Author Topic: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!  (Read 5455 times)

envilid

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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #60 on: March 07, 2012, 04:51:09 AM »
I was just wondering about how old your kids were? I have a nephew is just a few days from 6. He mostly watches educational shows or documentaries on dinosaurs and the planets on netflix. His parents have just never brought the topic up. I am wondering when he will just come up with the question himself, or will he come up to his parents after school to ask who God is.
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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #61 on: March 07, 2012, 02:11:31 PM »
I was just wondering about how old your kids were? I have a nephew is just a few days from 6. He mostly watches educational shows or documentaries on dinosaurs and the planets on netflix. His parents have just never brought the topic up. I am wondering when he will just come up with the question himself, or will he come up to his parents after school to ask who God is.

My son is almost 4.  The reason it came up is that my parents are very religious, and they have been talking about god to him, so then he comes back to me and says things like "Is God real?  Is Jesus really going to protect me?"  I had no intention of talking to him about this stuff this early, but since my parents have pushed the issue, I have been answering him as honestly as I can.  What I have actually told him is that no one really knows for sure if there is a god, and some people believe and some people don't, and either way is fine.  But then he asked if I believe, and if his dad believes, so I answered honestly "not really".  So he immediately "decides" that he doesn't believe either.  Which just means that he's parroting back what I said, you know?

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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #62 on: March 10, 2012, 02:55:41 PM »
I only just came across this thread, but I just wanted to say good for you!
I think you handled it perfectly. Does that woman really think that everyone believes in God? Or does she think Atheist parents should lie to their children? Either way, it makes no sense.

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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #63 on: March 10, 2012, 05:29:39 PM »
I only just came across this thread, but I just wanted to say good for you!
I think you handled it perfectly. Does that woman really think that everyone believes in God? Or does she think Atheist parents should lie to their children? Either way, it makes no sense.



Religion is not supposed to make sense. Didn't you know that already?


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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #64 on: March 10, 2012, 05:46:16 PM »
I only just came across this thread, but I just wanted to say good for you!
I think you handled it perfectly. Does that woman really think that everyone believes in God? Or does she think Atheist parents should lie to their children? Either way, it makes no sense.

Religion is not supposed to make sense. Didn't you know that already?

I've had friends tell me "to me, my faith makes perfect sense!" and I always figure what they're really saying is, "to me, my faith satisfies my emotional needs" which is something just slightly different from making sense.  ;)

I figure that mother at the daycare was perhaps one of those folks, who does get a lot of emotional satisfaction out of her faith, and wants her daughter to, also. I mean, if you believe in God, I can see how answering your children's questions would be easier, at least. Family pet/beloved grandparent/etc pass away? They're in heaven. Why's the sky blue? God made it that way. Who'll keep you safe? God will. Who loves you? God does. Etc etc. When I was a kid, that's the version of God my parents gave me -- a happy, fuzzy kind sort of being up in heaven who wants everyone safe and happy. Imagine my surprise when I found out life didn't work that way.  :P


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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #65 on: March 10, 2012, 06:32:55 PM »
Quote from: Amicale
Imagine my surprise when I found out life didn't work that way.  :P

And when you read Leviticus, Deuteronomy and 2nd Samuel. 
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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #66 on: March 10, 2012, 07:30:47 PM »
I've had friends tell me "to me, my faith makes perfect sense!" and I always figure what they're really saying is, "to me, my faith satisfies my emotional needs" which is something just slightly different from making sense.  ;)

You know, that's how it's always seemed to me as well -- that faith is a matter of meeting emotional needs, esp. the need for comfort.  But I've had a number of religious people tell me, in almost offended tones, that it has nothing to do with emotional needs and certainly not comfort, as if there's something wrong with that. 

All other things being equal, I don't see anything wrong in believing something for emotional reasons, and I have great respect for the desire for comfort.  There's more than enough pain and difficulty in life that's automatic, or that we can't do a single thing about once it arrives, so I say if you find something that comforts you, cling to it.  There's no shame in that (and again, that's based on all other things being equal).

What puts my back up is the assumption that what comforts A will also, or should also, comfort B and if it clearly doesn't then B is just being difficult and needs to be "re-educated" or even punished.  And as much as this is my problem with religious fundies, it's also part of my problem with atheists like Dawkins and Hitchens.  Defend the separation of church and state to your death, yes, but keep your public opinions out of peoples private lives.  OK, rant over.
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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #67 on: March 10, 2012, 07:52:49 PM »
I've had friends tell me "to me, my faith makes perfect sense!" and I always figure what they're really saying is, "to me, my faith satisfies my emotional needs" which is something just slightly different from making sense.  ;)

You know, that's how it's always seemed to me as well -- that faith is a matter of meeting emotional needs, esp. the need for comfort.  But I've had a number of religious people tell me, in almost offended tones, that it has nothing to do with emotional needs and certainly not comfort, as if there's something wrong with that. 

All other things being equal, I don't see anything wrong in believing something for emotional reasons, and I have great respect for the desire for comfort.  There's more than enough pain and difficulty in life that's automatic, or that we can't do a single thing about once it arrives, so I say if you find something that comforts you, cling to it.  There's no shame in that (and again, that's based on all other things being equal).

What puts my back up is the assumption that what comforts A will also, or should also, comfort B and if it clearly doesn't then B is just being difficult and needs to be "re-educated" or even punished.  And as much as this is my problem with religious fundies, it's also part of my problem with atheists like Dawkins and Hitchens.  Defend the separation of church and state to your death, yes, but keep your public opinions out of peoples private lives.  OK, rant over.

It was a very good rant.  ;D

I know exactly what you mean. Even in the atheist community, I'm sometimes still a bit surprised to hear from people (elsewhere, not really here) that the things I'm interested in, I shouldn't be. I'm not a Christian or a theist, but I am interested in spirituality, to a degree. That, and philosophy. I sympathize with several Buddhist ideas, for instance -- much of it has a lot to say about how to live well, how to treat others, etc. I'm also interested in dialogue between theists and non-theists, in terms of learning to coexist and respect one another, rather than both sides being so darned divided. But sometimes I'm given the impression that atheists have to be in one camp, theists firmly in another, and ne'er the two shall meet. It's too bad that mentality exists, really. There's a lot of progress we could make if we took a good look at the things we did have in common. Which is why I respectfully disagree with anyone who says "I'd NEVER have a good friend who was a Christian/atheist/etc etc." Nonsense. We're all people. We can find a LOT of good in one another that has nothing to do with religion. Which is why I don't understand people like the mother at Ali's son's daycare -- just assuming that people HAVE to be 'a certain way', or else they're flawed. Sigh.

/my own rant over.  :P


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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #68 on: March 10, 2012, 10:04:21 PM »


I know exactly what you mean. Even in the atheist community, I'm sometimes still a bit surprised to hear from people (elsewhere, not really here) that the things I'm interested in, I shouldn't be. I'm not a Christian or a theist, but I am interested in spirituality, to a degree. That, and philosophy. I sympathize with several Buddhist ideas, for instance -- much of it has a lot to say about how to live well, how to treat others, etc. I'm also interested in dialogue between theists and non-theists, in terms of learning to coexist and respect one another, rather than both sides being so darned divided. But sometimes I'm given the impression that atheists have to be in one camp, theists firmly in another, and ne'er the two shall meet. It's too bad that mentality exists, really. There's a lot of progress we could make if we took a good look at the things we did have in common. Which is why I respectfully disagree with anyone who says "I'd NEVER have a good friend who was a Christian/atheist/etc etc." Nonsense. We're all people. We can find a LOT of good in one another that has nothing to do with religion. Which is why I don't understand people like the mother at Ali's son's daycare -- just assuming that people HAVE to be 'a certain way', or else they're flawed. Sigh.

/my own rant over.  :P

Actually the behavior you describe there Amicale has a rather Christian ring to it.  Guardian, I think, noted this in another thread: funny how non-believers seem to don the Christian principles at the same juncture that a lot of Christians don a judgmental mindset.  And non-believers are suppose to be the vile, immoral of the two sects. 
Suffering is the breaking of the shell that encloses one's understanding.  Khalil Gibran

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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #69 on: March 11, 2012, 02:01:51 AM »
Actually the behavior you describe there Amicale has a rather Christian ring to it.  Guardian, I think, noted this in another thread: funny how non-believers seem to don the Christian principles at the same juncture that a lot of Christians don a judgmental mindset.  And non-believers are suppose to be the vile, immoral of the two sects. 

See, I'm smarter then I look!  ;)


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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #70 on: March 11, 2012, 08:15:25 AM »
All other things being equal, I don't see anything wrong in believing something for emotional reasons, and I have great respect for the desire for comfort.  There's more than enough pain and difficulty in life that's automatic, or that we can't do a single thing about once it arrives, so I say if you find something that comforts you, cling to it.  There's no shame in that (and again, that's based on all other things being equal).
Hmm... Haven't really thought of it that way... Perhaps part of the reason why I seem to be immune to religion - even at an age when I really had no way of knowing better - is that I revel in misery and care little for emotional comfort or sympathies, thus turning a major "why" of belief subjectively useless...

I like my way though. Someone close went toes-up? Well, I can bitch and moan and be depressed about it for a week, and then I'm done with it. If I masked the issue in a mosaic of emotional comforters, however, I think it would take longer to "go away" and ultimately be just as difficult.

Self psychoanalysis aside, I see your point, but I contest that using self-desception for comfort is not only dishonest, but also potentially dangerous. To use a somewhat out-there parallel: you can use heroin for your head ache - it will kill the pain very effectively, after all, and make you feel good in the process. However, using paracetamol, while less effective in regards to pain management, is far more legal with far less risk of ending up a street junkie.
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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #71 on: March 11, 2012, 09:33:00 AM »
To use a somewhat out-there parallel: you can use heroin for your head ache - it will kill the pain very effectively, after all, and make you feel good in the process. However, using paracetamol, while less effective in regards to pain management, is far more legal with far less risk of ending up a street junkie.

Which is where the "all things being equal" comes in.
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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #72 on: March 14, 2012, 03:27:22 AM »
I only just came across this thread, but I just wanted to say good for you!
I think you handled it perfectly. Does that woman really think that everyone believes in God? Or does she think Atheist parents should lie to their children? Either way, it makes no sense.



Religion is not supposed to make sense. Didn't you know that already?
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Re: Outed (and publically berated) at daycare!
« Reply #73 on: March 26, 2012, 10:00:51 PM »
Never had kids. Thank god though, because I would be a horrible father. Almost everyone I know says that I corrupt the true tenets of the Christian faith.  >:(