out of the box, as truth has, by definition, the attribute of being true, which a lie does not. However, how many things that were true yesterday will be lies tomorrow - outright or by degrees of approximation?
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

Magdalena

Let's not forget that in (certain circles), falsehoods were referred to as:
alternative facts or
additional and alternative information.

So...

If I say that I have a huge penis, and someone says, that's not true. I can say,

"Saying that I have a huge penis is an alternative fact." Which means:
"It's not the truth, but if you chose to believe that it is the truth, it can be. You have the option of lying to yourself and others. Take advantage of the self-delusion option."

How?

"Just remember, what you are seeing and what you are reading is not what's happening."
--Trump.



OK.
 ::)

"I've had several "spiritual" or numinous experiences over the years, but never felt that they were the product of anything but the workings of my own mind in reaction to the universe." ~Recusant

Asmodean

#36
Quote from: Magdalena on July 28, 2022, 08:30:40 AMLet's not forget that in (certain circles), falsehoods were referred to as:
alternative facts or
additional and alternative information.
There are semantic ("water is dry, now let med define "water," "dry" and "is...") alternative facts, and then there are perspective-dependent ones. There is also ideological propaganda, but I'm staying out of that for now, well-knowing that those are probably the exact circles to which you refer, because there is actually an interesting side to alternate truths.

For instance, you can look at a rectangle and say for a fact that it is a rectangle. I can look at a circle and say for a fact that it is a circle. Someone else may look at the cylinder we're both looking at and say that it's neither. Assuming the possibility of additional dimensions of space and the passage of time, who, if any-one, is being truthful?

Quote"Saying that I have a huge penis is an alternative fact." Which means:
"It's not the truth, but if you chose to believe that it is the truth, it can be. You have the option of lying to yourself and others. Take advantage of the self-delusion option."
It could also mean that you have a giant, penis-shaped dildo, to which you just refer as a penis. Or you may be referring to your romantic interest's genitals as your own.

There is any number of ways in which your statement may indeed be a statement of fact from your perspective. In such instances, calling it "alternative" could be little more than the acknowledgement that others may see things differently.

A good, albeit somewhat controversial example; a transsexual man sees and refers to himself as a man. Another person sees and refers to him as a woman. Both are factual statements; "I am a man." "You are a woman." Both are alternative facts.

Note that I am not trying to court controversy here - this is just too good an example of both semantic and perspective-driven mutually-incompatible truths.

Quote"Just remember, what you are seeing and what you are reading is not what's happening."
--Trump.

OK.
 ::)
Yep. Gotta give the Orange Man that one. What you're seeing and reading are at best approximations of what's happening. Versions of it, if you will. When speaking of media specifically, as I assume he was, that gets compounded with actively pushing narratives.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

Magdalena

Quote from: Asmodean on July 28, 2022, 08:47:14 AM
Quote from: Magdalena on July 28, 2022, 08:30:40 AMLet's not forget that in (certain circles), falsehoods were referred to as:
alternative facts or
additional and alternative information.
There are semantic ("water is dry, now let med define "water," "dry" and "is...") alternative facts, and then there are perspective-dependent ones. There is also ideological propaganda, but I'm staying out of that for now, well-knowing that those are probably the exact circles to which you refer, because there is actually an interesting side to alternate truths.

For instance, you can look at a rectangle and say for a fact that it is a rectangle. I can look at a circle and say for a fact that it is a circle. Someone else may look at the cylinder we're both looking at and say that it's neither. Assuming the possibility of additional dimensions of space and the passage of time, who, if any-one, is being truthful?

Quote"Saying that I have a huge penis is an alternative fact." Which means:
"It's not the truth, but if you chose to believe that it is the truth, it can be. You have the option of lying to yourself and others. Take advantage of the self-delusion option."
It could also mean that you have a giant, penis-shaped dildo, to which you just refer as a penis. Or you may be referring to your romantic interest's genitals as your own.

There is any number of ways in which your statement may indeed be a statement of fact from your perspective. In such instances, calling it "alternative" could be little more than the acknowledgement that others may see things differently.

A good, albeit somewhat controversial example; a transsexual man sees and refers to himself as a man. Another person sees and refers to him as a woman. Both are factual statements; "I am a man." "You are a woman." Both are alternative facts.

Note that I am not trying to court controversy here - this is just too good an example of both semantic and perspective-driven mutually-incompatible truths.

Quote"Just remember, what you are seeing and what you are reading is not what's happening."
--Trump.

OK.
 ::)
Yep. Gotta give the Orange Man that one. What you're seeing and reading are at best approximations of what's happening. Versions of it, if you will. When speaking of media specifically, as I assume he was, that gets compounded with actively pushing narratives.

Nit-picky? Hell yes.

;D

"I've had several "spiritual" or numinous experiences over the years, but never felt that they were the product of anything but the workings of my own mind in reaction to the universe." ~Recusant

Asmodean

#38
'Tis what He doth. :smilenod:

I must admit a certain fascination with people labelling differences in perspective as lies though. I think much of it is due to assuming malice before all other concerns, especially when it comes to any kind of political speech, where cylinders often are circles or rectangles.

That's not to say that there are no lies, of course, it's just that when someone says "This is a lie" and I ask them "Well, what does it look like from where the liar is standing," I almost never get the answer to the question I asked - rather, I get a version of the facts from the side accusing the other of lying. So, no motive, no projected gains, just... Opining out the ass, much like the accused liar likely was..?

...And so "we all" keep calling each other liars, looking at our geometric shapes with never a thought to the possibility of them being "true" parts of something more in a higher dimension.



"The Earth is round," said the Flat-Earther. I'd call it round too, though in a spheroidal kind of sense. Who's to say what a heptadimensional being would call it..?
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

billy rubin

why do you thinknthe esrth is round? is this a truth you assert from your own knowledge or do you depend on someone else to support the isea?


News has been received from the Punjab that the Amritsar mob has again broken out in a violent attack against the authorities. The rebels were repulsed by the military and they suffered 200 casualties.

Magdalena

Quote from: billy rubin on July 28, 2022, 12:16:57 PMwhy do you thinknthe esrth is round? is this a truth you assert from your own knowledge or do you depend on someone else to support the isea?

It's not round or flat, billy rubin, it's a heptagon.
Heptapods, or
heptadimensional beings will prove this alternative fact one day.
 :smilenod:
--You just wait for it.

"I've had several "spiritual" or numinous experiences over the years, but never felt that they were the product of anything but the workings of my own mind in reaction to the universe." ~Recusant

billy rubin

lol

at least you didnt say oblate sphreroid

did you know the earth is hollow? im looking for video evidence right now

theres giant fungi too!


News has been received from the Punjab that the Amritsar mob has again broken out in a violent attack against the authorities. The rebels were repulsed by the military and they suffered 200 casualties.

billy rubin



News has been received from the Punjab that the Amritsar mob has again broken out in a violent attack against the authorities. The rebels were repulsed by the military and they suffered 200 casualties.

No one

It's funny that any of you believe there's an "Earth".

FOOLS!!!!

Asmodean

Quote from: billy rubin on July 28, 2022, 12:16:57 PMwhy do you thinknthe esrth is round? is this a truth you assert from your own knowledge or do you depend on someone else to support the isea?
Mostly my understanding of geometry and a slight misuse of linguistics (in choosing a relatively imprecise word - "round.")
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.