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George Floyd

Started by Magdalena, May 31, 2020, 02:20:45 AM

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Magdalena

Quote from: billy rubin on June 06, 2020, 10:17:13 PM
well, my son got back from his demnstration without incident.
Good to hear.

"I've had several "spiritual" or numinous experiences over the years, but never felt that they were the product of anything but the workings of my own mind in reaction to the universe." ~Recusant

billy rubin

yes

hes something of a hothead and i would prefer him not tobe up in the front


more people have been to berlin than i have

Randy

How old is your son, Billy?
"Maybe it's just a bunch of stuff that happens." -- Homer Simpson
"Some people focus on the destination. Atheists focus on the journey." -- Barry Goldberg

Dark Lightning

There was a silent demonstration in my hometown. Some businesses were boarded up, but nobody (on either side) got stupid, for which I am thankful. I'm 67 YO and while I agree that PoC should not be getting killed (or even beaten) like is happening, I'm not offering my near-terminal body up for that.

Anne D.

Quote from: Asmodean on June 06, 2020, 09:46:12 AM
Quote from: Tom62 on June 05, 2020, 08:30:49 PM
I've watched the video as well. The criminal background of Floyd is irrelevant. He was an unarmed man who was murdered by a bad cop. Three other cops were standing around, doing nothing to stop the murder. I haven't heard a single person say that was justified (maybe the KKK and other white supremacist groups excluded) . Even Trump found it horrible.
There's a lot of intersectional weirdness in this thread, so let me lay it out as I see it, from the cold and rational depths of me not giving a shit;

Mr. Floyd's criminal background, use of narcotics, on-scene behaviour, etc are relevant to understanding the timeline of the events, as one must, were one to form an informed opinion on what happened. The same is true for the arresting officer's level of education, mental state, affiliation with the person being arrested, etc.

For instance, one way or another, Mr. Floyd ended up on the ground with a police officer on top of him. Not being standard procedure under a routine arrest, how did that happen? Every one of the above variables, and yes, also Mr. Floyd's skin colour, may or may not have had significant influence on that and other events on the timeline leading from the call being made to Mr. Floyd's demise.

Understanding the variables in a situation does not equate to blaming the victim of a crime, or to excusing the perpetrator. It does, however, paint a deeper, more detailed picture of reality for each variable accounted for. It also lets one avoid some unfortunate rushed judgements. For example, there are groups out there which will tell you as if it were a fact that this was a racially-motivated crime. How do they know that? Could there be more to it, like negligence, carelessness, psychiatric/psychological issues, one or both parties having used narcotics, the list goes on?

My point is this; a lot of people are calling for change. Some are purely virtue signalling. Some in a more level-headed and grounded way than others. Some throw bricks at businesses because... Reasons. If you want change, but only approach the situation from a surface-level analysis, how will you be able to figure out where the problem lies?

Asmo, you have no conception of how deeply racism runs in the US, and you have no conception of how deeply racist the MPD's history is. Google Bob Kroll. That's the cretin that MPD officers have chosen as their leader. Have you watched the video of George Floyd's death, seen the smirking MPD officer who killed him? You don't have to post every inane thought that passes through your mind. This isn't virtue signaling, it's disgust. If you don't know of what you speak, consider not speaking.

Tom62

15,000 people were protesting in Berlin. Social distancing was ignored and many shops were destroyed. WTF, Antifa????
This has nothing to do with racism.
The universe never did make sense; I suspect it was built on government contract.
Robert A. Heinlein

Magdalena

I have a question:
Does this, Antifa group, do they have a leader?

"I've had several "spiritual" or numinous experiences over the years, but never felt that they were the product of anything but the workings of my own mind in reaction to the universe." ~Recusant

Tom62

Quote from: Magdalena on June 07, 2020, 07:25:54 AM
I have a question:
Does this, Antifa group, do they have a leader?

I don't know and I frankly don't care how Antifa organises themselves (could be different in every country). Fact is (and I'm not pleased with it at all) that these scumbags think it is OK to destroy shops in Germany because a bad cop murdered a black man in the USA.

One thing I have to make clear is that I DON'T associate the 15,000 peaceful protesters in Berlin with these nasty destructive actions. 
The universe never did make sense; I suspect it was built on government contract.
Robert A. Heinlein

billy rubin

Quote from: Randy on June 07, 2020, 12:35:38 AM
How old is your son, Billy?

hes 23

concerned about injusyice, disillusioned with the failed system. skeptical of change from within.

good kid.


more people have been to berlin than i have

billy rubin

Quote from: Magdalena on June 07, 2020, 07:25:54 AM
I have a question:
Does this, Antifa group, do they have a leader?

no.

its just a name unaffiliated small groups of people have decided to call themselves. theres no group, no organization. they share a left wing ideology. probably some anarchists in there.

their style is violent and confrontational. just left wing thugs out in the streets fighting right wing thugs.


more people have been to berlin than i have

Tom62

Quote from: billy rubin on June 07, 2020, 09:38:15 AM
Quote from: Magdalena on June 07, 2020, 07:25:54 AM
I have a question:
Does this, Antifa group, do they have a leader?

no.

its just a name unaffiliated small groups of people have decided to call themselves. theres no group, no organization. they share a left wing ideology. probably some anarchists in there.

their style is violent and confrontational. just left wing thugs out in the streets fighting right wing thugs.

Good point. Fighting right wing thugs sounds fine with me. However, since they also attack moderate liberals and conservatives, I have a feeling that they label anyone a fascist, who isn't as much on the left as they are.   
The universe never did make sense; I suspect it was built on government contract.
Robert A. Heinlein

billy rubin

the circle of politics on tbe right runs moderate to conservative to reactionary ti vigilante to anarchist.

on the left is moderate to liberal to radical to revolutionary to anarchist.

both ends meet the other. if you turn the sound off so you cannot hear the propaganda, there is very little difference between right wing militias and left wing antifa.

while they have political differences, they hold the same values,  use the same methods, and leave the same chaos in their wake.


more people have been to berlin than i have

Tom62

^Hear, hear! I've even seen people switching from one extreme to the other. That might be easy, if people are angry or disillusioned about the society.
The universe never did make sense; I suspect it was built on government contract.
Robert A. Heinlein

Davin

Quote from: Magdalena on June 06, 2020, 10:12:39 PM
Quote from: billy rubin on June 06, 2020, 09:38:50 PM
magdalena:

https://twitter.com/NickAndert/status/1268316722773192705?s=09
Wow!
Yes, this is the LAPD.
It has always been like this.
(Image:1991)

Looks like these mother fuckers never got a chance to beat up a piñata when they were kids.  :grrr:
This incident inspired the incoming union president to go for it. Apparently the incoming president didn't like being put on the "problem officer" list for his use of excessive force against minorities. Apparently he doesn't want what happened to him (hardly anything), happen to any other officer because the idea that an officer should face consequences for their actions is so scary to these guys that they'll do anything (lie, cheat, steal, intimidate, and murder), to avoid facing any punishment for bad behavior.
Always question all authorities because the authority you don't question is the most dangerous... except me, never question me.

Davin

This guy, dressed suspiciously as a fire fighter sitting in a car right outside his fire station, was apparently very suspicious for some reason.



Officers that see phantom guns, I think, should be riding the desk. That kind of eye or hallucination problem I think should disqualify them from operating guns in the public.
Always question all authorities because the authority you don't question is the most dangerous... except me, never question me.