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How Dumb is Man?

Started by MadBomr101, April 19, 2020, 02:23:30 PM

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MadBomr101

No matter how preposterous an idea or belief may be there's always some percentage of the population that will believe it.

It doesn't matter how demonstrably false, conceptually ridiculous or irretrievably stupid the idea is, it will find an audience that supports it. This is in evidence given the billions who believe in a god of some kind and also in the millions who insist Donald Trump is a great leader and a brilliant man.

But it gets even worse than that, There are people who believe that the earth is flat, that the holocaust never happened, that the moon landing was a hoax, that there's a dinosaur living in Loch Ness, and that an 8' tall species of man/ape lives secretly in the wilderness of the Pacific NW. They believe in ghosts, and crystal magic, and in the unfailing power of prayer. I'll bet there's at least 10.000 people globally who believe ALL of that shit.

My question is WHY?

Why do so many people insist on being ignorant and just plain dumb in the face of reality and common sense? It really irks me.

Oh, and Scientology. Goddamn Scientology!

Post 1 of 25
- Bomr
I'm waiting for the movie of my life to be made.  It should cost about $7.23 and that includes the budget for special effects.

billy rubin

i believe in ghosts.

dunno what they are, but i think the evidence is sufficient that zomethi g has been going on there.


"I cannot understand the popularity of that kind of music, which is based on repetition. In a civilized society, things don't need to be said more than three times."

billy rubin

pleased to meet you, by the way


"I cannot understand the popularity of that kind of music, which is based on repetition. In a civilized society, things don't need to be said more than three times."

Asmodean

Quote from: MadBomr101 on April 19, 2020, 02:23:30 PM
It doesn't matter how demonstrably false, conceptually ridiculous or irretrievably stupid the idea is, it will find an audience that supports it. This is in evidence given the billions who believe in a god of some kind and also in the millions who insist Donald Trump is a great leader and a brilliant man.
There is also the flipside of that coin - all those Trump-deranged people, who seem to think that if they just manage to get almost any-one else at all in power, "things" will get "better."

Mr. Trump has his flaws, and on a personal level, I dislike the man. Still, he has done my stock prices nothing but good, and personally, I'm not at all above giving him that.

QuoteBut it gets even worse than that, There are people who believe that the earth is flat, that the holocaust never happened, that the moon landing was a hoax, that there's a dinosaur living in Loch Ness, and that an 8' tall species of man/ape lives secretly in the wilderness of the Pacific NW. They believe in ghosts, and crystal magic, and in the unfailing power of prayer. I'll bet there's at least 10.000 people globally who believe ALL of that shit.
Does any-one know if any Flat Earther came up with the "unification theory" for their models of the seasons and the day/night cycle? I'd like to see if the geometric contortions required would result in spheroidizing the Flat Earth or not  ;D

QuoteMy question is WHY?
My take: it's a multivariate question. People see different things differently and reach different conclusions when presented with the same events/facts. On top of that, some people don't question authority and the potential figures of authority are as diverse as opinions in the previous point. There is more to it, and I'll gladly philosophize upon it in a more sparring style. I needs me some winding up before I start making good and well thought-through non-generic points on this subject.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

Old Seer

Quote from: MadBomr101 on April 19, 2020, 02:23:30 PM
No matter how preposterous an idea or belief may be there's always some percentage of the population that will believe it.

It doesn't matter how demonstrably false, conceptually ridiculous or irretrievably stupid the idea is, it will find an audience that supports it. This is in evidence given the billions who believe in a god of some kind and also in the millions who insist Donald Trump is a great leader and a brilliant man.

But it gets even worse than that, There are people who believe that the earth is flat, that the holocaust never happened, that the moon landing was a hoax, that there's a dinosaur living in Loch Ness, and that an 8' tall species of man/ape lives secretly in the wilderness of the Pacific NW. They believe in ghosts, and crystal magic, and in the unfailing power of prayer. I'll bet there's at least 10.000 people globally who believe ALL of that shit.

My question is WHY?

Why do so many people insist on being ignorant and just plain dumb in the face of reality and common sense? It really irks me.

Oh, and Scientology. Goddamn Scientology!

Post 1 of 25
We all are victims of an inheritance from previous generations.
The only thing possible the world needs saving from are the ones running it.
Oh lord, save us from those wanting to save us.
I'm not a Theist.

billy rubin

Quote from: Asmodean on April 19, 2020, 08:49:16 PM

Does any-one know if any Flat Earther came up with the "unification theory" for their models of the seasons and the day/night cycle? I'd like to see if the geometric contortions required would result in spheroidizing the Flat Earth or not  ;D


mostly variations on this



northern hemisphere bias is usual in flat earth models.


"I cannot understand the popularity of that kind of music, which is based on repetition. In a civilized society, things don't need to be said more than three times."

MadBomr101

Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 02:56:21 PM
i believe in ghosts.

dunno what they are, but i think the evidence is sufficient that zomethi g has been going on there.

What sort of evidence has convinced you? The only evidence i ever see are apocryphal claims made by people who are generally agreeable to the notion of ghosts to begin with. Then there's those laughably silly ghost hunting shows on TV where badly staged "encounters" are passed off as proof of the supernatural and, of course, all those hoax photos and mistakes brought on by bad photography.

Also wouldn't the spirit remnant of a person be considered a soul? Something atheism rejects for the same lack of proof that makes all religious claims for the supernatural unsubstantiated for their a lack of evidence?

If ghosts were real they would be proof of an afterlife. I think something like that would be eligible for a Nobel prize but no one has ever won it for that particular discovery.

Pleased to meet you too.
- Bomr
I'm waiting for the movie of my life to be made.  It should cost about $7.23 and that includes the budget for special effects.

No one

About as bright as a wet match in a dark room.

billy rubin

Quote from: MadBomr101 on April 19, 2020, 09:22:30 PM
Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 02:56:21 PM
i believe in ghosts.

dunno what they are, but i think the evidence is sufficient that zomethi g has been going on there.

What sort of evidence has convinced you? The only evidence i ever see are apocryphal claims made by people who are generally agreeable to the notion of ghosts to begin with. Then there's those laughably silly ghost hunting shows on TV where badly staged "encounters" are passed off as proof of the supernatural and, of course, all those hoax photos and mistakes brought on by bad photography.

Also wouldn't the spirit remnant of a person be considered a soul? Something atheism rejects for the same lack of proof that makes all religious claims for the supernatural unsubstantiated for their a lack of evidence?

If ghosts were real they would be proof of an afterlife. I think something like that would be eligible for a Nobel prize but no one has ever won it for that particular discovery.

Pleased to meet you too.

nah i dont think ghosts are surviving spirits of dead people. probably not anyway. lots to unpack with that hypothesis.

the thing is there are so many things that we call ghosts. i ve been trying to list them:

-- unidentified sounds, like bumps or wails or speech

-- poltergeists, or physical manifestations in general. moving or moved objects.

-- unidentified sights of inanimatr stuff, like v9iewz through windows that arent there, or stuff seen in mirrors

-- feelings or emotions that onesenses only in certain times or placez

-- spectral figurez of living things, people or animals

we lump all these things together as "ghostz" and maybe some of them have non-supernatural causes and some we dont know and zome just are BS

but we have thousands of years of pretty consistent folklore observationz on some of this stuff. when i say i believe in ghosts, i mean that i think there is likely some real existence to some of them in ways we dont yet understand.


"I cannot understand the popularity of that kind of music, which is based on repetition. In a civilized society, things don't need to be said more than three times."

Asmodean

Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 09:13:56 PM
Quote from: Asmodean on April 19, 2020, 08:49:16 PM

Does any-one know if any Flat Earther came up with the "unification theory" for their models of the seasons and the day/night cycle? I'd like to see if the geometric contortions required would result in spheroidizing the Flat Earth or not  ;D


mostly variations on this



northern hemisphere bias is usual in flat earth models.
Yes, they also have a model for the day/night cycle, incompatible with this model. That was my question - it's about whether their bullshit is getting any more internally consistent  ;)
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

MadBomr101

Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 10:39:28 PM-- unidentified sounds, like bumps or wails or speech

A sound that isn't clearly identifiable is far more likely to be a sound with a commonplace origin that simply hasn't been identified rather than a potentially supernatural noise that can't be identified. Add to that there's no proof that anything supernatural is real to begin with because the supernatural itself hasn't been proven.

Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 10:39:28 PM-- poltergeists, or physical manifestations in general. moving or moved objects.

First, poltergeists would have to be proven to exist outside of fiction before any claims of poltergeist activity can be given any credibility. No such real world evidence exists. Only hoaxes like Enfield and unsubstantiated claims. None of this is evidence of anything but humans trying to get away with some kind of duplicity.

Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 10:39:28 PM-- unidentified sights of inanimatr stuff, like v9iewz through windows that arent there, or stuff seen in mirrors

Visual hallucinations can be brought on by drugs, alcohol, mental disorder, or just an active imagination. Any human being can throw something through a window and run from sight in seconds. Again, there's just too many banal explanations available that discredits any supernatural explanation.

Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 10:39:28 PM-- feelings or emotions that onesenses only in certain times or placez

Feelings of any kind are only proof of how someone feels. They can interpret it any way they like but its still just their feelings and are evidence of nothing more than that.

Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 10:39:28 PM-- spectral figurez of living things, people or animals

I don't know what you mean by "special figurez."

Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 10:39:28 PMwe lump all these things together as "ghostz" and maybe some of them have non-supernatural causes and some we dont know and zome just are BS

but we have thousands of years of pretty consistent folklore observationz on some of this stuff. when i say i believe in ghosts, i mean that i think there is likely some real existence to some of them in ways we dont yet understand.

We have thousands of years of people insisting there are magical people who live in the sky as well but there isn't. How long a delusion persists or how many people believe it doesn't make it credible. After all, there's lots of things we didn't understand throughout history that we do now and none of them were ever supernatural in origin no matter how seemingly inexplicable they once were.

You're free to believe in ghosts if you choose. I just don't see any reasonable or compelling evidence to do so. It's all too likely explainable by more prosaic means.
- Bomr
I'm waiting for the movie of my life to be made.  It should cost about $7.23 and that includes the budget for special effects.

billy rubin

Quote from: Asmodean on April 20, 2020, 12:06:36 AM
Quote from: billy rubin on April 19, 2020, 09:13:56 PM
Quote from: Asmodean on April 19, 2020, 08:49:16 PM

Does any-one know if any Flat Earther came up with the "unification theory" for their models of the seasons and the day/night cycle? I'd like to see if the geometric contortions required would result in spheroidizing the Flat Earth or not  ;D


mostly variations on this



northern hemisphere bias is usual in flat earth models.
Yes, they also have a model for the day/night cycle, incompatible with this model. That was my question - it's about whether their bullshit is getting any more internally consistent  ;)



no

all the models contradict each other. each is a one-purpose tool. take a problem, solve it, go to the next.

but then ptolemy's epicyclez werent mathematically correct either.

the most glaring issue iz zimply that nothing in the southern hemisphere works.

if you start talking southern hemisphere in a flat earth forum your posts get monitored.

ask me how i know


"I cannot understand the popularity of that kind of music, which is based on repetition. In a civilized society, things don't need to be said more than three times."

Asmodean

If yours is first hand knowledge, I assume it's because you was trolling Flat Earthers. I did that myself some time ago, before a more sinister variety of crazies began to fester and require my attention.
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

Ecurb Noselrub

While we have a brain capable of "rational" thinking, we are just a more evolved version of our brute beast cousins. We can rationalize better than we can reason, and we don't have much more capacity to predict the future than other apes. We simply cannot know the full consequences of our actions, so we make decisions like we always have - what seems to work now. We are smarter than chimps, but not smart enough to figure out how to keep from destroying ourselves. We've had a good run - but so did the dinosaurs. Hope the next iteration of "rational" beings can do better.

Asmodean

Don't write us off too soon - we are still here, and chances are, we will continue to be here, if nothing else than out of pure spite for those environ-mentalists screaming at the skies about "last generations."
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.